Is it normal to rage at Fallout 3 ??

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kingcom

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Vault101 said:
like I said FO3 is far from perfect in the morality side of things (one of the games main weaknesses)....but I stil like having that backstory and all that, I mean your from a vault eather way, you back story cant be that varied
Thats probably the core difference between someone like you and someone like me when we look for an RPG. Your looking to see someone else's story. Im looking to create MY story.

Thats, for me, one of the most important and powerful aspects of the Fallout series, and F3 did not allow you to do so.
 

C-Mag

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Well I've played FO3 and NV, but I'm also pretty well versed in the lore, so here's my take on it.

FO:3 and NV were both great games, but they also had very different strengths and weaknesses that reflected their different developers. FO3 had a bad story, mediocre characters, and generally fell down when it came to plot related stuff. But it absolutelly excelled in the actual gameworld. Compare this to NV, which had a great story to tell, but really lacked atmosphere.

I'll try and demonstrate through some examples. Compare the moments from the two games when you first stepped out into the wasteland. In FO3, after going through a hectic escape from the Vault, the door slid open with a huge sound of grinding and screaming metal. Then you walk down a tunnel, silent as the grave, with centuries old skeletons at your feet. Open the door at the end, and step out. It takes a moment for your eyes to adjust, and then the view hits you. Slowly walking up to the scenic lookout, you see the bone dry wastes, a ruined road littered with burnt out cars, a massive broken off overpass to your right. Further down their's the ruins of a small town, an enclave eyebot floats down the street, broadcasting patriotic tunes. Then you get to the school, which is your first introduction to the brutality of the raiders, again a marvelous piece of carefully thought out atmosphere.

Compare this to NV. You wake up to find Doc Mitchell smiling down on you. Then a character creation stage that takes all of 5 minutes as you walk around his house, not very interesting. He gives you a vault jumpsuit, which you really don't feel much attachment to, and you walk out the door. Your first view of the wastes is........ a small backwards town straight out of a Wild West movie. Victor the robot rolls down just ahead of you, and talking to him quickly gets old by your second character. Then you go out with Sunny Smiles and do a few errands shooting geckos. Ho Hum. Then, after more great tracts of words that gets tedious to go through, you get into your first quest. I'm sure you all know how it goes, but it means that it takes AGES before anything exciting happens.

And don't get me started on the Mojave Wasteland itself. It was a whole load of nothing. In FO3 you could start walking in any direction and eventually hit an interesting old ruin to loot. For me at least, a large part of the FO3 experience was simply exploring the wastes, because the Capital Wasteland was brimming with stuff while still managing to feel empty and desolate. But the Mojave Wasteland feels empty and desolate because it IS empty and desolate, which is the bad kind of empty and desolate. Exploring was not very rewarding and it was mostly there to create some space between the towns.

Part of this is becauseof the atmosphere, which has a number of elements I'll try to tie together here. First of all; ambient music, another area where FO3 excells. It was just right, and combined with the sound of the wind whistling through the dust, made the wasteland feel alive. Overall, Bethesda put a ton of time into creating the wasteland itself. It made simply running along with only the sound of my own steps for company something that I actually liked. If that got boring, than I'd simply turn on the radio.

FO3 had much better radio stations than NV. This is fact. Three Dog, though he felt a bit flat as a charcter when you actually met him, made really great broadcasts and had a fine selection of music. His NV equivalent, Mr New Vegas, cannot match up. I suppose this is because in Fallout 3 you were a really major player in the wastes, and listening to Three Dog talk about you in his broadcasts was one of the greatest things in FO3's ambience in my opinion. Mr NV,on the other hand, has bigger fish to fry than talking about one courier, so his broadcasts are a lot more impersonal. Not to mention that the choice of music Obsidian put into the radio stations REALLY gets old after a while, and has nowhere near the repeatability of FO3's tunes.

Now this is sounding like a huge NV bash, and it's true that I prefer FO3 to NV, but NV was great too. It had more features that I absolutely loved, such as disguises and mods. It had better voice acting, and a half way decent plot. Thhe character creation was also more flexible.

My point is that for the next Fallout game, my ideal set up would be to have Obsidian write the story, envision the locations, and handle everything relating to the lore and what features actually appear in the game. Then let Bethesda do their stuff and actually build the world, making slight modifications to Obsidian's ideas to improve their impact. And, of course, use Skyrim's engine. That is what I believe would lead to the perfect Fallout game.
 

kingcom

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Shiny Koi said:
kingcom said:
I thought Fallout 3 was mediocre, the shooting felt uncomfortable, the characters were irrational, your father was an idiot, there were no doors to get off the train and was left to ride the rails, laughing at the sights. Then I hit the stupidest thing I have ever experienced in a videogame in a long time. Little Lamplight, the town whose very existance implys childhood sex and subsequent births, and whose existance makes no sense. And then, THEN the game has to blindly insane move of forcing me to ACTUALLY DEAL WITH THESE KIDS. They are children? How are they holding off the army of slavers. Actually more important HOW ARE THEY HOLDING OFF THE UNENDING TIDE OF SUPERMUTANTS?

That broke everything, a mediocre game was reduced to an utterly painful experience.
Huh... They're pretty far from any kind of Super Mutants. Just saying. You don't see them spawning anywhere near Little Lamplight. Super Mutants mainly appear around the central city area thing (the DC ruins) and the vault from which they come, as well as a few other scripted encounters.

Also, the fact that they're all children is explained. Little Lamplight started as a small settlement with just a handful of kids and grew. The kids there are all orphans or kids who got seperated from their parents and were seeking refuge. Again, just saying.
Ummm what? They have a passage which leads DIRECTLY to the super mutant base Vault. You know, the massive collection and nerve centre of their activities. So how are any of these kids making it to Little Lamplight? Every five metres something in the wasteland is trying to murder you, the numbers require:

You need to be a kid lost/seperated from adults, have heard of/stumble upon little lamplight AND survive the journey there. Thats a very very small number. No where near enough to have this group survive 200 years and still have a functional community, enforce the aging law AND hold off the slavers.
 

Ghengis John

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Ragsnstitches said:
You have no reason to rage at this game.
You sound like a fan, so I don't expect they'll be any reasoning with you. Is it safe to say you were a fan of fallout 3?


snakeakaossi said:
Can I add that I don't find it normal at all to rage at anything that is for your entertainment?
Spoken like a man that has never played SUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUPER MEAT BOOOOOOOOOOOYYYYYY!!!


loc978 said:
You want a game-breaking bug in Fallout 2? How about the one where you can waltz into Navarro at level 1, beat the guard to death without breaking a sweat and be issued a suit of advanced power armor (and a plasma rifle, power fist and super sledgehammer)? Without the restoration mod, that game is ridiculously easy, if you know what you're doing...
Good point, I'd say, if that was a bug. And almost any game can be broken if you know what you're doing. Need I point to the Chinese stealth suit in fallout 3? "wooo I squat down and suddenly I'm invincible!". And what kind of shit was the dart gun?

Anyhow, I played through the original un-patched fallout 2 twenty odd some times and no, it was not rife with "game-breaking" bugs. Despite my best attempts to do everything in the wackiest ways imaginable I never managed to break it. Which is more than I can say for fallout 3 (which I couldn't even finish because every time I went to talk to General Autumn I'd get stuck hearing Sarah go "let's do this." forever.
 

giggetygooo

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The realism mod sounds awesome - unfortunately Ive played Fallout 3 already and the spell is broken, and no matter what is added it will be like polishing a turd. Same thing happened with oblivion, oscuros mod was great but the damage was done. SO, for skyrim im assuming it will be as terrible as its predecessors (yes fallout really was oblivion with guns), and plan to wait for a long while till it is fixed with a mod, then hopefully enjoy it...seriously these modders deserve a medal of some kind, andshould be employed by bethesda to show them how to make a game.
 

Liudeius

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kingcom said:
Liudeius said:
So I can't have an FPS where I have an expansive equipment inventory, lots of character customization, exploration, side-quests, stat-based damage output and still get to have a bit of a reflexive challenge?

Thanks, I'll be off having absolutely no fun somewhere else.

(by the way, if incorporating reflexes into a game instantly removes the RPG element, there are a ton of non-RPG's these days, including Fallout 3 with only VATS. What about your reflexes pressing the VATS button?)
The current trend is to combine rpg conventions with everything. You just described just about every modern fps ever. I never said you can never have them, you can theoretically have anything and to boot thats probably the only type of rpgs which will ever exist in the mainstream in the future. I never said incorporating reflexes into a game removes the rpg element. I was making a point of what the two styles of games do. One is an FP-RPG and the other is an RPG. A pure fps and a pure rpg are at odds just like Blue and Yellow are opposed colours that when mixed produces something else entirely.

Also if your going to use 'interacting with the game' as a comparable reflex to the core fps activity, I dont even want to have this conversation.
Not really, only really mild stuff like leveling to get better gear.
Most FPS's have no more than 5-8 hours of actual play time, so they don't really have the option to be actual RPG's.

If you want an actual RPG, Fallout 3 is not one. In fact, I don't think a single game this generation has a true turn based battle system, at least not one that I've played.

Well if you see someone dash out from behind cover in Fallout 3, if you can press VATS before they fire, you have a higher chance of not getting hit than you do if you wait a second.
Then there is stuff like in Legend of Dragoon, where your base attack is boosted by hitting a button at exact moments during your attack.
You said the difference between an FPS and an RPG that makes "at odds" is that one relies on the person, the other on the character. Or more specifically, one relies on personal skill, the other relies on pure math.

Play Legend of Dragoon without getting a single chain attack, I bet you won't even be able to beat it.
 

azraelthor

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Shiny Koi said:
I feel like one of the only people that actually likes FO1/FO2 AND the Bethesda-related FO3/FO:NV.

I loved Fallout 3 and I swear I don't get what people are talking about when they mention glitches. I've probably clocked more hours than anyone here (100% completion) and I never experienced any bugs. Then again, I was running third party mods that were intended to fill in all of those holes.

I ended up seldom using VATs and playing FO3 as a standard FPS once I reached a high level.

New Vegas is still better. Trust Obsidian to fix all of those gaping characterization and story issues and actually make a vibrant and believable world.
I agree with this. F3 was great fun when I first played it. However once NV came out and I played that I can't go back to F3. But that's just because I was never as emotionally invested with the Lone Wanderer as I was with the Courier
 

wooty

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Its normal to rant over anything really, I even had a full blown rant over the toaster this morning, so anything goes.
 

azraelthor

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kingcom said:
Vault101 said:
like I said FO3 is far from perfect in the morality side of things (one of the games main weaknesses)....but I stil like having that backstory and all that, I mean your from a vault eather way, you back story cant be that varied
Thats probably the core difference between someone like you and someone like me when we look for an RPG. Your looking to see someone else's story. Im looking to create MY story.

Thats, for me, one of the most important and powerful aspects of the Fallout series, and F3 did not allow you to do so.
I agree with you there, it also didn't help that I felt no attachement to my dad at all in that game and personally didn't care if the bastard never showed up again. Out of curiosity did you like NV? (I looked through the old posts and didn't see you mention it and if you did already I appologize)
 

kingcom

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Liudeius said:
Not really, only really mild stuff like leveling to get better gear.
Most FPS's have no more than 5-8 hours of actual play time, so they don't really have the option to be actual RPG's.

If you want an actual RPG, Fallout 3 is not one. In fact, I don't think a single game this generation has a true turn based battle system, at least not one that I've played.

Well if you see someone dash out from behind cover in Fallout 3, if you can press VATS before they fire, you have a higher chance of not getting hit than you do if you wait a second.
Then there is stuff like in Legend of Dragoon, where your base attack is boosted by hitting a button at exact moments during your attack.
You said the difference between an FPS and an RPG that makes "at odds" is that one relies on the person, the other on the character. Or more specifically, one relies on personal skill, the other relies on pure math.

Play Legend of Dragoon without getting a single chain attack, I bet you won't even be able to beat it.
I honestly have very little idea as to what your trying to say so forgive me if i misintrepret this. Levelling and gear, the two most recognisable aspects of rpgs (though actually nothing to do with what an rpg is but justifyable as rpg elements)

RPGs dont have length requirements.

Dont know what you mean by actual RPG, do you mean turn based? (thats a whole debate im not having now)

Does not matter, if your trying to outmaneover someone your sneak should be running that not your trigger finger.

Never played Legend of Dragoon, sounds like your talking about active reload stuff, find that incredibly boring and you appear to be betting me to play a game ive never heard of and not use a core mechanic of the game as it sounds like to beat it. Why would I do that? Seems like its stupid to not use something if have to play the game, doesnt mean I will like it.

No I did not say they rely on maths. All combat in games relys on maths. I said combat in an FPS is resolved by the player entirely and in an RPG its resolves as a result of the characters abilities (as a long term result of the players choices).
 

ChupathingyX

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C-Mag said:
FO3 had much better radio stations than NV. This is fact. Three Dog, though he felt a bit flat as a charcter when you actually met him, made really great broadcasts and had a fine selection of music. His NV equivalent, Mr New Vegas, cannot match up. I suppose this is because in Fallout 3 you were a really major player in the wastes, and listening to Three Dog talk about you in his broadcasts was one of the greatest things in FO3's ambience in my opinion. Mr NV,on the other hand, has bigger fish to fry than talking about one courier, so his broadcasts are a lot more impersonal. Not to mention that the choice of music Obsidian put into the radio stations REALLY gets old after a while, and has nowhere near the repeatability of FO3's tunes.
I really don't think the radios are really an important point for Fallout games.

Personally I didn't like either hosts that much, but I preferred Mr New Vegas. Yeah sure Three Dog reports on your actions using his army of ninjas but his voice...was...so...annoying that I was forced to kill him. And Mr New Vegas does actually report on your actions, most people who play the game I guess jus don't realise.

Also the actual sonsg themselves are waaaay too subjective to talk about and bring up. If a game features a radio station with lots of rap then rap fans will like it, but everyone else will be left out. Personally I liked songs from both games and didn't like songs from both games.

Fallout 3 had;

*I don't want to set the world on fire
*Butcher Pete
*Civilization
"Maybe" was featured in the original Fallout so I didn't count it.

Fallout: New vegas had;

*Blue Moon
*Big Iron
*Ain't that a kick in the head
*Jingle, Jangle, Jingle
*Love me as though there was no tomorrow

Plus New vegas had the songs that were written by JE Sawyer and Chris Avellone which were great but not featured enough.

What I'm saying is that both featured some great songs and it's just way too subjective to argue.
 

michael87cn

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Speaking as an Xbox 360 player, Fallout 3 ran amazingly well for me for over 500+ hours. (yes I love the game that much, and I've had since 2008 to play that much :p).

New Vegas on the other hand, well, I began to wonder if they made the game disc out of a wet paper bag.

Because it was unplayable.

And I tried. Oh, I tried.
 

kingcom

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azraelthor said:
kingcom said:
Vault101 said:
like I said FO3 is far from perfect in the morality side of things (one of the games main weaknesses)....but I stil like having that backstory and all that, I mean your from a vault eather way, you back story cant be that varied
Thats probably the core difference between someone like you and someone like me when we look for an RPG. Your looking to see someone else's story. Im looking to create MY story.

Thats, for me, one of the most important and powerful aspects of the Fallout series, and F3 did not allow you to do so.
I agree with you there, it also didn't help that I felt no attachement to my dad at all in that game and personally didn't care if the bastard never showed up again. Out of curiosity did you like NV? (I looked through the old posts and didn't see you mention it and if you did already I appologize)
Not the best game ever intially and I really felt a bit let down but once I hit New Vegas itself it was definitely one of the best experiences i've had in a while. Really enjoyed that it let me resolve the overall scenario however I wanted to, making allies or enemies out of practically anyone and thought the idea of a central conflict forcing player to end up with hostilies with atleast one faction was a really good idea. The plot hand a really nice turn which made everything so clear and the gathering of allies and consequences of your decisions in the path all coming together for the final act of the game was a definite thrilling experience.

The future of New Vegas was determined by ME, an experience that made the bad start all worth it.

I founded the New California Republic. I united the north-western wasteland under its banner. And now I was responsible for holding Hoover Damn and creating the largest most stable force in the US. A force potentially large enough to restore civilisation.

Just something profoundly awesome when your fighting side by side with ex-Enclave troopers and Brotherhood of Steel paladins all working together to hold back the barbarian hordes so to speak.
 

Liudeius

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kingcom said:
I honestly have very little idea as to what your trying to say so forgive me if i misintrepret this. Levelling and gear, the two most recognisable aspects of rpgs (though actually nothing to do with what an rpg is but justifyable as rpg elements)

RPGs dont have length requirements.

Dont know what you mean by actual RPG, do you mean turn based?

Does not matter, if your trying to outmaneover someone your sneak should be running that not your trigger finger.

Never played Legend of Dragoon, sounds like your talking about active reload stuff, find that incredibly boring and you appear to be betting me to play a game ive never heard of and not use a core mechanic of the game as it sounds like to beat it. Why would I do that? Seems like its stupid to not use something if have to play the game, doesnt mean I will like it.

No I did not say they rely on maths. All combat in games relys on maths. I said combat in an FPS is resolved by the player entirely and in an RPG its resolves as a result of the characters abilities (as a long term result of the players choices).
So now RPG's are about leveling and gear? You were trying to argue that RPG's were about using only math, stats, and strategy, with not reflexive skill, to play. By that definition there is no problem between RPG's and FPS's. Wait... Now you contradict that? If they are recognizable elements but not actually what RPG's are, then they aren't elements that make something an RPG. Rendering your argument illegitimate once again.

Well by your own definition an RPG must be purely turn based. You said that they rely on the Character, meaning the character's stats and damage output based purely on those, with absolutely no reliance on reflexes (like FPS's).
It relies on math, just showing these pixels relies on math, but in an FPS calculations are only done if you hit, hitting relies on reflexes and dexterity.

Active reload? It's not a shooter. Most RPG's these days use some sort of reflexive command or ATB putting more reliance on the reflexes of the player of the game than the stats of the characters. (and Legend of Dragoon is from the PS1 era)

"I said combat in an FPS is resolved by the player entirely and in an RPG its resolves as a result of the characters abilities (as a long term result of the players choices)."
So wait, once again there is not conflict between them.
In Fallout 3, the perks I choose and skills I level drastically influence how much damage I do, regardless of whether I use VATS or play it like an FPS.
 

azraelthor

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kingcom said:
azraelthor said:
kingcom said:
Vault101 said:
like I said FO3 is far from perfect in the morality side of things (one of the games main weaknesses)....but I stil like having that backstory and all that, I mean your from a vault eather way, you back story cant be that varied
Thats probably the core difference between someone like you and someone like me when we look for an RPG. Your looking to see someone else's story. Im looking to create MY story.

Thats, for me, one of the most important and powerful aspects of the Fallout series, and F3 did not allow you to do so.
I agree with you there, it also didn't help that I felt no attachement to my dad at all in that game and personally didn't care if the bastard never showed up again. Out of curiosity did you like NV? (I looked through the old posts and didn't see you mention it and if you did already I appologize)
Not the best game ever intially and I really felt a bit let down but once I hit New Vegas itself it was definitely one of the best experiences i've had in a while. Really enjoyed that it let me resolve the overall scenario however I wanted to, making allies or enemies out of practically anyone and thought the idea of a central conflict forcing player to end up with hostilies with atleast one faction was a really good idea. The plot hand a really nice turn which made everything so clear and the gathering of allies and consequences of your decisions in the path all coming together for the final act of the game was a definite thrilling experience.

Just something profoundly awesome when your fighting side by side with ex-Enclave troopers and Brotherhood of Steel paladins all working together to hold back the barbarian hordes so to speak.
The only that would have made that part better would have been if I could have used
my army of Securitrons to help
to aide the NCR I also enjoyed how all of the add-ons are actually linked to the main game, rahter then just "hey look an alien space ship!"
 

MasterOfWorlds

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Vault101 said:
eh Id say generally it was a very well recived game

and quite frankly die hard F1 and F2 fans can take their ranting elsewere (plus I loved the story for falllout 3)
This. I never played FO1 or 2, but I really liked 3 and even some parts of NV.

The rage that I see about deathclaws and cazadors doesn't make much sense to me because I've always been able to take them down with relative ease unless I had the misfortune of being snuck up on.

I don't use VATS except for the rare occasion in combat, and to see what the enemy is if I can't see it on the screen. I never really had glitch issues except for on rare occasion, and even then, I save often, so it's not that big of a deal.

Then again, I'm a fight smarter not harder kind of guy, so even some of the strongest enemies in the game aren't too much of a problem for me unless I don't have enough ammo or are just grossly outnumbered.
 

Philip Petrunak

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I had quite a few rage moment's myself. The biggest one for me was at the beginning when they shoved a bible verse into my face! WTF? Then it just got wrose, with the constant moralizing, to the game wagging it's figure at me every time I stole a bottle-cap. It was cheap, moralizing bullshit designed to the kind of "god fearing" conservative morons who made it. It was completely divorced from the total nihilism of the first games.

God, it's like if someone pop'd in a new Veggie Tales DVD and two minutes in Bob starts fucking Larry in the ass while talking about the plight of the proletariat.

I was so glad when the enclave started to show up and I was like "alright, looks like 'daddy' is going to die." Seriously. I hated that self-righteous fucker more than any other character I've ever encountered. I hated how I had no choice to "follow in his footsteps." I hated how I was constantly denied the ability to end that tools miserable life. God. what I'd pay to see Liam Neeson dress up as James and step on a land mine.
 

Alphakirby

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Here's a wonderful fucking idea: Make it so New Vegas doesn't freeze at the most important times!!!

I only ever rented Fallout 3 so I wouldn't know if that was as buggy as New Vegas.

(Fucking Rex not coming back until I finished Old World Blues.)
(Oh and in Old World Blues,when your brain NEVER STOPS REMEMBERING US MAKING THE GHOULS FLY OFF INTO SPACE,FOREVER...)
 

TheAngryKoala

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Here is a list of things I found which ruined this otherwise excellent game:

1. Character design. the 'never break eye contact' thing the NPCs do gives me nightmares and characters look like mattel action figures rather than 'convincing humanoids.

2. Lack of songs on Galaxy News Radio. I like to have music around in-game like an orchestra piece to accompany a scene or a place. Having 6-7 of the same songs repeated more than the Go Compare advert wears thin after a mere three hours of play through and I admit that I know the words to "Lets Go Sunning" word for word after fixing the antennae of GNR.

3. Raiders, Super Mutants, Giant Radscorpions etc. They just don't leave you alone, making trips to anywhere entirely predictable: Enjoy wasteland, stumble upon some undiscovered place, get jumped, kick them in the shins, loot their bodies. This makes for TONS of free ammo and weapons making the game all the easier and making every fight stupidly boring.

4. Retarded Companions. Oh how often I get stuck in rooms due to the big, green, radioactive tank Fawkes blocking the way out. They have the hardest of times navigating their way through a stair case or a room with multiple doorways. They also don't get the concept of leaving bad guys alone. Everytime you trek through the wasteland with a companion, you're forced into battle by your companion starting a fight that you so hardly tried to avoid. The idiot ghoul Charon decided it was a bright idea to take on Fort Bannister when I was trying to make a dash around it forcing me into a big waste of time.

5. It's bloody addicting. I have spent 40+ hours in this game. That 40+ hours I could've used to socialise, talk to someone real, hell, get acquainted with a girl. Instead I've played the crap out this game and got involved in a way Everyone had. the game's Immersive qualities made me go back to it all the time. So I'm taking a break from this game. I'm going to play New vegas Instead.
 

Ragsnstitches

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Ghengis John said:
Ragsnstitches said:
You have no reason to rage at this game.
You sound like a fan, so I don't expect they'll be any reasoning with you. Is it safe to say you were a fan of fallout 3?
Actually no... I wasn't a fan. I enjoyed it, but not enough to get the story extending DLC (Broken Steel?).

I much prefer new vegas over 3, despite the state it was released in, but that's not in discussion now. Between the numbered sequels, 2 was my favourite.

So you can take yourself off your mighty perch, and actually try to debate instead of antagonise.

and for the record:

Fallout 2 patch 1.2 fixes (i.e were bugs/glitches) said:
NEW FIXES TO THE 1.02d PATCH: Again this is NOT a complete list, but a list
of the more commonly asked about problems.

-Fixed T-Ray not taking money for getting car back

-Fixed Stuart Little boxing so that he only gives you one chance to repeat.

-Also, he wasn't setting the names properly for the STUPID character, this
should be fixed.

-All boxing problems have been addressed. Critical failures count as a
knockdown, this is not going to be changed.

-Fixed Valerie where to go when done upgrading weapons.

-Fixed Slim Picket not taking/checking for money for the Outdoorsman Skill
upgrade. Also, there should be no way to get him to give you the upgrade more
than once, code put in as a safety.

-When Vegeir was sending you home with Jonny, he was trying to send the car
with you too. I found out this is bad and the car isn't set up to do so. He no
longer touches your car in this situation.

-Car should be compatible with patch, it also will fix some of the car
problems that might occur if the car doesn't show up in correct spots.

-In related news, the trunk should be working better in conjunction with the
car as the code is all new since we shipped and now knows where the car is at
all times.

-One of the Engine bugs we fixed will fix the problem of the trunk showing up
without the car, since the trunk script was becoming "junked"(to speak
technically).

-The car leaves with you when you leave random encounter maps, but only if the
car is on that map and it has fuel. Before, if you used the out of gas car, it
-would keep following you around, this is fixed.

-Slavers die and now STAY DEAD when killed by the slaves you are hunting!
Amazing, bastards just didn't want to go down easily.

-Get Car part quest should be clearing now.

-Fixed the leaving maps with party member crash. This could potentially fix
lots and lots of thing out there since it was killing memory at this
point(this is what helps fix the cars).

-Miria should no longer follow after she is dead.

-Fixed party members going up levels with Power Armor bug.

-Fixed Tyler door bug where he would sometimes give you permission to use the
door, but would attack you if you tried to use the door.

-Fixed Joey not taking money for Jet.

-Fixed problem with when the player comes out the back entrance of the
raiders(secret entrance) and the car not being there.

-Fixed Saving game on "Holy Knights" encounter do that you can finish the
whole thing even after saving.

-No longer pre-maturely ends "Murder" quest when you tell Mr. Wright that his
son was poisoned.

-Fixed inability to use the dresser in New Reno map 2 where Mrs. Bishop is.

-Cody gives you exp now when he leads you to the chop shop.

-Mason will let you use the door if he tells you it's O.K.

-Myron now takes all the stuff to make drugs even if it's in his inventory. So
if you tell him you want to make 3 radscorpion antidotes and switch the tails
to his inventory, he'll delete them from his inventory as well.

-There no longer is any way to get $2000 from Dr. Troy for selling him jet.

-Fixed "offcier" spelling to "officer" with Randal.

-Fixed it so you can't get stuck on level 4 by entering from the world map
before the player extracts the organ. This fix is simply due to the fact that
you should only be able to enter Sierra Army Depot from the ground floor from
the town map.

-You now get xp for giving the non-working brainbot a brain.

-Buster now replenishes his supplies more often.

-Cannot enter any map but the entrance map from the town map.

-Player can complete the spleen seed even if he is a Hubologist.

-Talking Bette out of fighting should set the "Stop-the-bar-brawl" quest to
complete.

-Fixed bug with saving during lopan/dragon fights.

-Made it so there is only the Battle Field area to enter the Sierra Army Depot

-Changed it so that Melchior only lets 4 of his pets out at once. This should
reduce pathing problems with multi-hex critters.

-You now get 1000 experience for getting Brian more power for his AC.

-Fixed error with using the bulletin board during combat.

-Fixed kids not being able to be pushed when they're not on their home tile.

-Fixed bulletin board error like that in the Den.

-Fixed problem with car not showing up first time with high outdoorsman.

-Fixed endless loop for not having power armor with door guard.

-Fixed bug regarding re-entrance to vault 15 squat area.

-Fixed problem with sometimes ending a fight and becoming stuck inside the
ring.

-Fixed bug causing some Melchior crashes related to fire geckos not being able
to hit their target.

-Fixed craps dealer bug allowing setting odds bet to 0 dollars in order to
take odds money back.

-Fixed problem with party members dying on map exits, causing Miria or any
party member dying in the toilet explosion and then following you around the
game forever.
Some of these carry over even after the patching. It took multiple Unofficial community patches to iron out the majority of bugs/glitches/imbalances in the game. Go to the No Mutants Allowed community site to see how extensively they had to work at Fallout 2 AFTER interplay (or whoever was working on it) abandoned the post-release support.

Your unpatched run was a fluke, just like my pre-patched run on New Vegas... I had no problems on the game until the first patch, where I was suddenly met with crashes and save corruptions a plenty.