Is Kinect really that innovative?

[IamSofaKingRaw]

I recently saw this video on N4G about the Eyetoy and many off the Kinect games now look like some of the ones shown in the video (most notably Sonic Free Riders). It seems to me that Kinect is just a barely upgraded Eyetoy; something Sony developed like 10 years ago. Does anyone else share my opinion?

 

[Terminate421]

No, its pretty fun, Eyetoy was a clusterfuck.

 

[Armored Prayer]

From what I hear Kinect is more advanced than the Eyetoy.

Technology wise its pretty damn impressive. Game wise it looks like Wii knockoffs, but I'm sure more impressive games will be made with Kinect.

 

[omega 616]

Nah, Kinect is far more advanced. All the Eyetoy did was track shadows, and therefore couldn't be used in low light. Kinect actually tracks the person and their movements, so it can see you no matter what.

That doesn't mean Kinect won't encourage a ton of shovelware just like the Wii, but it's still more innovative than say, Sony's Playstation Move, which is just a direct rip-off of Nintendo. Same technology and everything, maybe a little more accurate than the Wii's Motion Plus.

Both a are more accurate versions of previous things. Kinect tracks movement, of what sort it doesn't matter. Move is a more accurate version of the Wii.

The only difference I see is, kinect was based off something last decade or so and move is based off something more recent.

That being said, I think both suck and should just team up with 3D and take a long walk off a short pier.

 

[DustyDrB]

You can say something good about Kinect. It won't kill you.

 

[Jonluw]

Kinect doesn't really have much in common with the eyetoy. The eyetoy only captured your silhouette, and let the stuff on screen react to being touched by the silhouette. Kinect, on the other hand, uses infrared technology to track your movement in three dimensions and transfer them to your on-screen avatar.

The eyetoy just identified an object in the path of the camera, and allowed it to interact with on-screen objects. The Kinect, on the other hand, identifies humans, and can even keep track of two separate humans. In other words: The Kinect knows it is filming people, and not, say, a branch wawing in the wind in front of the camera.

Edit: The only thing they actually have in common, is that a camera is involved.

 

[IamSofaKingRaw]

Kinect doesn't really have much in common with the eyetoy. The eyetoy only captured your silhouette, and let the stuff on screen react to being touched by the silhouette. Kinect, on the other hand, uses infrared technology to track your movement in three dimensions and transfer them to your on-screen avatar.

The eyetoy just identified an object in the path of the camera, and allowed it to interact with on-screen objects. The Kinect, on the other hand, identifies humans, and can even keep track of two separate humans. In other words: The Kinect knows it is filming people, and not, say, a branch wawing in the wind in front of the camera.

The Move is difinately differnt to the Wiimote. The Wii mote can only track movement in the y and x direction whereas the Move can track in the YX and Z (Z bing 3d space) it also allows users to interact with objects in 3d space. Yet with all that change its seen as a Wii ripoff. The Kinect may be superior but all of the games have similar gameplay mechanics to previous Eyetoy games.

Look familiar?

What about this?

Yeah we should all praise Microsoft for their innovation in gaming.

 

[IamSofaKingRaw]

Nah, Kinect is far more advanced. All the Eyetoy did was track shadows, and therefore couldn't be used in low light. Kinect actually tracks the person and their movements, so it can see you no matter what. The tracking is much more accurate, down to hand movements rather than whole limbs. Not to mention it's got voice recognition and player profiles.

That doesn't mean Kinect won't encourage a ton of shovelware just like the Wii, but it's still more innovative than say, Sony's Playstation Move, which is just a direct rip-off of Nintendo. Same technology and everything, maybe a little more accurate than the Wii's Motion Plus.

Wrong. It uses the Playstation Eye to track the glowing ball on top of the Move controller and also has sensors inside of it to further increase accuracy. I never heard of the Wiimote tracking in 3d space, have you? Most of the games I've seen from Kinect have been done on the Eyetoy/Pseye whereas some of the developer demos I've seen of the PS Move show its clear dominance over the Wiimotion plus controller.

 

[Jonluw]

Kinect doesn't really have much in common with the eyetoy. The eyetoy only captured your silhouette, and let the stuff on screen react to being touched by the silhouette. Kinect, on the other hand, uses infrared technology to track your movement in three dimensions and transfer them to your on-screen avatar.

The eyetoy just identified an object in the path of the camera, and allowed it to interact with on-screen objects. The Kinect, on the other hand, identifies humans, and can even keep track of two separate humans. In other words: The Kinect knows it is filming people, and not, say, a branch wawing in the wind in front of the camera.

The Move is difinately differnt to the Wiimote. The Wii mote can only track movement in the y and x direction whereas the Move can track in the YX and Z (Z bing 3d space) it also allows users to interact with objects in 3d space. Yet with all that change its seen as a Wii ripoff. The Kinect may be superior but all of the games have similar gameplay mechanics to previous Eyetoy games.


Look familiar?


What about this?

Yeah we should all praise Microsoft for their innovation in gaming.

OP's claim was not that the Kinect's games weren't innovative. He/she claimed that the Kinect was a barely upgraded eyetoy. I was not making a point regarding the gameplay of the kinect: I was talking about the technology; and technology-wise, the only common denominator between the eyetoy and the Kinect, is the camera.

 

[IamSofaKingRaw]

Kinect doesn't really have much in common with the eyetoy. The eyetoy only captured your silhouette, and let the stuff on screen react to being touched by the silhouette. Kinect, on the other hand, uses infrared technology to track your movement in three dimensions and transfer them to your on-screen avatar.

The eyetoy just identified an object in the path of the camera, and allowed it to interact with on-screen objects. The Kinect, on the other hand, identifies humans, and can even keep track of two separate humans. In other words: The Kinect knows it is filming people, and not, say, a branch wawing in the wind in front of the camera.

The Move is difinately differnt to the Wiimote. The Wii mote can only track movement in the y and x direction whereas the Move can track in the YX and Z (Z bing 3d space) it also allows users to interact with objects in 3d space. Yet with all that change its seen as a Wii ripoff. The Kinect may be superior but all of the games have similar gameplay mechanics to previous Eyetoy games.


Look familiar?


What about this?

Yeah we should all praise Microsoft for their innovation in gaming.

OP's claim was not that the Kinect's games weren't innovative. He/she claimed that the Kinect was a barely upgraded eyetoy. I was not making a point regarding the gameplay of the kinect: I was talking about the technology; and technology-wise, the only common denominator between the eyetoy and the Kinect, is the camera.

It could face track at the very least. If you want a youtube video I can get it fo you. Like I said in this thread the Kinet is just an improvement of the Eyetoy but it is seen as a totally nwe idea and innovation in gaming. Th Move on the otherhand, is seen as a blatant ripoff of the wiimote even though it also is very different.

 

[Delusibeta]

Nah, Kinect is far more advanced. All the Eyetoy did was track shadows, and therefore couldn't be used in low light. Kinect actually tracks the person and their movements, so it can see you no matter what. The tracking is much more accurate, down to hand movements rather than whole limbs. Not to mention it's got voice recognition and player profiles.

That doesn't mean Kinect won't encourage a ton of shovelware just like the Wii, but it's still more innovative than say, Sony's Playstation Move, which is just a direct rip-off of Nintendo. Same technology and everything, maybe a little more accurate than the Wii's Motion Plus.

Wrong. It uses the Playstation Eye to track the glowing ball on top of the Move controller and also has sensors inside of it to further increase accuracy. I never heard of the Wiimote tracking in 3d space, have you? Most of the games I've seen from Kinect have been done on the Eyetoy/Pseye whereas some of the developer demos I've seen of the PS Move show its clear dominance over the Wiimotion plus controller.

It doesn't make the Move any less of a rip-off. It's a bit like arguing Sony didn't rip-off the analogue stick from Nintendo and Sega by adding a second analogue stick. PS Ever tried editing pictures in the Photo Channel? You know how that when you move the Wiimote closer to the screen, the brush gets larger? Yeah? Then stop talking out of your arse.

 

[Delusibeta]

Nah, Kinect is far more advanced. All the Eyetoy did was track shadows, and therefore couldn't be used in low light. Kinect actually tracks the person and their movements, so it can see you no matter what. The tracking is much more accurate, down to hand movements rather than whole limbs. Not to mention it's got voice recognition and player profiles.

That doesn't mean Kinect won't encourage a ton of shovelware just like the Wii, but it's still more innovative than say, Sony's Playstation Move, which is just a direct rip-off of Nintendo. Same technology and everything, maybe a little more accurate than the Wii's Motion Plus.

To innovate is to improve on existing tech or ideas.
Kinect is innovating off of the Eyetoy
Move is innovating the Wii-mote

To say that either of these is more innovative than the other is a stupid statement

To say that either is "innovative" is just inviting a flame war.

 

[Jkudo]

Nah, Kinect is far more advanced. All the Eyetoy did was track shadows, and therefore couldn't be used in low light. Kinect actually tracks the person and their movements, so it can see you no matter what. The tracking is much more accurate, down to hand movements rather than whole limbs. Not to mention it's got voice recognition and player profiles.

That doesn't mean Kinect won't encourage a ton of shovelware just like the Wii, but it's still more innovative than say, Sony's Playstation Move, which is just a direct rip-off of Nintendo. Same technology and everything, maybe a little more accurate than the Wii's Motion Plus.

To be fair to the eye toy it can do voice and face recognition as well. Also head tracking seems to work pretty well. Now kinect works completely differently, but i have yet to see this version of kinect do anything the eye toy cannot do.
I don't consider it a move rip-off, if you think so it seems you are a bit ignorant about the controller. At first glance i can see why it would be called that, and it does have similar tech to the wii, but far more capabilities.
http://www.computerandvideogames.com/article.php?id=257075
My favorite demo.

 

[Jonluw]

Kinect doesn't really have much in common with the eyetoy. The eyetoy only captured your silhouette, and let the stuff on screen react to being touched by the silhouette. Kinect, on the other hand, uses infrared technology to track your movement in three dimensions and transfer them to your on-screen avatar.

The eyetoy just identified an object in the path of the camera, and allowed it to interact with on-screen objects. The Kinect, on the other hand, identifies humans, and can even keep track of two separate humans. In other words: The Kinect knows it is filming people, and not, say, a branch wawing in the wind in front of the camera.

The Move is difinately differnt to the Wiimote. The Wii mote can only track movement in the y and x direction whereas the Move can track in the YX and Z (Z bing 3d space) it also allows users to interact with objects in 3d space. Yet with all that change its seen as a Wii ripoff. The Kinect may be superior but all of the games have similar gameplay mechanics to previous Eyetoy games.


Look familiar?


What about this?

Yeah we should all praise Microsoft for their innovation in gaming.

OP's claim was not that the Kinect's games weren't innovative. He/she claimed that the Kinect was a barely upgraded eyetoy. I was not making a point regarding the gameplay of the kinect: I was talking about the technology; and technology-wise, the only common denominator between the eyetoy and the Kinect, is the camera.

It could face track at the very least. If you want a youtube video I can get it fo you. Like I said in this thread the Kinet is just an improvement of the Eyetoy but it is seen as a totally nwe idea and innovation in gaming. Th Move on the otherhand, is seen as a blatant ripoff of the wiimote even though it also is very different.

The eyetoy having a face tracking function doesn't make its technology in any way more similiar to the Kinect. You provide no evidence that the technology of the Kinect is similiar to that of the eyetoy.

Also, note that I never called Move a ripoff of the Wii. Yet you are arguing to me that the Move is not a ripoff. Please stop talking to me about this, since it is only tangentally related to what I am saying.

As a sidenote, your line of reasoning in this post makes no sense to me: You jump from a claim that has close to zero relevance to the discussion, to the conclusion that the Kinect is a ripoff. I am beginning to believe you are trolling.

Additionally, you make it seem like you think you are the only one who thinks the Kinect is similiar to the eyetoy. I assure you, this is not the case. There are plenty of people on the internet who are making poorly grounded arguments for this being the case.

 

[IamSofaKingRaw]

Nah, Kinect is far more advanced. All the Eyetoy did was track shadows, and therefore couldn't be used in low light. Kinect actually tracks the person and their movements, so it can see you no matter what. The tracking is much more accurate, down to hand movements rather than whole limbs. Not to mention it's got voice recognition and player profiles.

That doesn't mean Kinect won't encourage a ton of shovelware just like the Wii, but it's still more innovative than say, Sony's Playstation Move, which is just a direct rip-off of Nintendo. Same technology and everything, maybe a little more accurate than the Wii's Motion Plus.

Wrong. It uses the Playstation Eye to track the glowing ball on top of the Move controller and also has sensors inside of it to further increase accuracy. I never heard of the Wiimote tracking in 3d space, have you? Most of the games I've seen from Kinect have been done on the Eyetoy/Pseye whereas some of the developer demos I've seen of the PS Move show its clear dominance over the Wiimotion plus controller.

What are you talking about? The Wiimote has always had tracking in all directions. Front, back, left, right, up, down. Is there some new plane of movement that Sony discovered for use with the Move?

Show me a game where you could move your arm straight out and the character on screen would do the same. The Move can track movements foward and back as well as right and left, the wiimote only does right to left. The motion plus only fixed the accuracy problem for the Wii's tracking right to left.

notice that it also is tracking their body head movements and mimicking them in game. Yeah its a clear wiiripoff/s

 

[IamSofaKingRaw]

Kinect doesn't really have much in common with the eyetoy. The eyetoy only captured your silhouette, and let the stuff on screen react to being touched by the silhouette. Kinect, on the other hand, uses infrared technology to track your movement in three dimensions and transfer them to your on-screen avatar.

The eyetoy just identified an object in the path of the camera, and allowed it to interact with on-screen objects. The Kinect, on the other hand, identifies humans, and can even keep track of two separate humans. In other words: The Kinect knows it is filming people, and not, say, a branch wawing in the wind in front of the camera.

The Move is difinately differnt to the Wiimote. The Wii mote can only track movement in the y and x direction whereas the Move can track in the YX and Z (Z bing 3d space) it also allows users to interact with objects in 3d space. Yet with all that change its seen as a Wii ripoff. The Kinect may be superior but all of the games have similar gameplay mechanics to previous Eyetoy games.


Look familiar?


What about this?

Yeah we should all praise Microsoft for their innovation in gaming.

OP's claim was not that the Kinect's games weren't innovative. He/she claimed that the Kinect was a barely upgraded eyetoy. I was not making a point regarding the gameplay of the kinect: I was talking about the technology; and technology-wise, the only common denominator between the eyetoy and the Kinect, is the camera.

It could face track at the very least. If you want a youtube video I can get it fo you. Like I said in this thread the Kinet is just an improvement of the Eyetoy but it is seen as a totally nwe idea and innovation in gaming. Th Move on the otherhand, is seen as a blatant ripoff of the wiimote even though it also is very different.

The eyetoy having a face tracking function doesn't make its technology in any way more similiar to the Kinect. You provide no evidence that the technology of the Kinect is similiar to that of the eyetoy.

Also, note that I never called Move a ripoff of the Wii. Yet you are arguing to me that the Move is not a ripoff. Please stop talking to me about this, since it is only tangentally related to what I am saying.

As a sidenote, your line of reasoning in this post makes no sense to me: You jump from a claim that has close to zero relevance to the discussion, to the conclusion that the Kinect is a ripoff. I am beginning to believe you are trolling.

Additionally, you make it seem like you think you are the only one who thinks the Kinect is similiar to the eyetoy. I assure you, this is not the case. There are plenty of people on the internet who are making poorly grounded arguments for this being the case.

You initially said the Kinect had pretty much nothing in common with the eyetoy and I stated it did. How? By the games and similar features they both share like face tracking, voice commands, body tracking. True I brought the Move into the discussion but that was to show you the common bias favouring Kinect when people talk about who is copying who. My point here is that you can't say either the Move/Kinect is copying another product without saying the other is also.

 

[robinkom]

They're all gimmicks, that's for sure. This console generation has materialized more gimmicks and peripherals than any other before it. It's getting tiresome.

My major problem with motion controls is I don't want to move that much. After work and whatever else I have to do, I sit down with a game to unwind and relax, not flail around some more.

As for the OP's question, Kinect is an interesting and expensive venture to be sure. I know when the Eyetoy came out it drifted under my radar as if I never noticed. Kinect, however, has a more marketing muscle behind it and is hard to ignore. Until you get to try out Kinect yourself and form a genuine opinion of it, you won't really know how "innovative" it is or isn't. Everyone's game preferences are different and if you are heavily attracted to what games it supports, it will make your opinion of the peripheral biased but that's your prerogative.

For me, it will take something very special, unique and worth spending countless hours with to be worthy of spending the money on the device and game in question.

 

[Onyx Oblivion]

Kinect is an Eyetoy that WORKS.

Kinect has a few issues, but Eyetoy was just BROKEN.

 

[Hashime]

From experience programming motion tracking algorithms, it is impressive. My cousin and I were just trying the track a large moving object in 2 dimensions (for an auto-aiming airsoft turret) and it was bloody hard. The programming, optimization, and 3 dimensional nature of the kinetic is impressive.

 

[shemoanscazrex3]

Nah, Kinect is far more advanced. All the Eyetoy did was track shadows, and therefore couldn't be used in low light. Kinect actually tracks the person and their movements, so it can see you no matter what. The tracking is much more accurate, down to hand movements rather than whole limbs. Not to mention it's got voice recognition and player profiles.

That doesn't mean Kinect won't encourage a ton of shovelware just like the Wii, but it's still more innovative than say, Sony's Playstation Move, which is just a direct rip-off of Nintendo. Same technology and everything, maybe a little more accurate than the Wii's Motion Plus.

So what he said was true, it is just an upgraded Eyetoy haha.