Linux Namesake Argues In Favor Of Being A Jerk
- Thread starter Earnest Cavalli
- Start date
I kind of think it's unfair for us to judge him.
He does what he does and it works for him, I mean he's worth $150 million. If any of you are worth that or more, then I'll gladly listen to your opinion on "antisocial behavior" and how you think it would hurt your multimillion dollar corporation.
He does what he does and it works for him, I mean he's worth $150 million. If any of you are worth that or more, then I'll gladly listen to your opinion on "antisocial behavior" and how you think it would hurt your multimillion dollar corporation.
One can be "non-fake" without having to be a complete asshole. Being civil and mature is more about being able to maintain a neutral ground for discourse and cooperation. Being able to resolve differences and conflicts in a calm, rational, and mature manner is not being fake; it's being an adult. Being completely unwilling to do so and trying to justify such unwillingness just being a big, overgrown baby who wants to always have his way.
I did a quick google of the whole Management by perkele style of the Finnish. That style is simply to be decisive and to get on with just doing something (not wasting time), not being a complete egotistic jackass to all around you. One can be direct, truthful, and to the point without being a douchebag. So, I don't buy the whole "It's my culture" thing. That's just a bullshit excuse.
ADDENDUM: Some of you praising Linus, if any one of you actually found yourselves in a real personal situation in which this was how people treated each other, I guarantee most of you would either leave or find yourselves coming to fisticuffs with the person. Would you really want to be in an environment in real-life in which people treated each other the same way as folks treat each other on the Internet and in online games? Think for a moment how that would turn out.
No, sorry, Linus is just wrong. He's simply being brave behind a keyboard; otherwise, he better know how to physically defend himself, because I could see him getting beat-up a lot in public for being rude, in exactly this manner, to just the wrong person. In fact, I guarantee that he probably exercises exactly the kind of "fake politeness" he claims to hate so much if he ever finds himself in a situation in which not doing so could get one physically very hurt, or even dead, but even more so where being an asshole means he won't get what he wants. Nope, sorry, I just don't buy into this kind of bullshit rationalization.
At least just admit that being an asshole to others just makes you feel more empowered. I'd be willing to believe that.
I did a quick google of the whole Management by perkele style of the Finnish. That style is simply to be decisive and to get on with just doing something (not wasting time), not being a complete egotistic jackass to all around you. One can be direct, truthful, and to the point without being a douchebag. So, I don't buy the whole "It's my culture" thing. That's just a bullshit excuse.
ADDENDUM: Some of you praising Linus, if any one of you actually found yourselves in a real personal situation in which this was how people treated each other, I guarantee most of you would either leave or find yourselves coming to fisticuffs with the person. Would you really want to be in an environment in real-life in which people treated each other the same way as folks treat each other on the Internet and in online games? Think for a moment how that would turn out.
No, sorry, Linus is just wrong. He's simply being brave behind a keyboard; otherwise, he better know how to physically defend himself, because I could see him getting beat-up a lot in public for being rude, in exactly this manner, to just the wrong person. In fact, I guarantee that he probably exercises exactly the kind of "fake politeness" he claims to hate so much if he ever finds himself in a situation in which not doing so could get one physically very hurt, or even dead, but even more so where being an asshole means he won't get what he wants. Nope, sorry, I just don't buy into this kind of bullshit rationalization.
At least just admit that being an asshole to others just makes you feel more empowered. I'd be willing to believe that.
Yeah and meanwhile in the real world if Joe Average back chats his boss and gets disciplined or in worse cases fired for gross misconduct. Its all well and good for Linus to say this because he is the boss who does have some slack to be a bit of a jerk to other companies.
There's a huge difference between being professional and polite and being nice or likeable.
I think Linus is confusing the two because he seems not to be differentiating them.
Additionally, being able to untie your emotions from an issue and respond in a cold and objective manner is a mark of maturity. Children and especially adolescents are the ones who get swept up with their emotions and let it alter their behavior.
It's generally best to work without emotions. This means maintaining an unchangingly calm and professional demeanour.
Just my two cents.
I think Linus is confusing the two because he seems not to be differentiating them.
Additionally, being able to untie your emotions from an issue and respond in a cold and objective manner is a mark of maturity. Children and especially adolescents are the ones who get swept up with their emotions and let it alter their behavior.
It's generally best to work without emotions. This means maintaining an unchangingly calm and professional demeanour.
Just my two cents.
Linus is a fucking ****. He preaches on about this, but reprimands his employees when they show any backbone against his ideas.
He's an asshole because he can be and because he's the boss.
Let me give you all a word of advice; if you're on your second week in the office shouting at your colleagues all the time and being a confrontational tit is going to get you fired, not promoted.
He's an asshole because he can be and because he's the boss.
Let me give you all a word of advice; if you're on your second week in the office shouting at your colleagues all the time and being a confrontational tit is going to get you fired, not promoted.
Depends on what you're doing. Those traits are really frowned upon when dealing with customers or advertising.Bujiraso said:
While I respect him for his contributions, I don't agree with him here...at least on the whole. While lying, backstabing and buzzwords DO bother me, taking a second to be polite very rarely does anything but help the situation. It's not that difficult to be honest and polite at the same time, and 9 times out of 10 those individuals who "refuse to sugar coat it" are just making excuses so they can be jerks. That raises workplace anxiety, slows projects down (if not breaks teams apart), makes people uncomfortable and less willing to work together, which just makes everything (including profit margins in many cases) worse.
That, and he's basically advocating being a douche by decreeing it behind some false credo of "I'm just being honest instead of hiding behind false politeness".canadamus_prime said:
Even worse, a LOT of people, even in this thread, are behind the guy 100%.
Listen people: There's a HUGE difference between being honest and direct, and being a rude, cantankerous prick.
From the sounds of things, this guy is the latter.
And it's because of people like this that the world won't get any better. If all you want to do is accept the natural order of things then you might as well sit there and let yourself starve to death. Working with other people isn't about you, it's about working.
Generally speaking the defining difference here would be whether the other party is capable of return fire.
If your abrasiveness is intimidating an otherwise capable colleague, or your professional relation is such that (s)he's afraid of repercussions if (s)he'd tell you to stick your opinion where the sun don't shine... you might want to dial it down.
And when viewed from the other perspective: 9 out of 10 cases it's better to not reply in kind when somebody is being an asshole. Chances are you'll only escalate matters, not reach a better understanding.
Also, blithely ignoring your asshole boss attempts at cowing you is much funnier.
If your abrasiveness is intimidating an otherwise capable colleague, or your professional relation is such that (s)he's afraid of repercussions if (s)he'd tell you to stick your opinion where the sun don't shine... you might want to dial it down.
And when viewed from the other perspective: 9 out of 10 cases it's better to not reply in kind when somebody is being an asshole. Chances are you'll only escalate matters, not reach a better understanding.
Also, blithely ignoring your asshole boss attempts at cowing you is much funnier.
I fully embrace undiplomatic language in the office place. I've had 1 way conversations at me, and that I've had with other people. When my boss was being a dick on purpose, I called him a dick and vice versa. For an outsider I'm sure it looks like an extremely abusive, and sometimes violent work place. But no one is singled out and when the time come, everyone knows when to buckle down and do their job quickly and efficiently and without complaint.
It is that brutal honesty and directness which keeps a lot of the office politics away and lets people actually work and function successfully in a team.
It is that brutal honesty and directness which keeps a lot of the office politics away and lets people actually work and function successfully in a team.
A proper workplace relies on politeness and professionalism and cohesion. If you can't maintain that, then your work will suffer for it, either because no one is willing to work with one another or because no one can amend other people's work due to office drama stemming from hurt feelings. It's one thing to ask people to express their true opinions, rather than fall back on insincere flattery, but having a workplace that relies solely on abrasive and unabashed feelings and unrestrained beliefs will not be able to function well.
Actually I am pretty sure he know the difference, Linus a nice guy in general, but if you do stupid mistake that you shouldn't be doing, he will call you out for what he think you are, at that very moment.Bujiraso said:
And the mistake the person made was actually quite a major one, they committed code has stable which was unstable and that simply wouldn't compile, which is a mistake so obvious even a student shouldn't make it.
And the kernel maintainer who accepted the commit, was told to stop been a doormat and start yelling a bit, has he let unstable code go through, while the person who actually submitted the code was told they were "the devil f*ck head" for daring submit obviously broken code, then the discussion how not liking Torvald way started from there.
What would you do if you called a plumber for a new toilet plumbing and he left you with a flooded basement, I am pretty sure most would yell at him like rotten fish, either in person or in his back. Torvald just prefer would just do it in his face.
Because rich people never say stupid things.cokeordie said:
Should I also not judge a drug lords because they make lots of money?
You don't need to be a genius to know treating people bad, is bad(and not just bad for business, but a bad idea in general). A person doesn't have to be nice or mean to make money. Both ways can work very well, if you have a good idea, or a product everyone wants.
Also, people aren't saying he's going to lose money by being a jerk. They're just saying he's a jerk(granted many people don't like to work with jerks or buy their products, but if they want the thing enough they'll look the other way. To a point). You can be a crappy person, and still make money. Money doesn't make you a good person.
To the topic; The guy just sounds like he's too lazy to take the time to be nice to other people. Being passive aggressive, or wearing fake smiles while planning to stab others in the back is just as bad, but we don't have to pick only one of those to.
As others have said, you can be honest without yelling, and you can tell someone the truth without being abusive.
Anyone who says other people, who've done nothing to them, aren't worth what little energy it takes to not act like a jerk to them, is just too lazy/impatient to bother not being a jerk.
This too. The guy doesn't want all people working for companies to be able to say what they want. He wants to be able to say whatever the hell he wants as the boss, while his employees have to shut up and take it.AC10 said:
Sounds like another pretentious man-child throwing a fit because someone didn't accept his bad behavior. Professionalism allows people to focus on a goal rather than let their personal biases get in the way. Otherwise, things wouldn't get done and companies wouldn't make money. No one is asking people to force themselves to like others. All you have to do is work with them and work out your frustration in your own time.
And this. Besides, I feel that rules are in place because people tend to take advantage of their freedoms in ways that harm others.kiri2tsubasa said:
I think people misinterpret what he said. IMHO, what he was saying is that if someone screws up, if they act like a dick, if they get in the way, then call them on it, and not in the pretentious "nice and professional" way, but unfiltered. It's better for everyone.
As for my two cents on the issue, politeness and professionalism are manufactured requirements, not something that's actually necessary. People get offended when someone isn't polite and professional because politeness and professionalism is what they were raised to expect from others, if they weren't, nobody would care. You can't tell people what you honestly think about them while being polite and professional, they're mutually exclusive. Telling people what they deserve to be told may be rude, but it's not being a jerk to do so, it's just being honest.
As for my two cents on the issue, politeness and professionalism are manufactured requirements, not something that's actually necessary. People get offended when someone isn't polite and professional because politeness and professionalism is what they were raised to expect from others, if they weren't, nobody would care. You can't tell people what you honestly think about them while being polite and professional, they're mutually exclusive. Telling people what they deserve to be told may be rude, but it's not being a jerk to do so, it's just being honest.