Is Mario done for?

[Sixties Spidey]

in this generation of fratboys, Yes. Mario is starting to become a dead goose with ribbons and googly eyes. Kids in my school and even in my old school think Mario is shit. I on the other hand had enough balls to come out and say, "Fuck Halo 3. Super Mario Galaxy is THE Game of the Year for 2007" People looked at me like i was a lunatic. And yes, that was possibly the dirtiest most treasonous thing I said to anyone in recent memory.

 

[searanox]

Yeah it's a platforming game, plenty of jumping puzzles, running around, and it did what SMG did back on the PS2.

Look SMG is a good game but it's not THAT original.

Or by this account Megaman isn't a platformer?

Fair enough; my experience with both those franchises has been limited, but every time I have been given the opportunity to play them, I have been unimpressed. Pretty visuals, but incredibly repetitive and boring gameplay with awkward controls and camera angles. Maybe things have improved in the last year or two though. Either way, I can't admit to being an expert on either of them.

Mega Man is definitely a platform game because it relies a lot more on acrobatics than it does on shooting; it's only really the bosses that demand much in the way of combat skills.

As for Galaxy not being that original, yes, I heard that one of those titles did the whole "spherical worlds" thing long before Mario did; however, I have also heard that it applied only to spheres (not non-standard shapes like cubes or, well, anything at all) and that its implementation within the gameplay was significantly more limited. Furthermore, I doubt that Miyamoto watches Western-developed games for new ideas to pilfer. Any stuff that gets made here might as well be completely unknown to him, and the rest of Nintendo of Japan for that matter.

 

[searanox]

Mario Galaxy wasn't a bad game. But let's face facts, it was pretty much a rehash of Mario 64. All the set pieces were there, a few new ideas were added but most were just silly. The gravity based gameplay was the highlight of the game, IMO. And, of course, what Wii game would be complete without a "Shake the Wiimote" function that Nintendo can claim is "innovative game design". The story is nothing we haven't seen before though, and maybe it's time for Nintendo to try something other then "Bowser kidnaps Peach, Mario beats up Bowser, repeat until stale".

Yeah, Call of Duty 4 was really just a rehash of Doom. All the set pieces were there, a few new ideas were added, but most were just silly. The modern-day setting was the highlight of the game, in my opinion. And, of course, what console shooter would be complete without an online mode, featuring thirteen-year-olds constantly screaming in your ear and humping your corpse's face, that can be claimed as "revolutionary". Really, though, the gameplay is nothing new, and maybe it's time for Infinity Ward to try something other than "linear and highly-scripted corridor-crawling with a standard variety of contemporary weapons, facing off against a bunch of nameless, faceless goons."

 

[Roger T. Houston]

^^ searanox wins this thread!

Although I agree with Johnx61 as well..

SMG is a rehash of Sunshine, which is a rehash of M64..

What is a platformer? You jump from place to place, in most cases a 3rd person perspective. You have to get to get from the starting point to the ending, collecting coins, notes, figments etc. That is the god-damn standard..

What you need is variation of the standard, wheter it is carrying a water cannon, a bird in a backpack, a levitating telekinetic ball, freaky gravity or whatever..

Mario 64 set the standard for 3D platforming, easy as that. When I raided my fathers collection for Beatles to my MP3 player, one of my thought were that there are a few cliches in their music. Then it hit me that they weren't cliches when the Beatles made the songs, it was Beatles who made the frikkin' cliche.. You can't hold that against them! (By the way, here is some extra ''''''s for the cliches, I have no idea where to put them....)

It seems like many here dislikes platforming, which is fine, but don't go blaming it all on Mario, he does better than most keeping the genre fresh...

 

[PureChaos]

Even though critics have given the game good reviews most of the hardcore Mario fans that I have spoken to and I have interviewed claim that it was in their opinion terrible due to the simple fact that Mario games have not differed in story or mechanic in the last 20 years.

First off, I'm *way* more inclined to trust the culmination of 73 professional reviews than two of your buddies from high school. No offense.

Secondly, why don't you try playing it yourself and see what you think? It's crazy fun.

- J

why is the opinion of someone who reviews a lot of games more important then the opinion of two random high schoolers? at the end of the day, they are still just opinions

 

[tiredinnuendo]

Even though critics have given the game good reviews most of the hardcore Mario fans that I have spoken to and I have interviewed claim that it was in their opinion terrible due to the simple fact that Mario games have not differed in story or mechanic in the last 20 years.

First off, I'm *way* more inclined to trust the culmination of 73 professional reviews than two of your buddies from high school. No offense.

Secondly, why don't you try playing it yourself and see what you think? It's crazy fun.

- J

why is the opinion of someone who reviews a lot of games more important then the opinion of two random high schoolers? at the end of the day, they are still just opinions

First off, I said the combination of 73 different reviewers.

This is 73 different people from different companies across the globe who measure game quality for a living. Their *average* score was 97 out of 100. That's a fairly substantial market survey, wouldn't you say?

Also, I left high school ages ago, and grew out of the "say everything sucks it makes you cool" mentality very shortly thereafter. There's a good reason why teenagers don't get to vote, just as a for instance. Forgive me for pointing out that their "reviews" are hardly likely to be objective.

- J

 

[PureChaos]

Even though critics have given the game good reviews most of the hardcore Mario fans that I have spoken to and I have interviewed claim that it was in their opinion terrible due to the simple fact that Mario games have not differed in story or mechanic in the last 20 years.

First off, I'm *way* more inclined to trust the culmination of 73 professional reviews than two of your buddies from high school. No offense.

Secondly, why don't you try playing it yourself and see what you think? It's crazy fun.

- J

why is the opinion of someone who reviews a lot of games more important then the opinion of two random high schoolers? at the end of the day, they are still just opinions

First off, I said the combination of 73 different reviewers.

This is 73 different people from different companies across the globe who measure game quality for a living. Their *average* score was 97 out of 100. That's a fairly substantial market survey, wouldn't you say?

ah, i see. i misunderstood. going by the average score of 73 reviewer, yes, i agree is probably more accurate than high schooler but if 73 reviewers gave a game called Princess Peach's Pony Training School 97% and some high schoolers said it was shit, i would probably agree with the high schooler.

Also, I left high school ages ago, and grew out of the "say everything sucks it makes you cool" mentality very shortly thereafter. There's a good reason why teenagers don't get to vote, just as a for instance. Forgive me for pointing out that their "reviews" are hardly likely to be objective.

- J

not sure about that. i was always one where if i thought something was great, i say it's great regardless of what others think. yes, peer pressure can make a lot of teens go against their real opinion through fear of being outcast but get them to give their opinion where their friends can't hear and you'll get their real opinion.

 

[Sylocat]

Also, I left high school ages ago, and grew out of the "say everything sucks it makes you cool" mentality very shortly thereafter. There's a good reason why teenagers don't get to vote, just as a for instance. Forgive me for pointing out that their "reviews" are hardly likely to be objective.

- J

But... but... everything popular DOES suck, don't you know? Because saying so makes me all cool and edgy and stuff! I'm cool like Yahtzee because I agree with everything he says!

 

[Hamsterlad]

Mario has been here for 20 years and he will be here weather we like it or not like the mega man titles that Grimm91 is saying. but the thing is all they need to do is come with something that brought out the joy that we all had in the good SNES days and Mario 64 or to a lesser extent Mario sunshine. Also another thing that would bring the series back to life is to have actuall human enteraction with Mario and Peach. or give him that damn cake that was promised in mario 64. *just to show you the cake is still a lie* also i know that they are trying to go with the wii's talent in making you look like a retard by flalling your arms around like morons and when sunshine was around it was the water gun. they need to stop with gimmicks in Mario games. that is the only way to TRULY save the franchise.

 

[countrysteaksauce]

Its time for them to invigorate the series. Mario needs a gun and misogynistic catchphrases, also strippers.

 

[spyrewolf]

wario shake was a step in the right direction, mario needs to go back to his 2d roots and have modern updates applied to him (much in the way wario shake was done). these 3d mario's have changed the soul of mario, zelda works in 3d because even in 2d, link moved through a world

 

[ZP---Fanatic]

After Super Mario 1,Super Mario 2 Super Mario 3 Super Paper Mario-The Thousand Year Door Super Paper Mario (The Newish One) Super Mario Sunshine Super Mario Galaxy Super Mario 64 Super Mario DS (The Sh!t One) And The Other 40 That Are Released Tonight? No He Isnt,I Bet NINTENDO Are just Gonna Keep Him And Remove The Mustache And Call Him Gario :/

 

[Nigh Invulnerable]

Phew, what is up with the Mario-bashing??

The Mario games aren't that bad. They aren't stagnant either, as some are saying.. The whole "random" gravity thing was quite inventive (although the cameraman still should be keelhauled). A lot of people just dislikes it since it's mainstream.. It would be far down on my personal favorites list, but not as much that it advocates to kill the franchise.. A lot of people seem to think that just because a franchise has gone on to long, and that the latest installment wasn't the very best game ever, should be put to sleep (ZP had some of this mentality in his Nintendo-bashing episode (Zelda? Mario? I forget..))

Consider the CEO (or whatever) of Coca-Cola Inc. making this statement:
"We have decided to discontinue the Coca-Cola soft drink. We know a lot of people regulary buys this product, and that it is well liked among a lot of target groups, and that this is the largest source of income to the corporation, and a pillar of who we are, however we believe the product has become stagnant. In addition, there are some fancy wine-connoisseurs that feel the product is low-class."

Yeah, not gonna happen.
There is a long way from best game ever, to bad. The Mario games are not bad, they may not be what I/You/Anyone, like best, but as long as they aren't outright bad, Nintendo has my endorsment to continue to make them. (And I'm sure they value that..)

Your Coke example is, I think, a very apt one. Mario is such a household brand that he's never going to truly disappear from the Nintendo stable. I do think that his games have decreased in their rate of innovation compared to the way they used to be. Perhaps this is why so many people here are hoping to see him die a painful death soon.

I'd personally prefer it if Mario games became less frequent and introduced more interesting gameplay mechanics. Yes, I know it's getting harder and harder to break through that wall of innovative gameplay as more companies get bigger budgets and are able to hire more talent, but Nintendo seems pretty capable of coming up with some really good ideas. If only they'd save them up for a little while and put them all into the next Mario title.

 

[Terramax]

Seriously? You are being ripped off my friend. I got Mario Kart for £27.99 and that was at least a year ago (and it was from game, Brand New before you ask).

I'm just saying how much I still see it in the stores for. On boxing Day I still saw Zavvi selling MK DS for £34.99.

I know wiser people will find it cheaper, but obviously some poor naive sod is buying it for that price or they wouldn't put it at that price.

 

[Blind0bserver]

I do hope that Mario gets put into retirement soon. With every new game that comes out (with an exception or two depending on who you talk to) it keeps getting harder for the poor guy to go out with some dignity.