Is the whole "Games as art" mainly kind of a misnomer?

[Cat_loves_Dragon]

I always wonder the why people say "We want to be taken as seriously as movies or books" which is to say as art think it need to apply to all games. On the whole movies and books are littered generic tripe and as far as TV that is literally the bulk of the content as even the news is hours or days behind even a small time website.

Why are video games not like every other medium a gradation of what is viewed as art? Movies we know yeah Citizen Cain that is art even if you hate it you can grasp what it gets at same for most if not all classic books on school reading list. T

Then you have items that may or may not be art like The Avengers or Fantasy novels (sorry can not think of a good popular book in this category) which to fans who see it as comics are love the genera mas into film is absolutely art and to man others is the tier below I will discuss in a next. Again this exists and is just kind of inherently understood.

Then you have pure entertainment nonsense. Now here it is absolutely necessary that you must understand this in no way shape or form is a bad thing, but we do nonsensically see it as such. This is anything from B-Movies millions love like Evil Dead or Starship Troopers but no one would claim as art unless they are a fanboy to to massive flops like Sc4ry Movie. In books this only negative examples that most hate where the Title of must books may as well be "(Spanish sounding name) leaned in close" and has Same as the others we know the this class likely even by the trailer or cover alone.

Games? Oh no Fez has proven games are are all of them even CoD! If only CoD was not holing us back with it generic guns! Gir it is why Fez will never be art! Why? Why can Fez be art while CoD just be entertainment? We do it with everything else! Why not games? And why does the lable of art apply to a medium anyway?

 

[Anthony Corrigan]

I think your confusing the push to be taken as a serious medium with "games as art"

Art

Noun
The expression or application of human creative skill and imagination, typically in a visual form such as painting or sculpture,...: "the art of the Renaissance"
Works produced by such skill and imagination.

Games ARE art because they are an expressive medium, what people want is for it to be recognised as more than just a kids toy or the realm of nerds which it is more and more. Gaming is being recognised as a mainstream medium, that can be used to tell deep and engaging stories rather than just "light entertainment" like packman or pong

 

[The_Scrivener]

I get with and even agree with the gist of what the original poster is saying. I actually think the fact that the industry is 15-20% legitimate pure art by community more or less and 80% streamlined crap puts it in the exact same boat as music and movies in the modern age. So in an ironic sense, I think it proves the point that they are art (in the broader sense.)

 

[Greg White]

For the most part, it's just a small, pretentious group that demands games be considered art by the rest of the world.

As Robert Ebert said "Why do you care what I think? I'm not a game critic."

Some game developers want to be recognized as artists, but seem to forget that most artwork doesn't get much recognition outside of its target audience anyway.

 

[Vern5]

Games are not art. I'm sorry to say it but a game is not a work of art; it is an entertainment commodity, which is not a bad thing at all. HOWEVER, Games do contain art that is visual, audible, and sometimes legible.

 

[Lilani]

Why are video games not like every other medium a gradation of what is viewed as art? Movies we know yeah Citizen Cain that is art even if you hate it you can grasp what it gets at same for most if not all classic books on school reading list.

Games are art, by the very definition of the word. And if you examine games objectively, many have the same components sought out in a great piece of art (being a creative endeavor, pathos, expression, theme, artist's statement, level of engagement, principles of art and aesthetics, etc). What people are after by beating the "games are art" drum is for games to be taken seriously by the art world. It took a long time for the world of the high arts to consider films to be art, and even now some are still dubious of the idea. They're starting to gain a bit of traction, but it'll still take a while, if it ever completely happens.

Games are not art. I'm sorry to say it but a game is not a work of art; it is an entertainment commodity, which is not a bad thing at all. HOWEVER, Games do contain art that is visual, audible, and sometimes legible.

Can the same not be said of films, though? Or books? What about games makes all of them inherently incapable of being art, while certain films and books are allowed to be art? Films and books are also made for entertainment, and to seek a profit. Hell most artists are out to make a profit one way or another. Since when does the selling and marketing of a work make it not a piece of art?

Ironically, it's artists like Andy Warhol who blew the top off commodities being art. His work was produced essentially like a commodity. He called his studio "the factory," and a lot of his works (like his prints of the Campbell's soup cans) were reproduced and handled not by him, but by his interns. His work was produced like mass-produced products, yet he's still considered to be one of the greatest contemporary artists.

 

[Amaror]

For the most part, it's just a small, pretentious group that demands games be considered art by the rest of the world.

As Robert Ebert said "Why do you care what I think? I'm not a game critic."

Some game developers want to be recognized as artists, but seem to forget that most artwork doesn't get much recognition outside of its target audience anyway.

It's not just about: "We want people to think we're art". Being legally considered "Art" is a huge advantage to any medium. I don't know how exactly it is in other countrys, but here in Germany Art, Science and ... another Thing that i can't remember right now are free from all Laws, except the "Grundrecht", so the basic Laws, that are the foundation of our legal system here, and human rights.
A little example.
I bet you all know the film inglorious bastards. This film shows the nazi symbol quite often, don't you think?
Well in Germany the public display of the Nazi Symbol is illegal. However, since it's a film and it's art, it get's away with it. While Games that are released in Germany must get rid of all the nazi symbols in them, if they want it to get released in Germany.

 

[Tom_green_day]

It depends what you define as arts. In school, even things like history and geography count as 'arts' subjects. Does this mean they are art? No! To me, only art art (like paintings and sculptures and stuff) is art as it's the only thing made purely for the expression of oneself. When I play music, or write, I don't do so to express myself.

 

[Glongpre]

Games are not art. I'm sorry to say it but a game is not a work of art; it is an entertainment commodity, which is not a bad thing at all. HOWEVER, Games do contain art that is visual, audible, and sometimes legible.

So games are not art...but they are. ????

Video games contain pretty much every medium, so....?

 

[RogueportJack]

Oh look at that. Gamers who don't know the first thing about art trying to talk about art. How original.

It's a stupid debate. Games have the power to tell amazing stories, have unique styles, and touch us emotionally. If John Q. Dumbass thinks that none of that matters because games are an entertainment business then that's on his joyless soul.

 

[OurGloriousLeader]

I think generally people are just discussing whether video games have the capacity to be art. So yeah, I guess it's worth pointing that out.

 

[irok]

I don't like art, I like games, if games aren't art, I'm fine with that but I still detest anyone trying to argue they aren't because its all semantics, its generally done from a standpoint of go play your stupid games and is often a stance made by those who haven't played them or even seen them being played since Mario, bio shock had a better storyline then most movies and yet movies are art apparently.

Soooo, against the ignorant stance that they cant be art but at the same time if they aren't art, fine, fuck art, who needs art when we have steam sales, go Google Picasso for abit if its so much deeper and more meaningful.

 

[balladbird]

Games are already like movies or books. the center is an over-inflated industry that churns out by-the-numbers pieces guaranteed to hit it off with the masses, at the expense of depth (honestly, was I talking about AAA games, hollywood, or the publisher demand for books like "twilight"?) punctuated by niche popular, deeper works in the independent sector, and with plenty of people ready to take everything in them more seriously than is merited.

as to the belief that video games are kid's stuff, or not to be taken seriously? *shrug* preconceived notions take forever to die out, even longer for the entertainment industry than most, the only cure is time.

 

[Norithics]

Yeah, there's definitely a confusion between 'art' and 'respected medium.' Poorly-drawn pornographic pulp comics are art, they're just not held in much esteem or valued greatly.

 

[MysticSlayer]

Why does a game have to follow a specific set of guidelines to differentiate itself from entertainment and be considered art? OK, Call of Duty may not be the greatest form of artistic expression out there, but why can it only be considered "entertainment" and also not "art"? Cannot "art" be used with the purpose of also entertaining a person, with no more comment being made by the artist than "This is what I find enjoyable"? Joy and excitement are themselves emotions, so why can't we include them in our definition of art?

Personally, I just find the whole "a game has to have the emotional weight of BioShock before it is considered art" to be rather ridiculous. All games, even entertainment-based ones like Call of Duty, are designed to deliver a certain emotional response and are judged based on whether or not they deliver that emotional response. That's basically what art is. It is something meant to give us an emotional response, and we generally categorize what is "good" and "bad" art by whether or not it delivers an emotional response. Whether that is the entertainment of Call of Duty, the horror of Amnesia, or the philosophical delve of BioShock, if it is meant to give us any form of emotional response, then it is considered art.