Hobbit Casting Agent Fired For Dismissing Non-White Hobbits

[Elf Defiler Korgan]

It's a sensitive topic to be sure, but Hobbits are fair-skinned. A little white-slacker people, smoking dope, brewing mead, picking vegetables and far from the Southron or the Easterlings in colouration.

I'm going to have to say it, in the world of Tolkien, the only dark-skinned people are the goblins, the orcs and their allies. They are spread out, but concentrated in the south, south-east and far east. They get dark indeed, but they are the bad guys. Colouration in Tolkien is influenced by climate, geography and merging a fantasy world with the real world in that south of europe you get Africa, east of europe you get the browning middle east.

A touchy subject to be sure. Alas it is a mythos where the good guys are the white guys. On Dwarves they are so far north, that is also the reason they aren't tanned to black.

Read Tolkien. According to his own words, the Harfoot Hobbits are "brown-skinned."

Yeah I saw your post. So how many Hobbits are Harfoot Hobbits? Were there Harfoot Hobbits in the films thus far? Would it be plain weird to insert them in the up-coming film? When an English 20th century writer like Tolkien says certain types of Hobbits are brown-skinned, how brown are we talking? Northern European I work in a field brown, or Lebanese brown, or Middle Africa brown? We are going to need some more specificity.

 

[SlasherX]

But arent all the hobbits white any way wtf is the problem, they were all white in the lord of the rings movies so WTF, its like saying "I want african villagers" then you say you want only black people, a very resonable request and then you get fired for not having white villager, WTF, and anyway it was written during the 1940's and everyone was racist so there wouldn't be any black people anyway.

half troll half serious, hobbits are supposed to be white

Read Tolkien. According to his own words, the Harfoot Hobbits are "brown-skinned."

This movie isn't being based on another movie, it's being based on Tolkien's book. There are these thing called "books." You ever read one? If not, try it sometime. You may be pleasantly surprised. It can be a quite enjoyable experience. If you're new to books, I suggest you start out with the "Dick and Jane" series. They're really cool. They've got a dog named Spot. And every page has a picture of Dick and Jane. Sometimes the picture's of Dick and Jane with their dog, Spot. I think you'll like them.

You sir epic fail, I was obviously talking about the book since I said written in the 1940's and I was pointing out the fact that in the LoR movies the hobbits where all white and no one raised a stink, in fact basically every member of the cast was white you stupid shit, and the reason you know what is in Dick and Jane books is because that is all you can read you illiterate fuck, I am a more acomplished reader and published writer, unlike your fail-ass who sits in his mother basement, and he said "Tan-skinned" which would imply a white complexion darkened by the sun

 

[JDKJ]

While I disagree with the idea of racism, aren't all the Tooks lightskinned anyway?

I mean, I've no problem with there being Asian-descent Stoutfellows, but Bilbo et al are all meant to be near anaemic.

This was my thought. Sure, it's considered racist to tell someone they can't be a hobbit just 'cause they aren't "white" enough, but can anyone view Bilbo Baggins played by Deep Roy? Years of his portrayal as a dwarfed (medical term, not the race) human have always painted him as a jolly caucasian. Tolkien identified with the hobbits more than any race, since he grew up from a poor and distinctly rural background. So it's safe to assume he saw at least some of them as white.
Then there is continuity. Most of us who will see The Hobbit have also by now seen The Lord of the Rings Trilogy So we all say Ian Holm as Bilbo. While another person as Bilbo is all too likely, if we go from a white male to a black male, there will be some who will feel confused, betrayed, cheated, or a combination of all three. Ian Holm did well as Bilbo, and I think fans will only accept someone who can pass as his younger self. But maybe I don't have as much faith in the fans as others.

I guess all I have to say is while I am glad they will consider other ethnic groups for hobbits, I don't want Deep Roy as Bilbo. That would just seem wrong.

But the Tooks aren't the only clan that I imagine the movie will have to to represent. It may well have to represent the Harfoot Hobbits. And Harfoot Hobbits are brown-skinned.

 

[JDKJ]

But arent all the hobbits white any way wtf is the problem, they were all white in the lord of the rings movies so WTF, its like saying "I want african villagers" then you say you want only black people, a very resonable request and then you get fired for not having white villager, WTF, and anyway it was written during the 1940's and everyone was racist so there wouldn't be any black people anyway.

half troll half serious, hobbits are supposed to be white

Read Tolkien. According to his own words, the Harfoot Hobbits are "brown-skinned."

This movie isn't being based on another movie, it's being based on Tolkien's book. There are these thing called "books." You ever read one? If not, try it sometime. You may be pleasantly surprised. It can be a quite enjoyable experience. If you're new to books, I suggest you start out with the "Dick and Jane" series. They're really cool. They've got a dog named Spot. And every page has a picture of Dick and Jane. Sometimes the picture's of Dick and Jane with their dog, Spot. I think you'll like them.

You sir epic fail, I was obviously talking about the book since I said written in the 1940's and I was pointing out the fact that in the LoR movies the hobbits where all white and no one raised a stink, in fact basically every member of the cast was white you stupid shit, and the reason you know what is in Dick and Jane books is because that is all you can read you illiterate fuck, I am a more acomplished reader and published writer, unlike your fail-ass who sits in his mother basement, and he said "Tan-skinned" which would imply a white complexion darkened by the sun

Just because your poorly-written posts appear on the Escapist is no legitimate basis to lay claim to being a "published writer." That's not at all what the term means.

And Tolkien never said "tanned-skinned." His exact words were that the Harfoot Hobbits were "browner in skin." Is that what you call being an "accomplished reader?" Not knowing the difference between what actually appears in a book and what you think appears in a book? If so, I'm going to once again recommend you to the "Dick and Jane" series. Once you've mastered "Dick and Jane," perhaps you can move up to "The Cat in the Hat" by Dr. Seuss. But try to creep before you crawl. Don't bite off more than you can chew.

 

[JDKJ]

It's a sensitive topic to be sure, but Hobbits are fair-skinned. A little white-slacker people, smoking dope, brewing mead, picking vegetables and far from the Southron or the Easterlings in colouration.

I'm going to have to say it, in the world of Tolkien, the only dark-skinned people are the goblins, the orcs and their allies. They are spread out, but concentrated in the south, south-east and far east. They get dark indeed, but they are the bad guys. Colouration in Tolkien is influenced by climate, geography and merging a fantasy world with the real world in that south of europe you get Africa, east of europe you get the browning middle east.

A touchy subject to be sure. Alas it is a mythos where the good guys are the white guys. On Dwarves they are so far north, that is also the reason they aren't tanned to black.

Read Tolkien. According to his own words, the Harfoot Hobbits are "brown-skinned."

Yeah I saw your post. So how many Hobbits are Harfoot Hobbits? Were there Harfoot Hobbits in the films thus far? Would it be plain weird to insert them in the up-coming film? When an English 20th century writer like Tolkien says certain types of Hobbits are brown-skinned, how brown are we talking? Northern European I work in a field brown, or Lebanese brown, or Middle Africa brown? We are going to need some more specificity.

Assuming there is a role for a Harfoot Hobbit in the movie, then, regardless of degree of brown, it'll require someone brown if they're gonna be true to Tolkien's vision. How brown, I dunno. But some sorta brown seems clear.

And the LOTR films thus far don't hew very closely to Tolkien's original source materials. They take huge poetic license.

 

[Kyp]

What a load of crap. This is why desrcimination laws are broken. If your non-white and you don't get what you want, all you have to do is play th race card. If I remember correctly, the only dark-skinned people in the LOTR books were the humans that worked for Sauron.

I wish that this wasn't put in such a way, as it makes the entire book's premise seem racist: the dark-skinned people only worked for the evil guy. The reason that these people were darker-skinned was due to their orientation in the world: the southern lands.

However, I would love to give major kudos to the guy who mentioned the Harfoots were of darker skin tone. I suppose I improperly stated before that all hobbitts were meant to be britans; I meant to say that the Shire was meant to be like Britain. Apologies for my misstep.

Another thing that I've heard mentioned a couple times is that there were no pakistanis (and thus, according to my reading of the logic inherent in these posts, no darker-skinned people) in Europe during the medieval period. As anyone who has studied Western civilization will tell you, the moors (a tanner group of people) were firmly established in Europe during that period of time.

Finally, someone mentioned that we have likely all pictured the characters from Lord of the Rings as though they were white and I'd like to say (as someone of Italian and Irish descent) I actually pictured Aragorn as more of a Mediterranean-looking person. It's truly all a matter of perspective and personal interpretation. Such is the joy of fiction.

 

[JDKJ]

What a load of crap. This is why desrcimination laws are broken. If your non-white and you don't get what you want, all you have to do is play th race card. If I remember correctly, the only dark-skinned people in the LOTR books were the humans that worked for Sauron.

I wish that this wasn't put in such a way, as it makes the entire book's premise seem racist: the dark-skinned people only worked for the evil guy. The reason that these people were darker-skinned was due to their orientation in the world: the southern lands.

However, I would love to give major kudos to the guy who mentioned the Harfoots were of darker skin tone. I suppose I improperly stated before that all hobbitts were meant to be britans; I meant to say that the Shire was meant to be like Britain. Apologies for my misstep.

Another thing that I've heard mentioned a couple times is that there were no pakistanis (and thus, according to my reading of the logic inherent in these posts, no darker-skinned people) in Europe during the medieval period. As anyone who has studied Western civilization will tell you, the moors (a tanner group of people) were firmly established in Europe during that period of time.

Finally, someone mentioned that we have likely all pictured the characters from Lord of the Rings as though they were white and I'd like to say (as someone of Italian and Irish descent) I actually pictured Aragorn as more of a Mediterranean-looking person. It's truly all a matter of perspective and personal interpretation. Such is the joy of fiction.

Yep. That guy wins the thread.

 

[Elf Defiler Korgan]

What a load of crap. This is why desrcimination laws are broken. If your non-white and you don't get what you want, all you have to do is play th race card. If I remember correctly, the only dark-skinned people in the LOTR books were the humans that worked for Sauron.

I wish that this wasn't put in such a way, as it makes the entire book's premise seem racist: the dark-skinned people only worked for the evil guy. The reason that these people were darker-skinned was due to their orientation in the world: the southern lands.

However, I would love to give major kudos to the guy who mentioned the Harfoots were of darker skin tone. I suppose I improperly stated before that all hobbitts were meant to be britans; I meant to say that the Shire was meant to be like Britain. Apologies for my misstep.

Another thing that I've heard mentioned a couple times is that there were no pakistanis (and thus, according to my reading of the logic inherent in these posts, no darker-skinned people) in Europe during the medieval period. As anyone who has studied Western civilization will tell you, the moors (a tanner group of people) were firmly established in Europe during that period of time.

Finally, someone mentioned that we have likely all pictured the characters from Lord of the Rings as though they were white and I'd like to say (as someone of Italian and Irish descent) I actually pictured Aragorn as more of a Mediterranean-looking person. It's truly all a matter of perspective and personal interpretation. Such is the joy of fiction.

Well put. especially on the Moors. Although the presence of Moors in Europe would differ; compare say Middle England and Denmark to southern France or Sicily. It will be interesting to see where the casting goes given the recent troubles. Do they become thoroughly inclusive, or do they take another path?

 

[Fearzone]

Ghetto Hobbits!!! Buckwheat Took and Sassafrass Underfoot.

 

[JDKJ]

Ghetto Hobbits!!! Buckwheat Took and Sassafrass Underfoot.

Makes perfect sense. They did lay around the crib all day, smoking weed and drinking malt liquor.

 

[Waif]

As far as I am aware. The original books of J.R. Tolkien never had any colored hobbits. I don't think this is discrimination based on prejudice, rather, keeping to the original spirit of the novel. Naz Humphreys appears to be playing the race card, and it was easily predicted that she would do so. The ironic part of it is, that in by forcing your skin color into a fictional culture whereas such a provision was never made, is racist in itself. It does not respect the cultural heritage of the native hobbit. Maybe just ethnocentric?

How exactly can you determine the color of the skin of all Hobbits from a book? From what I remember, I have never read where it would indicate one way or the other. And why is it not perfectly acceptable to have a black dwarf or dark skinned Hobbit?

I've always found it amusing that the closer you are to good and light, the paler your skin and the closer to evil and darkness, the darker your skin. Obviously pigmentation works in reverse in the fantasy realm, or maybe it's just a kind of evolution - better to hide from beasties in the dark by being black? That's funny, I've always found it hard to discern colors in the dark...

I never said that there was anything wrong with a dark skinned dwarf or hobbit, however, they have always been shown as light skinned in LoTR. If you read back, you will see that I am not the only one who has this perception. I don't feel it would be truthful to the series to have a black hobbit, not because I don't think there is anything wrong with the idea, but it is part of the mythos of LoTR. In fact another person explained this in quite nice detail:

"Obviously, there are no blacks in the land of Middle Earth and it's stories because it is derived entirely of Anglo-saxen (which Tolkein was a proffessor of at Oxford University) Celtic, and Norse lore which were all of the white race.

You see, the entire world of Middle Earth is based upon the mythology of these, and so it would be absurded to add a black character to the story. Middle Earth is, as a fantasy, supposed to be Europe, or more specificaly England, tens of thousands of years ago in a time that was lost and unknown to us - a place of lore and magic.

All of the characters in the book are English folk, and English culture is throughout it.

Imagine a fantasy written about the ancient history of Africa, it's people, and it's culture. Would you expect any whites to be there? Of course not. The same goes for The Lord of the Rings.

I assure you, it has nothing to do with racism or the ideals of discrimination very common in Tolkein's time. Any who suggest it know nothing of The Lord of the Rings."

Hobbits and the concepts around them are based in Europe particularly the English culture, which of course is the inspiration behind it. If you have problems with this, you could bring this up with Mr. Tolkien, if he weren't dead right now. I don't see the real connections of light and dark, good and evil. I do know that many people believe these things, but good and evil are concepts, and colors can't do much in the way of representing these concepts. Not sure why you quoted my post when many others said essentially the same thing.

 

[Orcus The Ultimate]

While I disagree with the idea of racism, aren't all the Tooks lightskinned anyway?

I mean, I've no problem with there being Asian-descent Stoutfellows, but Bilbo et al are all meant to be near anaemic.

maybe some Haradrim passed by...

 

[lord.jeff]

It's common to cast by ethnicity in fact talent search sites have a it as one of the search options.

 

[AngryPuppy]

In between all the bile being spewed did anyone mention how there ARE dark skinned hobbits mentioned in the books, Harfoots if memory serves? I didn't make it past the first page, sorry if it was mentioned.

The Harfoots are one of the three races of Hobbits.

The Harfoots were the most common of Hobbits, and in their earliest known history they lived in the lower foothills of the Misty Mountains in the Vale of Anduin, in an area roughly bounded by the Gladden River in the south and the small forested region where later was the Eagles Eyrie near the High Pass to the north.

They were browner of skin than the other Hobbits, had no beards, and did not wear any footwear. They lived in holes they called Smials, a habit which they long preserved. They were also on very friendly terms with the Dwarves, who travelled through the High Pass on the Great Road.

The Harfoots were the first to migrate westward into Arnor, and it was to them that the name Periannath or Halflings was first applied by the Dúnedain when they were first recorded in Arnorian records around TA 1050 of the Third Age. They tended to settle down for long times, and founded numerous villages as far as Weathertop.

By the 1300s of the Third Age they had reached Bree, which long was the most western village of any Hobbits.

The Harfoots were joined between TA 1150 and TA 1300 by the Fallohides and some Stoors. The Harfoots took Fallohides, a bolder race, as their leaders.

When The Shire was colonized in TA 1601 most of its people were Harfoots.

http://lotr.wikia.com/wiki/Harfoots

 

[RoBi3.0]

In between all the bile being spewed did anyone mention how there ARE dark skinned hobbits mentioned in the books, Harfoots if memory serves? I didn't make it past the first page, sorry if it was mentioned.

The Harfoots are one of the three races of Hobbits.

The Harfoots were the most common of Hobbits, and in their earliest known history they lived in the lower foothills of the Misty Mountains in the Vale of Anduin, in an area roughly bounded by the Gladden River in the south and the small forested region where later was the Eagles Eyrie near the High Pass to the north.

They were browner of skin than the other Hobbits, had no beards, and did not wear any footwear. They lived in holes they called Smials, a habit which they long preserved. They were also on very friendly terms with the Dwarves, who travelled through the High Pass on the Great Road.

The Harfoots were the first to migrate westward into Arnor, and it was to them that the name Periannath or Halflings was first applied by the Dúnedain when they were first recorded in Arnorian records around TA 1050 of the Third Age. They tended to settle down for long times, and founded numerous villages as far as Weathertop.

By the 1300s of the Third Age they had reached Bree, which long was the most western village of any Hobbits.

The Harfoots were joined between TA 1150 and TA 1300 by the Fallohides and some Stoors. The Harfoots took Fallohides, a bolder race, as their leaders.

When The Shire was colonized in TA 1601 most of its people were Harfoots.

http://lotr.wikia.com/wiki/Harfoots

It was mentioned but apparently people don't care. Cause HOBBITS!!!!! ARE WHITE!!!!!!! no matter if Tolkien specifically stated that they were of many skin tones.

 

[Elizabeth Grunewald]

Just

 

[Daipire]

This is like if they made a A-Team remake and had an asian Mr T.


HOBBITS ARE WHITE...
Next they'll be going on about how there are no purple orcs...

 

[Champion Head Boy]

Just because the inspiration for the books comes from Middle-Ages-Europe, doesn't mean they are human, doesn't mean they live in Middle-Ages-Europe, and doesn't mean they are the same as humans from that time and place. If you are arguing that there wouldn't be any dark-skinned hobbits because of the geographic region of Middle-Earth, a) you don't know what you're talking about because it is a fictional world and you've never been there, and b) it's called migration - there are millions of dark-skinned people living in Europe today and have been for centuries. They didn't all go white the second they set foot on the continent.

The director/producers are within their rights to limit casting to shorter people without being discriminatory because the books EXPLICITLY describe hobbits as being short. He also describes the Harfoots as being darker of skin than other hobbits. Sorry folks, but if Tolkien never wrote "all hobbits are white" then the producers can interpret the hobbits however they want, and they clearly are interpreting hobbits as having a diverse background. Tolkien, in fact, wrote the opposite. How many of you have actually read these books?

And many of the commentors who believe the casting director wasn't being racist need to read the post more clearly. He didn't say "only white hobbits" - he said "only white women-hobbits". Why would there be dark-skinned male hobbits and not female hobbits? That's not biology, that's just stupid.

 

[JDKJ]

In between all the bile being spewed did anyone mention how there ARE dark skinned hobbits mentioned in the books, Harfoots if memory serves? I didn't make it past the first page, sorry if it was mentioned.

The Harfoots are one of the three races of Hobbits.

The Harfoots were the most common of Hobbits, and in their earliest known history they lived in the lower foothills of the Misty Mountains in the Vale of Anduin, in an area roughly bounded by the Gladden River in the south and the small forested region where later was the Eagles Eyrie near the High Pass to the north.

They were browner of skin than the other Hobbits, had no beards, and did not wear any footwear. They lived in holes they called Smials, a habit which they long preserved. They were also on very friendly terms with the Dwarves, who travelled through the High Pass on the Great Road.

The Harfoots were the first to migrate westward into Arnor, and it was to them that the name Periannath or Halflings was first applied by the Dúnedain when they were first recorded in Arnorian records around TA 1050 of the Third Age. They tended to settle down for long times, and founded numerous villages as far as Weathertop.

By the 1300s of the Third Age they had reached Bree, which long was the most western village of any Hobbits.

The Harfoots were joined between TA 1150 and TA 1300 by the Fallohides and some Stoors. The Harfoots took Fallohides, a bolder race, as their leaders.

When The Shire was colonized in TA 1601 most of its people were Harfoots.

http://lotr.wikia.com/wiki/Harfoots

It was mentioned but apparently people don't care. Cause HOBBITS!!!!! ARE WHITE!!!!!!! no matter if Tolkien specifically stated that they were of many skin tones.

And no matter how many times I post to the thread that the Harfoots were not white.

I wonder if there's any correlation between ability to read and willingness to make a "Hobbits are white" post. Perhaps the less the former, the greater the latter.

 

[JDKJ]

It's a sensitive topic to be sure, but Hobbits are fair-skinned. A little white-slacker people, smoking dope, brewing mead, picking vegetables and far from the Southron or the Easterlings in colouration.

I'm going to have to say it, in the world of Tolkien, the only dark-skinned people are the goblins, the orcs and their allies. They are spread out, but concentrated in the south, south-east and far east. They get dark indeed, but they are the bad guys. Colouration in Tolkien is influenced by climate, geography and merging a fantasy world with the real world in that south of europe you get Africa, east of europe you get the browning middle east.

A touchy subject to be sure. Alas it is a mythos where the good guys are the white guys. On Dwarves they are so far north, that is also the reason they aren't tanned to black.

Read Tolkien. According to his own words, the Harfoot Hobbits are "brown-skinned."

Yeah I saw your post. So how many Hobbits are Harfoot Hobbits? Were there Harfoot Hobbits in the films thus far? Would it be plain weird to insert them in the up-coming film? When an English 20th century writer like Tolkien says certain types of Hobbits are brown-skinned, how brown are we talking? Northern European I work in a field brown, or Lebanese brown, or Middle Africa brown? We are going to need some more specificity.

In answer to your "how many Hobbits are Harfoot Hobbits" question, it appears that "when The Shire was colonized in TA 1601 most of its people were Harfoots." (Source: http://lotr.wikia.com/wiki/Harfoots) So, I'm inclined to conclude that to include Harfoots in a film version of Tolkien's "The Hobbit" wouldn't be "weird." It would be "weirder" to not include them.