generals3 said:
briankoontz said:
While 80% of the mainstream games industry has killing as a primary form of gameplay (including games featured civilized killing like Caesar and Civilization), 50% of Newgrounds games (few of which make any money) have killing as a primary form of gameplay. The mainstream games industry greatly influences the rest of the industry, including indies.
Saying violence is the primary form of gameplay in games like Civ or Caesar is an exaggeration. In both games the non-violent game mechanics are much more prominent. Total War would for instance be an example of a civ game with killing as a primary game feature.
"A" primary form of gameplay, not the, like in Diablo 3 where inventory management is a primary form of gameplay, along with hack 'n slash.
generals3 said:
Which came first, the chicken or the egg? If 80% of books featured killing as the primary plot device, studies would show that readers would be into killing in books. How could we expect the studies to show otherwise?
The industry itself is an influential force. By making games about killing, it encourages players to favor games about killing over other games. If 80% of books were about killing, it would encourage readers to enjoy books about killing which they could call "normal books" over any other type of book which they would dismiss as "weird books".
But think about it, what makes more sense: that devs made violent VG's because that's where the money is at or that that is where the money is at because devs made violent VG's?
Both make sense. It's a two-way feedback loop. For example, id software, makers of Doom, emerged before there was a market for fast, frenetic games with lots of graphic killing. They made Doom because it was the game THEY thought was fun, the game they themselves wanted to play, not because they expected a huge market for it, and they wouldn't have had even the expectations they did if they hadn't made the similar Wolfenstein 3D previously.
Think about it. Let's say you never watch a violent film, not on overt principle but just because they don't interest you. But now your favorite director for the first time makes a film where the protagonist is a mass murderer, and the movie is about him carrying out those murders. He keeps making those types of films, abandoning his earlier themes.
Why wouldn't you watch his newer movies? You still enjoy the director and you lack any overt principle which hinders you from watching hyper-violent movies. So you would be transformed from a viewer of non-violent movies to a viewer of violent movies, all due to the change in the preferences and output of the favored artist.
Other upcoming artists are influenced by existing artists, so if 80% of movies featured the protagonist killing living things as a primary plot device, they would be influenced in that direction, and viewers would likewise go in that direction, unless there was some conscious movement among artists, consumers, and/or critics to move in another direction.
generals3 said:
There's nothing wrong with enjoying games (or books) about killing. Dark Souls is great. Doom is great. Deus Ex is great. Any number of other games featuring killing as a primary form of gameplay are great. The problem is that when the industry is super-dominated by killing games it ensures that creativity and innovation are severely hindered, that game designers are put in a box from which they can't escape prior to ever designing their game, and to return to the original purpose of this thread that many women and many men who wish to experience a variety of gameplay have a scant selection of options, especially in the mainstream industry, from which to choose.
Games featuring killing have so dominated gaming culture for so many years that it's not even possible to have a serious unbiased discussion about them - gamers treat such criticism as if it's criticizing gaming itself.
But what's wrong with violence dominating the industry?
That's a 200-page book in itself, but I'll try to condense it into a mere several paragraphs.
The countercultural drug movement of the 1960s and 1970s, whose primary purpose was to alter one's consciousness so as to gain enlightenment, then to use that enlightenment upon "returning from the trip" to help save a dying world, was recognized even at the time as being damaging to one's overall health. When this effort officially failed with the self-destruction of Timothy Leary, a new "consciousness altering" form was taken - that of video games, the drug roots of which can be seen in the frequent pot smoking of early Atari developers (and the even-to-this-day stereotype of gamers as "stoned gamers"), the "mushroom kingdom" of Mario, the "alternate reality" ideological conception of early developers, and the like. Operating in parallel and with frequent crossover to early gamer culture were the hackers, who were attempting to subvert the state by being smarter and more technical.
Video games were the "clean" version of drugs, minus the psycho-chemical alterations. When one gamed one went on a "trip to an alternate reality", which one would then learn from, and bring back knowledge to the "real world" to apply and help save the world. This conception is clearly detailed in early versions of Ultima, where the player is literally (within the game) transported from the "real world" to the alternate reality as well as through Garriott's focus on player behavior in the gameworld.
But something terrible happened along the way. The bipolar world, which enforced a certain degree of good behavior on the world's powerful actors, became at least militarily a unipolar world. Those powerful actors who were pleased about the new unipolar world gained great confidence, spawning both the Neoconservative movement and providing the basis for Francis Fukuyama's infamous book "The End of History".
For countercultural gamers hoping to subvert the primary global culture, this was a disaster, leading to a deepening of the existing culture of despair as well as giving birth to gaming's post-unipolar seminal moment: the video game Doom (another word for deep despair).
This despair, in turn, is the underlying reason why gaming is so substantially about murder, as opposed to books which have a completely different cultural basis, or television which (as a whole) was never countercultural.
There are some dark possibilities for a world deep in despair, just as there were some dark possibilities in the 1930s in Germany, what would then become Nazi Germany. The despair is far deeper now, since the problems in Germany had nothing to do with nuclear terror or ecological collapse, merely terrible economic oppression.
Fascist movements around the world are growing, from the Zaitokukai in Japan, the Zionists in Israel, the Golden Dawn party in Greece, and likewise - despair breeds desperation which breeds insular violence.
And in this world we live in we then examine the content of gaming, which typically features a cleansing process - the protagonist leads a civilization to conquer all others, for example, as in Civilization V, or a superpowered hero murders thousands of monsters in the name of "saving the civilized world". This compares very closely to a certain "superpowered" fascist leader in 1930s Germany who went about "killing the monsters" in order to "save the civilized world", as well as providing a kind of template for what the Zaitokukai, the Zionists, and the Golden Dawn, among others, hope to achieve.
Given that fascism in the world is growing at a substantial rate, it ought to give non-fascist gamers a long pause to consider the nature of the games they are playing. Since fascism is a cleansing process to save the world, and gaming is (largely) a cleansing process to save the world, why do non-fascist gamers enjoy games featuring fascist cleansing?