Guerilla said:
A feminist blogger with millions of views and MANY feminists defending her is not an isolated incident. Feminist "journalists" like Leigh Alexander that spread the exact same bullshit and worse is not an isolated incident. Kotaku and the entire Gawker clickbaiting shithole that have turned feminist "controversies" into a lucrative business which btw feminists have made what it is, is not an isolated incident. Enough with this hypocrisy, either join us then to fight these people or stop looking the other way every time they do shit like this [http://www.reddit.com/r/TumblrInAction/comments/2b4gky/kotaku_takes_down_patricia_hernandezs_piece_on/] and then when criticized as a movement acting as if these people aren't part of it.
That's a fair opinion but I personally feel a more constructive avenue for discussion is to voice my own opinions as well. There's a lot of asshole on either side of this thing. I don't equate everyone who disagrees with extremist feminism with all the harassment and abuse that goes on, or insist that if you don't agree with me that you preface every post with a disclaimer crying out against those actions.
I feel I have a somewhat more moderate view on the "pro-feminism" side of the spectrum, and I feel like at this point it's important that the "silent majority" start speaking up more often. The loudest voices right now on either side are too far in either extreme to be taken seriously at this point, but I truly believe that there's more common ground to be found for most gamers out there. I also don't think it'd be fair for me to counter every converse point by pointing to popular misogynistic voices and countering their arguments instead of the post I'm quoting.
Assholes suck and they do more harm than good. The poor actions made in the name of feminism are harmful and not acceptable. Two wrongs don't make a right, I was always taught.
As I've said in the past, I actually think this has been a good year for feminism in games. Quite a few well-written characters (as I don't believe the only "proper" way to portray a female character is as an empowered hero any more than I think every male character should be one-note caricatures or token participants either.) And more focus should be on the positive examples.
I feel that if videogames are an art form, then art history and critical thinking is important to it as a medium (I come from a classical art background, I think art education, history, and critical analysis is important for encouraging educated conversation about any medium.) There are many screens through which to view a media, and feminism is one.
For me, a feminist view of videogames does not boil down to placing every game in an arbitrarily binary category. Placing every game that makes use of a cliche into the "sexism bin" is a simplistic answer to a complicated and layered question. I feel it's more useful to explore each game individually with what tools and terminology is available. And unfortunately there isn't a lot of that going around right now.
It is more about quality of writing than equal quantity of every possible character, I think.
I also feel that it's just as overly simplistic to label every character that doesn't live up to a feminist utopian ideal of a perfect woman as sexist or expect a sudden sea change in the way games are written. I don't even think there's no place for less-than-ideal portrayals of women in games. To me, the importance (from a creator's standpoint) is self-awareness and ownership.
ie, if you want to make a game with a plot that revolves around a damsel in distress, then do so. But at least be aware you're doing it and take ownership of the cliche you're using. Like... ah hell, what was that game that stirred up some controversy earlier in the year? The 2D fighting game with the really over-the-top anatomy and the witch character that was like 90% boobs? I don't think that was actually a particularly offensive game - the guy clearly was intentional in his character design and knew what he was doing and what audience he was aiming for. I don't think that's entirely problematic. I think maybe it should be the exception to the rule, but I can't decry that specific game for being something I don't think
every game should be.
Extreme "men are scum" feminism is a bad thing and shouldn't be tolerated or defended, and any action of abuse or harassment is unacceptable regardless of the victim or transgressor. I wish Anita Sarkeesian hadn't ended up as the de facto figurehead for all things feminist or the "voice of the movement." I'll bring that up at our next weekly meeting.
In the meantime I have my own views on matters that I'm providing for discussion and dissent. I really do feel like the extremists don't represent the typical views or that the conversation in gaming culture should focus on them - and that's not going to happen unless people start espousing their own views.
Netrigan said:
Personally, I think the way to deal with it is to actively listen to the major criticisms in more mainstream fare (there's really no reason an Assassin's Creed or Call of Duty should have anything really sexist in it... and for the most part, neither do), but if you want to cut loose on a Duke Nukem or Grand Theft Auto, just own it. I'm so very tempted to write up a blog entry on Crank 2, which is the most gleefully sexist/racist/homophobic/misanthropic thing ever. So much so, I don't think the makers want anyone to be offended by it... but they're daring you every step of the way to be offended.
Those are good points.
I especially agree with you about Crank 2. That's the sort of self-awareness I was talking about, really. They knew what movie they were trying to make and went about doing so. I wouldn't want every single movie to be like that, but there's nothing objectionable about that movie as viewed by itself.
Kind of why I don't worry about whether or not Saints Row is sexist or not, or "properly" portraying women. I actually haven't played beyond the first game (planned to, but other games keep getting in the way,) so I can't comment too much on it - but the feeling I got from those games was that they were intended as over-the-top parodies not to be taken seriously.
I'd rather a developer or whatever possess self-awareness of the game they're making, take ownership of the content they put in, and be capable of explaining their position and justifying their actions than the converse.