Killing bugs - is it wrong?
- Thread starter MiracleOfSound
- Start date
I don't mind killing bugs, but I don't torture them. I hate bugs (because of an incident when I was younger), so I feel like it's okay to kill them if they're around me, but I don't torture them.
[long post]
[HEADING=3]Prelude:[/HEADING]
WOW! This is gonna be a long one. Now this thread's old, and there seems to be a general consensus, so instead of "just putting in my two cents," I'm going to try and say something developed and thoughtful. This is an attempt, mind you. Here it goes.
[HEADING=3]Some differing opinions I found interesting:[/HEADING]
The general consensus I mentioned above is that killing bugs is ok as long as they're annoying and you don't make them suffer. The other prominent opinions I can discern are: "Killing anything is just wrong," "Bugs are too important ecologically to kill," and "Bugs are disgusting blights on the world that should be murdered with extreme prejudice." I think bugs are below moral consideration, like a rock or a bit of bread, and killing them doesn't hurt the ecosystem.
First, the two primary reasons killing bugs could be wrong:
1. It damages the ecosystem or
2. It violates the intrinsic rights of the bugs.
And I'll address these in order.
1.Obviously, for reasons stated elsewhere, killing a few bugs won't hurt the whole system. You could do some damage by killing them en masse, but for the purposes of the topic, we're only talking about the more personal "stomping a roach" kind of killing. Insects have such a stupidly high birth rate that anyone trying to take them down with, say, a roll of newspaper would be hard pressed to even dent their population. Therefore, "reason 1" is invalid.
2.On to the more complex reason, we have to ask two questions: "Do bugs have rights?" and "If so, what is the extent of those rights?" Some argue that all living things have rights, and the same ones to boot, but I find that tremendously impractical and incongruous. This leads us to decide what traits give individuals their specific rights.
This investigation, however, has led me in a bunch of circles, leading nowhere. A beating heart? The ability to feel? Most creatures share this, and to give them all rights would be impractical. The (higher thought process resulting in) desire to have the rights? That implies that any desire becomes a right. I can't put it down. It seems to me that the difference between the minds of animals and insects aren't that different. It leads me to believe that the assertion of "inalienable rights" is more of an organizational convenience for self-interested humans than a result of empirical observation.
But that is a whole other argument.
The way I see it, either bugs have the same basic rights as you or me and everything that implies (e.g. info-mercials about feeding starving aphids in New Guinea, bug Geneva convention, etc.), or they have no rights and neither do animals (I'd sort of like to elaborate, but it's too complicated for this post). I lean towards the latter position for practicality's sake. This turns the idea that bugs are "suffering" into a bit of a pathetic fallacy, like saying your cereal is suffering when you eat it. For reasons I've excluded, insects don't matter enough to respond to their instinctual resistance to death. They're just... bugs.
Well, I'd say that was a clusterfuck. I didn't prove anything, did I? Might have fooled you with all that writing though. Reason 2 remains ambiguous. On a side note, while it may or may not be intrinsically "wrong," torturing bugs could certainly indicate more serious underlying problems with the torturer. Like an obsessive need for control, or an unhealthy propensity towards violence. The act itself shouldn't so much be discouraged as the problem that causes it should be treated until the symptom is no longer exhibited.
[HEADING=1]TLDNR: Here's a quick summary of my opinions.[/HEADING]
Killing bugs doesn't hurt the environment and while the morality of it is ambiguous, I'd say a bug's right to life should be the same as any sentient, non-human organism, including animals.
[HEADING=3]In other news[/HEADING]
It's my favorite from Dimmu Borgir.
...[/long, LONG post]
[HEADING=3]Prelude:[/HEADING]
WOW! This is gonna be a long one. Now this thread's old, and there seems to be a general consensus, so instead of "just putting in my two cents," I'm going to try and say something developed and thoughtful. This is an attempt, mind you. Here it goes.
[HEADING=3]Some differing opinions I found interesting:[/HEADING]
RAMBO22 said:
mento 2425 said:
Valkyrie101 said:
interspark said:
[HEADING=3]Actual Content[/HEADING]Dexiro said:They're entirely instinctive. Meaning they don't feel pain, or any emotions.
There's nothing wrong with killing them, just don't go out of your way to kill tons of them because there's an eco system to be kept
The general consensus I mentioned above is that killing bugs is ok as long as they're annoying and you don't make them suffer. The other prominent opinions I can discern are: "Killing anything is just wrong," "Bugs are too important ecologically to kill," and "Bugs are disgusting blights on the world that should be murdered with extreme prejudice." I think bugs are below moral consideration, like a rock or a bit of bread, and killing them doesn't hurt the ecosystem.
First, the two primary reasons killing bugs could be wrong:
1. It damages the ecosystem or
2. It violates the intrinsic rights of the bugs.
And I'll address these in order.
1.Obviously, for reasons stated elsewhere, killing a few bugs won't hurt the whole system. You could do some damage by killing them en masse, but for the purposes of the topic, we're only talking about the more personal "stomping a roach" kind of killing. Insects have such a stupidly high birth rate that anyone trying to take them down with, say, a roll of newspaper would be hard pressed to even dent their population. Therefore, "reason 1" is invalid.
2.On to the more complex reason, we have to ask two questions: "Do bugs have rights?" and "If so, what is the extent of those rights?" Some argue that all living things have rights, and the same ones to boot, but I find that tremendously impractical and incongruous. This leads us to decide what traits give individuals their specific rights.
This investigation, however, has led me in a bunch of circles, leading nowhere. A beating heart? The ability to feel? Most creatures share this, and to give them all rights would be impractical. The (higher thought process resulting in) desire to have the rights? That implies that any desire becomes a right. I can't put it down. It seems to me that the difference between the minds of animals and insects aren't that different. It leads me to believe that the assertion of "inalienable rights" is more of an organizational convenience for self-interested humans than a result of empirical observation.
But that is a whole other argument.
The way I see it, either bugs have the same basic rights as you or me and everything that implies (e.g. info-mercials about feeding starving aphids in New Guinea, bug Geneva convention, etc.), or they have no rights and neither do animals (I'd sort of like to elaborate, but it's too complicated for this post). I lean towards the latter position for practicality's sake. This turns the idea that bugs are "suffering" into a bit of a pathetic fallacy, like saying your cereal is suffering when you eat it. For reasons I've excluded, insects don't matter enough to respond to their instinctual resistance to death. They're just... bugs.
Well, I'd say that was a clusterfuck. I didn't prove anything, did I? Might have fooled you with all that writing though. Reason 2 remains ambiguous. On a side note, while it may or may not be intrinsically "wrong," torturing bugs could certainly indicate more serious underlying problems with the torturer. Like an obsessive need for control, or an unhealthy propensity towards violence. The act itself shouldn't so much be discouraged as the problem that causes it should be treated until the symptom is no longer exhibited.
[HEADING=1]TLDNR: Here's a quick summary of my opinions.[/HEADING]
Killing bugs doesn't hurt the environment and while the morality of it is ambiguous, I'd say a bug's right to life should be the same as any sentient, non-human organism, including animals.
[HEADING=3]In other news[/HEADING]
I love that songMoncaco said:
It's my favorite from Dimmu Borgir....[/long, LONG post]
Do you feel it is wrong to kill insects/other bugs?
Nope, then again I have helped my friend slaughter a cow and it didn't bug me.
Under what circumstances do you think it is morally acceptable?
Any. Why? Because it's a bug, there are like a billion of them.
Do you feel a pang of guilt for crushing a bug that wasn't harming you in any way?
Nope, they annoy me and make my house look messy, I also kill them if they are in my garden.
Nope, then again I have helped my friend slaughter a cow and it didn't bug me.
Under what circumstances do you think it is morally acceptable?
Any. Why? Because it's a bug, there are like a billion of them.
Do you feel a pang of guilt for crushing a bug that wasn't harming you in any way?
Nope, they annoy me and make my house look messy, I also kill them if they are in my garden.
I don't get why you're saying bugs have the same rights as any other animals. It seems pretty widely accepted that they don't have the nervous components to feel pain or any type of emotion; they're non-sentient and it seems strange that you've put them on the same pedestal as sentient lifeforms. Just to be clear, most other animals are sentient that i know of, harming them is always wrong.summerof2010 said:
Really it's no different than killing a plant, they're living and non-sentient too.
I'm not saying anyone should fully be in the right to go around killing massive amounts of bugs purely because they can. That'd be creepy, and like i said before they're important to the eco system.
Maybe it's sort of a taboo subject. If a human was non-sentient then it gets kind of complicated. It feels weird bringing that up already so i won't delve on it xD
arggh, why did you resurrect this thread!, IT FILLS ME WITH RAG!JEBWrench said:
Of course you shouldn't kill Spiders or Dragonflies! and most insects, flies and mosquito's are vermin.
And so are Daddy Long Legs, since they will eat other spiders.
Speaking of cats, I have a mouse problem and the cats from the neighbourhood are coming into my house to hunt them, this is a transcription from the other day.
Sush "fuck me thats a persian!, if I catch it I'm keeping him!"
Pete "why?"
Sush "BECAUSE ITS A FUCKING PERSIAN!"
Sneaky stealth cat got away, I'LL GET YOU NEXT TIME SNEAKY STEALTH CAT!
Depends on the bug, really. I mean, I slaughter wasps and ants with a vengeance, but I leave dragonflies, spiders, and bumblebees alone.
no, not really, if your killing a entire ant pile just for the sake of killing (Protecting your lawn, is not "for the sake of killing"), then, yeah, its 'prolly wrong
What if, but some random happenstance, the bug you kill happens to be one of the last remaining living specimins of a highly endangered species? Then killing it really WOULD be putting towards making it extinct!mad825 said:
More seriously and to answer OP's question, I have no problem killing insects IF they attack or annoy me. If it's just sitting there, on a wall, not coming near me... I'll usually leave it be. Live and let live and all...
i HATE spiders. so in my opinion: GO CRAZY!
why couldnt i have a fear of dinosaurs? nope it had to be spiders.
why couldnt i have a fear of dinosaurs? nope it had to be spiders.
LMAOMoncaco said:The nerve of some people!ColdStorage said:
You know, my ex used to fill me with rag... Never a pleasant experience.
What sort of rag?
Not really. You kill them all the time without meaning to or realising it. I went out for a run yesterday and killed at least 3 small flying insects: one went on my forehead and somehow died, one went in my mouth and got swallowed by accident (pretty gross), and one got in my eye so I had to crush it with my eylids and then it would get disposed of the same way as dirt would.
The only bugs, in and around my house, that I try to avoid killing are spiders. Spiders creep the shit out of me, and I really don't like them. However, the more of them I have around my house the even fewer 'pest' insects I have.
So I grit my teeth and shoo them away whenever I cross their path.
So I grit my teeth and shoo them away whenever I cross their path.
I absolutely hate flying insects. The only time one has ever done anything useful for me is a few years ago when a mosquito flew past my ear at around 2am, which instantly woke me up and triggered my usual "There's-a-mosquito-buzzing-around-my-ear" reaction which consists of swatting the crap out of whichever ear it buzzed past.
I couldn't get back to sleep, so I told my family about what happened and I got the day off.
Other than that, if it dares to invade my airspace, it gets squished.
As for the questions themselves...
Q1. No. If it comes near me, it dies.
Q2. All of them. There are a lot more where that one came from. Killing one that buzzes past me isn't going to get them any closer to extinction.
Q3. They only really piss me off if they're disrupting my current activity. They don't annoy me, I don't kill them.
I couldn't get back to sleep, so I told my family about what happened and I got the day off.
Other than that, if it dares to invade my airspace, it gets squished.
As for the questions themselves...
Q1. No. If it comes near me, it dies.
Q2. All of them. There are a lot more where that one came from. Killing one that buzzes past me isn't going to get them any closer to extinction.
Q3. They only really piss me off if they're disrupting my current activity. They don't annoy me, I don't kill them.