I have a problem with Dark Souls

[Olas]

Normally amassing Souls thru normal play is NOT farming. You were talking about the fact that you can just keep going thru the same area over and over again, to amass souls. That is farming.

Souls in the game is basically currency and is used to buy things, and to level up, and to level up weapons and so forth. Putting a finite amount of souls in the game is stupid.

Why?

You seem to literally be the only person to complain about how the game plays. If you don't want to amass more souls, then dont "reset" the enemies by resting at bonfires.

Resting at the bonfires is how you heal and move your re-spawn point. I would be making things a LOT harder on myself if I ignored them.

You want them to change the way they made the game play, and its economy, just for you. Go play something else that fits your criteria. Problem Solved.

It sounds like they did fix this problem in Dark Souls 2, where enemies re-spawn a limited number of times, which I probably will play after I beat this one if I like it. I'm obviously not expecting them to fix a 3 year old game for me, I'm just explaining why I do in fact think this is a flaw.

 

[Dirty Hipsters]

It sounds like they did fix this problem in Dark Souls 2, where enemies re-spawn a limited number of times, which I probably will play after I beat this one if I like it. I'm obviously not expecting them to fix a 3 year old game for me, I'm just explaining why I do in fact think this is a flaw.

And then people who have A LOT more experience in the game than you explained to you why it's not a flaw. It seems like the only reason you insist that this is a problem is because you seem to have some kind of expectation for the game that doesn't mirror the reality of what the game is. Maybe once you get a bit farther along you'll realize how much of a non-issue what you're talking about is.

 

[nokori3byo]

It's been said already, but merits further emphasis: pushing forward is ne plus ultra for advancing a character in DS. You can putz around in early areas forever and not really improve in the ways that matter to making your build viable for the endgame. I will admit to having farmed certain areas for the following reasons: gathering crafting materials, gathering humanity, and simply amusing myself by killing off high-level enemies and collecting their souls while I fruitlessly waited for someone to summon me. In the first place, it was my time to waste (invest). In the second, these were not bad uses of my time in terms of what they gave me. Contrast this with the dragon bridge which is neither efficient nor fun.

So, is the ability to farm a blindspot in the game's design? I don't think so. DS is a game that nourishes you with one hand and slaps you senseless with the other. The latter tends to happen when you throw yourself against beef gates you're as yet ill-equipped to take on, not through some arbitrary anti-grind mechanic.

 

[StriderShinryu]

At the end of the day, I feel like being able to grind for souls, especially early on, is a lot like being able to get the Drake Sword early on. On one hand, it can give you a little bit of a leg up at the start if you're having trouble. It's a way to assist the player in making some progress if they're having difficulty getting started. On the other hand, it offers little hope for the later game. By relying on either the Drake Sword or early farmed levels, you're not necessarily getting any better at the game or understanding how to play it. Just like the Drake Sword, early levelling feels powerful early on and may even help a little but doesn't scale well into the later game.

If acquiring some early levels makes helps get you into the game more, then accumulate them by all means but don't ever expect them to supplant the skill, perseverance or knowledge you'll need to actually progress beyond the starting areas.

 

[Elijin]

Dark souls is one of the few games where maxing out your character level / stats wont really mean much at the end of the day. Having the right tool for the job, and being good at the combat system trumps your stats 9/10 late game.

 

[michael87cn]

Actually, Dark Souls is a great RPG unlike what's been said. If you play as a melee character you won't see huge benefits to leveling past a degree, but as a mage? You can get really powerful by leveling up. And getting the right 'gear' a staple system of any 'rpg'.

It's an action game if you play a melee character. It's an RPG if you play a mage, imo.

 

[SmallHatLogan]

Olas, I'm not really getting where you're coming from. Being able to farm enemies indefinitely for experience points and currency (and in Dark Souls they are one and the same) is a feature of the majority of RPGs. As a lot of us have explained there is no real way to abuse the system short of spending countless hours farming, although considering how long you'd have to put in it's a stretch to even call it abusing the system. And again, this is just like the majority of RPGs. Why is it so objectionable in Dark Souls specifically?

 

[Olas]

Olas, I'm not really getting where you're coming from. Being able to farm enemies indefinitely for experience points and currency (and in Dark Souls they are one and the same) is a feature of the majority of RPGs. As a lot of us have explained there is no real way to abuse the system short of spending countless hours farming, although considering how long you'd have to put in it's a stretch to even call it abusing the system. And again, this is just like the majority of RPGs. Why is it so objectionable in Dark Souls specifically?

I haven't played too many RPGs, in fact I can barely think of any I've played at all. Does Mass Effect count? I didn't even really realize Dark Souls was an RPG until I started playing it. Not that I dislike the RPG elements mind you.

I guess the reason I was particularly bugged by the ability to farm here was because of the reputation Dark Souls has as an unforgiving game that never lets up on the player. I started out playing as the Deprived class, because I'm a masochist, but also because I like the idea of starting weak and getting more powerful as I go along. However I quickly realized in the Undead Burg that I could buy just about any item I wanted from the merchant just by killing a bunch of weak enemies, respawning them, and repeating the process until I had enough souls for whatever item I wanted. It didn't take long for my character to have a full set of gear. The same went for leveling up. I know now that the ability to gather souls is pretty insignificant in the grander scheme of the game, but at the time it pretty much seemed like the most important thing to be doing since souls seemed to be required for almost everything.

 

[Darks63]

That spot really start to diminish in returns after around SL 25 after that you would really have to keep at it to try and level there. Plus if you don't know how to properly invest those points it doesn't matter much in the end anyway. I mean you have all those souls but what build are you going for? Dex based? Str based? Chaos based?

And DS as a unforgiving game is debateable. Sure if you go into blind it will trash you hard, but if you look things up it really isn't all that bad.

 

[ReservoirAngel]

Farming souls from the same area isn't sustainable. The number of souls needed to level ends up quickly outstripping the number of souls you gain from farmable enemies.

I speak as someone who ran Undead Burg a dozen or so times to level up so I might have a chance of taking the fucking Taurus Demon down at long last.

Spoiler: I never did. Yes, I am just that terrible.

 

[Dirty Hipsters]

Farming souls from the same area isn't sustainable. The number of souls needed to level ends up quickly outstripping the number of souls you gain from farmable enemies.

I speak as someone who ran Undead Burg a dozen or so times to level up so I might have a chance of taking the fucking Taurus Demon down at long last.

Spoiler: I never did. Yes, I am just that terrible.

Key to taking down the taurus demon super easily:

Buy residence key from the merchant in undead burg and get the gold pine resin.

When fighting the taurus demon climb the ladder next to the fog gate to the top of the tower, apply gold pine resin to your weapon, do a plunging attack on taurus demon. While he's stunned for a second 2 hand your weapon and go to town. I usually manage to take him down in 3-5 hits and take no damage.

Later on in the game the taurus demon becomes a normal enemy in the Demon Ruins.

 

[ReservoirAngel]

Farming souls from the same area isn't sustainable. The number of souls needed to level ends up quickly outstripping the number of souls you gain from farmable enemies.

I speak as someone who ran Undead Burg a dozen or so times to level up so I might have a chance of taking the fucking Taurus Demon down at long last.

Spoiler: I never did. Yes, I am just that terrible.

Key to taking down the taurus demon super easily:

Buy residence key from the merchant in undead burg and get the gold pine resin.

When fighting the taurus demon climb the ladder next to the fog gate to the top of the tower, apply gold pine resin to your weapon, do a plunging attack on taurus demon. While he's stunned for a second 2 hand your weapon and go to town. I usually manage to take him down in 3-5 hits and take no damage.

Later on in the game the taurus demon becomes a normal enemy in the Demon Ruins.

It always sounds easy when someone explains to me how to do it, but the second I actually get in there all my higher brain functions just vanish and I revert to my usual gameplay method of "hit buttons until the thing falls down" which is not a winning strategy at any point.

Even with an Uchikatana with Gold Pine Resin applied, I fail. Then there was the one time I decided to try to get out of the narrow corridor of the ramparts by luring him up onto the big circular tower you kill the archers on... wherein I missed a dodge, got hit and got thrown over the edge and down to my death in truly humiliating fashion.

On the plus side of my brief and miserable failure-filled experience with Dark Souls, I am now a fucking expert at taking the Undead Burg. I can do that shit practically in my sleep now the amount of times I had to run through it on my way to getting flattened again.

Yet I'm still very much considering getting my hands on Dark Souls 2 tomorrow... hooray for masochism! Though I've heard that Dark Souls 2 is not so much easier as it is a touch more accessible so maybe I'll get a bit further in that one before I hit the "you don't belong here, get fucked" boss fight.

 

[Dirty Hipsters]

Farming souls from the same area isn't sustainable. The number of souls needed to level ends up quickly outstripping the number of souls you gain from farmable enemies.

I speak as someone who ran Undead Burg a dozen or so times to level up so I might have a chance of taking the fucking Taurus Demon down at long last.

Spoiler: I never did. Yes, I am just that terrible.

Key to taking down the taurus demon super easily:

Buy residence key from the merchant in undead burg and get the gold pine resin.

When fighting the taurus demon climb the ladder next to the fog gate to the top of the tower, apply gold pine resin to your weapon, do a plunging attack on taurus demon. While he's stunned for a second 2 hand your weapon and go to town. I usually manage to take him down in 3-5 hits and take no damage.

Later on in the game the taurus demon becomes a normal enemy in the Demon Ruins.

It always sounds easy when someone explains to me how to do it, but the second I actually get in there all my higher brain functions just vanish and I revert to my usual gameplay method of "hit buttons until the thing falls down" which is not a winning strategy at any point.

Even with an Uchikatana with Gold Pine Resin applied, I fail. Then there was the one time I decided to try to get out of the narrow corridor of the ramparts by luring him up onto the big circular tower you kill the archers on... wherein I missed a dodge, got hit and got thrown over the edge and down to my death in truly humiliating fashion.

On the plus side of my brief and miserable failure-filled experience with Dark Souls, I am now a fucking expert at taking the Undead Burg. I can do that shit practically in my sleep now the amount of times I had to run through it on my way to getting flattened again.

Yet I'm still very much considering getting my hands on Dark Souls 2 tomorrow... hooray for masochism! Though I've heard that Dark Souls 2 is not so much easier as it is a touch more accessible so maybe I'll get a bit further in that one before I hit the "you don't belong here, get fucked" boss fight.

Yeah...I'd say that if you can't beat the taurus demon in dark souls you shouldn't bother getting dark souls 2. The beginning of dark souls 2 doesn't give you a shield with 100% physical block (and in fact, only one starting class even gets a shield to start with), so if your entire gameplay strategy is "hit buttons until thing dies" you're going to have a bad time.

 

[Fat Hippo]

Yet I'm still very much considering getting my hands on Dark Souls 2 tomorrow... hooray for masochism! Though I've heard that Dark Souls 2 is not so much easier as it is a touch more accessible so maybe I'll get a bit further in that one before I hit the "you don't belong here, get fucked" boss fight.

Though I haven't played it myself yet (waiting for PC version) many people are seeing that the first few hours and especially bosses are far easier and forgiving than the start of DkS 1. Of course, these people have already learned how the game works, similar to Demon's Souls players who thought Dark Souls 1 was way easier, so their judgment is skewed. I wouldn't mind having a few hours to warm up again before it starts kicking my ass, to be honest.

 

[ReservoirAngel]

Farming souls from the same area isn't sustainable. The number of souls needed to level ends up quickly outstripping the number of souls you gain from farmable enemies.

I speak as someone who ran Undead Burg a dozen or so times to level up so I might have a chance of taking the fucking Taurus Demon down at long last.

Spoiler: I never did. Yes, I am just that terrible.

Key to taking down the taurus demon super easily:

Buy residence key from the merchant in undead burg and get the gold pine resin.

When fighting the taurus demon climb the ladder next to the fog gate to the top of the tower, apply gold pine resin to your weapon, do a plunging attack on taurus demon. While he's stunned for a second 2 hand your weapon and go to town. I usually manage to take him down in 3-5 hits and take no damage.

Later on in the game the taurus demon becomes a normal enemy in the Demon Ruins.

It always sounds easy when someone explains to me how to do it, but the second I actually get in there all my higher brain functions just vanish and I revert to my usual gameplay method of "hit buttons until the thing falls down" which is not a winning strategy at any point.

Even with an Uchikatana with Gold Pine Resin applied, I fail. Then there was the one time I decided to try to get out of the narrow corridor of the ramparts by luring him up onto the big circular tower you kill the archers on... wherein I missed a dodge, got hit and got thrown over the edge and down to my death in truly humiliating fashion.

On the plus side of my brief and miserable failure-filled experience with Dark Souls, I am now a fucking expert at taking the Undead Burg. I can do that shit practically in my sleep now the amount of times I had to run through it on my way to getting flattened again.

Yet I'm still very much considering getting my hands on Dark Souls 2 tomorrow... hooray for masochism! Though I've heard that Dark Souls 2 is not so much easier as it is a touch more accessible so maybe I'll get a bit further in that one before I hit the "you don't belong here, get fucked" boss fight.

Yeah...I'd say that if you can't beat the taurus demon in dark souls you shouldn't bother getting dark souls 2. The beginning of dark souls 2 doesn't give you a shield with 100% physical block (and in fact, only one starting class even gets a shield to start with), so if your entire gameplay strategy is "hit buttons until thing dies" you're going to have a bad time.

See, that's not it. With normal enemies I really know what I'm doing, it's just that boss fight. I think if I could fight him on a proper level with some kind of open space to manoeuvre properly I could have him easy, but it's the tight corridor-style that you fight him in that fucks me over.

Because despite how I made it sound, I'm not an idiot. I know how to play Dark Souls, it's just that boss fight always finds some way to absolutely fuck me... largely down to my own stupidity but there's only so far you can evade the gigantic cowbeast and look for a halfway decent opening when you're fighting in a narrow corridor.

 

[Dirty Hipsters]

Farming souls from the same area isn't sustainable. The number of souls needed to level ends up quickly outstripping the number of souls you gain from farmable enemies.

I speak as someone who ran Undead Burg a dozen or so times to level up so I might have a chance of taking the fucking Taurus Demon down at long last.

Spoiler: I never did. Yes, I am just that terrible.

Key to taking down the taurus demon super easily:

Buy residence key from the merchant in undead burg and get the gold pine resin.

When fighting the taurus demon climb the ladder next to the fog gate to the top of the tower, apply gold pine resin to your weapon, do a plunging attack on taurus demon. While he's stunned for a second 2 hand your weapon and go to town. I usually manage to take him down in 3-5 hits and take no damage.

Later on in the game the taurus demon becomes a normal enemy in the Demon Ruins.

It always sounds easy when someone explains to me how to do it, but the second I actually get in there all my higher brain functions just vanish and I revert to my usual gameplay method of "hit buttons until the thing falls down" which is not a winning strategy at any point.

Even with an Uchikatana with Gold Pine Resin applied, I fail. Then there was the one time I decided to try to get out of the narrow corridor of the ramparts by luring him up onto the big circular tower you kill the archers on... wherein I missed a dodge, got hit and got thrown over the edge and down to my death in truly humiliating fashion.

On the plus side of my brief and miserable failure-filled experience with Dark Souls, I am now a fucking expert at taking the Undead Burg. I can do that shit practically in my sleep now the amount of times I had to run through it on my way to getting flattened again.

Yet I'm still very much considering getting my hands on Dark Souls 2 tomorrow... hooray for masochism! Though I've heard that Dark Souls 2 is not so much easier as it is a touch more accessible so maybe I'll get a bit further in that one before I hit the "you don't belong here, get fucked" boss fight.

Yeah...I'd say that if you can't beat the taurus demon in dark souls you shouldn't bother getting dark souls 2. The beginning of dark souls 2 doesn't give you a shield with 100% physical block (and in fact, only one starting class even gets a shield to start with), so if your entire gameplay strategy is "hit buttons until thing dies" you're going to have a bad time.

See, that's not it. With normal enemies I really know what I'm doing, it's just that boss fight. I think if I could fight him on a proper level with some kind of open space to manoeuvre properly I could have him easy, but it's the tight corridor-style that you fight him in that fucks me over.

Because despite how I made it sound, I'm not an idiot. I know how to play Dark Souls, it's just that boss fight always finds some way to absolutely fuck me... largely down to my own stupidity but there's only so far you can evade the gigantic cowbeast and look for a halfway decent opening when you're fighting in a narrow corridor.

You could just fight him my way, without having to dodge. Seriously, plunging attacks are your friend against him, they do massive damage and you don't have to weasel your way around him in that tight space. Also, Uchigatana isn't exactly a high damage weapon. If you want to end the fight with him quickly you're better off grabbing the zweihander from the graveyard, pumping a few points into strength to be able to two hand it, and use that. I've taken the taurus demon down with 2 hits using that beast. Same strategy, gold pin resin, plunging attack, hit him again while he's staggered = dead boss. No dodging, no maneuvering around him.

Problem is though, you're really going to want to learn how to fight on ledges because you'll be doing that A LOT in dark souls. Tons of small ledges in New Londo, Anor Londo, Dark Root Garden, Catacombs, Tomb of the Giants, The Great Hollow, Lost Izalith, Valley of the Drakes, etc, and same with Dark Souls 2. Dark Souls LOVES setting you up to get knocked off ledges.

 

[ShinyCharizard]

Farming souls from the same area isn't sustainable. The number of souls needed to level ends up quickly outstripping the number of souls you gain from farmable enemies.

I speak as someone who ran Undead Burg a dozen or so times to level up so I might have a chance of taking the fucking Taurus Demon down at long last.

Spoiler: I never did. Yes, I am just that terrible.

There is a very easy strategy for taking down the Taurus Demon. Stick to his groin, as he attacks you can literally walk through his groin area and end up behind him, almost every attack will miss you. For those that hit, just block them, it won't do much damage at all.

 

[Samael Barghest]

Yeah, it kinda does break the game a bit. I started playing a week ago with the intent of NOT beating this game due to how bad the physics are. I'm not going to put my all into a game where there are enemies that can swing a cleaver through a wall but when you do it your sword bounces off harmlessly. Anyways, I spent the first 15 hours in Darkroot Garden just pissing about doing nothing. Then, for some weird reason, I decided to fight the Moonlight Butterfly. I lost the first time (its attack went through a wall to hit me) but won easily the second time. So easily that I wanted a challenge. So I fought the Gargoyles but was disappointed by them. So I fought the Capra Demon, which did give me a bit of a challenge until I switched over to the great scythe and wiped the floor with him. I don't even remember the fight against the Gaping Dragon. It was over in under a minute. Quelaag was horrifyingly easy with the great scythe and was another fight that ended under a minute. I didn't actually get any real challengle from a boss until I hit Ornstien and Smough at the 18 hour mark. I've been stuck here for ten hours without making a shred a progress.

 

[Shraggler]

I've only found "soul farming" useful when I want to purchase some (relatively cheap) consumables, such as firebombs, arrows/bolts, titanite shards, resins, or even a shield/weapon that I want to use that I haven't received from a drop at that point.

Also, farming rats for Humanity seems to be useful from time to time, especially in the Depths. If I've been trying too many new techniques with different weapon-armor-shield combinations and just getting my ass kicked, a good amount of Humanities are quite useful and seem to be worth the time sink to farm.

Granted, I've only just reached the Gaping Dragon; that is to say, I've never beat the game. I'm taking my time running around, exploring shit, being super cautious and getting my backstab/parry aptitude up.

Honestly, this is the only game in recent (and maybe even long-term) memory that I didn't want to just rush to the end of the story at some point. It definitely has something to do with the constant, varied challenge the game provides, and the way that it goes about doing so.