Han Solo You're Getting Old
- Thread starter tendo82
- Start date
When a specific archetype (in this case, I believe Lovable Rogue [http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/LoveableRogue?from=Main.LovableRogue] fits the bill) becomes overused, however, it becomes stale. To the common man, something is cliched when it's overused to the point of being stale. We can agree that just about every modern adventure story has its Lovable Rogue; the writer was driving more at the fact that the archetype is being overused and is getting old.GonzoGamer said:
Look at some popular games. Most of them have that Lovable Rogue somewhere in the game, especially in Western RPGs. In KOTOR2, you have Atton (He was a failed attempt at a Lovable Rogue, turned out to be more like an Affable Villain or an Anti-Hero, depending on whether you followed the Dark side or not), for example. I personally haven't played Mass Effect, but there is not a doubt in my mind that it has a Lovable Rogue somewhere in the story.
The truth is, the archetype is being overused and has become cliched. Just like the "Paragon of Virtue" cliche created, maintained, and symbolized by Superman [http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Comicbook/Superman?from=Main.Superman]. "Cliche" and "archetype" are not mutually exclusive, and it's simply foolish to think of them as such.
I don't like Todd McFarlane because of his awful characters, Venom, Carnage, Spawn etc. Hate em' All.xmetatr0nx said:
Also how is the Spawn style of character under used? Kratos from God of War is VERY similar to Spawn. He has a damn similar back story, damn similar capabilities... all he's missing is the cape and the Christian Mythology.
Actually there isn't, suprisingly, unless that's how you decide to play the main character and even then you kind of need to work at it. The Morality system of Mass Effect is based more around the Dirty Harry vs. Captain America dynamic than good or evil.Flying-Emu said:
I am of the opinion that a do gooder can still be done well and so can a anti-hero. Storywise, a character can be only a hero or an anti-hero. Otherwise he would jump to the other side, the villain side.
What Tom Endo is seeing is bad storytelling. If a character is gruff just for the sake of it, then, yes, the term 'emo' would suffice. (Prince of persia 2 I'm glaring at you). Han solo was a rather 'light' anti-hero. He didn't really harm others and his main fault was that he was lazy when it came to helping others. All he really did wrong was not be the goody two shoes.
There's still deeper to go, such as characters like Sherlock Holmes, who make you question the boundaries of morality (or Dr House from House MD, who is inspired by Holmes), a depth not really explored by star wars. Or hardly any game for that matter.
What would be nice for game developers that want to tell a story to do a little research into what makes a story good and hire writers with gaming experience.
The result will be a game that tells a story in a game way. It won't bring back mainstream adventure games (good riddance!), but it will bring back what we most enjoyed about adventure games: Witty writing and enjoyable stories.
What Tom Endo is seeing is bad storytelling. If a character is gruff just for the sake of it, then, yes, the term 'emo' would suffice. (Prince of persia 2 I'm glaring at you). Han solo was a rather 'light' anti-hero. He didn't really harm others and his main fault was that he was lazy when it came to helping others. All he really did wrong was not be the goody two shoes.
There's still deeper to go, such as characters like Sherlock Holmes, who make you question the boundaries of morality (or Dr House from House MD, who is inspired by Holmes), a depth not really explored by star wars. Or hardly any game for that matter.
What would be nice for game developers that want to tell a story to do a little research into what makes a story good and hire writers with gaming experience.
The result will be a game that tells a story in a game way. It won't bring back mainstream adventure games (good riddance!), but it will bring back what we most enjoyed about adventure games: Witty writing and enjoyable stories.
My point is that it's always been an overused because its a necessary archetype... usually. Since before Star Wars, since before Jane Austin, since even before Shakespeare. They all (over)used the "lovable rogue" archetype because it's a necessary character in most themes; of course how necessary depends on their ultimate function: sacrifice, reform, or just levity.Flying-Emu said:
Can you name a few of that archetype from pre, oh, we'll go with pre-Industrial Revolution? I'm curious; I don't see many lovable rogues in Shakespearean-type work.GonzoGamer said:
I agree, spawn is a very under appreciated comic character. Even though the movie was shit, the comics and that cartoon they had on HBO years ago was amazing.xmetatr0nx said:
Balthier sucked me into Final Fantasy XII harder than a vacuum cleaner after a night of drinking.tendo82 said:
Sounds like a Tony Scott movie with Harvey Keitel.Krakyn said:
So the question is, what will be the next popular character-type? Do we keep going down into the blackness or find something refreshing with a true hero? I wouldn't mind seeing more like Blade, except anybody that doesn't get Blade would only make the character cheesy.
As for a true hero, we have Harry Potter, who still finds wonder in the things he experiences, and is striving to defeat the evil without falling into the same darkness.
