I want to get into D&D

[zenoaugustus]

So a couple days ago, one of my roommates came up to me and asked if I had ever played Dungeons and Dragons. I had, about ten years ago (I would've been 10 at the time). After I asked around to a couple other roommates and friends who come by often, it seems like we have a few people who are trying to play.

But it has fallen to me to organize and figure out what to do. I recall some rules and with my experience playing complex RPGs I'm sure I can read the handbooks and determine how to play appropriately. What I am worried of is that I'm not sure all the materials we are going to need. Here is a list of stuff I was planning on getting, can someone verify to me if I should get more or not. I was planning on getting the third edition, because that is the one I played, and I've heard grumbles before regarding the 4th edition.

-The Player's Handbook
-An Expansion Set
-Graph Paper

I know I need dice, but I'm not sure how many or what kinds. And should I get the Monster's Handbook, so I can create an adventure of my own? Is there a treasure handbook?

I would appreciate any and all information you can share with me. Thanks for your help!!

And in case you were wondering, yes, I'm making a druid.

 

[Basement Cat]

I was planning on getting the third edition, because that is the one I played, and I've heard grumbles before regarding the 4th edition.

-The Player's Handbook
-An Expansion Set
-Graph Paper

I know I need dice, but I'm not sure how many or what kinds. And should I get the Monster's Handbook, so I can create an adventure of my own? Is there a treasure handbook?

Dice needed: One d4, a handful of d6, one d8, two d10, and one d12 and d20.

Go for 3.5th edition. Stay away from 4th edition--The makers acknowledged it sucks and are working on the 5th edition. Pathfinder (which I haven't played) is a build up from 3rd and simplifies things to the games betterment: For example they combined Spot and 2 other skills into 1 called Awareness. Also magic users no longer burn XP to craft magic items--a serious and influential improvement there.


You NEED a Dungeon Masters guide--that's where the treasure lists and rules for crafting magic items (including weapons and armor) are found. It also has a lot of crucial information on all other aspects of the game.


You'll WANT a monster manual. You can get info for free from the internet but you'll appreciate having one literally on hand.

 

[DoPo]

Stay away from 4th edition--The makers acknowledged it sucks and are working on the 5th edition.

Actually, it was Essentials which led to the early retirement. Evidence, before Essentials, 4e was leading the charts. Also evidence, the Essentials team don't know what the fuck they are doing. Also, WotC are not known for consistently sound and sane decisions. Evidence: the info released for D&D Next. Dear god, they sound like incompetent morons half the time while tossing brilliant but almost impossible to achieve plans the other half of the time.

OT: Hobby shops usually have complete sets of dice for D&D players. Normally, assuming you're providing all the dice (so players don't have any of their own) for each person you'd want a d20 and about 2-3 of all others. OK, that might be a bit excessive but 1 d20 per person is pretty good, you can also do with 1 per 2 people. For the other dice, go with about 2-3 per 2 people but get more d6s, especially if you'll be rolling stats. Just go with 4 per person for those, or if you're poor (or just don't want to lug that many dice) - again, 4 per 2 people is fine. If you find you need more dice (one person needs d10s, for example) just buy more - players can share for a session or two. Or they can go buy some themselves. And I don't know if it's obvious or not but get pencils - have 1 per person and some spare ones. You could do with less but don't be cheap. You can do with less rubbers (or "erasers", you American, you). Actually one trick I do with rubbers is to just separate them in halves or quarters (depending on how big they are) - that way I get more of them (seriously, has anybody here wore one out?) and I can share or afford to lose them without much problem.

Book-wise, you could roll with the Player's Handbook only, but you'd probably want the Dungeon Master's Guide as a new DM - it has...well, advice for DMs unsurprisingly. It's not mandatory but it's recommended if you're new to RPGs. Even then it's not that necessary if you have ideas for a game already and just want some rules to bind them with. Also, there is the Monster Manual - it is really handy. At the very, very least, you want the MM so you can just pull enemies from it at any time. There are books with complete adventures, too - if you don't want to make your own and aren't bad (at least the...two I've played. not till the end even). Treasure was...I forget, I think you can find some equipment in the Player's Handbok but I can't recall if it's all (so, for stuff like generic enchantments for items and so on) of it, you may need the Dungeon Master's Guide - I'm not sure. Do note that you can use the d20 SRD [http://www.d20srd.org/] which is the rules for D&D for free. It's all the rules you should need, however the Player's Handbook is still more structured - I'd advise getting that if you feel unsure.

What is the expansion set you plan on getting? There are loads - from settings to books with new rules and stuff. I'd suggest the Tome of Battle. Pick it up and, if anybody wants to run a vanilla "warrior" type class, just slap them with the it then hand it over and make them use it instead. The classes there are approximately seventy bajillion times cooler than just "a fighter". Also, a personal favourite of mine is Complete Psionics. If I were running a game, I'd just have all magic users use those rules instead (although, I could just still call it magic and get rid of some of the psionic references).

Other than that, remember rule 0 - the DM is always right. Make sure your players also know it. But don't abuse it, too - the rule that supersedes rule 0 is "you're there to have fun", rule 0 is supposed to support that. And one VERY important thing - you are not friggin' babies (at least I assume you're not) - for some reason DMs and players alike manage to forget that on a regular basis and act immature. If there is a problem, talk to the players. If somebody does something dickish, don't go passive-aggressive on him (injure or otherwise his character) in hopes "they'll get it" - it doesn't work, it never has, never will. Instead either bring it up on the table or after the game or something. This is the stupidest mistake I've seen and keep seeing being made - the "don't act like adults" mistake.

 

[Nieroshai]

Pathfinder is making a huge uptick in popularity, so go with that. You need a player's handbook, a Game Mastery Guide, a few sets of RPG dice (go to almost any game shop and ask for roleplay game dice), and a large grid with one-inch squares. As for all errata, the Pathfinder SRD online is a great place to bone up on any questions you may have. As for character tokens, coins with masking tape on them will work in a pinch.

Pathfinder (which I haven't played) is a build up from 3rd and simplifies things to the games betterment: For example they combined Spot and 2 other skills into 1 called Awareness.

For the sake of undoing OP confusion, the gestalt skills are Perception (Listen + Spot) and Stealth (Move Silently + Hide). I haven't played 3.5 long enough to be quite sure if Survival is a combo skill too, but it has Track in it.

 

[Basement Cat]

Pathfinder is making a huge uptick in popularity, so go with that. You need a player's handbook, a Game Mastery Guide, a few sets of RPG dice (go to almost any game shop and ask for roleplay game dice), and a large grid with one-inch squares. As for all errata, the Pathfinder SRD online is a great place to bone up on any questions you may have. As for character tokens, coins with masking tape on them will work in a pinch.

Pathfinder (which I haven't played) is a build up from 3rd and simplifies things to the games betterment: For example they combined Spot and 2 other skills into 1 called Awareness.

For the sake of undoing OP confusion, the gestalt skills are Perception (Listen + Spot) and Stealth (Move Silently + Hide). I haven't played 3.5 long enough to be quite sure if Survival is a combo skill too, but it has Track in it.

Thank you for the clarification. When I started writing that post I knew those two pairs of skills [Perception (Listen + Spot) and Stealth (Move Silently + Hide)] were the skills that were combined...but when I was actually writing my mind went blank.

*blushes*

Didn't know Survival included Track, though. Smart. I like it when game makers wise up. The way D&D was going--having all these skills but having a limited # of points per character class (Wizard--2 points/level plus Int bonus=WHAT?!?)--reminded me of how Role Master reached the point of inanity by including a skill for personal cleanliness. I don't remember the Name but you had to 'officially' sink points into it or 'technically' you were an unbathed, stinking slob.

Yeah...riiiiiight.

 

[Nieroshai]

Pathfinder is making a huge uptick in popularity, so go with that. You need a player's handbook, a Game Mastery Guide, a few sets of RPG dice (go to almost any game shop and ask for roleplay game dice), and a large grid with one-inch squares. As for all errata, the Pathfinder SRD online is a great place to bone up on any questions you may have. As for character tokens, coins with masking tape on them will work in a pinch.

Pathfinder (which I haven't played) is a build up from 3rd and simplifies things to the games betterment: For example they combined Spot and 2 other skills into 1 called Awareness.

For the sake of undoing OP confusion, the gestalt skills are Perception (Listen + Spot) and Stealth (Move Silently + Hide). I haven't played 3.5 long enough to be quite sure if Survival is a combo skill too, but it has Track in it.

Thank you for the clarification. When I started writing that post I knew those two pairs of skills [Perception (Listen + Spot) and Stealth (Move Silently + Hide)] were the skills that were combined...but when I was actually writing my mind went blank.

*blushes*

Didn't know Survival included Track, though. Smart. I like it when game makers wise up. The way D&D was going--having all these skills but having a limited # of points per character class (Wizard--2 points/level plus Int bonus=WHAT?!?)--reminded me of how Role Master reached the point of inanity by including a skill for personal cleanliness. I don't remember the Name but you had to 'officially' sink points into it or 'technically' you were an unbathed, stinking slob.

Yeah...riiiiiight.

Something you'll like then: in Pathfinder, the rules about rolling an untrained skill are a little looser. Not having ranks just means you roll a flat D20 (or else take a /2 penalty, I don't remember-- I'm kind of drunk). Only skills like Use Magic Device, Sleight of Hand, Profession, Craft, or knowledge checks are unusable without ranks. (Once again, all errors are due to inebriation)
I like to think of Pathfinder as D&D 3.75; with all the detail and story immersion of 3.5 but the focus on gameplay of 4th edition but without turning the game into PnP Diablo. It's also built upon by the community, with room for inclusion of homebrew material. A nice factor thought is that any rules or characters can be imported between D&D3.5 and Pathfinder with only minor tweaking or just moderately creative DMing.
Wizards still only get 2 points per level, plus INT. It's kind of sad, but magic can accomplish most of those skills with a Spellcraft check and a spell slot instead.

 

[Basement Cat]

Wizards still only get 2 points per level, plus INT. It's kind of sad, but magic can accomplish most of those skills with a Spellcraft check and a spell slot instead.

In other words Wizards--the character class most associated with being 'learned and scholarly' (bards can bite me)--receive no more points for Knowledge skills than grunt fighters.

*sighs*

I know the Lore Master prestige class can turn a Wizard into a veritable Gandalf but this kind of thing always reminds me of the time I decided that I wanted to make a Gentleman fighter. He was a gentry class fellow who was trained for war "Like a gentleman should be." and who also had a "gentleman's proper education" (think Gone With the Wind West Point educated Southern gentlemen). I gave him a higher Intelligence than I did Strength because it fit in with the character and sank the extra beginning skill points into knowledge skills, artistic skills, etc.

Come our first adventure we had a Wizard who acted like the archetypal 'know-it-all'--no problem there--but who had literally NO skill points in any knowledge skills except Spellcraft. It took about five seconds before our party members--including our rather embarrassed Wizard--started turning to me for EVERY knowledge check, etc.

It was funny as hell, sure, but that was the moment I just shook my head at how the system was a little toooooo balanced towards meta-gaming, if you take my meaning.

 

[Voxgizer]

You'll WANT a monster manual. You can get info for free from the internet but you'll appreciate having one literally on hand.

I don't think this can be stressed enough. I've had times where it's just easier to have the book. Funny kind of thing when that happens.

My main tip for it: Make sure you're having fun first and foremost.

Also, don't be shy about the role playing aspect, it's all in good fun.

 

[WOPR]

You need a Dungeon Master Guide, a Monster Manuel, a good imagination, and I hope you're playing 3.5 and not 4.0... 4.0 did to D&D what dubstep did to music.

 

[KeyMaster45]

Go for 3.5th edition. Stay away from 4th edition--The makers acknowledged it sucks and are working on the 5th edition.

You need a Dungeon Master Guide, a Monster Manuel, a good imagination, and I hope you're playing 3.5 and not 4.0... 4.0 did to D&D what dubstep did to music.

*scratches head*

I got into D&D over the summer playing 4e sessions of Darksun, Encounters, and Eberron; I'm having a great time. What's so bad about it? I've looked at the 5e stuff they're working on and some of the changes sound kinda crappy. Granted now that they're selling pdfs from older editions we're considering running a 3.5e campaign. Hell, there's even been talk of when 5e finally drops that we'd just keep using 4e and 3.5e.

 

[McMindflayer]

Though you're going to hear massively differently from everyone else. 4th edition isn't bad. I would go on to defend it, but that's not the point of this thread and I'm not going to derail it.

But whatever, you want a 3rd edition game. My suggestion is Pathfinder. It's essentially an updated version of 3.5 and has been referred to 3.75 by most.

While I do suggest actually getting the books, you can find almost all info on the game here http://www.d20pfsrd.com/

My suggestion for running a first game. Buy a module. A game that's already pre-made, and set for pathfinder. This will get you prepared for DMing a game and the players will get to better understand the rules. Keep it low level, no higher than 5. After a module or two, you can then branch out from there to whatever story you want to create.

 

[Kyrian007]

I've played a little 3 and 3.5 DnD... really preferred 2nd ed but 3 and 3.5 are perfectly fine. But don't get locked into DnD as the only pen and paper game out there.

Palladium Games has a wide variety of game genres to play around with all built around a common rules system (way more complicated than DnD, but you get the hang of it.) They have the standard Fantasy setting, but they also have "Beyond the Supernatural" a kind of modern noir setting with magic and psychic ability. "Nightbane" is a modern setting with a "light world, dark world" theme. "Heroes" is their superhero game (and they do have "Villains" you can play as well as use to create npcs.) Some older games of theirs include the TMNT RPG, and a really cool game where the title says it all called "Ninjas and Superspies." And their most popular game is "Rifts" a very unique take on and mix of post-apocalypse, cyberpunk, fantasy, road warrior, mechwarrior, and sci-fi.

But MY favorite game is still Pinnacle Games classic "Deadlands." A Spagetti western... with meat. It's "Supernatural" meets "Gunsmoke," AND you got a little "X-Files" in my "Maverick."

Both require d4s, 6s, 8s, 10s, 12s, and 20s (a couple of each and some extra 6s is recommended.) Deadlands also requires 2 decks of cards per GM, 1 deck per player (if you want to play a magic user) And a set of 3 color poker chips used as optional exp that can be spent to "twist fate."

 

[Basement Cat]

snip

snip

I had to say it.

[small] Please don't hurt me.[/small]

To each their own. One thing I do like about 4th edition was the introduction of Ritual Magic. I took that and ran with it in (adapted it for my own gaming).

I'm sure 4th edition has other good characteristics...I can't think of any, but I'm su--

Spoiler: AAARGH!!! Not in the face! Not in the face!

 

[Defenestra]

In other words Wizards--the character class most associated with being 'learned and scholarly' (bards can bite me)--receive no more points for Knowledge skills than grunt fighters.

Notably, that + Int bonus is pretty significant if you are a wizard. Because, as a wizard, that's gonna be a fairly large number.

My recommendation, echoing several others here, is to go for Pathfinder. It's built on a robust system, the vast majority of it is online for free, and I've had rather a lot of fun with it. It also managed to make the more limited 3.5 classes less sad, and the more monstrous ones less horrifying. Balance isn't a term I like to throw around too forcefully where games designed for diverse teams are concerned, though.

As for 4th, well, it's not so much a bad game as a very different game than what most folks who are fond of 3.5 and its kin were looking for. It's the lack of customization options that bugged me.

S'like, there are a handful of ways to set up any given class in 4th. Wheras you get more customization options within any one of the 11 or so diferent kinds of *bard* that Pathfinder offers.

In the interest of not dropping a refrigerator's worth of character tuning and powers in to you and your players' laps all at once, I suggest starting out low level. Pathfinder characters have this tendency to pick up superpowers as they climb in levels. It's very satisfying, but starting on the small end of things might be sensible.

Oh, and for party composition, I tend to suggest a medic(cleric, oracle, witch, paladin, bards and druids can cover here in a pinch), an asskicker (fighter, monk, cavalier, paladin, ranger), a utility-type (thief, wizard, bard, witch, if it's got a big spell list or lots of skill points, it counts), and a blaster (alchemist, sorceror, wizard, ranger, maybe even a gunslinger, though I'd want to tinker with them before tossing them in).

 

[Jfswift]

I was planning on getting the third edition, because that is the one I played, and I've heard grumbles before regarding the 4th edition.

-The Player's Handbook
-An Expansion Set
-Graph Paper

I know I need dice, but I'm not sure how many or what kinds. And should I get the Monster's Handbook, so I can create an adventure of my own? Is there a treasure handbook?

Dice needed: One d4, a handful of d6, one d8, two d10, and one d12 and d20.

Go for 3.5th edition. Stay away from 4th edition--The makers acknowledged it sucks and are working on the 5th edition. Pathfinder (which I haven't played) is a build up from 3rd and simplifies things to the games betterment: For example they combined Spot and 2 other skills into 1 called Awareness. Also magic users no longer burn XP to craft magic items--a serious and influential improvement there.


You NEED a Dungeon Masters guide--that's where the treasure lists and rules for crafting magic items (including weapons and armor) are found. It also has a lot of crucial information on all other aspects of the game.


You'll WANT a monster manual. You can get info for free from the internet but you'll appreciate having one literally on hand.

I second this. I think 3.5 offers a lot of flexibility for character builds and overall is a pretty balanced system. It has that 'classic' dungeons and dragons feel anyway.

btw, give this escapist article a look if you haven't already. It was posted a few years ago and has some interesting views on DM'ing and dungeons and dragons in general.

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/articles/view/columns/checkfortraps/7429-Master-of-the-Game

 

[loc978]

Can't help you with 4th edition (I probably play the most ass-backwards homebrew ever created, based mostly off AD&D 2e with mechanics pulled from 3.5, pathfinder, and Star Wars D20... also, any of my players can choose any race and class they or I can find a sheet for. I'll reverse-engineer and rebalance anything), but if you're willing to wing it, all you really need is a DM guide, a player's handbook, and a first-level campaign module (far easier than building your own campaign from scratch. Get a few sessions under your belt before attempting that). Also dice, but those should be quite inexpensive anywhere you can buy manuals. Those little tubes with matching sets in em are handy and come with at least one of every die you need... though I'd recommend having each of your players pick one up as well.

Ideally you should also have a specialized class book covering each of your players' classes, a monster manual, various magic manuals for any casters in the party, and a good amount of familiarity with D20SRD.org (also dandwiki.com).

Spoiler: also, if you have 20 minutes to kill

Listen to this guy

Spoiler: if you have a little more than an hour to kill...

Seriously, Spoony has a lot of good practical advice.

 

[Windcaler]

So a couple days ago, one of my roommates came up to me and asked if I had ever played Dungeons and Dragons. I had, about ten years ago (I would've been 10 at the time). After I asked around to a couple other roommates and friends who come by often, it seems like we have a few people who are trying to play.

But it has fallen to me to organize and figure out what to do. I recall some rules and with my experience playing complex RPGs I'm sure I can read the handbooks and determine how to play appropriately. What I am worried of is that I'm not sure all the materials we are going to need. Here is a list of stuff I was planning on getting, can someone verify to me if I should get more or not. I was planning on getting the third edition, because that is the one I played, and I've heard grumbles before regarding the 4th edition.

-The Player's Handbook
-An Expansion Set
-Graph Paper

I know I need dice, but I'm not sure how many or what kinds. And should I get the Monster's Handbook, so I can create an adventure of my own? Is there a treasure handbook?

I would appreciate any and all information you can share with me. Thanks for your help!!

And in case you were wondering, yes, I'm making a druid.

As a GM your job is to facilitate an enjoyable roleplaying environment for everyone, including you. I dont know if you're focused on a specific edition or anything. If not I suggest you look into Pathfinder, its much like D&D 3.5 edition but has some other changes. Its still a fantasy based pen and paper roleplaying game though, just under a different name

I say look into that for a few reasons. 1. the core rules are free, listed on online at d20pfsrd.com you can also find a wiki for Golarian (the world setting) at pathfinderwiki.com. You will probably need a Bestiary (monster manual) and there are 4? out though you really only need the 1st one. It might be 3 I havnt been following Paizo much this year. Paizo also offers Bestiaries in PDF format so if you just want a file you can pull up on your laptop they provide that (pdfs are cheaper then the books too) 2. Paizo publishing, the people that make everything for pathfinder, also publish some huge adventure paths which are premade adventures allowing the PCs to start at level 1 and move up to high levels. If you want I can give you a rough idea of what most of them are about. 3. Pathfinder has a pretty active and friendly community on the Paizo forums if you need help understanding anything 4. If you really need it the GMs manual is actually pretty amazing for new players, I wish I would have had something like that when I was starting out

As far as dice go you will need at least 1 of each kind. I recomend 3 or 4 sets if you have to provide all the materials. For just the GM I recomend at least 2 four sided dice, 3 six sided dice, 1 eight sided dice, 2 ten sided dice, 1 twelve sided dice, and a twenty sided dice. These are pretty easy to get in hobby stores or online.

Instead of graph paper I actually recomend a battle map. Which is basicly a grided dry erase map. Just take some dry erase markers to draw out rooms and erase them with a wet towel and you can use dice, minitures, poker chips or nearly anything else to represent characters and opponents. If you take care of them battle maps last a long time, mines probably 10 years old by this point and its still in excellent shape. Plus using that instead of graph paper has probably saved me a ton of money over the years. If you need an example something like this will work fine: http://www.amazon.com/Chessex-Role-Playing-Play-Mat/dp/B0015IQO2O/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1360668957&sr=8-1&keywords=dry+erase+battle+map

Finally I recomend some 3 by 5 cards to help you track initiatives with players and enemies along with vital stats. What I do with them is write the characters name in the center. Then at the top right I put vital stats like hit points, armor class, and initiative modifier. At the top left I put important skill modifiers like stealth and perception. When a fight starts I arrange them so who goes first is on top and who goes last is on the bottom. That way when someone takes their turn you just move their card to the bottom. Its a really easy way to determine who act when

If you have any specfic questions about pathfinder just ask, Ill be happy to answer them

 

[WOPR]

*scratches head*

I got into D&D over the summer playing 4e sessions of Darksun, Encounters, and Eberron; I'm having a great time. What's so bad about it? I've looked at the 5e stuff they're working on and some of the changes sound kinda crappy. Granted now that they're selling pdfs from older editions we're considering running a 3.5e campaign. Hell, there's even been talk of when 5e finally drops that we'd just keep using 4e and 3.5e.

Okay first off I want to say that Eberron. Is by far my FAVORITE campaign setting! (all the new races!)
What bugs me and many others about 4.0... In short they took the "RP" out of "RPG".
The storytelling is practically non-existant compared to the past versions and it's really simple and dumbed down. ...Heh, I just noticed how I can make a bunch of Devil May Cry jokes right now...

 

[davidsoc]

I have played D&D from Advanced through 4e.....3.5 is the cleanest in my opinion with some complexity. I would personally stick with it. Though i am currently running pathfinder, and i find it to be a very good system as well. Beyond that, yeah you are getting plenty of ideas on what to have here, but basic list:

-Players Guide
-Gamemaster Guide
-Monster Manual (yes having the book is better than just the online source though if money is an issue by all means use one of the online sources)
-At least 2 sets of dice (pref. each player has their own: they can cost as little as 4 dollars a set (US here, i realize they will be different in each country) and can get really expensive if you decide you need crazy sets) One note on the dice, there exist dice rolling programs for phones and computers and what not, but i personally do not like them, and actually play in one game where the gm refuses to let them be used...i do not care if my players use them....but like i said i personally do not like them
-a game mat of some sort with one inch squares...used for combat and drawing dungeons and what not on...the ones you will buy at a gaming store will be simple to clean if you use a dry erase pen on them.

Beyond that you can make your own stories and adventures, or you can buy or borrow published ones as well. I would recommend buying a dungeon magazine as they will have (usually) 3 adventures in them with just about everything you need to run it....one low-level (level 1-5), one mid (usually 7-12), and one high (15-20) so you can use those to truly experiment before creating your own, and give you players an idea of creating different level characters, and how to advance them.

Good luck and have fun.

 

[DoPo]

Go for 3.5th edition. Stay away from 4th edition--The makers acknowledged it sucks and are working on the 5th edition.

You need a Dungeon Master Guide, a Monster Manuel, a good imagination, and I hope you're playing 3.5 and not 4.0... 4.0 did to D&D what dubstep did to music.

*scratches head*

I got into D&D over the summer playing 4e sessions of Darksun, Encounters, and Eberron; I'm having a great time. What's so bad about it?

In short - you know how people would often claim one instalment is better than the other with video games ("GreatGame 2 is obviously better than GreatGame 3 - it has blah and blah" "Nuh-huh, GreatGame 2 was boring and repetitive, while GreatGame 3 actually FIXED blah!")? It's the same with RPGs. We call these "edition wars", though, since they go on a much bigger scale and people start spewing nonsense.

What bugs me and many others about 4.0... In short they took the "RP" out of "RPG".
The storytelling is practically non-existant compared to the past versions and it's really simple and dumbed down.

Case in point. The storytelling is not touched at all since that has never been part of any system. Storytelling is what you do that's unrelated to the game, the system is there for conflict resolution during that process. However, I expect the usual retort of "something something no rules some other stuff" that blatantly contradicts the fact the fact that RP itself not only does not need rules, they directly contradict the entire purpose of RP. However, somehow not having rules for roleplaying restricts you. You know, instead of being the opposite. Alternatively, it might "not be the heart of D&D/Gary Gygax any more" because some other stuff glossing over the fact that D&D didn't actually start as what one would call the "heart of D&D" and Gary Gygax pretty much made it as a dungeon crawler, because that's what he digged more.

Or maybe it's something else - I dunno, I've lost track of all the arguments for and against each system. It just boils down to opinions=facts.