Hair of the Dog

[Danzavare]

I don't dance, and I no nothing about art form. But I have watched So You Think You Can Dance just to see girls in skimpy costumes, jump around with firm sexy bodies. I don't take offense when the judges trash the dancers delivery.

I think everyone can admit the Expendables, and Hangover part 2, are mediocre and unsophisticated. so how can it hurt anyones feelings when someone who is openly an elitist movie critic, picks on these movies. IF you liked them that only means you are unsophisticated in the context of movie taste. This does not mean you are dumb, but when you are triggered to defend a mediocre movie with the threat of your personal identity in the balance. YOu do look kind of dumb. Just learn to live with the fact that you can enjoy things other can't. That makes you special.

I have to say, that's a perfect way to summerise the situation here! I agree, there's nothing inherently wrong with watching shallow or 'bad' movies and enjoying them. There is something wrong with assuming something suddenly becomes great just because you like it.

I loved Hangover 1 personally. I haven't seen the second, but I was already skeptical about it before reading/watching Bob's reviews of it. Really, his reviews just cement the fact that I don't want to justify its existence (I thought the first finished the story as good as it could) by paying to see it.

 

[Shjade]

Moreover, while being transexual certainly does not make one less than a human being, to a large percentage of people (including me) it is both quite gross and disturbing.

Would any straight males honestly say you would not be slightly disgusted bringing a girl home only to find out she had a little more than you bargained for?

Missing the point. You find it gross and disturbing, fine, okay. Is your finding them gross and disturbing funny? Probably not. We'd just watch you go AW MAN THAT'S NOT RIGHT and say okay so what and move on.

Think of it this way: you see someone with a visible physical deformity - say they're an amputee - that grosses you out. You turn to the people next to you and, pointing at the person in question, make a disgusted face while asking, "Do you see that? Man, that's hideous! What the fuck?"

Do you expect them to laugh, or to think you're a jackass?

 

[Cliff_m85]

Again, he doesn't get it. I'm not homophobic, but I don't want a cock in my ass. If someone told me they put their cock in my ass when I was drunk, I'd be shocked and disgusted.


Come on, dude. Stop the PC bullshit. I'm all willing for people to dress how they want and express their sexuality however they want, but we're talking about a CONSERVATIVE DENTIST who was shocked at marrying a hooker getting a dick in the ass. It's not about the dick, but the individual taking the dick.

I feel like Shakespeare.

 

[Cliff_m85]

Think of it this way. A Klansman finds a black chick in his bed after a heavy night of drinking. Are we laughing because the person is black? No. The situation is funny as the Klansman is a racist.


Come on Movie Bob.

 

[AWDMANOUT]

Moreover, while being transexual certainly does not make one less than a human being, to a large percentage of people (including me) it is both quite gross and disturbing.

Would any straight males honestly say you would not be slightly disgusted bringing a girl home only to find out she had a little more than you bargained for?

Missing the point. You find it gross and disturbing, fine, okay. Is your finding them gross and disturbing funny? Probably not. We'd just watch you go AW MAN THAT'S NOT RIGHT and say okay so what and move on.

Think of it this way: you see someone with a visible physical deformity - say they're an amputee - that grosses you out. You turn to the people next to you and, pointing at the person in question, make a disgusted face while asking, "Do you see that? Man, that's hideous! What the fuck?"

Do you expect them to laugh, or to think you're a jackass?

But the joke of the movie is not that being transexual is gross, it is that Stu unwillingly had sex with one of them.

If the person with the visible deformity walked up to me and asked, "Hey baby, wasn't last night great?", I would probably not only freak out but be laughed at by my friends as well.

 

[Therumancer]

With the whole transgender thing I feel to see the big issue with this gag. Winding up in bed with someone that you find repugnant is a stock gag. Granted it doesn't deserve any points from creativity, but the only way that you could possibly find this offensive is if your taking the rather extreme position that everyone is a bi-sexual in denial or something like that. Face it, MOST people are straight and not attracted to the same gender, either not getting the attraction, or being outright apalled. The obviously straight guy getting hammered out of his mind and winding up in bed with a transgender accidently, or taken advantage of by one while hammered, is funny, and for the overwhelming majority of viewers who are straight and not into that, it would be a rather gross situation. Like it or not crossdressing and so on is not something the majority of people are into. The overall situation is no differant than the standard rom com gag of some girl winding up in bed with some utterly repulsive beast of a guy after she got drug, being disgusted by it, and trying to sneak out before he wakes up and failing... and so on.

See, the only viable reason to complain here is if you are putting the transgender community on a pedestel. Your also pretty much claiming that a straight guy has no right to be repulsed if they were to find themselves in such a situation, as if to basically claim nobody has the right to be straight and to NOT like certain sex acts.

Okay, granted, I can see how a certain scene might not have worked for some people. However to decry a movie largely because it's not politically correct, especially a movie like this one, seems to be going a bit overboard.

I'll go one further, pick a sex act that you find repulsive, if your really tolerant maybe something involving feces, vor, or maybe both. You head out, get drunk, probably do some mind altering substances and wake up in the morning with a person while covered with feces and polaroids of you sticking your limbs down the throats of emaciated barnyard animals while having sex littered liberally around where you woke up, do you think your just going to go "oh gee, that's wonderful", no it's going to bloody freak you out. You can't say "that's differant, we're *only* talking about a transgender here" when no, it's really not, your turned off by what your turned off by, it doesn't matter what it is. If some really butch lesbian wakes up in frilly lingerie tied to a bed by a snoring muscle man it's a similar kind of gag since it's so disgusting and out of character for the person involved.

There is no reason why transgenders should be put up on a pedestel and prevented from being used for things like when when dealing with straight guys who frankly aren't into that, and would be disgusted to find that they were involved in such contact. There is nothing wrong with being straight.

 

[incal11]

I'll be damned if I'm called a bigot by anyone who's understanding of sexual orientation is that no one in an enlightened society even cares. Please, introduce yourself to some people offline, sexual identity is important to a lot of people that are perfectly fine with people of all other sexualities and gender identities.

In an enlightened society people are not just tolerant, they are accepting of difference, while of course you have your right to remain irked by certain practices. I guess it's hard for you to understand, there's a difference between
"Ew, eek (repeat for an hour)" the reaction of the guy in the movie
and
"damn it, I wish it had been a woman at least"
one answer is more mature and less bigoted, can you spot it ?

If the person with the visible deformity walked up to me and asked, "Hey baby, wasn't last night great?", I would probably not only freak out but be laughed at by my friends as well.

That would serve as a lesson that drinking too much just isn't worth it. As for the friends laughing, that's the "conformity police" in action:
http://www.heise.de/tp/artikel/2/2248/1.html

 

[Therumancer]

Moreover, while being transexual certainly does not make one less than a human being, to a large percentage of people (including me) it is both quite gross and disturbing.

Would any straight males honestly say you would not be slightly disgusted bringing a girl home only to find out she had a little more than you bargained for?

Missing the point. You find it gross and disturbing, fine, okay. Is your finding them gross and disturbing funny? Probably not. We'd just watch you go AW MAN THAT'S NOT RIGHT and say okay so what and move on.

Think of it this way: you see someone with a visible physical deformity - say they're an amputee - that grosses you out. You turn to the people next to you and, pointing at the person in question, make a disgusted face while asking, "Do you see that? Man, that's hideous! What the fuck?"

Do you expect them to laugh, or to think you're a jackass?

The differance here is that the guy apparently got so hammered on booze and possibly other mind altering substances where he actually went to bed with theis transgender without knowing it was a transgender. Nobody is just pointing and saying "that's gross and wrong" to an exagerrated degree just because it's a transgender, but because of the sex and the intoxication.

The only reason to make a big deal out of this is political correctness. The Hangover 2 is pretty much reusing one of the oldest gags in the book, which is when you get two people of obviously the wrong type together due to intoxication and then have at least one of them going "WTF" and freaking out. The exact nature of why one or both of the people are repelled is not important, it could be anything, as long as they are clearly not a matching pair and the intoxication was to blame. Saying that doing it with a transgender because it's a transgender is putting a specific group on a pedestel and saying "this is beyond criticism or being used for jokes" and I'm sorry, that's not right.

In the end there is nothing wrong with a straight guy being straight, and being grossed out if he found himself in a situation like that.

Of course Bob is right, this isn't exactly very deep or creative. However there is no reason to say there is anything wrong with it for being what it was. Truthfully, most straight people in a situation like that WOULD freak out.

All told it's probably most fair to say that "The Hangover 2 is a cash in sequel, weakly recycling gags from the first movie, while falling flat with what little new material it attempts".

On the other hand I do hope to see more of Mr. Frog and Mr. Rabbit, they were the most honest and sincere portrayals of representitives of a modern creative industry that I've
seen since ENN's Ryan Quickbender stopped giving us insights into the minds of the gaming industry. I hope to see more of them, I felt like I was right there in a board room, watching how modern movies get greenlit and made.

 

[Serge A. Storms]

I'll be damned if I'm called a bigot by anyone who's understanding of sexual orientation is that no one in an enlightened society even cares. Please, introduce yourself to some people offline, sexual identity is important to a lot of people that are perfectly fine with people of all other sexualities and gender identities.

In an enlightened society people are not just tolerant, they are accepting of difference, while of course you have your right to remain irked by certain practices. I guess it's hard for you to understand, there's a difference between
"Ew, eek (repeat for an hour)" the reaction of the guy in the movie
and
"damn it, I wish it had been a woman at least"
one answer is more mature and less bigoted, can you spot it ?

If the person with the visible deformity walked up to me and asked, "Hey baby, wasn't last night great?", I would probably not only freak out but be laughed at by my friends as well.

That would serve as a lesson that drinking too much just isn't worth it. As for the friends laughing, that's the "conformity police" in action:
http://www.heise.de/tp/artikel/2/2248/1.html

I'm guessing you've never slept with someone and regretted it, regardless of the circumstances.

 

[Andy of Comix Inc]

Homophobia and transphobia of any sort piss me off like nothing else, my ex-girlfriend being a transgender herself. Whenever people say "oh man, the Hangover 2 was some funny shit," I get really mad, now.

...thanks, Bob.

 

[AWDMANOUT]

If the person with the visible deformity walked up to me and asked, "Hey baby, wasn't last night great?", I would probably not only freak out but be laughed at by my friends as well.

That would serve as a lesson that drinking too much just isn't worth it. As for the friends laughing, that's the "conformity police" in action:
http://www.heise.de/tp/artikel/2/2248/1.html

Oh, that's odd... I thought it would be because I felt awkward and nervous from the unexpected situation, and my misfortune would be humorous to them.

But, no. They're... conforming? To what, exactly?

 

[Neosage]

In a fair world you'd be right bob, but this isn't a fair world, and transsexual jokes are funny. The film isn't trying to get you to imagine how it would feel to be a transsexual (it's comedy not some-sort of documentary about they're people too), it's trying to get you empathise with Stu after being

Spoiler

sodomized by a woman with a penis.

To the target audience this is funny and disgusting, hence the joke works in the way it does. I'm not homophobic, but I don't particularly want to have sex with men, there is a difference. It doesn't it makes me a bad person because I laughed.

 

[WhiteTigerShiro]

Yes, I get it, Bob. You don't like that scene about the transexual hooker.

Could you please move on to something else that's wrong with the film? Like how Ken Jeong can go crawl in a hole and never come out?

Dude, this is only the SECOND time he's mentioned it. Once in the review, where he had to talk about the movie, and once in this article where he has time to go into more detail about a particular scene he mentioned because a lot of people didn't get why he hated the scene so much. At least wait until a month from now when he's mentioned it in every review from now until then, sorta like how he was banging-on about Expendables for a while.

 

[incal11]

Oh, that's odd... I thought it would be because I felt awkward and nervous from the unexpected situation, and my misfortune would be humorous to them.

I couldn't be sure whether it was because of this or because you and your friends would be especially grossed out by the guy's "deformity". If it's really just that then it's ok.
As for conforming, that's a bit of a separate issue. Ever tried to be accepting of someone's excentricities and got laughed at as a result ? That's what I was talking about.

 

[Booze Zombie]

I've never watched either film and to be quite frank, I never plan to, but I can see where your displeasure with this film comes from. As I read the article, I could already hear the comments being bashed out in response...

"A middle-class white man who watches movies for a living complaining about bigotry, HAR, HAR, it is to laugh! What would someone with that resume of life experiences know about bigotry? You damn self-rightious crusader!"

On my way down to the comments box here, I did indeed see a comment pretty much like the one I mockingly created there. It's quite easy to say that white American males are "feeling guilty" and crusading against anything that's remotely offensive... but then, aren't you just dismissing their views based soley on their being male, white and middle-class? Isn't that bigotry?

 

[Mister Linton]

Because in your magical fairytale politically correct future everyone is bisexual and doesn't think it makes a difference which gender they sleep with while intoxicated?

Pretty much, since you're intoxicated anyway. I don't see why slightly more tolerance is a "magical fairytale", and technically speaking the "politically correct" one here is you

A person's tolerance has nothing to do with their sexual orientation. Having a sexual preference does not make someone a bigot.

 

[incal11]

A person's tolerance has nothing to do with their sexual orientation. Having a sexual preference does not make someone a bigot.

Quite right, but I was only making a point in relation to that movie. Getting especially disgusted by someone's difference is being a bigot, same for enjoying a stupid movie on that topic a bit too much.

 

[cerealnmuffin]

Doubt you would see this Bob, but wanted to say it anyway. I enjoy your videos, but you really won my respect calling out that transphobic bigotry. As someone who is trans and who happened to nearly be killed over that fact, it saddens me when people are are like 'it's just trying to be funny no harm done' because harm is done every time mass media okays bigotry and perpetuates a feeling of you can do whatever to that sort of people cause they aren't "human". That same attitude some people have almost cost me my life a few years ago. If the movie featured a scene where the audience is encouraged to cheer on racism then people would have demanded it to be yanked from the theaters... but don't see how any one can defend such blatant bigotry. It's not about not being able to take a joke, my trans friends and I joke about all the stuff one has to go through and can make light on a difficult time, but the humor doesn't center around making it okay to consider a person a thing to be repulsed by. Someone mentioned they would make jokes back and forth about one another... it's done out of love and respect... stuff like this is done at the expense of others without a care how they feel.

So I applaud you Bob. Thanks for being on this site, standing up for others, and I hope you keep making videos esp the big picture ones for a long time. ^^

 

[incal11]

And I have to also disagree that in a perfect world that no one would be made fun of for X characteristic. I think that in a perfect world everyone could make fun of everyone else equally without anyone getting whiny about it.

That's not what I was trying to say but it's right. Except one could hope this fun wouldn't rest on more or less repressed phobia (homophobia in the case of the movie, and that the mockery wouldn't be a consequence of discrimination but of productive criticism.