I Ruined World of WarCraft

Fordo

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Oct 17, 2007
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I welcomed the change from 40 man to 25 man-10 man raiding, but there was something to be said when a huge pack of lowbies would try to raid barrens, or to see 40 people in greens and blues running through BRD.

most MMO players will tell you they play the game for the community as much as the content. How many people showed up for the first Lord Kazaak sighting? And how much server e-drama did that encounter promote? To me, developers may have had less control over this kind of content, but it was the most memorable.

/nostalicsuperrant
 

Samah

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Jul 7, 2008
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barryween said:
WOW is cool, just not 15 bucks a month cool...Maybe 2?
I hear this so often. What else would you spend that $15 on? I know people who can spend $200 on alcohol every other weekend. $15 will JUST get you a restaurant dinner or a movie ticket (not both).

On the other hand, $15/m will give you as much time in WoW as you like to socialise and enjoy the content. You can still head out every now and then, but now you have something easy and enjoyable to do in the meantime.

It's all relative dude, $15 is nothing.

Fordo said:
...or to see 40 people in greens and blues running through BRD.
BRD has a player limit of 5 people. Even when it was raidable (a long, long time ago), it certainly wasn't for 40 people.
 

Fordo

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Oct 17, 2007
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Samah said:
Fordo said:
...or to see 40 people in greens and blues running through BRD.
BRD has a player limit of 5 people. Even when it was raidable (a long, long time ago), it certainly wasn't for 40 people.
A long long time ago, the only way into MC was through BRD.
 

Samah

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Fordo said:
Samah said:
Fordo said:
...or to see 40 people in greens and blues running through BRD.
BRD has a player limit of 5 people. Even when it was raidable (a long, long time ago), it certainly wasn't for 40 people.
A long long time ago, the only way into MC was through BRD.
You could only have a small number in the instance at a time though. When did they bring in the attunement? I remember doing lava jumps to get to that stupid crystal.
 

Fearzone

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Dec 3, 2008
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I'm trying to figure out why WotLK rubbed me the wrong way, and this article makes some good points.

For some odd reason, the most interesting and enjoyable part of the game for me was the level 20-40 range. "Those were the glory days" I think whenever I reflect back upon the characters I leveled to 70. There you settle in to your toon and meet new people who are settling in to theirs. There is a rapid and easy gear and ability progression which keeps things fresh and new. Every couple of days your whole look and playstyle can be reinvented.

Then, when you get to the endgame, Raids can be fun in the beginning, but the rep/honor/boss grinds eventually drains your soul. Guild spirit turns in to guild drama and collapses with guild politics. And then you re-roll.

I think the expansions should have gone horizontal, not vertical.
 

BoredKellon

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Jan 11, 2008
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I miss UO, pre-trammel of course. Very few mmo's out there tickle my fancy and WoW is a great example of what i don't want in an mmo. Personally for me I'm looking forward to Mortal Online, Infinity: Quest For Earth, and above all else Darkfall. Every time I hear a story of how an already soft mmo get's even softer, I cringe and die a little inside. Thanks a lot for killing me softly.
 

ffxfriek

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MA7743W said:
I was similarly disappointed when the Wilderness was removed from Runescape.
Then I realized that it sucked anyway.
So it's all good.
aagh too true at that. infact i still played until recently when my membs ran out and i dont feel like going back to that pittiful excuse of a gma e now
 

teh_v

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I think anyone who's never played Ultima Online really has no idea what the writer talking about. There was a day before 3d engines and fancy graphic when 2d gameplay ruled the MMO market. Those were the days of UO and they were chaotic days indeed. In those days to have even decent amount of points in a skill meant you had to grid your way there for hours there were no quest that gave out XP you just went into caves and grind, grind, grind intil your skill points went up. Any loot that was made or drop by monsters could be stolen from you unless you insured it. Yes murder and thievery were common in those days and death had its consequences. It was a hard life for a hard core MMO player but there was joy in that life. From being know as the best tailor in the land or feared for being a PC ganker. You felt alive in those worlds not now when you log into an MMO and its the virtual equivalent of going to Disney world and riding the roller coasters.
 

Abedeus

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Samah said:
barryween said:
WOW is cool, just not 15 bucks a month cool...Maybe 2?
I hear this so often. What else would you spend that $15 on? I know people who can spend $200 on alcohol every other weekend. $15 will JUST get you a restaurant dinner or a movie ticket (not both).

On the other hand, $15/m will give you as much time in WoW as you like to socialise and enjoy the content. You can still head out every now and then, but now you have something easy and enjoyable to do in the meantime.

It's all relative dude, $15 is nothing.
For US people, it's nothing. For rich countries of Europe, yes, it's nothing.

But in Poland it's 45 PLN, which will buy you a good lunch for a family of four. Or 2 movie tickets and a large popcorn.

I'd rather spend my $15/12 EUR on an MMO that is actually fun. CoX or Ragnarok Online could entertain me for longer than WoW. I couldn't play it more than 10 hours TOTAL during those years it has been running.

Because while RO managed to get me interested by playing first on Private servers, then on Officials, WoW failed to do that 4 times, twice on official and twice on privates.

Also, graphics suck. And that's by someone who likes RO graphics.
 

Fordo

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Oct 17, 2007
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Samah said:
You could only have a small number in the instance at a time though. When did they bring in the attunement? I remember doing lava jumps to get to that stupid crystal.
Like I said, in the begenning, you could, and did send in 40 people to BRD to get into MC. Then they added that goofy window you jumped through to save you and your group some headaches and the extra time it took to have to run through BRD. Then they changed it to where you could not have 40 people in an instance. BRS and BRD at first were capped at 15 and then were later changed to 10...then 5. The same happened with Strath and Scholo.
 

Rust Gun

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Jan 19, 2009
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Fearzone said:
I'm trying to figure out why WotLK rubbed me the wrong way, and this article makes some good points.

For some odd reason, the most interesting and enjoyable part of the game for me was the level 20-40 range. "Those were the glory days" I think whenever I reflect back upon the characters I leveled to 70. There you settle in to your toon and meet new people who are settling in to theirs. There is a rapid and easy gear and ability progression which keeps things fresh and new. Every couple of days your whole look and playstyle can be reinvented.

Then, when you get to the endgame, Raids can be fun in the beginning, but the rep/honor/boss grinds eventually drains your soul. Guild spirit turns in to guild drama and collapses with guild politics. And then you re-roll.

I think the expansions should have gone horizontal, not vertical.
It was that very fact which made me quit WoW. When I took a step back and looked at the game and it's community I saw just that. It's more trouble that it is actual fun.

*Sigh*
 

jigawatts

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Jan 27, 2009
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I would have to disagree with the game being less fun or less enjoyable nowadays. Like many people here, I was around during the 7 hour Molten Core nights and knocking down Onyxia, and they were fun and memorable. Nothing was cooler than knocking down that big stupid pink dragon for the first time, or opening the cache of the fire lord. But I also remember the hour-long afk's, the fights over loot, the cancelled raids because not enough people showed up. And I also remember vividly the disbanding of our guild just before BC - another casualty of inevitable drama.

BC, for me, was a beautiful time. Our fresh new guild made up of 15 from pre-BC was poised to take on the world, and we did. We hammered up to 70, and then the first wall: The runing of Steamvaults and Botanica and Shattered Halls ad infinitum until we had enough of us revered enough to run the heroics. We pushed through, and got eventually started Kara, where we hit the second wall: The difficulty of Kara at the beginning. Granted, most of us were undergeared and hadn't run enough heroics - but can you blame us? We were so burned out from the regular runs that we wanted to experience something new. It wasn't long after that that four or five of us burned out and quit playing.

When I picked it up again, I started a new toon on a new server with a friend who had just started. For him, everything was new and exciting, and he was moving along much faster than me. Thankfully, 2.3 came out right around that time, and the leveling process became bearable in the old world. We eventually made it up to 70, and found a small group of like-minded people, and started burning through Kara. And then we hit the third wall: the jump from 10 to 25 man raids. Our small group of friends who had worked to get through Kara started recruiting so we could start in on Gruul. It wasn't long before the guild collapsed under the weight of new recruits and old grudges, and we were forced to go our own way. By that time, I had every piece of badge gear and Kara gear, and was itching for something new. I pugged into the occasional Gruul's lair, but The Eye and Serpentshrine were painful to pug through. Eventually I landed in a larger guild that I could get semi-regular runs with and started slowly working on SSC, with Gruul and Mags always on the books. But that guild was sterile, and it wasn't all that enjoyable to be a part of... I was looking for a real challenge, so I found some of the top tier guilds, and joined up with them. But it was the same thing... people were grouped together out of necessity, not because they enjoyed the company. You could cut the tension on vent with a knife.

At the end of BC, we were working on BT, but not getting that far, but every raid night, I was there, flasked and farmed and ready to go. But I wasn't having fun. So I gquit and spent the next little while wandering alone.

When Wrath was finally launched, I joined up with a friendly, if not noobish guild. Now, Scarcely two and a half months after launch, a small group of us have begun clearing end game raids, and just last night, we downed Kel'Thuzad, and the event was as memorable as anything I've experienced in game.

With just 600 health left on the boss, our MT went down in a pile of scrap metal and holy light, our healers were dead, our dps were dead. It was over. We had come so close, so quickly. To fail now was heart breaking. But wait, in the shadows, a vanished rogue was chasing down the boss, with scarcely a hundred hit points to his name he snuck up behind big ugly and with a quick stab of his dagger, the night was ours. We celebrated and cheered and hooted and hollered and congratulated each other and retold the story to each other from our own perspectives, each of us crumpled on the floor.

Even last night, after the glow of the final encounter was over, we reminisced about the old days and how easy the new content is. I'll admit, the new content may be easier, but because it's more accessible makes it that much more rewarding. I never got to see Illidan, but now, with nine friends, I'll be able to stare down Arthas, and reminisce about that fight when we're looking down the ancient crypt that keeps Sargeras.
 

Z4ppyP4ntz2.o

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I disagree with alot of your artical maybe because i am one of those power levelers. However i play on PvP relms were everyone is pvp all the time and that adds a whole new type of game. I find no better joy then hiding in the woods waiting for some n00b to walk by or getting some friends together and slaughtering a whole low level village. Maybe its because i play horde but i think everyone needs to add a little anarchy to world of warcraft.
 

barryween

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Abedeus said:
Samah said:
barryween said:
WOW is cool, just not 15 bucks a month cool...Maybe 2?
I hear this so often. What else would you spend that $15 on? I know people who can spend $200 on alcohol every other weekend. $15 will JUST get you a restaurant dinner or a movie ticket (not both).

On the other hand, $15/m will give you as much time in WoW as you like to socialise and enjoy the content. You can still head out every now and then, but now you have something easy and enjoyable to do in the meantime.

It's all relative dude, $15 is nothing.
All I'm saying is 15 bucks a mont is 180 dollars a year. I'd rather save for a year and then I could buy two games for my console(xbox 360) and play them for as long as my 360 lasts. I know what your thinking "But you dont get that online stuff!" well with that other money I could buy a years worth of Xbox live membership.
 

Backup Bruv

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Nov 6, 2008
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Its impossible to destory a game that was made by satan. I wouldnt mind seeing Sgt. Soap Mac Tavish go head to head with the lich king, he would pown him, then we'd see where his crappy magic would get him, or hell Scarface vs Lich King.
 

Wingmna

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Feb 10, 2009
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<-- Was a casual for all of vanilla, ever only finishing 20man raids with my small guild and doing joined MC runs... We got up to rag and after that it fell a part. So your, 'lolnostalgia' or in fake's case 'Nostalgia glasses' will not work. Since if anything I had a much better time in TBC then I did in Vanilla in terms of raiding yet I enjoyed Vanilla more even though I hadn't experienced even HALF the content. So I am with the author, being a casual rocks in MMORPGs because it even feels more epic.

That said, anyone who doesn't like Vanilla over WOTLK, either never played it, or is one of the few retarded people that most likely gave up after getting killed the first time.


WoW was originally based on Everquest, mostly. It combo'd elements from many but Everquest was the real first epic-styled raiding game. Games like this have long questlines and big bosses for players to kill together, etc.

Vanilla was like this. EPIC stuff, long quests that sent you across the world (you actually felt like you were doing the work), massive battles that required you to have 40 raid members (while now guilds are getting away with 20-25 people for nax or anything else) and required a certain amount of skill for everyone of them. The randomness, it felt like a world that was alive... You could take a wrong turn in an instance, yet STILL end up finding something instead of linear aoe grindfests.

So why did Tigole leave? Because I think Blizzard knows that WoW has gone off track, they KNOW that so many people have joined, people that aren't real MMORPG players, they are more like wii players. Tigole is old-school, everquest-styled man, and this is a good sign for the new MMO.


Is the game less fun and less enjoyable?

Of course it is for those who play it for what it is meant to be. WoW is a different game now. Is it less enjoyable for all? No, of course not. Blizzard knew what it was doing and that it was stuffing up the hardcore game base.

Achievements are crap. Raiders want the actual encounters to be epic, achievements are just a bad excuse to reuse content and I personally have nothing to do with the pointless shit that only gives you crappy titles for... i dont know... gratz you can spend the most useless time of tiny little aspects of the game? Making raid encounters easy and adding extra, "oh but if you do this a bit differently it is harder" is not a MMORPG, its a sad excuse for lack of content.
 

Intoxicain

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Mar 18, 2009
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I have to join the CantFaketheFunk-bandwagon for the moment, but I'd also like to add that the out-of-the-box (so to speak) raid encounters in WotLK are intended to be easy, and that blizzard has stated they ddin't want the hard stuff to be availiable right away. think back to how much easier the t4 raids were to the t5 raids, and then the 6t raids (no vanilla WoW for me, I came late to the party). Right now we've got Kara (Naxx) Gruul (EoE) and Mag (Sarth) [I wasn't sure which of the latter two would be which, just bear with me]. Those raids were far easier than their counterparts at higher tiers. Even early on, pugging those raids wasn't unheard of, and in later stages of the expansion, only the newest guilds really worried about getting everyone together to run through them.

When the finalized version od Uldaar hits, I think (and hope) we'll see the difficulty curve rear it's ugly head again and make the endgame back to what we had seen.
 

Dorchucks

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Dec 17, 2008
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im agreeing with Backup Bruv but i hate those noobs who think there cool beacuse they have a crappy epic spaming over trade chat with Dirge or whatever.
 

Cowabungaa

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CantFaketheFunk said:
Sean, I have to say that I disagree with this piece. I think that you're confusing "easier" with "more accessible."

Oh sure, there are definitely things that are easier, and much less tedious. For instance, if I wanted to grind exalted with the Frostsaber Trainers in Winterspring, it'd take me about a week of solid grinding TOPS, compared to the months it would have taken pre-BC. Getting exalted with factions is also much simpler with Championing and daily quests (as opposed to just the repeatable turnins you saw pre-BC).

But as far as the endgame PvE content goes, I think you're dead wrong. Sure, I loved Molten Core back in the day, but really, when you look back at it? The fights were simple. The hard part was getting 39 other people to do it with. The arguably "hardest" fight before Majordomo Executus/Ragnaros, Baron Geddon, was: "Melee run out when he starts doing the fire thing. Dispel the mana drain. If you have the bomb, run away."

Compare that to, say, Sartharion, the easiest raid encounter in WotLK. Dodge lava waves, make sure that all the fire adds don't get caught in them or else they get much stronger, dodge the volcano blasts, etc. Also pretty simple, but more complex than most of the stuff we saw in Classic. Then you have all the optional stuff, like trying it with the three Drakes up - that's pretty damn tough.

You'd be right that Naxxramas is a shade of its former self, and I doubt we'll see anything THAT difficult until Icecrown Citadel (the Naxx/Sunwell of this expansion). But the actual content is far more complex and - for a 25 man group - more challenging than anything pre-BC. I have a hunch that Ulduar will be a definite step up.

I agree that there's very little RISK involved, though.
*claps* Very much true. Best thing by the way, about the optional things, is that everything can do the encounter as he or she wishes. Hardcore people can have the toughest fights possible, more relaxt players who just want to progress through the instance or something just pick the less difficult version; to each his own game, much more freedom. I only see good things about that. Same with achievements, I love the system. Gear is back to it's essence now: no longer a status symbol, but simply a tool for progress. Bragging is done with exclusive mounts, titles and tabards. Showing off is optional, again more freedom to the player on how he or she wants to play the game. Do you just want to see the content and progress through the game, or do you want to be the best of the best? The choice is yours.

Disclaimer: I don't play the game anymore, I ran out of content.
 

URfan

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May 14, 2009
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i agree with cantfakethefunk he is right (i also play world of warcraft) im skria on zuluhead