Souls don't really mean anything. I have close to 4 million souls on my character that have literally no purpose from killing people in PVP. Leveling up stats beyond 40 gives negligible results. So it's unlikely you'd want to go beyond Soul Level 250 or thereabouts, even if you were purely PVE. The recommended soul level if you're PVPing, however, is in the 100-120 range. The four million souls I have just sitting around are very likely more in number than the amount of souls I invested into leveling my character, (SL100 - more than enough to make a decked out character. I'm currently in NG++++++, and win...I'd say around 3/4 PVP battles I fight - clever, strong spellcasters are my weakness). Again, souls don't really mean anything.
I have a problem with Dark Souls
- Thread starter Olas
- Start date
Call me cynical, but I think one of the reasons they did this was so they didn't have to do any work on balancing the difficulty of the game. ie if there is a sudden difficulty spike you can farm souls until YOU HAVE THE POWER (oooooooh) to take it on
Hellkite Bridge is a bad place to farm souls. Pretty much the best place for farming souls (That I've seen) is from the second Anor Londo bonfire to the Anor Londo Boss Fight, especially if you're confident enough to drop some white soapstone in front of the fog gate. Plus, this way, you get actual, valuable experience in learning parry timing and backstab windows.
And there's that guy right there who'll sell you upgrade materials, which is the primary reason to farm souls anyway.
As everybody else has already mentioned: Equipment > Soul Level.
And there's that guy right there who'll sell you upgrade materials, which is the primary reason to farm souls anyway.
As everybody else has already mentioned: Equipment > Soul Level.
Forest > Dragon in terms of farming
And I'm not really sure what the problem OP is seeing is? He admits that the farming is boring and due to the demands the game puts on you for levelling up it becomes an incredibly diminishing return. You genuinely gain more on the walk from Firelink Shrine to the Undead Burg bonfire than the Dragon gives you. Yeah, they're free but it's sooooo boring. I mean, you could spend the first 4 weeks of the game killing Hollows in the asylum or the ones in New Londo who don't move, just farming souls so you level up. No-one's going to opt in for that though because it's not a game at that point.
And I'm not really sure what the problem OP is seeing is? He admits that the farming is boring and due to the demands the game puts on you for levelling up it becomes an incredibly diminishing return. You genuinely gain more on the walk from Firelink Shrine to the Undead Burg bonfire than the Dragon gives you. Yeah, they're free but it's sooooo boring. I mean, you could spend the first 4 weeks of the game killing Hollows in the asylum or the ones in New Londo who don't move, just farming souls so you level up. No-one's going to opt in for that though because it's not a game at that point.
... You haven't played it yet have you? You can gain 50 levels and still die like a b*tch if you don't have the strategy. Raising your dex higher won't make you magma-proof. Not to mention farming for levels can be utterly wasted by two mistimed deaths, all it takes is one mistimed dodge..mrgerry123 said:
Dark Souls is as hard as you want it to be. You can spend hours farming souls or stones and max out all your stats and gear, but you're going to be pretty fucking bored. In any case, the ability to grind levels isn't a sign of the game being broken. It exists as a sort of safety net. If you aren't good enough at the game to get past a certain part and have just hit a wall, you have the option to take some time to improve your stats and gear to make things a little easier for you. But it certainly isn't required and it's up to you if you want to use that method. Saying grinding levels is evidence of a broken game is like saying any game that has a players guide is broken. Both grinding levels and players guides exist to help players if they get stuck
I'm very curious about character levels in relation to who can invade you. Does the game search for someone your level to invade you before anyone else? Cuz that's horrible if you're leveling, just awful.
Also there's much worse farming spots
Anyway, I saw the bridge farm potential and I love farming souls and levels, but my rationalization for not doing that was that I could get a healthy amount of souls for just running around clearing enemies like I always do and actually get some modest loot doing it, and actually get better at the game at the same time. It only narrowly beat exploiting the dragon though. Man was I disappointed when I came back with better gear and found out
load of crap
Also there's much worse farming spots
the baby skeletons that spawn in the water in the pinwheel room, gets you tons of humanities too that you can either use or feed for more souls.
Anyway, I saw the bridge farm potential and I love farming souls and levels, but my rationalization for not doing that was that I could get a healthy amount of souls for just running around clearing enemies like I always do and actually get some modest loot doing it, and actually get better at the game at the same time. It only narrowly beat exploiting the dragon though. Man was I disappointed when I came back with better gear and found out
Killing that damn dragon dropped a pathetic 1000 souls and no items
I just now played Dark Souls for the first time, because the roommie was playing 2 and I got hooked on learning along with her. So, I wanted to play the first game, and, since I wasn't sure if I even had the dexterity to play it (had a stroke on my left side, still have trouble with my fingers) I cheated and gave myself a maxed out build thanks to save editing. I should also point out I only play alone. I don't have any online capability, so, it was for my own edification and testing. And even with maxed out stats, I still died, a LOT. But I learned, and eventually beat it. And moved on to 2, and again, for my own edification, and since I can't do any sort of Jolly Cooperation, I gave myself stats and some items. And, while I'm far better with 2, I still die, a LOT. But I'm getting better.
At least do it right, buy the crest of artorias and go into the woods where every enemy gives 5000 souls and runs off a ledge for you like the kool kids do then.Olas said:
You'll hit the levelup plateau faster than hundreds of miserable dragon runs.
This has been done better in dark souls 2, if you can't beat a boss you generally have somewhere else to go and the alternative routes are less hidden. You'll never sit in an area thinking "I need to farm this over and over now" unless you want a specific item drop.
Exponentially growing level cost. The more you level, the more expensive it is to level.Olas said:
That said, farming/grinding is a part of most RPGs and there aren't many RPGs where you couldn't do the same. There's also the fact that you don't gain THAT much by leveling after a while, certain points with certain skills just stop being effective (Endurance only gives you Stamina until 40, Dexterity gives you a pathetic increase in damage after 40 as well etc.)
The point you're at, the dragon bridge only gives you 550 souls for each reset, which, while awesomely beneficial to do a few times (usually lets you level up a few needed skills), becomes pointless and futile very soon. I only do it a few times to get my Strength to 16 (or was it 14?) for the Drake Sword (yes, I know it sucks, but at that point it is awesome and I need that much Strength or more later anyway) and maybe some Endurance points to stop myself from getting overweight with gear and then move on. After a certain level (very low), it takes a lot of runs to get even a single level out of it.
Soul farming is rather useless for the most part, you usually want to farm something else WHILE getting souls. There are two places you'll want to farm. One is beneath the Firelink Shrine past the ghosts (you have to get through it once to drain the water) where the mobs drop the upgrade stones - it's a fast run, nets you a decent amount of souls and a fastastic drop rate for upgrading your weapons (if you're doing it right, ie. 10 held humanity+the drop rate ring) and the mobs are remarkably easy to parry/riposte (or backstab, but riposte kills faster). The other place is in the DLC near the end where you can farm the Humanities to your heart's content.
As for farming souls, if you really want to do it, PvP is your friend. Particularly the Cat Covenant PvP as it has (or at least had, I imagine a lot of players moved on to DS2) an excellent rate of PvP and you're always invading above your level. While this might seem hard, the fact is that you're gonna run into clueless players who've leveled their characters to ridiculous levels, which is gonna net you a LOT of souls. After a few days of PvPing there, I had a few million souls on me. The way PvP works is, you get a percentage of souls that cost your opponent to reach the level they're at. So when you run into a ~712 player who thought it'd be a great idea to waste time leveling up like crazy despite it giving him very little advantage, if you kill him (and it's not at all hard most of the time since those players are mostly awful) or have one of your partners kill him, you'll get some 800.000 souls just for him, because that's what his final level cost him.
levels and stats mean exactly jack in Dark Souls. The only stats you need are the ones that help you to equip good/great gear and high life helps on NG other than that apart from magic stats for sorcerers it is totally pointless to just level especially 500 souls at a time.
Not to mention why would anyone even do that more than a few times? Its friggin boring. If you want to gain levels quick just cheat with dragon head glitch way more efficient. Not that lvl 711 will help you survive all that much better without skill and gear.
Not to mention why would anyone even do that more than a few times? Its friggin boring. If you want to gain levels quick just cheat with dragon head glitch way more efficient. Not that lvl 711 will help you survive all that much better without skill and gear.
It sounds like you're ruining your own experience by attempting to exploit the game. Why would you even want to?
Farming in Dark Souls is, by and large, a huge waste of time. You get plenty of souls by just going through the game normally and all you really need to do to progress is 1) learn to play better, and 2) upgrade your equipment, which tends not to be expensive. So the fact that it's easy to farm kind of doesn't matter at all. You can if you want, I guess, but it's not a good tactic at all.
Incidentally, in Dark Souls 2 enemies stop spawning after a certain number of runs through an area, making it impossible to farm for very long - but really, like I said, it doesn't help much to begin with so it's not a huge concern it being possible.
Incidentally, in Dark Souls 2 enemies stop spawning after a certain number of runs through an area, making it impossible to farm for very long - but really, like I said, it doesn't help much to begin with so it's not a huge concern it being possible.
Yes, because the only alternative to allowing people to effortlessly farm a resource is removing all choice from the game and making it linear like COD.cloroxbb said:
That being said I think choices can be a bad thing if they can allow you to undermine what the actual point of the game is supposed to be.
First of all, I am listening to your words, not accepting your explanation isn't the same thing as ignoring you.
Now, you keep using the word "choice" like it's some buzzword that means something universally positive. I think it's safe to say we can agree that there are situations where having too much choice can be a bad thing. The problem I have with this particular choice is that it allows you to substitute skill and effort with tedium, which I don't consider to be an adequate trade off, and yet you say it's a perfectly legit way to go through the game. Perhaps you could frame this as being analogous to playing a game on different difficulty settings, choosing to farm more is effectively lowering the difficulty of the game. But then that changes the dynamics of the game somewhat. Whereas before I viewed having a powerful character as a sign of accomplishment because that strength had to be earned through difficult accomplishments, now it seems more like training wheels. I guess that's okay, it's just that I was looking forward to having a really badass character by the end of the game.
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And here's where you're playing the game wrong. You won't have "a really badass character by the end of the game" regardless of how much you raise his stats. If at the end of the game you take the default equipment your character started with and go fight some of the optional bosses, or go through some of the high level areas with it you'll quickly realize that your character is basically the same as what you started with, just a bit less squishy. The damage your character does largely depends on your weapon and its upgrades, not your stats, and how much survivability you have largely depends on your armor and shield, not on how much HP you have. Sure, having more HP helps, but at the end of the day, having a character with 800 HP, or having a character with 1400 HP is just the difference between a boss killing you in 1 hit or 2.Olas said:
Other people have explained this to me too. I've already found it to be mostly true, however when I was talking about having "badass character" I wasn't talking strictly about personal stats. I meant in terms of armor and weapons as well because from what I can tell stats like strength and dexterity are what allow you to wield larger weapons while stats like intelligence and faith let you wield better magic. (unrelated point: what does intelligence have to do with magic? Wouldn't intelligence be more for like inventing stuff?)Dirty Hipsters said:
Maybe those stats don't need to be really high to allow you to wield most weapons, and maybe the best weapons can't be bought at stores for souls, and maybe the items needed to upgrade said weapons can't be bought with souls either. Basically all this leads back to the same thing: souls don't matter, which is what I'll walk away from this with.