Level Grinding: How much is worth it?

[Soviet Heavy]

I couldn't put a number on it, but leveling in New Vegas is very satisfying. I really am not looking forward to capping out, because it might take away the fun of getting a new perk or upping my skills some more.

 

[Zhukov]

Level-grinding is an automatic strike against any game that requires it.

It's one of the reasons I generally steer clear of JRPGs.

 

[geK0]

I played runescape for a total of probably 4-5 years (on-off, not all at once)

so I guess....... 4-5 years for me anyway : \

 

[Trivun]

I hate grinding for the sake of actually reaching a specific level, and any game that makes you grind to progress is guilty of bad game design. However, if the grinding is part of something larger, then I don't mind it. For example, in FF13 right now, I'm making a special effort to complete every single Mission on Gran Pulse before I take on Orphan. In doing so, I'm fighting a lot of low-level mooks too as I walk around, but it doesn't feel as if I'm grinding. Nvertheless, I'm levelling up a lot still, and that will serve to make the final fight against Orphan so much easier. And in FFX-2, I once ended up wiping out the final boss in the space of about five seconds, literally, because of Catnip and Trigger Happy Lv. 3 - which I got from doing all the side-quests, which helped me level up without feeling like the grinding that it technically was...

 

[Fishyash]

I think it's poor design if you need to grind in order to progress in the game.

I haven't really played many RPGs, but I have never had to grind in any of them in order to complete them.

Last JRPG I played that wasn't pokemon was chrono trigger (on wii virtual console), sure I lost on a couple of fights, but I just redid them and rethought my strategy.

I've also never played an RPG with "unfair bonus bosses" that seem to exist in some games, so maybe I am lucky in that part.

In Nocturne, there is usually a hard way to beat a boss and an easy/less hard way. The game expects you to get crushed and learn from your death as to what you need to beat the boss. It isn't bad design, the game just expects you to do your homework.

What I meant by poor design was that grinding is meant to be an easy way out, instead of a must-have. Nocturne doesn't seem like a game where you have to grind in order to win, but if you consider the encounter too hard, but doable, grinding can help.

Normally tough enemies are scaled in a way that without grinding they are stronger than you, that means you need to use your superior strategy and use of items. Dying a lot if you don't know the strategy seems to be a given if you're not willing to grind.

Grinding should be a convenience (to make a tough fight/boss easier), not a necessity (you need to grind in order to beat a tough fight/boss). It's just a show of poor scaling and general design.

 

[wooty]

I always grind upto at least the same level as the next big boss, maybe more if its troublesome.

 

[Vegosiux]

I'll grind as long as it's fun. In Disgaea for example, it's always fun to try and get a symbol combo going even when it looks impossible (Curse you, No Color Change symbols!).

Bringing twenty bear asses to some random dude while only 1% of the bears actually have an ass is just retarded, however.

 

[Vivi22]

Unless I find the game in general really, really, really fun, I'll barely grind at all, just enough to squeak by.

This is pretty much what I do. A game has to either be really damn good, or have a damn good battle system for me to tolerate grinding at all. If it becomes necessary to grind for 1 or more hours in order to progress then the developer didn't do their job right. I tend not to like leveling systems at all now specifically because of grinding, unless they're implemented as they are in games like Dark Souls; where leveling can make a difference, but developing your own skills at playing the game is vastly more important.

 

[Skoldpadda]

It depends on the system. Take just Final Fantasy for example. I love the grinding in IX and can do it all day. I can't stand it in IV.

Another good example is Lost Odyssey. I grinded the Skill Points from items. After a couple of battles there's always someone who acquires a skill. And inbetween a mortal suddenly gets a new skill, that your immortals can then start learning. There's a constant gratification going on. You really feel constant progress.

But just raw leveling without having any input over who learns what, like in FFIV, that's just the pits.

FF3 DS was also bad to me. Jobs leveled by issuing commands and it was invisible. So I had to make sure that all my guys were doing something at all times (if only defending) and I was discouraged to breeze through the stupid easy fights. And all that time, I had no way to gauge my progress. I hated that game.

 

[Clive Howlitzer]

It isn't grinding if its fun. If it isn't fun, it is grinding and grinding sucks and I don't do it.

 

[RuralGamer]

Depends on the prize at the end. Some games I've ground for days, whereas others I'm like "nah, I'll leave now".

Edit: Take Just Cause 2 right now (so wish I'd picked it up as soon as it came out on Xbox 360/when I got my new PC now); I like grinding because hook-shotting around looking for upgrades is fun and makes a difference, so I'll tolerate it for as long as its going on.

 

[babinro]

Typically 4-5 hours in a typical RPG style game.

I only level grind these days (read in the last 10 years) if I can do so while watching a movie or tv shows.

If I'm in a situation that a game calls for grinding after I've died too many times and I can't get that distraction, I'll typically move to another game rather than do something that mind-numbingly boring.

 

[Auron225]

To me, grinding should never ever be necessary to finish the game. I dont mind grinding a little bit (as in, 1 hour) but anything more than that and there's a flaw in the game design. It should be enough to beat all the enemies you happen to come into and be capable of finishing the game like that.

 

[Bostur]

If I notice I'm grinding, I've had enough. But I have a different perspective than many other players. What some people consider grinding I just consider playing the game.

I've sometimes had the following conversation with people in MMOs:

Player: "Oh no, I need to kill this mob 1000 times"
Me: "Why do you need to do that?"
Player: "I don't know, I just do".

And I just carry on in my non-grindy way. Some people seem to search for it, and then of course they will find it no matter what game they play. Grinding is a state of mind and not a requirement in many games.

 

[LilithSlave]

As long as the story and setting is good enough to warrant it.

That is, I usually don't grind, at all. But I understand why it's done. It's done to feel strong and awesome in a world you're fond of. And it's great for those OCD folks.

Again, it's only to feel strong. In most, it's not even a must. But it can be fun if you really like to feel strong and awesome.

What I don't understand, is in MMORPGs, when grinding seems to be the entire point. jRPGs are goal oriented. You don't grind so you can grind some more and then delete your character and start over once you reach the level cap. Your purpose is to overthrow some overwhelming opponent, whether a big dangerous monster or a big dangerous, corrupt political leader. Grinding allows you to feel like you didn't just barely beat the person due to luck and strategy, but because you were totally more awesome in every way. That's all grinding is for in offline RPGs.

You can either have it easy, and feel tough. Or you can not grind, and have it hard, and require strategy, relying on yourself rather than the game mechanics saying you're good.

If I feel like grinding in an RPG, it's usually because I really want to feel tough and awesome in the face of the upcoming challenge. In MMORPGs, I hardly ever grind and instead go look for a roleplayers guild. And goof off and use emotes. Grinding in MMORPGs is not fun.

To me, grinding should never ever be necessary to finish the game.

Agreed.

If grinding is ever necessary, it means you haven't properly developed the strategy aspect of the game.

Any challenge in an RPG should be surmountable with enough strategy.