Can we make it against forum rules to make threads like this? I'm serious. We see one every couple of weeks and it's all the same.
Half Life not that great?
- Thread starter cjspyres
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Nobody's actually answering the OPs question which was essentially to those who like Half Life, why do you like it/what makes it so good?
I'd actually like to see that answered rather than people just say "it's fantastic", because I'm genuinely interested as to what makes it so good, I get bored very quickly on those games.
I'd actually like to see that answered rather than people just say "it's fantastic", because I'm genuinely interested as to what makes it so good, I get bored very quickly on those games.
I think if you read between the lines it's obvious, ppl like HL1 because it was the first game to successfully marry plot and immersion with action to make a FPS which is both intresting to be in and explore aswell as the combat. Much of what makes the game good is lost from a modern gamers perspective because the same elements can be found in so many 1st and 2nd rate FPS games over the years but i'll list them.Midgeamoo said:
The start, Black Mesa itself is both intresting and varied and the Zen world, the set pieces and scripted dialog (little to no cutscenes), the different factions: scientists, security guards, aliens, army, the man in black. Friendly AI that follows and fights with you, fighting the army and its AI with the tanks and grenades (those sections are like a proto military shooter) the intresting weapons, the intresting monsters and boss monsters like that big one that chases you and you have to dial in its position for an airstikes. The mine cart ride, helicopters, crowbar, crates and ventshafts that are used skillfully in level design which was superb the correct ballance of open and linear (IIRC with no stages, no loading so the gameworld is connected and singular) Oh and the suit itelf. And the multiple choice ending.
HL1 does ALOT of things and ballances it all very well, most FPS's might take elements from HL and improve upon then, but how many are as varied and intresting enough to make 2 addons that is basically the same black mesa and events but seen from a different perspective? The hughly successfull Opposing Forces where you play as an army grunt and not the not so successful Blue Shift that you play as Barny the Security Guard.
For marrying action to a plot and story i'll take a 15+ YO HL1 over the cutscened riddled and badly paced Max Payne 3 any day.
Could be people are getting "worked up" over these types of threads because they're sick and tired of seeing them every week. (seriously, look at almost any weeks worth of threads on here going back to at least 2007 and you'll notice that there's at least one "Half-Life sucks" thread in each week)erttheking said:
Think of it this way. What's your favorite game/movie/show/etc? Well, whatever it is, let's imagine that someone on this forum decides to start a thread wherein the whole point of their post is to lambast your favorite "thing"; calling it horrible/stupid/over-hyped/whatever; and to insult you and anyone else that likes it.
Now, if you were like most people, you'd probably just brush it off. Thinking to yourself, "Meh. Just someone trying to stir up controversy. I can ignore them." However, now imagine you saw this same thread at least once a week for five fucking years straight.
Something tells me you'd get quite sick of seeing them. This is how most Half-Life fans feel on this forum. To use the old vernacular, these threads are "beating a dead horse". Just as bad, any genuine discussion on the topic (like, perhaps this thread) end up getting lost in the sea of vitriolic hate towards the game or fans. Even worse, there almost seems to be a degree of support from the site mods and owners in this over-all zeal to troll the Half-Life fans. I could link you several news posts with titles specifically designed to "troll". (I could, but most were changed due to user reactions)
But didn't you know? Subjectivity is the new objectivity. Something is only "good" if you like it.TheKasp said:
In which case, by my reckoning, Bioshock is a horrifically designed game and The Godfather is one of the most piss-poorly directed films ever.
(caveat: they most certainly are not)
Also this. But then, as I've said many times in the past, I've come to expect a "Half-Life sucks" thread just about every week. So...unless the OP is actually genuine in their questioning, nothing new here people. As you were.shoddyworksucks said:
(if the OP is, then he/she needs to bare this in mind: "To each their own.")
Well said. I feel I should quote you just so others are more likely to see what you've said; as it bears repeating.Xanadu84 said:
In a lot of ways, the Half-Life series is greater than the sum of it's "parts". While one can nitpick that one part isn't that "amazing" on it's own, the fact that Valve married all of those parts so seamlessly helps that "part" equate to an amazing whole. That same level of craftsmanship is rare in the industry (though certainly not exclusive), so in general we praise it when we see it.
It's the same reason many of us praise the likes of Irrational, Bioware, and Naughty Dog. It's not just because we're fans of their games (and in some cases, not even that), it's because we recognize the quality of their skill in their craft.
It's amazing enough in my opinion, to be a part of my skin as a tattoo. The world and detail is amazing, the characters are likable and not cliche, the story is interesting and the paste it all moves on keeps you on the edge of your seat the whole time, especially in part 2. THe first one leaned more on creating an incredible atmosphere and generating most of the big questions. 2 anwsered some, hinted at some and asked more, all the while having an incredible story about the fight for humanity, rebellion against fascism and police state. Freedom. It's amazing. Truly a one-of-a-kind experience and I find something new to love about it every time I play it again.
EDIT: I would like to link you guys to a show by everyones favorite THe Escapist-columnist, Shamus Young! These guys explain it better than anyone:
EDIT: I would like to link you guys to a show by everyones favorite THe Escapist-columnist, Shamus Young! These guys explain it better than anyone:
It's not that they're bad. I love the Half Life games, that said, I do think they are overrated. A bit like Final Fantasy VII.
Very well said good sir. I just recently (like two weeks ago) finished 2, 2:1, and 2:2 and I quite liked them. But I do see how some games have advanced beyond that. It's still a landmark franchise though. I may not like CoD that much (I used to) but I recognize and respect the impact it has on gaming.Ryotknife said:
This^Ryotknife said:
Now it can be seen as a generic shooter, but I remember when I played it right after the release, I was lucky enough to get a new PC that could run it on high quality. Hell, it was so awesome, it wasn't something you see every day, and graphics even surpassed pre-rendered cutscenes in other games which came before and after HL 2. I also remember when I got a CD of HL1: Blue Shift, it was a short game but it was an epic experience with awesome effects and cool gameplay (back then we had Quake and Doom 2) it was hell of a fun... When Episodes came out the graphics was boosted to be first games to introduce radial lighting system, which made my PC cramp whenever I turn on the flashlight, it was still awesome. I guess I wasn't spoiler by today's games back then and I see how many of younger generation can perceive HL series as generic. HL started shooters you see now
I honestly have no idea why people rave over it. Even when the Orange Box came out, I didn't see what the big deal was. Maybe it was ruined for me because I watched my friend do the stupid gnome challenge. Most boring 3 hours of my life.
Also, I think the cliffhanger ending is even worse than Halo 2's. It just felt like they went for shocking for almost no reason. They should have opened Half Life 3 with the death instead. That way, the villainy of the enemy would be fresh in the player's mind. Honestly, after this long of a wait, I just don't really care much about how it ends. The shock value wore off along time ago and I'm left with an overall feeling of meh.
Also, I think the cliffhanger ending is even worse than Halo 2's. It just felt like they went for shocking for almost no reason. They should have opened Half Life 3 with the death instead. That way, the villainy of the enemy would be fresh in the player's mind. Honestly, after this long of a wait, I just don't really care much about how it ends. The shock value wore off along time ago and I'm left with an overall feeling of meh.
What? People actually like Shamus Young?! Granted I've only read two of his articles but they were two of biggest piles of crap I've ever subjected my eyes to.Vkmies said:
You have to grow up with the games to appreciate them fully. The reason why Half-Life is so loved is because it revolutionised the FPS genre. Of course, now that many games have copied it to some extent, it doesn't seem like anything special.cjspyres said:
In my eyes it's a triumph of narration. Half Life 1 was one of the first shooters to forgo the traditional level structure and present us with a seamless adventure in one big world. Then Half Life 2 came along and perfected that.
HL2 also added storytelling through environment; a lot of the backstory and lore about the world can be deduced from the game itself. Until Metro 2033 I still hadn't seen a game that did that at least as well as HL2 did. It's still one of the most atmospheric games I've ever played.
Gameplay-wise it's not that big of a deal. At the time the AI was pretty good, but in that area it has been surpassed already.
HL2 also added storytelling through environment; a lot of the backstory and lore about the world can be deduced from the game itself. Until Metro 2033 I still hadn't seen a game that did that at least as well as HL2 did. It's still one of the most atmospheric games I've ever played.
Gameplay-wise it's not that big of a deal. At the time the AI was pretty good, but in that area it has been surpassed already.
No, they're not that good.
The newest Half-Life game came out almost five years ago.
The one everyone holds the highest praise to (Half Life 2) came out around eight years ago.
The first one came out around fourteen years ago.
It's outdated. There isn't much variation between the gameplay from Half-Life 2 to Episode 1. The original is really outdated, repetitive, not that good, and gray. I've had a lot more fun with the game by loading up GMod and replaying the levels with a bunch of weapons I've downloaded.
The newest Half-Life game came out almost five years ago.
The one everyone holds the highest praise to (Half Life 2) came out around eight years ago.
The first one came out around fourteen years ago.
It's outdated. There isn't much variation between the gameplay from Half-Life 2 to Episode 1. The original is really outdated, repetitive, not that good, and gray. I've had a lot more fun with the game by loading up GMod and replaying the levels with a bunch of weapons I've downloaded.
When I finally make my millions I'm going to invest at least half of my money into creating a two week course that will be mandatory for all gamers to teach them the difference between subjective and objective.
You're preaching to the choir, my friend. Even if I didn't like the Half-Life series I'd still argue it's place in gaming history. Much of what we come to expect in game design today; gameplay-wise; likely had it's start or inspiration in many of the things Valve has done in Half-Life.TheKasp said:
Like I said in my previous post, I'm not really a fan of Bioshock. The game-play just didn't suit me. It had it's flaws. However, I'll be one of the first to trumpet it's amazing design and one of the first to herald it as one of the greatest artistic achievements in gaming.
This, I think, is the issue a lot of people have. They simply can not grasp the difference between objectivity and subjectivity. Most people think: If they don't like something, then that something is "bad". And, if they like something, that something is "good".
Their sole gauge on the quality and craftsmanship of something is how they like it.
That, my friends, is an opinion; not a critique.
The sooner people realize this, realize that an opinion (though we're all granted one by right) is NOT the same as a critique. You are more than welcome to hate something that is good, and to like something that is bad. God knows, I dislike plenty of well-made things and adore plenty of poorly made things. I mean, hell, I absolutely love Tron: Legacy and the Evil Dead movies. Yet, I'll be the first person to tell you they were most definitely not good films. But, unlike most, I don't let that ruin my enjoyment of those films.
Why? Because I know the difference between an opinion and a critique. Something I wish more people could see as well.
Don't you use that word. That word is incorrect! I'd say that the opinion that it is great is over-vocalized and over-stated, but I think it is a great game; I'd say it holds up as a great game.Irreducible Sohn said:
Not really. If anything, a majority of this forum are fans of the series.Lumber Barber said:
The problem is, the minority that aren't are so fervent in their hate, so vitriolic in their disgust of everything relating to the games, that they simply drown out everyone else. They are the only ones who constantly (and by constantly I mean a weekly basis) start up Half-Life related threads. Simply to be mean, cruel, and to stir up controversy. Whereas most of the fans are just sick and tired of having to see these same people constantly berate them for liking the series.
It'd be quite aggravating if it weren't so pathetically hypocritical. More often than not, one of the biggest complaints these people leverage on the fans of the series is that, "they're tired of hearing people constantly talk about and praise these games".
The irony (or hypocrisy) of it is, they're the only ones fucking constantly bringing it up.
What's even more disturbing is, more and more, it seems like the mods on the forums either turn a blind to or actively encourage these sorts of threads.
Well I'll be damned...Monsterfurby said:
Someone who DOES appreciate the difference. Good sir, I do believe I owe you either a box of cookies, a case of beer, or a delicious cake. Your pick.