If a company doesn't provide a demo for a game is it ok to pirate it?
- Thread starter MuttyGrims1321
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No. If there's no demo, you still have resources telling you if you'll like it (friends, reviewers, interviews, etc). If the lack of demo really ticks you off, then don't play the freaking game. To play it anyways sends a message you don't want to send - that you really want to play and won't let personal values actually stop you.
No I don't think that's a good reason to break the law. That would mean you'd be legally entitled to a demo. Though it's not a demo, but a full copy, and I'd bet you wouldn't always go out and buy the full copy of the game if you liked it.
Oooh can I have some? If you haven't got much just cut me a chunk off, and send it in a zip lock bag please.Daystar Clarion said:
To the OP: No. A lack of demo is not a justification for pirating. There is almost no reason to pirate a game.
If you don't like the fact there isn't a demo, complain to the developer or company. Tell them you want a demo. Play the game at a friend's house if you can. You don't take matters into your own hands.
Yes, getting burned sucks, it really does, but still...
I am not going to be able to get my hands on a discontinued game from a discontinued developer that is not sold in a single retail shop in my country (or online). My option would either be paying an extremely high price for it second hand, probably abroad, (which supports nobody except the person who previously owned the game, and any middle man; ebay for example) or I can pirate it.
But that wasn't really what you meant was it I guess...
If you don't like the fact there isn't a demo, complain to the developer or company. Tell them you want a demo. Play the game at a friend's house if you can. You don't take matters into your own hands.
Yes, getting burned sucks, it really does, but still...
I can think of one, and that is if it is completely impossible to play the game any other way in a way that supports anything related to the gaming industry.GrandmaFunk said:
I am not going to be able to get my hands on a discontinued game from a discontinued developer that is not sold in a single retail shop in my country (or online). My option would either be paying an extremely high price for it second hand, probably abroad, (which supports nobody except the person who previously owned the game, and any middle man; ebay for example) or I can pirate it.
But that wasn't really what you meant was it I guess...
I see nothing wrong with that, provided you play it for maybe a half hour to an hour to inform your purchase decision, then delete it. At that point, either buy the game or don't. Then, morally, I'd agree with you.
If, like me, you're a PC gamer with a rig that's not quite as new as it once was, I'd equally say that it's morally defensible to pirate a copy only to ensure that the game will run on your machine. This is where I'd quite like the developer's website to include a "will this game run on my computer" button which could read your specs and give you a rough idea of how it will run. The recommended system requirements on the box are somewhat inadequate in this regard.
If, like me, you're a PC gamer with a rig that's not quite as new as it once was, I'd equally say that it's morally defensible to pirate a copy only to ensure that the game will run on your machine. This is where I'd quite like the developer's website to include a "will this game run on my computer" button which could read your specs and give you a rough idea of how it will run. The recommended system requirements on the box are somewhat inadequate in this regard.
Sorry, for er, health and safety reason, I'm unable to send meat through the postal system.thenumberthirteen said:
Actually, Just Cause 2 has a great demo. it drops you in an area and gives you about 15 minutes(if I remember) to do whatever you want in that area. I even found a grenade launcher in the area and had fun with that.Retardinator said:
As for pirating a game for demoing purposes, legally wrong but if you set certain boundaries for yourself when you're demoing it then that, in my opinion, is morally fine. Any other way is just not demoing its down right piracy. The limits have to be limiting though. Like an actual demo.
there are two real answers to this.
legally: you cannot, should not, never pirate a game, ever.
morally: more flexible, but basically this: if you want to pirate a game with the intent to purchase it in a week, sure (my paycheck comes in a week, but I have free time NOW for ex). if your intent is to torrent it and then buy it when the price drops, less okay. there are lots of instances of what is MORALLY right, but ultimately the correct thing to do is to compensate everyone fully for all of the work they have done. publishers deal with distribution, developers make the game, retailers take your money and deal with having a local store: all of these people deserve renumeration for their work. ->
to test a game is VERY murky water. how much will you play it? 10 minutes? an hour? 2 hours? one full play through? best to stay away, and rent it for your console, read a bunch of reviews, watch gameplay videos. there aren't a shortage of ways to see how games are, without actually paying a dime.
legally: you cannot, should not, never pirate a game, ever.
morally: more flexible, but basically this: if you want to pirate a game with the intent to purchase it in a week, sure (my paycheck comes in a week, but I have free time NOW for ex). if your intent is to torrent it and then buy it when the price drops, less okay. there are lots of instances of what is MORALLY right, but ultimately the correct thing to do is to compensate everyone fully for all of the work they have done. publishers deal with distribution, developers make the game, retailers take your money and deal with having a local store: all of these people deserve renumeration for their work. ->
to test a game is VERY murky water. how much will you play it? 10 minutes? an hour? 2 hours? one full play through? best to stay away, and rent it for your console, read a bunch of reviews, watch gameplay videos. there aren't a shortage of ways to see how games are, without actually paying a dime.
Stupid Royal Mail. It'd better be damn good sausage to be worth going all the way down to Nottingham for.Daystar Clarion said:
With a game like JC2 it's easy. Just limit the area and time and give the player things that he can have the most fun with. Mafia 2 did that, but then I played the actual game.DrSpoy said:
Dear. God.
So here's a little tidbit:
You pre-ordered the game/collector's edition, but the pirated version came out a day, two or three before. I don't see any problem with that since, you know, you already paid for it.
Depends if you the buy it afterwards should you enjoy it.
I think there are valid reasons for piracy. Just blanket condemning it is close minded and silly.
People comparing this to stealing things like food aren't really giving a good comparison. Food is finite, software availability isn't.
I think there are valid reasons for piracy. Just blanket condemning it is close minded and silly.
People comparing this to stealing things like food aren't really giving a good comparison. Food is finite, software availability isn't.
Admittedly I have pirated games in the past. After downloading and playing them I either tired of them in a couple of days and deleted them or purchased them legally. I did this with Company of Heroes, Oblivion, Fallout 3, CoD4, Bioshock and a couple others that I downloaded, played, and loved so I bought them to support the developers. This worked to my benefit in the case of Fallout 3 since the downloaded copy ran better and more stable than the purchased copy.MuttyGrims1321 said:
That said, in answer to your question, I would still say it is still legally wrong to pirate the games in question. Morally, well, that depends on perspective, intent, and eventual outcome but that is not an answer you are going to find on forums.
Lately I have found no need to do this as reviews, trailers, etc. have become far better at representing the product than they were several years ago. Also most of the releases I have purchased recently have been sequels so I knew what I was getting into and I have a better job than I did 3 years ago that pays more than twice as much so I can afford to take more risks on potentially shoddy products.
This debate will likely never go away though since retail return policies are generally so draconian that one can't return an open product and the buyer becomes saddled with a substandard purchase, thus protecting developers and studios that release well marketed junk.
This also. If the game has shoddy DRM or some other shit I'd rather let it collect dust on the shelf/delete it from the drive and get a pirated copy.Frost27 said:
No, it's still wrong. You can't justify stealing by saying "oh, I just wanted to try it out." To my mind, the only valid reason for piracy would be if someone was blocking access to something that you should otherwise have rights to; if you didn't buy the game then you don't have any rights to it, so that doesn't apply either.
However I have no sympathy for companies who don't realise that pirating is what happens when you don't release a demo.
However I have no sympathy for companies who don't realise that pirating is what happens when you don't release a demo.
Really, that idea came up in a debate? Man, that must be the first time! I don't think anyone has ever had that thought about piracy in the history of the internet! Certainly there wouldn't be several threads already about such an idea! Not on this website, at least.MuttyGrims1321 said:
Oh wait. [http://www.escapistmagazine.com/global/search/?q=piracy+demo&cx=005672590579257297818%3Amkmrjhvsnwa&cof=FORID%3A9&ie=UTF-8&sa.x=0&sa.y=0&sa=Search]
But, since you asked: nope.
How about a rental? How about gamefly?
If you want more demos, here's an idea: don't buy it, and then tell the publisher/developer why you didn't buy it.
That will give them an incentive, that is a demonstrable lost sale that they can do something about.
Turning around and pirating it only adds to the statistics of piracy that they allocate time and resources on (that could go to other things, like demos). Pirating "for a reason" only reinforces the developers and publishers to continue those "reasons" because they can't tell who is pirating for what reason.
Perhaps, but then you just get to see A dungeon. There are lots of them in the game and each one is different. Besides, there's a lot more to show aside from skills and dungeons in Skyrim, so a demo would probably have to be too big to even be called a demo.DrSpoy said:
As I stated, it's just not showing off full potential. Think Mirror's Edge, the demo was basically the whole game in a nutshell. Or I dunno, Worms demos basically represent what the whole game is about. Torchlight as well.
And since Elder Scrolls is already established as a franchise, you don't really need a demo. You have a basic idea of what to expect. But for some first-comer this is not the case.
Then rather than acting like a spoiled child who thinks he can justify flagrant copyright infringement just by throwing together some spurious logic, how about you do the actual logical thing and NOT BUY IT?Yatagarasean said:
You don't have a right to a demo. You don't have a right to play games. Saying that games cost 60 dollars does not entitle you to get the game for free to try it. It's not a difficult concept.
Ferrari's cost a lot of money, but I don't hotwire one so I can test drive it, then call people idiots when they point that what I did had absolutely no justification.