Israel Q.A.

[P1p3s]

The most terrible act is still going on, your cross threading the whole of Palestine with your own people, building communities that go through the whole of Palestine. Basically your giving your own people homes in an occupied country, so your breaking the Geneva convention.

Israel has been giving back land bequeathed to them by international powers for around 50 years now. I realise this conflict cannot be boiled down to a few ppithy statements but one thing I don't think get's mentioned enough is that the majority of that region belonged to the Israeli people for hundreds of generations, when they were scattered throughout the world other people moved in on the fertile land.

Before the Israeli people moved back to their current location it was basically a barren wasteland and now it is thriving again. I am not jewish, I am not israeli but I can pick up a history book and I can watch the news.

IMO people too easily forget that the israeli's didn't march in their and take the land by force, they were given it and have been fighting to defend it ever since.

Someone else said why not place these people in a more friendly area like texas etc - well their people didn't live in Texas for hundreds upon hundreds of years, the land they are in now was their own land to begin with.

EDIT: sorted my quote fail

 

[The Medic Who Ubered The World]

Little question. I got the impression that corruption is quite commonplace in Israel(a middle eastern tradition. I just wonder, because every few weeks there's a scandal involving an important politician or general and charges of bribery, sexual harrasment or nepotism. Whats the public opinion about this?

2) concerning the often militant settlers in the border areas:
Frankly, they seem to be quite fundamentalist nutjobs even pointing weapons at and attacking the IDF (when they are to be relocated). Again, what's the public view on them? Especially with many influent orthodox Iraelis sitting in Jerusalem working for the separation of men and women in public areas(seperated public transportation...Rosa Parks, anyone?)

 

[Flishiz]

Israel is a country that does deserve to exist, that I think we should all agree on. But the national government is racist to a degree of America pre-Civil Rights movement. Do you really believe it's fair to impose territorial control over an area of land of Palestinians, then refuse any non-Jew from having citizen's rights?

Sorry, that question is too much of an accusation. What I mean to ask is: Would you give Israeli Muslims the same citizenship rights as Israeli Jews?

 

[Xsy]

Little question. I got the impression that corruption is quite commonplace in Israel(a middle eastern tradition. I just wonder, because every few weeks there's a scandal involving an important politician or general and charges of bribery, sexual harrasment or nepotism. Whats the public opinion about this?

Well basicly the public opinion about its own government officials is quite bad. We dont like our politics , and charges of some sort just add to our bad view of the government.
Now you might say , you had elections recently why not change the whole government structure , and vote for different people , perfectly legit question with 2 answers:

1. Lack of actually good politicians , corruption is high in Israel and most politicians don't really want to help , they want their free car and high paycheck , having that its hard to find a decent party to vote for that will suit to the general public opinion , therefor we keep picking the same people hoping they have changed.

2. Most of the Israeli public are stupid frankly , they cry about political corruption but still vote for the same people. For example the people picked Netnyahu of hope that he got financial experience and is primary right winged so he could take care of the rocket threat.
Well the government he constructed that got sworn today is complete bollocks , 30 ministers that only 10 of them hold important cases , there are 4 'without a case ' ministers , who are basically ministers that get all of the benefits of nice free cars and high pay checks without doing anything , you can't see the logic behind that , well no one here can.

2) concerning the often militant settlers in the border areas:
Frankly, they seem to be quite fundamentalist nutjobs even pointing weapons at and attacking the IDF (when they are to be relocated). Again, what's the public view on them? Especially with many influent orthodox Iraelis sitting in Jerusalem working for the separation of men and women in public areas(seperated public transportation...Rosa Parks, anyone?)

This people dont even deserve my time to write about really , they are complete utter idiots who are blinded by their stupid religion from birth , the ones that build settlements on border areas are crazy religious freaks that think that because what is written in the Bible this is the 'holy' land and all of its territory belongs to the 'Promised people' , bla bla bla , they dont even realize the harm they are doing to Israel . The public view on them is generally like my own , some extreme right - winged people support them but most of the general public dont support stupid actions like that.

About the jews in Jerusalem , I cant say much about them , they are basically religious fanatics that live in their own little stupid world , and anyone who comes near it gets stoned (Not high , stoned as 'throwing rocks' ). Most of the public hates this fanatics , and dont even see them a part of the Israeli society.

Sorry about some harsh statements ( if it hurt anyone ) but my opinion about such religious fanatics is quite bad , and just a thought about them makes me mad

 

[Xsy]

Israel is a country that does deserve to exist, that I think we should all agree on. But the national government is racist to a degree of America pre-Civil Rights movement. Do you really believe it's fair to impose territorial control over an area of land of Palestinians, then refuse any non-Jew from having citizen's rights?

Sorry, that question is too much of an accusation. What I mean to ask is: Would you give Israeli Muslims the same citizenship rights as Israeli Jews?

This is a hard question to answer but i'll try.
I think that Muslims shouldent be a part of a Jewish state in the first place because of its definition. The whole point of the Jewish state is to have a large majority of jews in one place that can defend themselves against anti - semtisem.
The Muslims or more accurately the Palestinians ( as muslims is quite a generalization) should have their own state , with their own rules , their own government and so on.

The danger of having Palestinians in a jewish state is their high birth rate , they could become a majority in Israel basically contradicting the fact that this is a Jewish state.
Although , in current situation that a Palestinian state dosent exist ( not for long I hope ) , we should give equal rights to Palestinian Israeli citizens , although most of the public will probably never accept them for obvious reasons.

Also i'd like to comment about you saying we impose territorial control over an area which is Palestinian. Well firstly we do not impose control , we dont even want this territories , what you see in the news when the Israeli army gets inside some Palestinian settlements is strictly to capture Muslim extremists ( aka terrorists ) that plan on hurting Israel. We are even doing them a favor cleaning up their own mess by capturing all does assholes that dont let the Palestinians live peacefully.

 

[theklng]

i have tried to undermine my thoughts of this conflict for a while now. it is no doubt two sided; this war has been going on for the past 1000 years at least. it is the definitive proof that religion and politics do not mix.

still, i find myself being more biased towards palestinian side than to the israeli side. i have no affiliation whatsoever with religion or location or even race. why am i even bothered then? because i feel great injustices are being committed down there. the decision to create the state of israel in the first place was a mistake, made by people who could only see one side of the conflict, and who had financial and political power behind them. what's worse is perhaps the encroachment on palestinian territory by israeli forces.

that being said, there's been a problem with this ever since the crusades (900-1300) and probably earlier than that too; so i think both indigenous partners deserve the land. but it should never have happened like it happened with the creation of the state; rather, a neutral party should have gone in and seized the conflict on both sides. with that, people could start to split up the different parts of the land in a more unbiased fashion.

the irony of the whole situation is of course that the myth about david and goliath spring to mind, with the roles reversed. i think that as long as there isn't given at least some sort of leeway by israel (i am not talking about capitulation), then there's going to be war, be in hidden or visible. or in other words: if israel doesn't compromise and/or admit to their mistakes, i think that the "terrorism" shown by palestine will continue.

it's sad for me to see two sides, both with outdated religious-conservative mindsets still fighting and still not being able to swallow their pride and give in. the bigger man is definitely the one who can settle this by words and not attacks, retaliations or other. i have yet to see the bigger man in either sides.

 

[beddo]

What are the attitudes towards Israeli atheists? Is it acceptable to be Israeli and not Jewish?

If you mean Jewish as a religeon, well, Israel Is a Jewish state for the ewish race, not the jewish beleivers, except the ultra orthodox (the Scared for Israelis), people here are excepting of Atheists, My family has religeouse friends, and we are non reliouse (that for them is the same as atheists) and we go along O.K.

If you mean Jewish as a race, well... While the goverment teart non jewish Israeli citizens the same as jewish, there alot of right-wing extremists that say the arabs need to burn in a fire and that we should make Kababs on there burning body, But most israelis are O.K., but get pale and almost faint when they meet with Israeli Arabs, but thats just in our blood >.>

It was my understanding that there is no Jewish race and that the suggestion is racist. Though there is a Jewish 'people' through ethnicity, culture and belief.

I'm confused by your second paragraph. I thought gentiles and those of other faiths were to be respected. Surely the right-wing extremists are of the Jewish faith, otherwise they would not have a justification for the existence of the state of Israel as proclaimed in the Torah. In which case how do they justify calling for murder? That behaviour is not acceptable in the Torah except for exceptional circumstances.

 

[Horticulture]

Now, why did the Arab forces decide to attack Israel?
We posed neither military nor economic threats, the area belonged to the british before hand and thus wasn't taken directly from them, and Syria and Jordan care for the Palestinians about ten times less then we do. Why the war then?

You need to remember one thing, Arabs aren't citizens, they are SUBJECTS. Every single nation stated above was a dictatorship then and is a dictatorship now. The Arab people who were located in Israel would have become citizens, like the ones who didn't run are today. Full fledged, full rights citizen. It is my opinion that these nations could not handle the fact that Muslims near them would attain human rights, THAT IT WOULD LEAD TO REVOLUTIONS IN THEIR COUNTRIES. So thy first tried to destroy Israel, then demonized it.

The Arabs who choose to side with the Arab league actually choose being Arab subjects over Israeli citizens.

I do not see how Israel is endebted to these people, they choose to rise against us, against the Idea of citizenship, and side with people who were coming here to enslave them. And when they lost the war they come to us as if we were the aggresors.

In my mind, we owe them nothing, were they to side with us, they would have been both citizens and our brothers. They choose to be our enemies.

A lot of Arab residents fled hearing about massacres in places like Lod, Dawayima, and Dayr Yassin in '48, though. About half of the Arab population left and hasn't been allowed to return. You have people in refugee camps passing down the keys to their old houses from generation to generation. Are you of the opinion that all 1.7 million refugees and their descendents are mortal enemies of the state of Israel who choose to live in camps without citizenship of any country?

 

[asiepshtain]

Now, why did the Arab forces decide to attack Israel?
We posed neither military nor economic threats, the area belonged to the british before hand and thus wasn't taken directly from them, and Syria and Jordan care for the Palestinians about ten times less then we do. Why the war then?

You need to remember one thing, Arabs aren't citizens, they are SUBJECTS. Every single nation stated above was a dictatorship then and is a dictatorship now. The Arab people who were located in Israel would have become citizens, like the ones who didn't run are today. Full fledged, full rights citizen. It is my opinion that these nations could not handle the fact that Muslims near them would attain human rights, THAT IT WOULD LEAD TO REVOLUTIONS IN THEIR COUNTRIES. So thy first tried to destroy Israel, then demonized it.

The Arabs who choose to side with the Arab league actually choose being Arab subjects over Israeli citizens.

I do not see how Israel is endebted to these people, they choose to rise against us, against the Idea of citizenship, and side with people who were coming here to enslave them. And when they lost the war they come to us as if we were the aggresors.

In my mind, we owe them nothing, were they to side with us, they would have been both citizens and our brothers. They choose to be our enemies.

A lot of Arab residents fled hearing about massacres in places like Lod, Dawayima, and Dayr Yassin in '48, though. About half of the Arab population left and hasn't been allowed to return. You have people in refugee camps passing down the keys to their old houses from generation to generation. Are you of the opinion that all 1.7 million refugees and their descendents are mortal enemies of the state of Israel who choose to live in camps without citizenship of any country?

I'm gonna argue with you on the definition of a 'massacres', Israel had at the beginning of the war no regular army and fighting happened between what was one armed civilian group to another. A battle lost is not a massacre, and a civilian with a gun is not a civilian. Where the Arab population fought Israel and lost, they were killed. Where they didn't, almost all of the time nothing happened.

I consent the fact that at some cases these militia groups, not yet joined and controled as the IDF, committed acts unaccaptalbe by an army. Then again, they weren't an army. Note that this is no way excuses their actions.

Am I in the opinion that the 1.7 milion 'refuges' are mortal enemies of the state of Israel? Yeah, pretty much. And before you knee-jerk to this, let me ask you a question. Would these people come here, swear an Oath of Allegiance to Israel and take arms against our enemies the Palestinians? What do you think?

As to what they "Choose" to do with their lives, like I said, I don't think I'm indebted to them. They can do whatever they want, they just can't come back here.

 

[Horticulture]

I'm gonna argue with you on the definition of a 'massacres', Israel had at the beginning of the war no regular army and fighting happened between what was one armed civilian group to another. A battle lost is not a massacre, and a civilian with a gun is not a civilian. Where the Arab population fought Israel and lost, they were killed. Where they didn't, almost all of the time nothing happened.

I consent the fact that at some cases these militia groups, not yet joined and controled as the IDF, committed acts unaccaptalbe by an army. Then again, they weren't an army. Note that this is no way excuses their actions.

Am I in the opinion that the 1.7 milion 'refuges' are mortal enemies of the state of Israel? Yeah, pretty much. And before you knee-jerk to this, let me ask you a question. Would these people come here, swear an Oath of Allegiance to Israel and take arms against our enemies the Palestinians? What do you think?

As to what they "Choose" to do with their lives, like I said, I don't think I'm indebted to them. They can do whatever they want, they just can't come back here.

My aim isn't to point fingers, but to explain why many (700k+) Palestinians chose to flee. There was an understandable fear for their lives and safety, regardless of loyalty to pan-Arab nationalism. Reinterpreting it as an ideological decision just plays right into the hands of extremists on both sides.

I do, actually, think that given the opportunity to return to their homes (talk about a logistical nightmare, 50+ years later), lots of Palestinian refugees would take Israeli citizenship. Surveys of non-Jewish Arab populations within Israel suggest that among those who support a two-state solution, most would prefer to remain in their Israeli homes even after the establishment of a sovereign Palestine. I can't imagine most Palestinians given the choice between Israeli citizenship and stateless life in a refugee camp would choose the latter. Serving in the IDF is a non-issue: non-Jews aren't conscripted.


They can't do whatever they want. They're refugees. That's the problem. Depending on the host country, some have even been prevented from holding permanent employment, traveling, or going to school.

 

[Beowulf DW]

Just to lighten things up:

What did you think of "You Don't Mess with the Zohan"?

Haven't seen it yet, not a big fan of Adam Sander thou.

As a whole, it was lack luster (at best), but the beginning was pretty funny, and there were several good parts throughout the rest of the movie. The Hezbollah Hotline part was hilarious.

 

[The Infamous Scamola]

Israel is a country that does deserve to exist, that I think we should all agree on. But the national government is racist to a degree of America pre-Civil Rights movement. Do you really believe it's fair to impose territorial control over an area of land of Palestinians, then refuse any non-Jew from having citizen's rights?

Sorry, that question is too much of an accusation. What I mean to ask is: Would you give Israeli Muslims the same citizenship rights as Israeli Jews?

This is a hard question to answer but i'll try.
I think that Muslims shouldent be a part of a Jewish state in the first place because of its definition. The whole point of the Jewish state is to have a large majority of jews in one place that can defend themselves against anti - semtisem.
The Muslims or more accurately the Palestinians ( as muslims is quite a generalization) should have their own state , with their own rules , their own government and so on.

The danger of having Palestinians in a jewish state is their high birth rate , they could become a majority in Israel basically contradicting the fact that this is a Jewish state.
Although , in current situation that a Palestinian state dosent exist ( not for long I hope ) , we should give equal rights to Palestinian Israeli citizens , although most of the public will probably never accept them for obvious reasons.

Also i'd like to comment about you saying we impose territorial control over an area which is Palestinian. Well firstly we do not impose control , we dont even want this territories , what you see in the news when the Israeli army gets inside some Palestinian settlements is strictly to capture Muslim extremists ( aka terrorists ) that plan on hurting Israel. We are even doing them a favor cleaning up their own mess by capturing all does assholes that dont let the Palestinians live peacefully.

Yeah but you know the only reason they created a jewish state was because antisemite world leaders wanted the jews out of their country.

 

[The Infamous Scamola]

Here's a question for ya, dont you think that the Balfour declaration was contradictory to previous British statements about freeing Palestine from the Turks to make an Arab state?

 

[tsb247]

Has the Tavor entered service yet, or are you guys still using M16s? I've seen some demos of the new Israeli Tavor, but I have yet to see if it has been fully adopted by the IDF.

 

[PopperThingi]

Another Israeli here! Good thing to know Im not alone.

 

[E_nchanted]

A its good to hear from an insider, the media is giving us nothing but lies to spice thinks up a bit. At least that was the case some while ago, haven't watched or paid attention to the media in quite some while now. I do have a question for ye:
You said you LOVE Mr.Obama, as an European could you explain to me why?, as for what I am aware, the only thing changed is, a white dumb ass got replaced by a black dumb ass (not racist). And you said you're relationship with the US is like a Parent/child relation, could you give me an example of a real situation instead of the example you have already given

~Enchanted

 

[hamster mk 4]

I would also like to know the cause for you and many other people outside America to Love Obama. Granted he is not Bush and is opposed to many of the unpopular policies Bush implemented, but is that reason enough to love some one? I live in the US and voted Obama but I am hesitant to call him a great president until I see some positive returns from the policies he enacts.

Also on the topic of Israel being the front line of the East/West culture war and if the terrorists are not attacking Israel they will move on to other nations. When these arguments come from the mouth of American Politicians it always sounds like rhetoric and slippery slope fallacy. Why do you believe this is the case? I believe Israel has the right to exist, but under the hypothetical situation where the Hamas is successful in destroying the state of Israel, what makes you think they will continue their campaign into countries outside the Middle East?

 

[SnowCold]

What are the attitudes towards Israeli atheists? Is it acceptable to be Israeli and not Jewish?

If you mean Jewish as a religeon, well, Israel Is a Jewish state for the ewish race, not the jewish beleivers, except the ultra orthodox (the Scared for Israelis), people here are excepting of Atheists, My family has religeouse friends, and we are non reliouse (that for them is the same as atheists) and we go along O.K.

If you mean Jewish as a race, well... While the goverment teart non jewish Israeli citizens the same as jewish, there alot of right-wing extremists that say the arabs need to burn in a fire and that we should make Kababs on there burning body, But most israelis are O.K., but get pale and almost faint when they meet with Israeli Arabs, but thats just in our blood >.>

It was my understanding that there is no Jewish race and that the suggestion is racist. Though there is a Jewish 'people' through ethnicity, culture and belief.

I'm confused by your second paragraph. I thought gentiles and those of other faiths were to be respected. Surely the right-wing extremists are of the Jewish faith, otherwise they would not have a justification for the existence of the state of Israel as proclaimed in the Torah. In which case how do they justify calling for murder? That behaviour is not acceptable in the Torah except for exceptional circumstances.

*facepalm*, those people AREN'T religouse, Israel ISN'T a relegiouse contry, The probbly serve shrimps at the goverment cafetiria, and those kababs the extremists are cooking on the arabs burning body is probbly pig meat.

 

[beddo]

What are the attitudes towards Israeli atheists? Is it acceptable to be Israeli and not Jewish?

If you mean Jewish as a religeon, well, Israel Is a Jewish state for the ewish race, not the jewish beleivers, except the ultra orthodox (the Scared for Israelis), people here are excepting of Atheists, My family has religeouse friends, and we are non reliouse (that for them is the same as atheists) and we go along O.K.

If you mean Jewish as a race, well... While the goverment teart non jewish Israeli citizens the same as jewish, there alot of right-wing extremists that say the arabs need to burn in a fire and that we should make Kababs on there burning body, But most israelis are O.K., but get pale and almost faint when they meet with Israeli Arabs, but thats just in our blood >.>

It was my understanding that there is no Jewish race and that the suggestion is racist. Though there is a Jewish 'people' through ethnicity, culture and belief.

I'm confused by your second paragraph. I thought gentiles and those of other faiths were to be respected. Surely the right-wing extremists are of the Jewish faith, otherwise they would not have a justification for the existence of the state of Israel as proclaimed in the Torah. In which case how do they justify calling for murder? That behaviour is not acceptable in the Torah except for exceptional circumstances.

*facepalm*, those people AREN'T religouse, Israel ISN'T a relegiouse contry, The probbly serve shrimps at the goverment cafetiria, and those kababs the extremists are cooking on the arabs burning body is probbly pig meat.

Don't facepalm! It's a highly ambiguous area; Israel seems to switch from saying it is a religious state to justify its existence to claiming it isn't to wriggle out of religious accountability.

The main justification for the creation of the State of Israel was that it was promised from God. If Israel is not religious then this argument is invalid and the land was 'stolen' from the Palestinians, thus it is no different from the colonising by the European states of much of the world, an act widely condemned.

I have to say that this is my opinion, that the land was stolen from the Palestinians. That the State of Israel was given out of guilt from the holocaust. Ironically the actions and crimes under the holocaust are being repeated by the state of Israel against the citizens of Palestine. You can track the oppression from the 1930s against the Jewish population and see remarkable similarities against Palestinians. We now see the same war crimes conducted against Palestinians as the Nazi's committed against the Jewish people, though on a smaller scale, the action are just as monsterous and horrific.

 

[ElephantGuts]

What are the attitudes towards Israeli atheists? Is it acceptable to be Israeli and not Jewish?

If you mean Jewish as a religeon, well, Israel Is a Jewish state for the ewish race, not the jewish beleivers, except the ultra orthodox (the Scared for Israelis), people here are excepting of Atheists, My family has religeouse friends, and we are non reliouse (that for them is the same as atheists) and we go along O.K.

If you mean Jewish as a race, well... While the goverment teart non jewish Israeli citizens the same as jewish, there alot of right-wing extremists that say the arabs need to burn in a fire and that we should make Kababs on there burning body, But most israelis are O.K., but get pale and almost faint when they meet with Israeli Arabs, but thats just in our blood >.>

It was my understanding that there is no Jewish race and that the suggestion is racist. Though there is a Jewish 'people' through ethnicity, culture and belief.

I'm confused by your second paragraph. I thought gentiles and those of other faiths were to be respected. Surely the right-wing extremists are of the Jewish faith, otherwise they would not have a justification for the existence of the state of Israel as proclaimed in the Torah. In which case how do they justify calling for murder? That behaviour is not acceptable in the Torah except for exceptional circumstances.

*facepalm*, those people AREN'T religouse, Israel ISN'T a relegiouse contry, The probbly serve shrimps at the goverment cafetiria, and those kababs the extremists are cooking on the arabs burning body is probbly pig meat.

Don't facepalm! It's a highly ambiguous area; Israel seems to switch from saying it is a religious state to justify its existence to claiming it isn't to wriggle out of religious accountability.

The main justification for the creation of the State of Israel was that it was promised from God. If Israel is not religious then this argument is invalid and the land was 'stolen' from the Palestinians, thus it is no different from the colonising by the European states of much of the world, an act widely condemned.

I have to say that this is my opinion, that the land was stolen from the Palestinians. That the State of Israel was given out of guilt from the holocaust. Ironically the actions and crimes under the holocaust are being repeated by the state of Israel against the citizens of Palestine. You can track the oppression from the 1930s against the Jewish population and see remarkable similarities against Palestinians. We now see the same war crimes conducted against Palestinians as the Nazi's committed against the Jewish people, though on a smaller scale, the action are just as monsterous and horrific.

I don't recall hearing about any Israeli death camps...

And I say just that as an understatement, besides everything else that isn't true with what you said and how offensive that is to suggest that the same people who suffered through the Holocaust are now doing the same thing.