Steppin Razor said:
Mikeyfell said:
I really that stuff like what you said was against the rules, You're being a massive jerk right now but since you didn't use the word "****" you're probably not going to get banned or any punishment really. People like you who seek out and belittle people's arguments just to say "I don't agree so you're wrong" are the worst kind of posts.
That should be against the rules because really, what did you add to the conversation?
You called him a ***** and said you weren't going to respond. You should be banned for that.
In fact, here's a game. Pretend I'm a mod and I just banned you for that. What do you say to the staff to get un-banned?
How do you justify posting that comment?
Easily.
Oh and just for a bonus, I'm going to time myself here.
"America doesn't have TV licenses. That makes America awesome! Fuck yeah!"
Time spent writing this text: 21 seconds
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IhnUgAaea4M
Time spent loading Youtube, finding the video, copying the URL, adding the HTML then previewing the post to make sure it works: 50 seconds.
Just sayin'
His response included the above. Hence I told him that I was not going to waste my time providing a reason why I disagreed with him as he has already proven that we are of completely different opinions and no middle ground will be reached between us. And "Just sayin'" is about as passive aggressive as it gets. I would accept mod wrath since I responded by being just as passive aggressive as he, but I would argue that a permanent ban is a little over the top for a heated disagreement which did not really have any insults in it.
That probably wouldn't work against a staff member. I tried to argue down one of my suspensions on the same grounds and they just gave me the runaround. I've also brought up the posts that I was responding to and they don't seem to care. They carry the attitude of "They weren't the ones that got reported so they're still in the right"
That wouldn't get you out of your hypothetical ban. I still wish saying something without backing it up was against the rules.
You're getting me wrong here. I don't like the Code of Conduct. I can not for the life of me fathom why they changed the old rules that worked perfectly well, but they did. But the low content rule about posting only a single image/video with no text as to why you're posting it has been in effect since I've been on this site and UltraHammer has not helped his case by posting it right after copping a warning over it and being overly aggressive towards people that disagree with him. I should know, both my warnings were for being aggressive towards people when they pissed me off.
This was a reasonable response:
All of my punishments were for telling people to stop re-contextualizing my arguments to try and make me look stupid, while at the same time not giving me a single reason for the disagreement.
While Low content posts aren't a good thing there's no good reason for them to be against the rules. They don't hurt anybody. A way to weed out LCP could be to wave the Capcha if your post is a certain length. But that could cause a completely different set of problems.
Also everything in its place, I've seen threads along the lines of "The last thing you killed in a game is now your superpower" and other popcorn threads like that that have no real opening for any sort of content to happen. Low content posts should at least be allowed in there.
UltraHammer said:
Steppin Razor said:
So this thread really isn't anything more than a thinly-veiled ***** and moan about your warning, then?
Well no, honestly, I totally understand following the rules as they are currently written, and the low-content policy is far from the worst idea ever, but I was really JUST SAYING, that, within this sub-sub-sub-topic regarding 'laziness', that sometimes it actually takes more work to embed a video than it does to conceive and type a message. That's seriously all I'm saying and it has absolutely nothing to do with the actual topic. (In fact it has nothing to do with 'wah I wanna be unwarned wahh!' I don't know how you even made the connection there... but whatever.)
But then he destroys it by quoting me again to have a little rant. UltraHammer man, I just got up for the day. Of course I have nothing to say yet, I was sleeping for the last 10 hours.
You both made your points. Arguing that your post isn't low content because it took you 50 seconds to look up a Youtube link instead of 20 seconds to just type what you wanted to say isn't a compelling argument in your favor. on the other hand saying he's just bitching and moaning is still a dick move.
Mikeyfell
True, true, I haven't seen every suspended or banned user on the site. But every time I see a punishment I always click on it, because for what ever reason this site feels the need to advertize every punishment on every post a user ever posted. (Which I can't think of a good reason for)
I've seen bans for pictures and warnings for "you're a fag" In fact I've seen worst stuff go unpunished in the same thread as someone who got banned for an LCP
Not to change the subject or anything but this might be a result of "report abuse." Maybe limiting the number of reports any user gets to (I dunno...) once a week would help balance the system.
The report system is one of the only systems that works on large websites, but it is far from perfect. Back when users like Furburt and Hubilub were on the site, and we had the massive popularity problems going on, they would get away with a lot of stuff that other users would get warned or probated for because nobody would report them. Unless we had about a quarter of the users on this site as mods, there is no way that they are going to see everything that gets posted,
My point is closer to: The mods don't need to see everything that happens on the site.
I think everything would work a lot better if there wasn't a report button at all. but every post had a hide button. and every account had a filter system that let users auto-hide posts or whole users with a certain number of hidden posts. That way everybody gets their own level of internet cleanliness.
As the system stands where the offended party's only recourse is to report them with no ability to accompany it with an explanation and the punishment being determined by the number of times someone reported that person, it makes whether you stay on the site a complete lottery. If you're the kind of unlucky bastard who gets their 7 arguably against the rules posts looked at by people with thin skin and sticks in their asses then you're banned.
If those people could just click a button to make that post go away, then click a second button that would make all the posts by that same user go away as well, they're happy, that user gets to stay on the site. everybody wins.
There's a reasonable explanation for that. Before the advent of the Forum Health Bar I bared no ill will towards the mods, they could put me on probation as many times as they liked. I just assumed having the link to my "taboo" opinion at the bottom of every one of my posts was the price I had to pay for having a divergent opinion on a popular game.
[sub]FYI calling the mods Cunts was a play on words from a Jimquisition episode[/sub]
As for the second part I don't directly insult people. I have no problem with calling out someone for arguing like an idiot or a child. Saying things like "Let me get this strait. It's popular so it sucks. Right?" or saying "Your opinion isn't a fact." or "Your biased"
Is stupid childish behavior to take to an argument especially if they don't have anything else to say. And when I call them out for being stupid and childish I'm the bad guy.
It's... an annoying problem on this site that people are easily able to get away with stupidity in the name of keeping things civil, but the alternative is to allow flame wars in every Halo, Call of Duty and Final Fantasy thread. The rules have always leaned towards not calling out people for their stupidity though. It is frustrating when you have to read a whole bunch of poorly thought out arguments from both sides that amount to little more than "hurr durr", but pointing out how stupid they are being takes a little bit of effort to not fall into the trap of breaking the rules and copping the punishment yourself. Things like "mate, your opinion is fucking stupid and brings nothing to the table" has always been grounds for punishment, no matter how justified it is.
I agree, and the thing is (You may not believe this) but I've never done that. I always give extremely detailed reasons for all my criticisms. I usually break down line by line why their argument wasn't up to par, or existent in most cases. (Which probably evokes repressed memories of them turning bad essays to their teachers and getting it back covered in red marks and corrections)
I should have 2 checks against me. one for calling the mods cunts, as a joke, mind.
and one for a Mass Effect thread where I totally snapped and cussed a ************ out.
every other punishment I got was bogus.
Of course the rules aren't going to change. If someone complains about the rules they get banned. suddenly nobody is left to complain about the rules and the staff thinks they're working.
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/groups/view/Escapists-against-the-machine
There's a whole group started after the rules updates for people that didn't like the changes being made. They have 46 members. In the grand scheme of things, even though there are quite a few people that disagree with the stance that the mods and staff have taken, they are still a minority of this site.
Seeing moderation go away completely would be a good thing for this site but only if you have faith in the community. Honestly from what I've seen the Escapist has no "middle ground" members (Using the word "no" to mean hardly any) (I wouldn't have to put stupid disclaimers like that if this community had a middle ground) They only have the people who think the internet needs to be strictly controlled and the people that think the internet is a place to have fun. And the Modstapo that we have right now only benefits the former category, and it's the worst thing in the world to the latter.
The flip side is the latter gets to have all the fun and the former have to run and hide, which would turn the Escapist into 4Chan which would be awesome except for the fact that 4Chan already exists and there's no need for 2 of them.
But even deeper than that it's not even the Mod's fault, yes they're easy to blame but it's the fault of who ever wrote the rules (as vague and ill defined as they are).
I'd be happy if the rules went back to how they were before the stupid health bar
