Jimquisition: The Adblock Episode

[Caiphus]

I must say, I became a Pubclub member to get away from the ads, but I can't remember them being this bad:

explicitly pornographic hentai in its ad banners.

...

*unsubscribes from Pubclub*

Wat.

Anyway, it's good that Jim tried to start this discussion, because it's one that needs to be had. It's one of the elephants in the room around here. It's slightly off that people are getting warnings, but the Escapist has to protect its revenue stream. The whole situation sucks, frankly.

Oh wells.

Edit: After reading what Kross and Marter had to say about adblocker discussion scaring off advertisers, I can see why they do what they do. So yeah.

Snip

This in particular was a bloody awesome post.

 

[nickpy]

I used to use adblock on the Escapist, but I always made an effort to craft some (heavily convoluted) exception rules so that (most) of the ads would get through - my issue was not the ads themselves, afterall I understood that blocking them was denying The Escapist revenue it needed to produce the content I wished to consume. My issue was with 1. the social plugins (privacy issues etc) and 2. the extremely heavy javascript that would outright crash my browser.

However, I have recently taken out a PubClub Sub so that now I don't have to worry about any such dodginess anymore, and any lingering guilt evaporated away there and then. Honestly, I think the Escapist could do more to push PubClub; had I known it was only $20 a year i'd have gladly taken it out years ago.

I also sent a feedback message to the site explaining all of this, including how it'd be nice to have an option to disable social plugins... never did get a response, though I didn't get banned either so hey-ho.

 

[GundamSentinel]

Personally, I prefer to use privacy-protection addons over adblockers. I don't mind watching an add once in a while (people gotta eat), but I want to know who gets all my data. Collusion tells me that browsing the Escapist for a bit can get me tagged by over 20 different sites and companies and I don't like it.

 

[themainc]

Eh, I just pay for the publishers club thing. I'd do the same for all the youtube guys I watch, but they don't have a system like that. And when I directly reach out to them and get no response, well there's not much else to do. On sites I absolutely have to support and can't just throw money add, I whitelist on adblock. Youtubers though usually eventually get apo box or something, that I can just post some funky coloured Australian money to.

 

[alj]

For me, notscript, blocking known add servers and add block addons are not about stopping content creators getting paid for me they are about security. If a site signs up with an ad network there is no way they can know if there malicious code in the adverts, cross site scripting is one of the biggest security problems on the internet and i am just not going to take that chance. I want to support the creators that is why i subscribe to the publishers club.

EDIT

Basic HTML adverts with no scripts are fine as are logos of sponsors links to sponsors sites, short adverts at the start of the video and so on.

In line adds in text that take up 1/2 of the screen, video adds, flash adds and adds with javascript are not ok. What is also not ok its dressing up your add as a download button or a log in button or as someone else mentioned a skip add button.

Possibly an idea would be a list of add networks that don't have bad adverts ( see above ) and then having an option in add block to whit list the networks would be an idea, however this is still a security concern as we don't know how long the network will stay with the " good " list.

The techdirt article on this linked further up is spot on

https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20100306/1649198451.shtml

EDIT 2 ( not regarding this site )

A system where we could subscribe to a YouTube channel ( a paid subscription not what we have now) where you pay say £5 a year and you get no adds on the videos and a few extra cool things would also be an idea or possibly access to higher res html5 video 2k and 4k as that was one of the main points on my for list when choosing to subscribe to the escapist .

 

[Legion]

*snipped for space*

A very interesting read, and hopefully people will start to be a bit more sympathetic as to why advertising is necessary. After all, it's not as though The Escapist (or any website for that matter) would want advertisements on their site if they weren't needed. I'm sure given the choice the staff would much rather the site was able to be kept as clean as it is for them and the Pub Club members.

I am not sure how viable it would be, but has the concept of a donation option been considered? The Pubclub does work in that way in some regards, but a lump sum probably seems more to a lot of people than a small donation might, even if the former works out as being cheaper in the long run.

I am also not aware of how much the advertisement for Pubclub is shown to regular users, but perhaps an advert showing off the positives of having it might encourage more people to join it.

While I completely get the reasoning behind it, the fact that ad free viewing is the main reason given for joining might actually put some people off, as it would seem like annoying advertisements are done in order to get people to buy it. Obviously this isn't the case, but even from an outsiders perspective, when I see people say "Don't like adverts? Get the publishers club" I can see why some people might think that way.

 

[loa]

The second I saw a 300 second ad on a livestream was the second I knew this shit has to stop and this was after I have put up with years of ads and watched them slowly take over youtube videos and then every other kind of video too (what a joyful day that was) and literally creep over my entire screen.
I'm sorry you're caught up in this but I can't support this model so it grows even larger.

Thanks for correctly identifying marketing companies as the shitheads who got you into this though.
I feel if it remained at just banners that make no sound including videos (no unskipable 30 second ad) we would all have a lot less trouble now but it just keeps growing and growing and taking and taking.

 

[atrevelyan]

With over 500 messages I think my voice will be lost in the noise. However if this proves to be an interesting feedback exercise for the escapist; I would like to throw in my 2 pence...

I do not block any content because it's an Ad, nor do I use noScript. I do however, block based on content type. i.e. No Flash, Videos, Sounds, Pop-ups/unders. I would be surprised if such things didn't annoy Escapist staff as much as it annoys its public.

That leaves all the image (including ani-gifs for the time being) and text/html banners visible.

I have in the past even clicked on ads for things that really interested me. Unfortunately such Ads are extremely rare.

e.g. Just because I went on holiday to some island does not mean, on returning, that I need to see Ads for more holidays to the same island; or even more holiday Ads to be honest. Not mention the sheer eerie-ness of seeing banners for an island one has just visited.

I fully agree with everything Jim said. I want to support content creators, I do not block Ads (just for being an Ad) but I will continue to block obtrusive content, that gets in the way of enjoy your great site.

Please avoid Flash (and any HTML5 equivalent), video and *sound* ads, and I am sure those who do use adblock will more freely turn it off for their favourite sites, such as the escapist.

Going back to this thread, I'm not going to have the time to read every post, but this topic is clearly important to the escapist community. Thank you for this opportunity.

 

[J0057Mith]

Yes, I should have made more mention of the fact (rather than just a still image) that The Escapist has a reasonable ad-free subscription service. This is also a really good way to support the site if you have some spare dubloons and want the ads gone.

Also, thanks so much for the frank and civil response thus far!

The still image was a great reminder, and I've already decided that I am taking down adblock, not just on the escapist, but channel awesome, lfgcomic, rooster teeth and all those hardworking content creators I've essentially refused payment to. I'm also going to go through my favorite content on this site, and if anything I don't like pops up in my face I'm getting a publisher's subscription.

I figure that content creators going so far as to call adblock users thieves are thinking too much of piracy. Enjoying digital content without paying for it... Only in this case there's a more reasonable excuse for people to dig their heels.
Piracy of games and movies is a practice people generally don't dig their heels on as much as adblockers do. They know just how much money they're costing a developer and are sometimes proud of it. I imagine if SimCity 5 somehow got hacked people'd JUMP at the chance to try the game without having to encourage and reward EA with their money. But in general, "piracy's bad.. m'kay". But! When you try to use the same argument against adblockers, and point out these aren't billion dollar AAA corporations whose profit margins can be forgotten, they will argue back about the severity of ads. And that's personal taste, but in general understandable. Still, I can't claim ignorance (anymore). So here's to Jim and everyone on the Escapist getting their due for their hard work!

 

[Yuuki]

Seeing how Kross is posting here I have a couple of questions directly to him in relation to this topic.

I have seen in the past sites have via some technical wizardry made it so that anyone running Adblock would not be able to access the site at all.
Has the Escapist thought about doing that in order to force everyone to comply with not using Adblockers?

Oh, Escapist could definitely do that.

...if they wanted to drive away 30-40% of their user base and literally DESTROY their site views by 50% or higher. This is a news site and a big chunk of views come from non-regulars.

Any site which forcibly tells people "disable adblock now!" will make the people in turn say "haha, fuck that" and simply click the back button.

 

[Antsh]

Is revenue generated by having the ads onscreen or does a user need to click the ad?

Also, who would watch watch five minutes of your video if they hated you just to flame? Or take the time and money to send you a 'cheap, shitty' Predator mask to match your, allegedly, shitty show? Man, I don't have time to dedicated that much effort to something I hate.

Anywho, I figure I get enough enjoyment out of this site and the content creators that I've whitelisted it.

Thank god for you.

 

[Playful Pony]

The Escapist subcription service is great. No ads and better video quality is just down my alley, and I would consider it a very reasonable price too.

 

[Spankable]

I use AD blocker, i put it on 2 years ago as i was tired of some of the evasive ad's, ie high volume, multiple pop up's, scams, ect. I still saw Ad's on the escapist so I assumed it didn't affect you, sorry, so i knocked it of after a minute of the video & reloaded. I then got jim speaking with a tetley's tea Ad at 3x the volume of Jim on a 10's loop on a sub screen. I had to close the video to find it.

I'll see if I can live without it a while, at least till I can work out how to white list some sites

Sorry for all the stealing I had been doing, I' try to find a way to correct it going forward.



P.S. the Escapist used to have AD's at the beginning of it's shows, movie trailers ect. I quite liked them, they seemed targeted for gamers so often where for stuff I was interested in. I defo bought/ whet to watch stuff based on them, so maybe its worth bringing back, some may scroll through, that seems a better way

P.S.S. Hear that Jim, tetley's can out shout you 3:1, hang your head in shame. Thank GOD! for a good brew

 

[x EvilErmine x]

I use ad block all the time and I love it, I'm not being funny but i don't want to be bombarded with advertisements for shit that i don't need, want or care about. I understand the need of advertising and how it creates revenue but when it's too blatant and forced then I find ads have the exact opposite effect, the more I see the advert the more determined it makes me no want to support that company/product.

That being said though, I'd like to thank Jim for making a well balanced and above all non judgmental video on the subject. So because you argued your point well and asked nicely Jim, just for you the escapist is now white-listed.

 

[ACman]

Discussion of adblockers on this comment thread need to contribute to the discussion of or the purpose of adblockers. Keep in mind, saying anything about the use of adblockers or the advocacy of that use without contribution to the discussion will involve health meter ramifications.

For the sake of expediency, keep in mind that everyone's definition of what is and isn't tolerable will be different. We implore you that if you feel any wrath in this thread is undeserved, use the Contact Form [http://www.escapistmagazine.com/contact/subject/forums] to appeal. Fair warning, any discussion of adblocking is treading dangerous waters. -Mod

Right. Well I will say this.

Just turned ADblock off because fair enough. I previously have whitelisted the escapist for this reason and I'm using a new computer and hadn't reinstated the whitelist for the escapist.

Holy fuck have the ads here gotten sooooooooooooo much worse.

Constant minivideo ads that run umuted for every single page that I open. Since I open multiple tabs off the front page and gradually run through them this ends up being a symphony of dischordant drival bombarding me with bullshit that I will never buy.

You can keep your whitelist. I'll watch the Escapist's videos on Youtube a week late. At least Google know how to be responsible with their ads (ie silent or only before the video).

Edit And the thumbnailed clickbait "Sponsored ads by Taboola"? Kinda gross.

 

[Lieju]

I have never used adblock, but it has led to me avoiding some sites since the ads were that bad. (NSFW, automated videos with sound, ads obstructing content in some other way)

Which was basically a lose/lose situation for everyone.

 

[Gridlock]

I think Adds are something that NEEDS to be balanced in order to work.
I don´t mind watching a 15 second add at the beginning of a 10 to 20 minuet long video, it annoying but i can live with it as long as its just this once and doesn´t repeat if i press replay.
I DO however mind watching set add for a video that AT BEST is 1 maybe 2 minuet long that´s just irritating as hell and really put me in a bad mood, where i wish i could just block the add and skip straight to the content.
Same thing with videos that are CONSTANTLY interrupted by adds (which is one of the reason i rarely watch TV, one can only go so far with a 30 minuet show being extended to 1 hour because of adds, before getting ANNOYED as hell)
Pop-up windows are also something that is REALLY annoying, you click on something that suddenly spawns 3 to 4 pop-up windows and those are just the ones firefox didn´t block.


The kind of adds i also don´t mind is the ones that run in the side of the screen in a little box. If its a video its mute and if a picture its just there, either way i can completely ignore it and it doesn´t interfere in anyway shape or form with the video i watch.

In short i don´t mind people earning money through Adds as long as those adds aren´t intrusive and ruins the experience.

 

[Azuaron]

Alright, Jim. For you, I will turn off Adblock on the Escapist.

However.

Flashblock will continue to be run. I have no problem watching what are essentially commercials before the show I'm trying to watch or seeing banner advertisements (even if they've gotten a little creepy... Amazon, I just bought that camera why are you advertising it to me? I already have it...) I even actually like the ads that show up as a kind of border around video popups; it's like a strange piece of corporate art, and they're usually for videogames (which I appreciate around here).

But I won't tolerate Flash banners that break out of their pane chasing my mouse, screaming BUY ME BUY ME at maximum volume. I won't. If the choice was down to visiting the Escapist with Flash ads and never again visiting the Escapist, I would remove the Escapist from my RSS reader. I'd be sad about it, but that's what would happen.

So let's work out a compromise: I won't Adblock, you won't Flash me. I mean, I guess I've already done that, but the more Flash ads you replace with something reasonable the more ads I'll see (the more money you'll get).

And while we're here, the whole "The first two rules of the Escapist is you don't talk about Adblock" is not helping anything. I mean, Jim, come on man, when has "squash all discussion" been better than discussion? I seriously doubt there are many Escapist readers who don't know how to block ads if they so choose, and making something forbidden always makes it more appealing.

 

[T3hSource]

Thankfully my region hasn't been researched too much by marketers so ads aren't predominant and intrusive. I see them, but that's it, no sound, no flickering, nos NSFW bullshit and the like. And thank god I don't have ads playing during videos, weather be it blip, Escapist or YouTube.

 

[EPICGunner]

Jim
I would like you to know that I use ad-block not to deprive you or anyone of income, I use ad-block because I live with three other family members who also use the internet and download a lot of crap and we have a data limit of 110gig. So for me using ad-block software is basically my way of minimizing the amount of bandwidth that I use when watching videos or surfing the net.
If I was paying for the Internet I would probably have my ad-block turned off, unfortunately that is not the case and I am genuinely sorry that by having the ad-block on I am depriving you of ad revenue.