Jimquisition: Why The PS4 Is Kicking Xbox One's Arse

Nimzabaat

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Caiphus said:
Nimzabaat said:
This is the last place one should look for informed reporting :)
As opposed to you, who saw one unsourced forum post and immediately went "Oh well! Guess Jim must have been wrong then. What a hack."
Nimzabaat said:
OT: So the PS4 barely outsold the Xbox One in february and it's being called a win? With PS4 available in 53 markets and Xbox One available in 13 and Sony only barely outsold them? With MS actually making more money in Feb because the Xbox costs more? That actually looks really bad for Sony. It'll be very interesting to see what happens when PS4 and Xbox have the same availability.

http://time.com/#27049/the-playstation-4-won-february-but-by-a-lot-less-than-it-did-in-january/

http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2454972,00.asp

EDIT: Okay ninja'd. But that's piss poor garm-jurnalizm if you ask me. Sony is beating MS because they're available in 40 more markets. So even if MS just doubles the amount of markets they sell to, they win, hands down. Now that's something to think about.
Yeah that was pretty much the first thing I put into this post Facts. Weird eh?
 

Caiphus

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Mar 31, 2010
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Nimzabaat said:
Fine, the fact remains that my and Ed130's posts immediately below the one you quoted show that the PS4 actually sold in the region of double the Xbox One during February. Both of your articles use NPD figures, as did Tomwiley's post. Those figures only cover America and (possibly) Canada.

So I don't really take an issue with you being incorrect. Calling Jim a shill, or a "piss poor garm jurnalist" when you haven't actually fully researched the matter, though? Yeah. Facts.
 

WeepingAngels

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Kameburger said:
I'm currently living in Japan and literally were it not for the fact that I work in the Gaming industry, I probably wouldn't know the Xbox one was even out. Aside from the occasional article in Famitsu (the more popular Japanese gaming magazine), there are no advertisements, no signs in stores, no signs for pre-orders, no upcoming titles. Sony even released PS4 late here despite Japan being its "domestic" market. I live in a country where games are literally everywhere, and yet the Xbox one doesn't exist. I've had the occasional conversation about Titan Fall at work, but everyone agrees that they really want to play it but not enough to find an Xbox.
I've read that the PS4 isn't selling well in Japan either.

Apparently even the Wii U had a better launch.

http://wiiudaily.com/2014/03/wii-u-ps4-japan-launch-sales/

First 3 Weeks, Wii U = 557,901

First 3 Weeks, PS4 = 410,083

I don't think I would be bragging about how well the PS4 is doing in Japan.
 

Kameburger

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WeepingAngels said:
I've read that the PS4 isn't selling well in Japan either.
Yeah but that's to be expected. I think Japan is a bit more used to phasing out its old systems, and having a gradual transition from one gen to the next. You see a lot more cases in Japan of games selling systems in comparison to the US. Monster Hunter for the PSP, Blue dragon for Xbox 360, Hatsune Miku for the Vita, Monster Hunter again for the 3DS. Once the games start rolling in from the Japanese developers sales will probably level out a bit. February is also a pretty harsh release time for things like games in Japan. Schools start up in April, the Financial year starts in April, and while February is still a break for school kids, its the break where most parents are kicking their kids to hit the books and not splurge on Video games. I would say around summer it should probably pick up a bit more. People in Japan usually get a half year bonus around June, and when it starts to heat up people are gonna want to stay inside.

WeepingAngels said:
I've read that the PS4 isn't selling well in Japan either.

Apparently even the Wii U had a better launch.

http://wiiudaily.com/2014/03/wii-u-ps4-japan-launch-sales/

First 3 Weeks, Wii U = 557,901

First 3 Weeks, PS4 = 410,083

I don't think I would be bragging about how well the PS4 is doing in Japan.
Sorry I should have waited for you to finish editing your post. While your point is valid, I think the initial launch has not been and isn't Sony's game. Only PS2 was able to launch very strong, and considering that even in home consoles digital distribution along with revenue streams more focused on DLC rather then one off package purchases like they have been in the past, the general trend has shown that smaller amounts of high paying users account for a lot more of the total revenue. This means that a relatively slow launch in one country means almost literally nothing in today's market.

As for your last comment... for christ sake... who's bragging? I was merely remarking on the surprisingly small presence of Xbox in Japan. But why would you choose that particular word order? Did my somewhat optimistic lean toward Sony bother you so much that you had to choose your words carefully to make your point sound as stuck up as possible?
 

TaintedSaint

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Aardvaarkman said:
thespyisdead said:
after all the drm and shit MS tried to push on the xbone, i am actually happy the system is failing! and this is coming from someone who used to swear by Xbox360
The Xbone is lagging slightly behind the PS4 in sales. I'd hardly call that "failing."

It's not like the market can't have more than one successful platform. For one to succeed, the other doesn't have to fail. Last generation, all three major consoles were successful. I think the only likely failure this time around will be Nintendo.
PS4 is out selling xbone 2 to 1 at the moment that is not slight in anyway shape or form.
 

Xyebane

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Feb 28, 2009
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Olas said:
You're joking right? Jim is the lord of all things true and righteous, his word is objective scientific truth by the very nature of it coming from Jim Sterling. Perhaps in the future you could be more respectful and appreciative of what Jim does for us.
Science ain't about your pseudo-religious idol worshiping. It's time to school you about how wrong Mr. Stirling is.

"Right now though, the Playstation 4 is killing it on the console scene and it deserves to come out on top as a result. That's just well a scientific fact."

While current sales trends do lend support that the PS4 is outselling the Xbone, the term 'killing it' lacks any quantification and further more is not previously or else where defined. Additionally, it cannot be used in a literal form as neither console is alive and capable of dying nor capable of killing anything directly (unless there is some fault which causes fires or some such that I have never heard of, which should probably be extrapolated upon if true). Thus this statement conveys no information to the viewer about how much the Playstation 4 is out competing the Xbone, only that it is. Very unscientific Jim. Furthermore the statement it deserves to come out on top is a value judgement and statement of opinion. The very language used prevents it from being a scientific fact. If you were to be generous to Mr. Stirling, and were to replace "deserves" with "will" or "has a high probability", both of these terms as well as Mr. Stirlings statement overall (not to take him out of context) imply causality. There is simply no evidence to suggest causality in anything Mr. Stirling has stated in the video.

To demonstrate causality, the best way would be to formalize the hypothesis and perform an experiment. In such a scenario, the hypothesis that supporting Indy developers and Indy content leads to successful console platforms seems appropriate given the context of the rest of the clip. A simple experiment would be to change the Indy game policies of Xbone, PS4, Wii U and Steam and measure how they impact sales. If PS4 strategy of picking only the best Indy games results in a significant increase in all consoles sales vs other strategies, than indeed we have scientifically demonstrated that Mr. Stirling's opinion was correct. However this hasn't been done. Additionally, if we do not observe significant results for all consoles, then it is unlikely that this is the determining factor for a game consoles success. Additionally, if we see a significant increase, but not a complete reversal of Xbone and PS4 sales data when their Indy developer policies are reversed, we can conclude that while a contributing factor, it is not the sole factor for a consoles success. This approach could be applied further, by changing MS and Sonys entire or partial business strategy (which ever you argue is most significant) in a similar method as above.

However such an experiment is highly unlikely to happen as we can't control companies policies for experimentation. A more plausible way to explore this statement would be to look at sales data and perform some statistical analysis to find correlations. For example, we could see if number of Indy titles available correlates with console sales or if number of Indy sales correlates with console sales. In this regard however, it is important to remember that correlation does not imply causality. An equally plausible explanation for such correlations is that the more popular a console is the more games are sold on it, including indy games. Therefore, let me restate that correlation does NOT imply causality. Even if such information was available (and I'm sure that MS and Sony both do look at such data) it cannot be stated as a scientific fact using such correlations as evidence.

There you go. Mr. Stirling has just demonstrated how wrong he can be with such a lingual faux pas ironically in an episode where he spends the end continuously repeating how he is right.

Sorry Mr. Stirling, but you are WRONG. (Although your opinion throughout the rest of the clip maybe correct).
 

Sarge034

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Jimothy Sterling said:
But, but, but... I agree with you. I think you are right, you say I'm wrong, but you say you are right.


OT- I think Sony is the mute leading the blind so to speak. All of the systems have substantial drawbacks but the PS4 is just less shit at the moment. Hopefully MS does pull it's head out of its' ass because, admittedly, I do have a biased preference for the Xbox.
 

Willstown

Borderline Crazy Cat Man
Nov 20, 2013
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Jim, the new lightning rig is giving you a halo like glow of inner radiance. That.. or it's a little too bright. I like to think the former.
 

Deathlyphil

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DragonDai said:
Deathlyphil said:
BL-4CT said:
You do realise just how difficult backwards compatibility between completely different hardware is right? The only way to get it to function properly is to have previous gen hardware in the same box. That means buying two consoles in one, and bumping up the price quite a bit.
I generally just lurk, but I had to comment on this. And all I can say is PC! My PC with all new parts when it was bought 2 years ago runs games that are just now coming out at max settings at 1080p resolution with 60+ FPS, while also playing games from 1995 with little to no hassle (usually no hassle, as in, I install them, they work), and games even older than that with some to little hassle (dosbox is about as "hassle-full" as it gets and really, once you've take the 10-30 mins to figure out how it works the first time you use it, it's never a hassle after that).

So yeah. The only reason the consoles don't have backwards compatibility is because the people making the consoles don't want you to have it. It's as simple as that.
It's definitely not as simple as that.

PCs have been running the same processor type (x86) since the early 90s, possibly before. We had the 186 through to the 486, then Pentium 1 (586), and even the latest Pentiums (and AMD chips) are still using the same core architecture. That, plus a few emulators for software that isn't used any more (DOSbox mainly) is why you can play older PC games on your newer PC.

Consoles, on the other hand, have a tendency to use their own chips, or what ever is cheapest/fastest/different enough to make them stand out. It is not as simple as writing a few lines of code, or configuring a few settings. Games will be expecting chipset features that either don't exist, or have changed their function over the years.

Think of it this way. In order to emulate a PS3 game on a PS4, it would be the equivalent of trying to give a speech in English that was written in Ancient Sumerian on the fly, without loosing any of the original meaning and intent of the speech. Oh, and you aren't allowed to pause and look up things, and the first time you saw this speech was just before you started. It has to be a seamless translation. Think you can handle that?

~tl;dr~

It's a hardware issue, not a software issue. Change all the settings you wish, but it won't make a difference.
 

Deadcyde

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Nice wind down there; we have to buy you stuff to get noticed do we Jim....

Also, on topic, aren't we onto x64 chips now?
 

MeChaNiZ3D

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Toadfish1 said:
MeChaNiZ3D said:
Well they can be, but would you buy a PS4 for an indie game? Any available now?
Well evidently people are, considering its the fastest selling console of all time.
Did I miss the part where you showed me how much of that can be attributed to indie games, or was it absent?
 

MeChaNiZ3D

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Charcharo said:
MeChaNiZ3D said:
Charcharo said:
I still dont understand why indi games cant be system sellers...
Well they can be, but would you buy a PS4 for an indie game? Any available now?

(also, Jim perhaps that lighting's a bit too luminuous)
No. But not for AAA games either. Games cant make me switch platform :p ...
Basically the PS4 must offer backwards compatibility for all PS games ever made, allow modding and be even cheaper. Honestly, currently the best, cheapest and least time consuming platform is the PC...
Fair enough. Hell, the only reason I'm looking at buying a PS4 eventually is because Armored Core isn't on PC. If it weren't for that I'd get myself a decent machine and enjoy the modding community. But I suppose that means there's a system seller for me.
 

Toadfish1

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MeChaNiZ3D said:
Toadfish1 said:
MeChaNiZ3D said:
Well they can be, but would you buy a PS4 for an indie game? Any available now?
Well evidently people are, considering its the fastest selling console of all time.
Did I miss the part where you showed me how much of that can be attributed to indie games, or was it absent?
WHat else could you attribute it to?
 

MeChaNiZ3D

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Toadfish1 said:
MeChaNiZ3D said:
Toadfish1 said:
MeChaNiZ3D said:
Well they can be, but would you buy a PS4 for an indie game? Any available now?
Well evidently people are, considering its the fastest selling console of all time.
Did I miss the part where you showed me how much of that can be attributed to indie games, or was it absent?
WHat else could you attribute it to?
...AAA games would be by large the greatest motivator, I presume.
 

Kameburger

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Apr 7, 2012
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One thing I will point out (even though I know this is gonna irk some) that consoles are not competing with the PC market. I think we like to play this game where platforms that can play the same games are competing on the same plane for the same audience, and while sometimes that is the case, in this case its just not. Sure a decent gaming PC will run a new triple game better especially when tuned properly, but lets not fool ourselves, the price point is still very different and there is a large black hole in the demographic of gamer that would play triple A games that can't or won't spend that kind of money on a PC. It's not a case of if you want to play both Titan Fall but don't want an Xbox one, is a bit like saying I don't want a Prius but I want a car that's good for the environment so I'm gonna spend 200 grand on a Tesla sports car. Of course that's not the next option. right now a PS4 costs $400, an entry level iPad costs $300, but the graphics card that's gonna help you run Titan fall by itself is most likely around $200. Even as a working adult with a decent salary, I am going to scrutinize the timing for when I can or should buy a PC and how much extra is ok to spend so that it can play games. Let's say I work in design and I generally need an industry standard mac book pro, it runs me about $1,800 dollars if I'm frugal. I am not gonna then go buy a gaming PC even if I can get it for $1000 that just doesn't make sense. I'll just pick up a console and play what I can. Sure in the scheme of things that makes me a little bit less "hardcore" but I work at a AAA Gaming publisher, and I do play games even if just for research and even still I have a huge backlog of things I want to play.
 

Deadcyde

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Kameburger said:
One thing I will point out (even though I know this is gonna irk some) that consoles are not competing with the PC market. I think we like to play this game where platforms that can play the same games are competing on the same plane for the same audience, and while sometimes that is the case, in this case its just not. Sure a decent gaming PC will run a new triple game better especially when tuned properly, but lets not fool ourselves, the price point is still very different and there is a large black hole in the demographic of gamer that would play triple A games that can't or won't spend that kind of money on a PC. It's not a case of if you want to play both Titan Fall but don't want an Xbox one, is a bit like saying I don't want a Prius but I want a car that's good for the environment so I'm gonna spend 200 grand on a Tesla sports car. Of course that's not the next option. right now a PS4 costs $400, an entry level iPad costs $300, but the graphics card that's gonna help you run Titan fall by itself is most likely around $200. Even as a working adult with a decent salary, I am going to scrutinize the timing for when I can or should buy a PC and how much extra is ok to spend so that it can play games. Let's say I work in design and I generally need an industry standard mac book pro, it runs me about $1,800 dollars if I'm frugal. I am not gonna then go buy a gaming PC even if I can get it for $1000 that just doesn't make sense. I'll just pick up a console and play what I can. Sure in the scheme of things that makes me a little bit less "hardcore" but I work at a AAA Gaming publisher, and I do play games even if just for research and even still I have a huge backlog of things I want to play.
That comes back to how consoles were a plug and play item and that these days they have woefully lost sight of that. An issue they -all- need to fix.
 

Deathlyphil

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Deadcyde said:
Nice wind down there; we have to buy you stuff to get noticed do we Jim....

Also, on topic, aren't we onto x64 chips now?
Yes we are, but they are still based on the i86 architecture.
 

Merklyn236

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I think I've been excited about every new console generation except this one. Both MS and Sony killing backward compatibility was a deal-breaker for me (more so from MS since I have a 360). I'm likely going to be standing pat (though my PC will undoubtedly get an upgrade) for a while.

All that being said, I have to admit that Sony has done more to try to whispering to me that the grass may yet get greener on the other side than MS has. I think Microsoft got too complacent since they did end up being the leader in the previous generation, but maybe that's me. The higher price, forcing the Kinect, the always online DRM...how many missteps can you make right out of the gate?