How to Argue a Point: A user's guide

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VanityGirl

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Apr 29, 2009
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VanityGirl here, as I continue my long run through college, I have to participate in several debates.
Now, arguing for a goal happens a lot on this site, so I thought it may be helpful to post some things about how to debate both calmy and intellegently.
Of course, this is only a helpful suggestion, if you get fired up because someone said something about your momma, then get fired up. I can't stop you.
(I know I've been guilty of getting fired up before, I'm no saint. :p)

How to Argue a Point:
1)When an argument is brought up about your point, read/analyze it atleast two times before making a response.
-You want to do this to avoid putting words into your enemy's mouth. This could cause a fight, not an intellegent debate, to occur.

2)When making a response, try to appeal to what enemy says.
-When making a response, if you say something that appeals to the enemy, you may be able to sway them to your side. You must do this without hurting your own cause.
Example: You say you thought the Left 4 Dead 2 boycott was dead on arrival, you enemy absolutely disagrees. You appeal by saying, "While the boycotters made a few good and undeniable points, their boycott was going to fail because..." then give your reason.

3) Always BACK UP YOUR EVIDENCE

-Why is it that so many people say things without providing evidence?
Even in the real world, if I need some evidence, I'll whip out my iPhone and go to the site or where ever I got my fact from and show it to the person I'm having an argument with. This is important because it gives your argument legs to stand on. You can't just blurt out, "PS3 sales beat the Wii and the 360 on it's opening day" without someone saying "I want to see your numbers"

4) Keep a cool head
-The easiest way to lose a debate is by losing your head. If you're passionate about something, that's fine, but don't go from "Well I disagree with you because.." to "You're wrong you stupid n00b!" Just keep your head screwed tightly onto your shoulders and you'll be fine

5) Lose the bias
-I know, a lot of people will say, "But I'm arguing because I'm bias". Actually no, you should lose all bias if you want to be successful. Don't you think Fox News and CNN would be better stations and be more reliable if they both weren't so bias? Yeah, the same thing applies to people. A Republican and a Democrat can have a civil argument, but if they let their political bias cloud their perspectives, then the debate will "Flame ON!" ..Er, so to speak. I say this because I've seen this a lot on this site, people who try to make an argument like "Democrats R battrz tan Republicanzzzz LOLOLOL, look @ ze last prez, he wuz a douche, LOLOLOL" Even if the last president was a douche, that's NO way to go about an argument. Instead say, "I believe both parties have their pros and cons, I prefer to be a Democrat because.." then state you reasons. The quickest way to absolutely lose is by BASHING someone's beliefs. (And yes, technically, you do lose if you bash instead of engage in a level headed debate.)

6) Never flat out say "You're WRONG"
-Ok, this is a fine line, but in general, don't tell a person they're flat out wrong. If they have an opinion on something, they have an opinion. The quickest way to hurt someone's feelings and start a flame war is by saying "You know what, you're wrong". If you numbers or a quoted statements that proves your enemy is incorrect then bring it up. Say something more civil while you bring up the quote or numbers, such as "Well, my statement/numbers say something different from you, would you please tell me your source?"
***There is an occasion when a person's is being extremely douchebag-ish (for lack of better word) and on certain occasions you can say, "Look, that's wrong", but use it with extreme caution. If a person says, "All Jews should die" or says something so incredibly wrong like that, then just say you're wrong. (Better yet, ignore a biggot like that.)

7) Never Defend by Attack
-I've almost reached the point of talking to the Department of Redundancy Department, but you don't Defend by Attack. This will make your enemy bristle up and attack back, at which point neither mind will be swayed. The point of a debate is to try to get the person to see your side of things, by attacking you'll make the person see that you're a douche. I'll use my Left 4 Dead 2 boycott thing as an example.
If I were trying to sway a boycotter to see that their boycott would have never worked, I would not say, "Well you guys are dumbasses for trying! No one was going to listen to your bitchass complaints you DOUCHES"... No that's bad. You deserved to be smacked on your nose with a rolled up newspaper if you say something like that. DO NOT DEFEND BY ATTACKING.


That's pretty much all I got. If you guys can think of any more things to add, please add it. I'd love to make a list because I feel like this is important to those who wish to engage in a civil debate about something.
 

Jedamethis

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Jul 24, 2009
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*Clappity clappity*
I tip my hat to you madame

Perhaps newcomers could be forced to read this...
 

HardRockSamurai

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May 28, 2008
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[small]*stands and applauds*[/small]

Finally! Someone on the internet who understands basic debate guidelines!

[small]*single tear rolls gracefully down cheek*[/small]
 

Jaranja

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Jul 16, 2009
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VanityGirl said:
There is an occasion when a person's is being extremely douchebag-ish (for lack of better word)
Stubborn?

OT: These sound like some good tips but some are quite obvious. I'll be sure to remember these when I find myself in an Argument. To be honest, the main one to remember would have to be 4. If you lose your head, you lose it all.
 

VanityGirl

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Apr 29, 2009
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Jaranja said:
Stubborn?

OT: These sound like some good tips but some are quite obvious. I'll be sure to remember these when I find myself in an Argument. To be honest, the main one to remember would have to be 4. If you lose your head, you lose it all.
I was trying to be semi-funny. ;) I wondered who'd quote me on that.
And yes, some of the things are pretty obvious, but it's amazing how many people will ignore all rules and just tell the other person that they're a flaming idiot.

Also, sorry I didn't really put the points in any particular order, I'll agree that #4 is one of the more important ones. Also to never defend by attack, if you do that, you lose.
 

Jaranja

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Jul 16, 2009
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VanityGirl said:
Jaranja said:
Stubborn?

OT: These sound like some good tips but some are quite obvious. I'll be sure to remember these when I find myself in an Argument. To be honest, the main one to remember would have to be 4. If you lose your head, you lose it all.
I was trying to be semi-funny. ;) I wondered who'd quote me on that.
And yes, some of the things are pretty obvious, but it's amazing how many people will ignore all rules and just tell the other person that they're a flaming idiot.

Also, sorry I didn't really put the points in any particular order, I'll agree that #4 is one of the more important ones. Also to never defend by attack, if you do that, you lose.
Very True. Well, they're all pretty important.

What are you studying at college to bring on these debates? Just curious. I'll feel like an idiot if you say 'debating' or something.
 

KhaineII

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Sep 21, 2009
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Psssshhhh!

I've got a much simpler debating method for you more laid back folks, like myself:

1)Stand up, pull your shoulders back, expand your chest. Look commanding!
2)Quickly thrust your right arm outward, towards your opponent, with your index finger extended. In layman's terms, this is known as pointing.
3)Shout, in the loudest voice that you can muster, "Objection!"
4)Bullshit an argument for the next five minutes.

If you're lucky, your sudden declaration of "Objection!" should have shocked your opponent(s) into such a docile state that you'll win easily.

Oh, and congratulations, you're an Ace Attorney now too.
 

Inverse Skies

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Feb 3, 2009
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Nice, although most people on here when they get into discussions aren't too bad at respecting these ideals. I should know, I seem to find myself in them quite often for some reason. But what you've done here is a very good, very through guide to how to hold a discussion with someone. Well done.
 

Zombie_Fish

Opiner of Mottos
Mar 20, 2009
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For one of my College courses I'm studying the structure of arguments and how to make good arguments, how to counter arguments and how to analyse and crush poor arguments and I was contemplating writing one of these a while back, so I'll see what I can chip in:

VanityGirl said:
2)When making a response, try to appeal to what enemy says.
-When making a response, if you say something that appeals to the enemy, you may be able to sway them to your side. You must do this without hurting your own cause.
Example: You say you thought the Left 4 Dead 2 boycott was dead on arrival, you enemy absolutely disagrees. You appeal by saying, "While the boycotters made a few good and undeniable points, their boycott was going to fail because..." then give your reason.
This is a very important thing to do in order to avoid looking bias. Also, another thing you can do when writing an argument (an argument simply being, by definition, a conclusion backed up by reasoning) that is similar to this is use your opponent's reasoning in your own argument and then prove it to be a bad piece of reasoning. This is known as a counter-argument and is very useful when it comes to strengthening your argument.

3) Always BACK UP YOUR EVIDENCE

-Why is it that so many people say things without providing evidence?
Even in the real world, if I need some evidence, I'll whip out my iPhone and go to the site or where ever I got my fact from and show it to the person I'm having an argument with. This is important because it gives your argument legs to stand on. You can't just blurt out, "PS3 sales beat the Wii and the 360 on it's opening day" without someone saying "I want to see your numbers"
Another thing I would like to mention here is to check your evidence and make sure it is reliable. I've seen people arguing about Obama and then use a link from a website along the lines of www.whitechristiannews.com for evidence -_-' This would be an unreliable source for a debate on Obama because it will obviously be bias against him. Our teacher makes us go through this checklist for reliability:

[li]Does the source have a motive? This can be good or bad reliability wise, but make sure that the source wouldn't stand to benefit from the issue at hand. This is called a vested interest and isn't a good thing for evidence to have.[/li]
[li]How well was the source at witnessing what happened? Could anything hinder it from seeing fully what happpened?[/li]
[li]Does the source have a reputation for reliability? Tabloid newspapers are well known to be less reliable than broadsheets, and also try to check who reads the newspapers, as that could point at who the paper are more likely to lean towards. Same goes for websites; Wikipedia is never a truly reliable source for arguments, and you should be careful to avoid falling for parody sites or sites likely to be bias one way or another.[/li]
[li]How much of an expert is the person writing the source? Have they been hired specifically to write this source due to his experience in the topic, or is he just a random person brought in and told to write this? A scientist is going to be able to write more on CFCs than a janitor will.[/li]
[li]Is it a primary or secondary source? If it's a secondary source then you need to check the reliability of the primary as well in order to make sure it is a good source.[/li]

Following this, make sure all the evidence is relevant to your reasoning and make sure you don't inferr too much from it.

I could go into much more detail about the reliability of different types of information and evidence, but I think that that's enough for now. Just check your evidence and make sure you don't come to a conclusion too harshly from what you're given.

I could probably go through my mass of notes and print-outs and find more about arguing in general as well, but it's all quite obvious stuff, arguing being lless of an academic thing and more oof a skill. If you're going to create analogies (comparisons), make sure the two objects are (usually) not hypothetical and simiar enough to compare and make sure you're consistent. Don't start arguing about one thing and then say something completely contradictory as you will appear like an idiot.

Tell me if you want more from me about this.
 

ben---neb

No duckies...only drowning
Apr 22, 2009
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VanityGirl said:
VanityGirl here, as I continue my long run through college, I have to participate in several debates.
SNIP
WRONG! You're wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong. Why? Because I say so. Generally I find that physical violence works so much better than actually going to the efort of constructing a logically valid point. People like you telling me how to argue, urgh, it makes me mad. Prove to me that your method works! I want evidence! What can you expect from a woman?

Right, any other rules I can break?

Personally my prefered method of arguing involved always agreeing with what the other person says. Or shouting loudly until they run away.
 

VanityGirl

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Apr 29, 2009
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Jaranja said:
I'm actually studying to be a pharmacist, but some of elective classes require us to get into a classroom discussion/debate. :) It's pretty neat.

Zombie_Fish said:
Actually, you contributed quite nicely. Thank you for your input and hey by any means if you can think of more stuff to write down, go ahead.
 

Fasckira

Dice Tart
Oct 22, 2009
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Debating in person and debating on the internet are generally completely different things. The majority of the internet populace seem to go nuts purely because they arent in the same room as the person they are arguing with. The semi threat, "Say that to my face" springs to mind.
Anyway, nice little step by step but it just kind of highlights what everyone knows already, they just chose not to act upon it. :p