Homosexuality Is Unnatural

[novixz]

I myself am bisexual. Being gay/bisexual/whatever isn't a choice, why would people choose to be apart of something that goes through hate? They wouldn't want to make themselves hated, so why would they choose that. And difference is sexuality is normal. I think I read somewhere (IDK how accurate this fact is) that you'r sexuality depends on how much of certain chemicals you got in the womb. So yeah, it's natural from a biological standpoint.

 

[KindlySpastic]

What's really funny (or sad) is that it doesn't make any difference in a moral sense if homosexuality is unnatural or not. It's a complete Non Sequitur as far as morality goes.

 

[Fenix7]

My view: Sexuality is like religion (bear with me here people). Everyone has one, no-one has the right to force theirs on other people, and what someone's is is no damn business of anyone else.

Amen.

If everyone on the world would learn to respect other peoples beliefs and not try to force theirs on them, we'd have a world infinite times better.

 

[GraveeKing]

Thank god this isn't another troll thread! I read through it worried of another major flame war. Good to hear you're actually balanced and even though you'll obviously want to lean towards one side of the argument (because like me you're bisexual as you stated) you did try and take her view into consideration too.

Personally the best thing to do when someones tells me something similar is 'well a love of boobs is completely unnatural too!' they're nothing to do with actual impregnation, so why do so many heterosexual men obsess over them? 'oh no it's unnatural'. Your Grandmother is clearly just part of an older generation as people have stated before, she's been taught that her entire life, can't hold it again her. Anyone else who says today with a modern education is just being an idiot, I mean one look at the discovery channel or youtube and you'll find it's natural quite quickly!

 

[Turing]

What you need to realise is that when people say something is "unnatural" it actually means "I don't understand this and it frightens me please go away".

 

[BanicRhys]

The malfunction, as you put it, occurred naturally and is therefore natural. Also, blue eyes are a malfunction. Are you going to call that unnatural? Evolution itself is all about mutations being the natural course of life. You seeing something as abnormal does NOT make it unnatural. Unless aliens or god did something, it's natural.

And again you state your opinion on sex as fact. I hate to tell you, but the way you see things as "meant to be" doesn't make them true. Also, not only do homosexual animals have sex in the wild, dolphins have sex with one another all the time for no point other than pleasure. It's a documented fact.

I can tell you're far too biased to look at this topic from an objective point of view, so rather than continue to put up with your fallacies and conjecture I'll leave you with with a few quick counterpoints.

The malfunction, as you put it, occurred naturally and is therefore natural.

Natural = anything essential for a species' vital functions and procreation.

Evolution itself is all about mutations being the natural course of life.

How is a condition that prevents procreation a good thing in terms of survival, which is what evolution is all about. Adapting to survive your surroundings. If the human race was going through this "evolution" in its infancy I very much doubt any of us would be here today.

You seeing something as abnormal does NOT make it unnatural.

No I don't. I clearly explained why it is unnatural. You chose to ignore that just so you didn't have to see things from another perspective.

And again you state your opinion on sex as fact.

It is, I provided reasoning behind that and once again, you choose to ignore it. Or do you dispute that procreation is required to continue a species?

but the way you see things as "meant to be" doesn't make them true.

It was meant to be, if homosexuality was more prominent in the animal kingdom this world would be whole lot emptier.

Also, not only do homosexual animals have sex in the wild

Mutations.

dolphins have sex with one another all the time for no point other than pleasure.

Dolphins are highly intelligent creatures, it's understandable that they would understand that sex brings pleasure. Humans aren't the only creatures on this planet that can defy nature's plan.

Next time, if you're going to ask a question, maybe you should ask yourself whether you're actually going to listen to viewpoints that are contrary to your own.

 

[FluxCapacitor]

God in Heaven, no! Parents shouldn't have sex with their kids. If they choose to seek a relationship that happens to involve sex when their offspring are adults, that's fine.

See, but that's just it - I don't think that those familiy ties ever really go away. I'm a 27 year old man, and my mother is the only person in the world who can male me feel 10 years old again if we argue. I just can't see how that power arrangement would ever completely equalise with the person who made you, so I would think the younger would always be low-status. Plus, your family are supposed to be the fallback when your personal life gets all fucked up, and I daresay it screws up unconditional parental love in the aftermath of life/relationship collapse if your parent is your ex. It just completely changes the game, and I think only in detrimental ways. I can see your point for those few cases where a person has been adopted out then later met and fallen in love with a blood relative, but any time where there was a relationship growing up I think that incest is just totally wrong.

Sorry for the tangent, I know that this wasn't the real point of your thread but I just hate to see these two equated by the loony Right ("Allow gay marriage any it's a slippery slope to incest and bestiality!"), so I thought I'd better take issue with a liberal poster doing it too. I know that you're not advocating compromised consent, I just think you're simplifying the issue for this case...

 

[Snowy Rainbow]

Next time, if you're going to ask a question, maybe you should ask yourself whether you're actually going to listen to viewpoints that are contrary to your own.

Oh I love to hear opinions! I just only really give credit to the ones with merit, is all.

 

[katsumoto03]

Sexuality is like religion (bear with me here people). Everyone has one,

LOLWUT?

Atheists don't, nor do agnostics...

OT: This video pretty much sums it up:


As for the whole: "Ahhhhh don't be so hard on your grandmother, she's from a different time maaaaann." That's no excuse for stupidity.

 

[Snowy Rainbow]

Sorry for the tangent, I know that this wasn't the real point of your thread but I just hate to see these two equated by the loony Right ("Allow gay marriage any it's a slippery slope to incest and bestiality!"), so I thought I'd better take issue with a liberal poster doing it too. I know that you're not advocating compromised consent, I just think you're simplifying the issue for this case...

Fair enough. I definitely see credit to your opinion. It's a complicated issue :/

 

[WolfThomas]

Wild animals have some the weirdest most diverse sex around, so no Homosexuality is not unnatural.

God in Heaven, no! Parents shouldn't have sex with their kids. If they choose to seek a relationship that happens to involve sex when their offspring are adults, that's fine.

There's still a problem in that there is still an inherent power balance with their offspring even if they're an adult too, it's the same reason a doctor isn't allowed to have a relationship with a patient even if they've stopped seeing them. The suspicion of childhood grooming, coercion and indoctrination is also present.

The only sort of example where it would be vaguely acceptable is the Oedipus scenario, where the person never knows their parents, meets someone and has a relationship. Then finds out they're their mother/daugther/father/son etc and most people would likely end the relationship after finding that out (plus vomit a couple of times).

 

[MasterOfWorlds]

The only argument against homosexuality I've ever heard was religious in nature.

To which I say this; If you're born that way, God made you that way. If it's a choice, God gave Man free will, and they have made their choice.

You'd be surprised at how many people that shuts up.

 

[Richard Eis]

It is funny how something can be so common that it leads religious people to need to define it as a massive threat to their personal way of life (ie telling other people what to do), while still being unnatural. It's like saying gold isn't natural because there isn't as much of it around as rocks.

 

[Kais86]

So are clothes, computers, this soda I'm drinking, deal with it.

 

[Treblaine]

Well homosexuality sure ain't artificial, it is not created in a calculated attempt by humans, it just happens. It just happens like having a birth mark, it has always happened for millennia.

What you could say is that it is abnormal or atypical, but it is certainly naturally occurring within the human condition.

PS: if she disapproves of her "unnatural" grandson so much leave her alone and forgotten, that is what anyone deserves for being so belittling.

PPS: make some black friends and bring them over to your Gran's house, make sure they are wearing cargo pants with big pockets, making many excuses to walk around the house unescorted. Your gran may be racist in private but she'll fold face-to-face.

 

[Windcaler]

Homosexual acts and emotions are IMO a natural part of our species. It occures in other species without outside influence just as it occures in ours without outside influence. Honestly arguing whether or not homosexuality is unnatural is useless, the only way we could be 100% certain is to ask our creator or if there is no creator we can never have an answer

I think there is another argument though, that being if it is unatural is that such a bad thing? Lets take a simple unatural event, when a doctor performs some kind of surgery. Obviously surgery has risks but it also has beneficial health effects by being able to remove cancerous growths or removing malfunctioning organs. This one instance shows that unatural events (read: things that dont happen in nature without outside influence/actions) are not, by default bad for our species

Anyway OP, Im sorry your grandmother gives you such a hard time. Keep in mind that there may be legitimate reasons for her outlook for example one of my close friends is very anti-gay because a few years ago a man tried to rape him. Oviously if it is that kind of situation it is exceedingly difficult to deal with, especially if you fall within the anti group.

 

[WolfThomas]

Two animals that I think show homosexuality being beneficial for the species are lions and penguins.

Sometimes two lions males from the same litter will end up leading a pride together, instead of there just being one alpha. As part of cementing their alliance, they let each other have sex with each other while the females are out hunting. So you've got this scenario where you get feed and have a chance to spread you genes to the females, instead of fighting and having to fend for yourself and not getting any sex. So in this scenario some incestuous gay sex leads to health and spreading your genes.

The other one is penguins, when there's too many males, they join lifelong gay relationships. This doesn't help their genes, but does help the species by preventing any fighting or other issues with females. Plus they've shown that if a male couple finds an abandoned egg they can actually raise it to be a healthy penguin, instead of it just dying. So there's that.

Both scenarios are odd, but I wouldn't call them unnatural.

 

[Grouchy Imp_v1legacy]

Sexuality is like religion (bear with me here people). Everyone has one,

LOLWUT?

Atheists don't, nor do agnostics...

My point was that not believing in a religion is still a religious stand-point. And non-religious people (such as myself, before you get confused) still hold ideals that they personally believe in.

 

[katsumoto03]

Sexuality is like religion (bear with me here people). Everyone has one,

LOLWUT?

Atheists don't, nor do agnostics...

My point was that not believing in a religion is still a religious stand-point. And non-religious people (such as myself, before you get confused) still hold ideals that they personally believe in.

Actually, it's the lack of a religious standpoint. And yes, there is a difference.

 

[rossatdi]

Sexuality is like religion (bear with me here people). Everyone has one,

LOLWUT?

Atheists don't, nor do agnostics...

My point was that not believing in a religion is still a religious stand-point. And non-religious people (such as myself, before you get confused) still hold ideals that they personally believe in.

I think the sexuality is like religion is a pretty risky analogy given that religion is a choice and sexuality isn't.

Also, I do not have a religion, nor do I have a religious stand point. In census forms I check 'none' under religious belief. I have a stand point with regard to religion, but that's like saying a robot has a stand point regarding sex, he could understand it but not do it.

And as a kicker, morality and ideals can easily come from non-religious rationality and humanism.