Graphics cards, I don't get it?

[godofallu]

I've been looking into upgrading my graphics card for a while now, but I just don't get it. I just don't understand how to read/rank graphics cards, and I basically have to check in at Canyourunit.com every time I want to buy/play a new game.

I want to get the Witcher 2, but it says my graphics card can't handle the minimum specs. I expected that, but I don't understand the logic behind it.

It says the minimum nVIDIA card allowed is a Geforce 8800, but I have a Geforce 9100.
It then says I need 512 MB video ram, but I have 2.9 GB's.
It then says I need pixel/shader version 3+, but I have version 4.

So what gives? How does nVIDIA's product line work? Do you want the lowest numbers since 8800 is apparently better than 9100? No matter how much I search their website I can't find a power rankings list or anything like that.

If I were going to update my Graphics card, what other things would I need to know/worry about? I heard someone mention that I might need a new power supply for example. Also what's overclocking? It sounds dangerous, but powerful too.

I'm looking at spending anywhere from 100-300 dollars. The goal is to play Gothic 4, The Witcher 2, and DA 2 on medium setting minimum.

PS: I have an HP Pavilion 6210y stock. I'd be interested in understanding the AMG line too.

 

[barbzilla]

On video cards the first number in the sequence denotes the series number, the second number (set of numbers) will give you the general power of the card itself. This was a common misconception where people would buy a card that had a larger number than their original card, only to find it that it was weaker. This is because some models are designed for gaming and have more pipelines and better processing/clock speeds, while others are designed for more general graphics needs (lowered powered games, movies, photo editing, ect.)

 

[manaman]

Think of it like a car production line. The 2011's might be newer, but if you buy a base model it's not going to do as much as a fully loaded 2010.

It's like that with the cards. The 8800 is the completely "loaded" version of the 8000 series cards, the 9100 is the base model of the 9000 series. I can't really think of a simpler way of putting that out there for you.

The card you want to buy should have ratings on it. You just need to make sure that your power supply has the same out pin out (six or eight) and provides sufficient current on the rail to handle the card you want.


You could always post the PSU model number, and the card you want to buy and any one of the helpful people here can give you a yay or nay.

 

[Hashime]

You do not have 2.9Gb of video ram firstly.
Secondly you graphics card is integrated so it does not follow the same system as dedicated cards.
Finally, it is simple really the higher the number (in the current gen) the better the card (in general, there are exceptions)

Go to bit-tech.net if you want to know about hardware, they are the best.

As for upgrading:

1.Look in your computer to see if you have a PCI Express 2.0 slot. (don't complain about not knowing what they look like, that is what google is for)

2. Check to see if you have 6 pin power connectors free on your PSU. You will need at least one 6-pin connector to attach a decent graphics card.

3. You will need to do a little math regarding the power usage however. (look up peak wattage online) Your PSU will have a power rating (probably 3-400 watts) if you do not have enough power you cannot put in said card. There are online tools to help you with this.

4. If you have both pick up a Radeon 5770 or 6850. You could also use a GTX 460.

 

[Hashime]

Think of it like a car production line. The 2011's might be newer, but if you buy a base model it's not going to do as much as a fully loaded 2010.

It's like that with the cards. The 8800 is the completely "loaded" version of the 8000 series cards, the 9100 is the base model of the 9000 series. I can't really think of a simpler way of putting that out there for you.

The card you want to buy should have ratings on it. You just need to make sure that your power supply has the same out pin out (six or eight) and provides sufficient current on the rail to handle the card you want.


You could always post the PSU model number, and the card you want to buy and any one of the helpful people here can give you a yay or nay.

The 9100 is an integrated graphics chipset. In short it is a piece of crap.

 

[Vonnis]

As the above posters pointed out, the second number is more important than the first to see how powerful a card is. Nvidia now uses three digit numbers rather than four but this still applies. If you want details, there's a wiki page for each of Nvidia's series (8, 9, 200, 400 etc) detailing clock speeds, memory type, etc.

"It then says I need 512 MB video ram, but I have 2.9 GB's."
Ignoring the odd number, you're mistaking video memory for system memory. Video cards have their own dedicated memory which is much faster than your system RAM, most cards have around 1-1.5 gb nowadays.

You will almost definitely need a new power supply; a 9100 is pretty shit by any standard (I'm not even sure if it's a card or if it's on the motherboard itself) and because it can't do much, it doesn't require a lot of juice, which in turn means your PSU is likely to shit itself when you upgrade it. I'm pretty sure if you go to Nvidia's site you'll see the minimum wattage required for each of their cards.

Don't bother with over clocking. It basically means giving your card some extra juice, which can definitely be worth it, but finding a stable clock can be time consuming and if you screw it up you might have to kiss your graphics card goodbye. Considering your limited knowledge of pc hardware, don't worry about it.

 

[godofallu]

Oh that clears a lot of things up guys, thanks.

I have a 300w power supply so i'll have to upgrade that to a 500 wat it seems, but luckily the HP site had a nice vid showing how and newegg has some for 75 bucks.

Hmm I know I have a PCI slot, but idk which type. I'll have to do some investigating.

Also when I get a new card, can I just plug it in and i'm good to go? Or will I need to go through a bunch of setup things to get it running?

 

[Vonnis]

You'll need a PCI express 2.0 slot. Regular PCI hasn't been used for graphics cards in years (too slow, like AGP before it). I googled your system and I think you have one PCI express 1.0 slot, no 2.0. You may have a problem if that's the case (the problem being you'd need a new motherboard).

When you have a new card, just plug it in, plug in the power connectors (one or two 6 or 8 pin connectors), and you're set. You'll have to download and install the latest drivers for it but that's no more difficult than installing any other program.

 

[godofallu]

I discovered that I have 1 PCI express x16 and 3 PCI express x1

I'm still looking into discovering what PCI x16 means, but it looks like similar to the images of PCI 2 I found on google.

 

[Destal]

The slots are different speeds, be sure that the open slot you have on the motherboard matches the video card you buy. They are not cross compatible.

Typically with Nvida, the first number is the series, the second number is the quality.

For games, typically the lowest you would want that second number to be is a 6, i.e. gt 260

For ATI it's a little different, the first number is again the series, then the next two indicate how good the card is, i.e. 5870 is a good card and probably better than 5930, 6200 is not so much.

 

[oplinger]

I discovered that I have 1 PCI express x16 and 3 PCI express x1

I'm still looking into discovering what PCI x16 means, but it looks like similar to the images of PCI 2 I found on google.

PCI x16 has 16 lanes for bandwidth. The number after the X stands for how many lanes it has.

Also overclocking is never really worth it, unless you sink more money into it. (It causes more heat, you'll need much better cooling to get a noticeable effect.

The slots are different speeds, be sure that the open slot you have on the motherboard matches the video card you buy. They are not cross compatible.

Typically with Nvida, the first number is the series, the second number is the quality.

For games, typically the lowest you would want that second number to be is a 6, i.e. gt 260

For ATI it's a little different, the first number is again the series, then the next two indicate how good the card is, i.e. 5870 is a good card and probably better than 5930, 6200 is not so much.

Actually a PCIe X1 card can go in a PCIe x16 slot. It's recognized as a PCIe x1 card and it utilized as such. It's pretty nifty >.>

and you're incorrect on ATI, the first digit is the generation, the second is the series, and the third designates power.

 

[Vonnis]

The number after the x is how many data lanes it has. The difference is easy enough to spot as the fewer lanes there are, the smaller the slot is. x16 is what you need for graphics cards.
The problem here, as I said in my previous post, is that your system only seems to have PCI-e 1.0, which is quite a bit slower than 2.0. Even if these slots are physically identical, I don't think sticking a graphics card that requires 2.0 in there is going to work very well.

 

[Destal]

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814125333 would be a good bang for your buck if the slot is truly a pci 2.0 x16.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102932
would work too if you prefer ATI.

 

[SL33TBL1ND]

I've been looking into upgrading my graphics card for a while now, but I just don't get it. I just don't understand how to read/rank graphics cards, and I basically have to check in at Canyourunit.com every time I want to buy/play a new game.

I want to get the Witcher 2, but it says my graphics card can't handle the minimum specs. I expected that, but I don't understand the logic behind it.

It says the minimum nVIDIA card allowed is a Geforce 8800, but I have a Geforce 9100.
It then says I need 512 MB video ram, but I have 2.9 GB's.
It then says I need pixel/shader version 3+, but I have version 4.

So what gives? How does nVIDIA's product line work? Do you want the lowest numbers since 8800 is apparently better than 9100? No matter how much I search their website I can't find a power rankings list or anything like that.

If I were going to update my Graphics card, what other things would I need to know/worry about? I heard someone mention that I might need a new power supply for example. Also what's overclocking? It sounds dangerous, but powerful too.

I'm looking at spending anywhere from 100-300 dollars. The goal is to play Gothic 4, The Witcher 2, and DA 2 on medium setting minimum.

PS: I have an HP Pavilion 6210y stock. I'd be interested in understanding the AMG line too.

http://www.overclock.net/graphics-cards-general/502403-graphics-card-ranking-5th-time-last.html

This is the most comprehensive list of cards in a ranking format. It's also a good website to ask for advice.

 

[octafish]

The number after the x is how many data lanes it has. The difference is easy enough to spot as the fewer lanes there are, the smaller the slot is. x16 is what you need for graphics cards.
The problem here, as I said in my previous post, is that your system only seems to have PCI-e 1.0, which is quite a bit slower than 2.0. Even if these slots are physically identical, I don't think sticking a graphics card that requires 2.0 in there is going to work very well.

PCI-e x16 1.0 is the same as PCI-e x8 2.0 in terms of bandwidth, there is a reduction of about 10% in FPS. Not enough to worry about if you don't want to rebuild your system anytime soon. A 300w PSU on the other hand is a worry, that must be addressed, it is the most important part of any computer, don't scrimp on it.

 

[cpnichol]

http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/best-gaming-graphics-card-geforce-gtx-590-radeon-hd-6990,review-32134.html

It's a round up of the best graphic cards around for varying price ranges and on page 7 there is a similar list to the one SL33T posted.

 

[Snowalker]

You do not have 2.9Gb of video ram firstly.

I want to say this first and formost... I agree with everything you stated except for the quoted item.
Second, the quoted item probably isn't wrong, I just think since you seemed to know what you're talking about I have to ask.

When I bought my card, it said 1.5Gigs (could be 3 gigs, not sure) of dedicated memory. I know that fairly good, (the cards a 580GTX, so yeah) and I know for a fact that I have 8 gigs of RAM (yeah its actually like 7 some odd number, but I digress, Hyperion is the type.) Yet, when I got to "Can you run it?" it says I have 4 gigs of dedicated memory on my graphics card.... That strikes me as kinda odd, and it has RAM listed elsewhere so i know its not confusing them... so it leads me to a WTF?

Can you explain this to me?

 

[oplinger]

You do not have 2.9Gb of video ram firstly.

I want to say this first and formost... I agree with everything you stated except for the quoted item.
Second, the quoted item probably isn't wrong, I just think since you seemed to know what you're talking about I have to ask.

When I bought my card, it said 1.5Gigs (could be 3 gigs, not sure) of dedicated memory. I know that fairly good, (the cards a 580GTX, so yeah) and I know for a fact that I have 8 gigs of RAM (yeah its actually like 7 some odd number, but I digress, Hyperion is the type.) Yet, when I got to "Can you run it?" it says I have 4 gigs of dedicated memory on my graphics card.... That strikes me as kinda odd, and it has RAM listed elsewhere so i know its not confusing them... so it leads me to a WTF?

Can you explain this to me?

Possibility of shared memories. You have 1.5 gigs of dedicated, plus a partial amount of shared, in cases of over flow. Your total video memory is then increased to...whatever.

 

[Snowalker]

Possibility of shared memories. You have 1.5 gigs of dedicated, plus a partial amount of shared, in cases of over flow. Your total video memory is then increased to...whatever.

I see, I probably have a 3gig card then, cause it sharing 2.5 gigs is almost mind boggling... I wish there was a way to be certain of how much dedicated memory you have. Cause I got the card second hand, and it didn't have the box (Ebay).

 

[Phlakes]

Look up cards online and read some reviews/general info. Going by names only won't make any sense. On a somewhat related note-

Spoiler