Linux Ubuntu

[cleverlymadeup]

it's linux and NOT gnu, the gnu project is something else entirely. there are some that will chew your head off if you don't say gnu/linux

but both gnu and linux are different things

No, it is GNU. GNU is the operating system, and Linux is its kernel. The kernel is part of the operating system.

WRONG for so many reasons

1. xwindows is NOT part of the gnu
2. mozilla is NOT part of the gnu
3. nvidia drivers are NOT part of the gnu
4. mysql is NOT part of the gnu
5. apache is NOT part of the gnu
6. bind is NOT part of the gnu

i could list thousands of other programs that are not part of the gnu

oh and here's a nice article on wikipedia proving my point as being correct

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GNU/Linux_naming_controversy

the actual kernel for the gnu system is called HURD and it isn't anywhere near complete

GNU is the umbrella term for what most people mean when they say 'Linux,' encompassing all of the distributions of that OS, such as Ubuntu, Ututo or Gentoo.

wrong as they contain things that are closed source or not part of the gnu system

GNU/Linux is an acceptable (more correct, I'll give you that) alternative to just 'GNU' simply because Linux is not made by the GNU Project, which built everything else in the system, and thus credit is due to Linus Torvalds who made a great kernel where Stallman and the GNU Project have failed. You can bet that they're still working on Hurd.

yes HURD is the kernel, they've adopted linux HOWEVER Linus thinks it's stupid and it's HIS os and NOT Stallman's. Linus doesn't mind calling it Red Hat Linux or SuSE Linux or Gentoo Linux but NOT GNU/Linux

So, when I say that I have used a 'Linux operating system' I mean GNU, and so I say GNU. We are only fortunate to have Linux as a free kernel, and a great one at that.

then you are saying it wrong, especially if you use anything that is not licensed under the GNU/GPL license, which EVERY Linux system contains

Anywho, does anyone have experience with system76, I've been thinking of buying from them.

i'd say go with Dell, not cause they aren't a good service at system76 but in these economic times, Dell will be around longer than system76 or at least should be, tho if you do go with system76 get the extra 3 year warranty, with laptops it's always better to get more warranty

 

[Phantom2595]

EDIT: And why does your avatar still have holly?

Yea, I just never got around to changing it. How about now, all better?

 

[Alex_P]

Indeed, the terminals from Fallout 3 connect to computers in much the same way, although they're a bit too far ahead for the game world. Video terminals like that didn't exist until the 1970s, I think, and the Fallout technology should have been line printers, manual teletypes and front-panel toggle switches. Just a bit of pedantry there.

Well, remember that the nuclear war in Fallout doesn't actually happen in the 1950s. It's just that timelines diverge around that time and America never really experiences any of the social shifts that make our society what it is today. (IIRC, the actual "Great War" occurs in 2077.) Technological progress has been retarded but not completely halted -- pre-war society does have stuff like fancy energy rifles and robots and power armor.

Terminals are definitely out of character for 1950 or 1960 but they're not unreasonable for a somewhat-underdeveloped alternate-history 2050.

-- Alex

 

[Kikosemmek]

1. xwindows is NOT part of the gnu
2. mozilla is NOT part of the gnu
3. nvidia drivers are NOT part of the gnu
4. mysql is NOT part of the gnu
5. apache is NOT part of the gnu
6. bind is NOT part of the gnu

You're just pointing out programs. You can also use Mozilla on a Windows platform, and you'll still be calling it Windows. The OS is the OS, not the programs that run on it. The OS allows you to run programs. They themselves are not constituents of the OS. The programs that come with every distribution out of the box are simply bundled with the installation. Microsoft Office, in that vein, is not a part of the Windows OS. It is just a program. The kernel is the only thing within the GNU OS (every 'Linux' distribution) that is not made by the GNU Project, and for that reason the OS is called GNU/Linux. Different distributions are merely different builds of the same OS, every bit of which is licensed under the GPL.

Calling the OS 'Linux' makes little sense as it is just the kernel.

Anyways, I feel that we've derailed the topic more than enough. Consider me resigned from the terminology war. I'd rather continue on PM if you still feel the need to convince me.

 

[Alex_P]

You're just pointing out programs.

Uh, how about X?

Yeah, I'm sure X doesn't matter at all...

-- Alex

 

[Kikosemmek]

You're just pointing out programs.

Uh, how about X?

Yeah, I'm sure X doesn't matter at all...

-- Alex

X is important but you can have GNU installed without it, and you can use the operating system without it. You can't do many things without it, but you're mixing apples and oranges. It's still a program, and you're (intentionally or not) putting words into my mouth. I never commented on the relevance or importance of any program. Try not to read beyond what I write. If I mean to say something, then I'll say it. There's no reason for me to be sarcastic.

 

[Alex_P]

X is important but you can have GNU installed without it, and you can use the operating system without it.

You don't need the GNU Core Utilities to use the OS, either. It's possible to cut out Glibc, too. We don't because they're useful (well, we do if we judge them to be taking up too many resources, but generally we don't).

On the most basic level, an operating system is an interface between the user's applications and the hardware. The kernel is really the centerpiece of that. The file system, the network stack, process scheduling -- this is all the kernel. Components like Glibc enhance those features and provide a useful interface for higher-level software, but they're "programs", as you said.

I've got no problem with using "GNU/Linux" or plain "Linux" as long as you're not trying to make it the One True Way. But calling the whole thing "GNU"? That's downright deceptive.

-- Alex

 

[Yog Sothoth]

So does anyone else have experience with Ubuntu?

OK, before I make the plunge, do you guys recommend that I that Ubuntu over Windows.

only if you don't intend to play any PC games... i can run the Eve Online windows client, but only get about 20 FPS at best....

 

[Kikosemmek]

I've got no problem with using "GNU/Linux" or plain "Linux" as long as you're not trying to make it the One True Way. But calling the whole thing "GNU"? That's downright deceptive.

-- Alex

I'll concede that. GNU/Linux is a better alternative.

 

[Jinx_Dragon]

As a user, for internet, videos and communications, I can say you can go no better then Linux. Unbuntu though, even though it is the one I am currently using, is a love and hate relationship. Laptops are not the best for Linux support but if everything goes well, as it has for me, you will just love it. I mean that, you will want to make sweet love to it. If you have problems, as one of my friends is doing so, then you will either become VERY tallented at setting up Linux programs or you will have to find another distribution and will just hate Ubuntu.

My advice, try it out and see. It is very lightweight, you can run it off a CD before you even install to get a feel for it, and is very graphically appealing. It often will set itself up with no trouble whatso ever, right down to identifying what drivers you need and DLing them and installing them for you without much more then a 'may I sir?' Any program you do decide you need can often be found through the package manager, ready for you to just click the download and install button. The security is top notch, Linux always understood that the user needs to be protected from themselves while still offering every feature it can to those who understand the risks of messing with your kernel coding.

Vista took what Ubuntu and other distributions already did and tried to 'borrow' the ideas found within. They then implemented them in the usual ham handed way Microsoft does. So think as pretty as vista, I find it even more beautiful myself, but a hell of a lot easier to operate.

So I would advise you to DL the install disk, burn it and at the very least run it via the CD... yes you can do that, run it off the CD before it is even installed! Then you can see what the differences are, come to love bouncing your windows off the side of the desktop and watch them wobble like jelly... ok I am easily amused... and generally see just what you will be getting before you need to even dive in.

Sad part is, as always, not many code for Linux and that means gamers will require Windows. You can find everything you need for media and the likes, I suggest getting VCL for movies over the built in player personally, but gaming requires a little more fiddling then most are comfortable with and even then can have bugs gallore. Not Linux's fault, everything is just coded for Microsoft POS "operating" systems.

 

[cleverlymadeup]

The kernel is the only thing within the GNU OS (every 'Linux' distribution) that is not made by the GNU Project, and for that reason the OS is called GNU/Linux. Different distributions are merely different builds of the same OS, every bit of which is licensed under the GPL.

Calling the OS 'Linux' makes little sense as it is just the kernel.

Anyways, I feel that we've derailed the topic more than enough. Consider me resigned from the terminology war. I'd rather continue on PM if you still feel the need to convince me.

yeah kinda sux being proven wrong, the gnu includes only GPL'd programs, if you include any non-GPL software in it you are not longer running a GNU system, OS's like FreeBSD is not GNU although it

there is NO linux distro that is pure GNU, they ALL contain software that is not part of the GNU. once you add things that are not GNU compliant you no longer have a GNU system, such as X which you NEED to run linux as a desktop

 

[thatstheguy]

I just recently installed Ubuntu on my computer along side with Windows (so I can use games and other software not compatible with Linux). I like it so far but I have to use it a little more to see if I really want to keep it.