Is it just me or is liking games not "in"?

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Darh Abdomino

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It's all just part of the fun, especially with a video game you enjoy. If people are pointing out flaws within the game design or the story, and they don't outweigh the good, it helps make the rest of the game seem better.

In Mass Effect 2 for instance, there was some canon discontinuity in Jacob's back story because of the iPhone game released, and enough people brought it to Bioware's attention for them to update the main game and fix it.

If enough people bring up the flaws in a game, it greatly increases the chances of the developer to fix them by the sequel (or, in some cases, fix them within the already-released game).

Basically, I don't trash games because they're bad, I trash them because they can be better, and I like to think that's what most of the people here do as well.
 

ReinWeisserRitter

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Cynicism isn't an inherently bad thing. It's easier to accept a thing's weaker aspects once you stop pretending being willing to do so automatically makes you a horrible person.

Cynicism also comes with the realization that you don't have to give a crap about what other people think about things that don't matter, like media; you can just like whatever you want without concern of their opinion. You might even find them amusing or interesting now.

I suggest you subscribe to all of the above regardless of your level of cynicism.
 

Assassin Xaero

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You have a lot of douches here that can't comprehend that other people have their own opinions, so they think that since they hate a game, everyone hates it. There are a lot of popular games I hate, and I do this really weird thing called not playing them.
 

Jabberwock xeno

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Are "games" in?

Yes, gaming is actually now mainstream. Where i once heard talk about football, I hear talks of COD.

Now, are HATING popular games in?

Yes.
 

Krion_Vark

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erttheking said:
RedEyesBlackGamer said:
erttheking said:
RedEyesBlackGamer said:
erttheking said:
RedEyesBlackGamer said:
erttheking said:
RedEyesBlackGamer said:
erttheking said:
RedEyesBlackGamer said:
Not really. Skyrim is universally praised, the Witcher 2 had a great reception here, Deus Ex: HR was met with a positive reception here,.....I don't see it. Personally, most of the games I played this year I liked/loved.
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/9.332369-Skyrim-Nice-patch
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/6.331000-First-Person-Skyrim-is-Soulless
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/326.329715-Deus-Ex-Human-Devolution
Gmans uncle said:
oi?
Have you SEEN the hype for Skyrim this website generated?
Have you SEEN how much love this site has for Mass Effect, Silent hill, Half-life, Portal, etc.?
We aren't THAT cynical, and I wouldn't say that just liking a game isn't "in" as you put.
unless I'm horribly misunderstanding the point of this thread.
Can't say much for Half Life Portal or Silent Hill (And call me as ass if you wish but I suspect that half of the support for those games comes from Yahtzee saying how good they are) but Mass Effect is most certainly coming under fire.

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/9.332217-Mass-Effect-3-New-Trailer
Read some of the comments

See some of my earlier links for Skyrim.
I was referring to the overall reception on the site. Some people are not going to like a game. And complaining that a company can't properly patch a game is uncalled for? Hell, one of your links is a site contributor explaining why he didn't like Skyrim. I still don't see it.
Games are still taking fire from all directions aren't they?
Isolated threads criticizing parts of a game amid tons of positive threads or threads just discussing the game? I don't see how that qualifies as "taking fire from all directions".
I've dug through the Skyrim threads and I've seen a lot of people getting really annoyed with it, a lot of people saying "STOP ALREADY" and if I'm wrong and the game is an exception...ever other game is still getting torn to shreds arounds here.
How so? I've seen nothing but positive things about Bastion, this community loves Minecraft, the community is obsessing over Skyrim, Dark Souls has a good following here....you need to stop exaggerating.
You need to point me in that direction, because whenever I look up games that I like, I get reminders about how much they suck.
What? So the community is split on some games you like=the community is always down on all games. Half the comments in that ME3 are positive for heaven's sake.
And the other half are saying how much it sucks. Half is a lot. I'm not getting worked up over it I'm just making an observation.
So are you a half empty or half full kind of guy?

Anyway on topic. I find things in some games that annoy the fuck out of me to the point where i just don't finish them. Case in point Demon's Souls. I played a mage which by the way the game was designed is inherently REALLY broken. People were posting about how hard the game was for them. I never finished it because I thought I was cheating in a way because I prefer the distance classes and prefer magic over bows. Does that make Demon's Souls a bad game? Fuck no. Does it mean I am down about a game on this site? Yes. Does it mean I have an opinion? I sure as hell hope it does. Either way it doesn't matter whether you think its a good game or not you will ALWAYS find people that disagree with you no matter what.
 

Taunta

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I think it's less "You can't like games" and more "You can't disagree with general opinion." If you liked Gears of War 3, prepare to be flamed. If you disliked Skyrim, prepare to be flamed.
 

iFail69

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RedEyesBlackGamer said:
Skyrim is universally praised
We haven't seen many of each other's posts have we? :p

And the reason why games are usually bashed by a lot of people, is because everyone has varying opinions, and there are A LOT of people on the Escapist, hence you will see a lot of opinions of both sides for a lot of games.

Taunta said:
I think it's less "You can't like games" and more "You can't disagree with general opinion." If you liked Gears of War 3, prepare to be flamed. If you disliked Skyrim, prepare to be flamed.
I liked Gears 3 and I disliked Skyrim. I just happen to be wearing a fireproof suit.
 

Racecarlock

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Well, there needs to be somewhere people can go to get a good judgment on whether or not a game is worth their money. Nearly everywhere else is constant 100%s and 10 out of 10s everywhere, and people end up wasting their money when they find out that the game that got a perfect score was either a broken mess, or had a 2 hour campaign that made as much sense as a black hole. Would I like to enjoy EVERYTHING? You bet I would, that would be great. I'd be happy forever, but alas, I was born with an analytical and smart brain, so I do criticize parts of games I don't like. I still love alot of games. GTA San Andreas and Vice City, Saints Row 2 and 3, a lot of racing games, outrun, portal, ace combat, and so on. But I have tried my hardest to enjoy games like the sims and indeed every day the same dream. But I just can't bring myself to enjoy mundane, every day tasks in the virtual world any more than I enjoy them in the real world.

Criticism is not a bad thing. How would anyone improve without it? Oh sure, there would be more positivity, but we'd also have cars made of stick and houses made of hay. Criticism makes the world better. Well, as long as it's valid and well written, anyways.
 

LiquidSolstice

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Somehow I feel the underlying message here is that it's uncool to like any of the CoD games. Which in that case, yes, it's certainly uncool to like Call of Duty, but fuck that, I'll like it anyway.
 

Joccaren

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It honestly just comes down to opinions. I don't like X, I have reason for not liking X, I will tell others reason for not liking X. At the same time, you will get person who likes X, who has reasons for liking X, and who will tell others reasons for liking X. Look at the Skyrim threads that popped up in the first day. Most of them were positive and 'OMG this is awesome'. Now, people have encountered a ton of bugs and will talk about those bugs and how they should be fixed, whilst others will not have encountered any bugs and say that they are fine and there is nothing wrong with the game. On the whole, we are a rather split community. Going just by Skyrim, some people say 'Its that big a game its bound to have glitches, stop complaining', whilst others will say 'Sure its bound to have glitches, but there's only one way to get tehm fixed: Complain about them'. Both sides are correct and have a valid point, and both sides will appear on most threads. You'll find a reasonable split where almost every thread will have people disagreeing with the majority. Sometimes its a positive thread and people disagree and say negative, others its a negative thread and others disagree and say positive.

You get people that love a game and are willing to overlook things, and others that don't love it, but don't hate it, and will point out the flaws it has, and then you will get those that just hate it and will say so.
An example: Dragon Age 2.
Some people loved the game, and how it de-cluttered the inventory from DA:O, made everything a lot faster paced, and simpler to play. Others pointed out the problems it had, like the low number of environments, inconsistencies with lore, and button mash combat, then you had others still who just hated the game and said it did nothing right at all. Dependant on the game, you'll find about 20% of the group that likes it, about 75% of those that don't like it don't hate it, and about 5% of those who hate it with a passion. These numbers vary wildly from game to game, though the 'Don't love it don't hate it' takes majority for most, even if they aren't too vocal all of the time. Because of this, whenever a ton of 'I love X' threads come out, at least one 'Why does everyone love X' thread will come out from one of the other two groups pointing out its flaws. Likewise whenever a lot of 'X sucks' threads come out, a 'I love X' thread will show up from one of the other two groups to point out the good things it does.

I like the split community where you get all sides; the ones that love it and see nothing wrong with it, the ones who hate it and see everything wrong with it, and the ones who feel neither and will just point out what it does badly and what it does well.
 

Eclectic Dreck

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Gmans uncle said:
oi?
Have you SEEN the hype for Skyrim this website generated?
Have you SEEN how much love this site has for Mass Effect, Silent hill, Half-life, Portal, etc.?
We aren't THAT cynical, and I wouldn't say that just liking a game isn't "in" as you put.
unless I'm horribly misunderstanding the point of this thread.
Each and every one of the examples you mentioned have a caveat. No matter how well liked they are in the beginning, eventually the all follow the same tack that goes something like this:

1) Game is released to overwhelmingly positive praise
2) A group starts to point out the flaws in the game (the difficulty of the Witcher 2 caused largely by the game not really telling you how it expects you to play, the removal of various mechanics often associated with an RPG in Mass Effect 2)
3) An argument ensues largely along one of the following lines: Game X2 is a sequel of Game X and the changes made are a slap in the face of fans of Game X. Accusations that game X2 represents the developer selling out and stories of fan betrayal by courting the lowest common denominator are common. Various arguments supporting or undermining the argument are delivered and no opinions are changed. The alternative is that Game Y has some feature or mechanic that deviates from the standard set found in the genre. These generally fall into the appealing to the lowest common denominator (dumbing down) argument seen above.
4) The argument dies down with each party retreating to their opposing camps and refusing to talk about it again.
5) Someone comes along years later and says something to the effect of "I know everyone liked this massively popular and well regarded game but I just don't get it". Some from the old dissenting camp will appear and voice their agreement, others will point out all the things they like and still others will assert that the context was important (For example, Crackdown was not a particularly great game in retrospect but given what was around on the 360 at the time it was pretty good). Opinions remain unchanged as those who originally asserted they did not like the game feel validated, those that liked the game assume the poster didn't get it and others assume the poster is just trying to generate thread responses using classic hipster tactics.
 

Eclectic Dreck

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Machocruz said:
Undue praise warrants undue criticism

Stop calling games the best ever in their genre when you aren't experienced with the genre enough to make that declaration. And most reviewers aren't.
I think you make an awful presumption that a person cannot declare a game to be the best in a genre because of some nebulous concept like "experience". Citizen Kane is heralded as the greatest American Film of all time and yet, having watched it 70 years after it was made I find it hard to believe this is true.

What a statement like this misses is that the word "Best" is relative. To make assert that one can incorrectly claim something has the status of best implies the following:

1) Someone has played all games this game shares similar traits with (for example, playing every game ever made that might fall into the Real Time Strategy genre - a feat that would require playing dozens of major titles along with hundreds of smaller or independent titles)
2) Said games can have their quality judged subjectively and without ambiguity.

When you start going down either path you quickly run into problems. For example, I think that Deus Ex: Human Revolution is a better game than Deus Ex. It has better mechanics, better technology, better controls and so forth. But even if I can recognize that the recent interpretation is the better game, were I asked to pick which game I liked the best I'd tell you it was Deus Ex.

In the end, any declaration that something is the best comes with the implied caveat of "that I've played myself".

Still, you hit the nail on the head with your opening remark. If you play a game that you did not like for some reason, it can be galling that other people seem to adore it. You start to wonder what is wrong with people when they can love something so obviously terrible. To put it another way, I hate coconut. It is, in my experience, the worst food one could eat. My disgust is so extreme that should I even detect the flavor in any dish, my instant physical reaction is nausea. So, when I see someone eating something covered in coconut, I'm forced to wonder what sort of madness might plague them that they would not only resort to eating such a meal but somehow enjoy it.

Perceiving praise as due or not, it turns out, is exactly as subjective as heaping that praise in the first place. I simply cannot stand to play games like Final Fantasy. I think that the praise heaped upon the more storied iterations of the franchise are undue. But I rarely point this out directly because I generally don't think people who love the game particularly care that I didn't.

And, to be perfectly honest, my reason for participating in such threads is because I do enjoy a good argument, even if no opinions are going to be changed. They also help me better understand why I did or did not like a game.
 

Raika

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It isn't cool to like something, and everybody wants to look edgy and hip in front of their e-friends. They're doing this for attention. That's all there is to it.
 

Xprimentyl

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Agreed. I haven't been around long, so I can't speak from years or thousands of posts-worth of experience, but it's been my limited impression that if I see a specific game named in a thread title, likely every other post is a "meh" or less if not an blatant declaration of the game's short-comings. A discussion with differeing opinions is great, but I get a strong sense of elitism a lot of the time.
 

veloper

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Complaining about products can be justified, just aslong as you praise better products aswell.

Likewise you shouldn't praise a product if you can't think of something worse to hate on.

This type of criticism is by far the most useful information gamers can share with eachother about games, so don't complaint about it TS.
 

Xpheyel

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Xprimentyl said:
Agreed. I haven't been around long, so I can't speak from years or thousands of posts-worth of experience, but it's been my limited impression that if I see a specific game named in a thread title, likely every other post is a "meh" or less if not an blatant declaration of the game's short-comings. A discussion with differeing opinions is great, but I get a strong sense of elitism a lot of the time.
A lot of gaming website forums are like this too. The Bioware forums and MMORPG.com were pretty much the same way. The repetitiveness gets oppressive.