Is this right, or even legal?

[Tyrant T100]

He deserved every minute of it.
I imagine his tears were just crocodile tears so he won't have to do it again.
The secondary school I went to was very liberal and believe me they could not deal with troublemakers, only 1 child was expelled when I was there and that was for clubbing a teacher over the head with a metal chair.
Most punishments were exclusion or detention, the former never worked as a troublemaker would just run around outside the class room causing problems and distracting everyone in the current block.
Detention only worked on the kids who had made a mistake and were sorry about it, the troublemakers just never turned up.

Shame our school didn't do this considering the boys toilets had excrement painted on the walls and urine everywhere.

 

[Sir Thomas Sean Connery]

To be completely honest? I don't think it was "Wrong" for him to steal the drink in the first place.

Stealing is NOT inherently wrong.

And obviously, that punishment is FAR too extreme for trying to grab some soda.

A can of pop is not a necessity.

Please explain how stealing a beverage that causes dehydration rather than hydration when there is free hydration available qualifies as 'morally right stealing'?

As I said in some of my later comments, I have come to agree with you. The soda was by no means a good reason to steal.

 

[Ruwrak]

Actually, come to think of it (I skipped 7 pages of postings, sorry.) theft is theft and the school has a choice of incorporating detentional methods or calling the police. Yes, even for a 1 pound can of soda, you can get legal punishment.

And where some school make you pick up litter around the campus, this school decided to make him clean out the bathrooms. I suppose it's one of those alternative punishments when detention & writing 1000 times "I shall not steal" stop working (like with Bart Simpson.)

EDITUM:

Plus taking into consideration the phrase "If I do this, it would mean everyone could and would I want that?", meaning that if the school does not punish the lad, it would basically give off the message: "It's allright to steal, we're not going to punish you so go ahead and take what you want." Now that is a rather disturbing thought is it not? I think the school want to set a firm example for the rest.

Cleaning might be a bit extreme, but better to scare then to scar I suppose.

 

[One of Many]

You know what, I clean nasty shit and piss covered toilets 8 hours a day for a living, so let me tell you, it's not that hard really or as bad as one might think. The kid got caught stealing and had to do a thankless job for a few hours. Not that big of a deal. Besides, it sounds like the kid has a record, he should be thankful that he wasn't expelled.

 

[DracoSuave]

To be completely honest? I don't think it was "Wrong" for him to steal the drink in the first place.

Stealing is NOT inherently wrong.

And obviously, that punishment is FAR too extreme for trying to grab some soda.

A can of pop is not a necessity.

Please explain how stealing a beverage that causes dehydration rather than hydration when there is free hydration available qualifies as 'morally right stealing'?

Look, this really annoys me. Fizzy drinks do not dehydrate you. It is true that caffeine is dehydrating, but most of a fizzy drink is water, water which massively outbalances the dehydration caused by the caffeine.

Nice tangent, but what does this have to do with the central point?

 

[Stu35]

Yeah, no, that's fucked up. It's clearly going to add significantly to this kids already fragile mental state. Not how the situation should have been dealt with.

How should it have been dealt with?



Based on the Original post, it seems that 'nothing' will make this person a useful member of society - so how about we just shoot him and get it over with?

Truth is, Punishment very rarely fixes the person who commited the crime - but punishment usually isn't there to fix them, it's usually there to deter others who might commit the same crime.

Now, this child may just go back and re-offend, but how many other younguns at your school will have seen this punishment, and as a result, be unwilling to commit the same crime themselves?

Had this child simply been let go because of his poor family life, then that gives everyone else free reign to do as they please... It's a problem often overlooked in todays "Rehab over Punishment" culture.

Don't get me wrong, I believe that Rehabilitation is far more important than Punishment, but the more I see people trying to steer away from Punishment because "people only re-offend anyway", the more worried I become - because I know the ONLY reason I don't commit some pretty serious crimes is that Prison life looks pretty unpalatable to me. It is the fear of Punishment that keeps most people in line(because, even good people occasionally get the urge to violate our laws, for many reasons) - Take away that fear, and you get more "first time offenders".

 

[Erana]

Forcing a kid into physical labor over something as petty as a single can of soda is a blatant power trip. If he's getting this upset over having to do it, then you're stripping away any sense of safety and control he could glean from school after having such a terrible home life.

He's not going to think of it as "I did something wrong and was punished for it," because the punishment is so outrageously severe compared to the crime, even as a repeat offender. He's in a bad place, and when you're in a bad place and are humiliated and shamed simply because the people in power say so, you wind up hating yourself and the people who did it to you.

They obviously have no idea how to handle kids with real problems, and are relying on simply shoving rules and enforcement down their throat. If a kid doesn't respond to punishment, making them more and more severe is just going to keep hammering at the person pointlessly until they snap.

 

[tycho0042]

To be completely honest? I don't think it was "Wrong" for him to steal the drink in the first place.

Stealing is NOT inherently wrong.

And obviously, that punishment is FAR too extreme for trying to grab some soda.

Yes, stealing IS inherently wrong. you are taking something that doesn't belong to you. He wasn't dying of thirst. Shitty or not, there was alternatives but for whatever reason he decided it was better to steal than to take what was free just because he didn't like it. Having a shitty life doesn't justify crime.
The punishment I agree was excessive. A better alternative should have been reached though what I don't know.

 

[Hamish Durie]

well........
hard to say
stealing a 3$ can of drink and getting punished to clean toliets
kinda harsh I think staying in at recess for 5min would've sufficed

 

[lord canti]

Would be having these reactions if the kid didn't have a messed up life?

 

[Felstaff]

Poor kid...

I don't suppose any person on this forum has ever been in such a desperate situation to steal something so trivial, because they simply can't afford it.

Hence the sheer amount of "make him do 2 YEARS of toilet-cleaning duty! That'll serve the little oik right!" style of responses.

Punishment isn't going to suddenly make him less poor. Punishment, if ever doled, should be served only to rehabilitate. This kid needs help, and the school should take a stronger responsibility in ensuring he gets the best help a school can offer. I know schools =/= parents, but this kid... well he doesn't have parents. If anything, the school should get in touch with social services and try to find some sort of help to stop the kid being kicked to the kerb by society.

Humiliating him in front of the whole school was a dick move, by a dick headmaster.

 

[Jakub324]

That does seem to be kind of messed up, but then school authorities are notoriously out of touch with the way kids think.

 

[Khada]

The school should be HELPING the kid. GIVE him a can of drink each day ffs. Water would be better but I assume that's free at your school anyway. I would highly suggest approaching your school head and -calmly and with civility- expressing your repulsion at the schools decision to further ostracize a child whos situation is already greatly distressing to him. And all over a $1 can of drink.

 

[Legit101]

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[ShadowStar42]

He shouldn't of stole etc but cleaning the toilets in front of other students is possibly the most degrading thing you could possibly do and not right.

Wow, you have a really low opinion of janitors don't you.

 

[chadachada123]

Having dated a girl whose mother was a whore (this mother having 5 kids with 3 different fathers, despite having little-to-no personal income and having all 3 fathers ditch as well), and this girl being the only legal adult of the siblings, this girl using as much time and money as possible helping out her other siblings while her mom just...basically sat around, this will sound weird coming out of my mouth, as I have some very Libertarian views on politics.

I think that this kid needs help, and I think that cleaning toilets doesn't solve anything.

Not knowing the age of the kid, I'm guessing he's at least too young to really understand what's going on here. He's (probably) not a legal adult, and probably had quite a shitty life. Not that that excuses the crime, only that the crime should warrant rehabilitation, not punishment, at least until he gets old enough to where it's obvious that it's less of a lack of understanding of morality, and more of just "wah wah I want I want."

From what I see, this kid just does not care about the consequences because his life is already shitty enough. And I sympathize with him. Were I in a position to, I'd through a pound or two his way.

 

[trollax]

janitors clean those for half a year why can't he clean them for half a day.you steal you get in trouble

 

[BSCCollateral]

Granted that we don't know what was going on here, aside from the fact that people who know the kid and work with kids professionally consider this appropriate.

My take is that if you're too special to drink the free water, and you're such a delicate flower that three hours of manual labor makes you burst into tears, then you are too delicate to be a fucking thief.

"Troubled childhood?" Unless he's in an asylum he gets to play by the same rules as everyone else.

 

[GiantRaven]

This isn't a punishment. This is somebody trying to pull a fast one by having a pupil clean up instead of actual cleaners. Saves money, you know.

Pathetic.

 

[Legit101]

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