March Mayem: Democratic Issues

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TheDrunkNinja

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I am willing to risk it, but this is a thread of a different sort compared to what you have seen in the past few days. I will not name names, I will not make any accusations to any game developers or any members. I am just pointing out what we all know in our hearts: this is WRONG.

Now, many will say things like, "Oh, but it's fair," or "It's within the rules." Well, ladies and gentlemen, I have come to the realization that there is undeniable evidence that suggests that these people are wrong.

Voting to obtain an agreement is an important practice in democracy. Is that not what March Mayhem is all about? To come to a decision through the mass participation and input of opinions in a large group of individuals? To figure out which developer is most loved by the Escapists. Let me break this down with an example:

Alright, now we're going to have the Escapist Forums be represented as a nation, a body of people coming together to form a democratic republic. Although many of you may not be from this specific country, I'm going to use the United States as the example, mainly because it's system of government is most familiar to me. The Presidential election is very similar to the March Mayhem voting, right? They go through the process of elimination in order to come down to two candidates and have a final vote to figure out which is the winner. The Escapist Website now closely resembles the US system of government, doesn't it?

Now, let's say during the election, the people from a different country have been heavily informed of all the details of the election for the US Presidency. After hearing all the candidates, these foreign people decided upon one candidate that they would prefer in office for the United States. They decided to rally together and come over for one day, Election Day, and vote against the candidate that they disagree with. When the voting day is done, they high-tail it back to their country, most never setting foot in America ever again.

Sound fair? Hell, does it even sound possible? No, because in order to vote, you have to become a full fledged United States citizen, which is very difficult and impossible if you want to go back to your own country the next day. Now, imagine that becoming a US citizen was as easy as pushing a button. Doesn't that sound scary? Knowing that people could come into the country and completely screw up your system of government in mass droves of people within a single day?

People, what is going on is not fair. You cannot argue that any of what you are doing is fair, even though many people DID exactly that when this happened last year. Becoming a member of the Escapist for one day and voting for your favorite developer in a competition specifically made for Escapists to partake in, NONE of that is in anyway fair.

I am making this specifically so that if last year's events happen again, no one will be able to defend the absolute bastardizing that March Mayhem went through. All because someone decided to advertise this contest to bias websites and have them come over in droves to make sure their favorite wins.

Don't let it happen, Escapists. Vote against this juggernaut, and end it before we all regret it!

EDIT: I know you think I may be taking this too seriously, (I know March Mayhem isn't nearly as important as a vote of Presidency) but I just wanted to present an argument to those who would believe this is fair.
 

NeutralDrow

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Mar 23, 2009
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I'm just waiting for the bandwidth-sucking annoyance to leave so I can effectively continue ignoring it.
 

reg42

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Mar 18, 2009
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You're missing the point that MM is mainly just a business move. The Escapist cares about it's people, but they have to focus on making money primarily.
 

Altorin

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May 16, 2008
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but the point of March Madness is to get people to come to the escapist. That's the whole point. That's why they have it. To increase the size of the community, and get word out there that we exist. There's a reason why last years March Madness results weren't overturned, and why the escapist allows companies self-promotion when it comes to winning.

We're not asking the winner of March Madness to make decisions that will influence our lives.. and comparing March Madness to a presidential election really laughs in the deeper implications of democracy.

It's not a sacred thing. If a company loses, they either didn't care enough (which is likely), or didn't have the support of the people. If a company you were rooting for loses, bolster support for another company, or stop paying attention to this stupid popularity contest (Cause like, it's for jerks anyway, amirite?).

All developers are welcome to rally their supporters, if they care enough to.
 

TheDrunkNinja

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Demented Teddy said:
The internet is in huge contrast to a nation.

It's like comparing the ocean to a car.
They are two completely different things that behave and are treated completely different
I'm more or less comparing the March Mayhem voting to an electoral voting of a democratic government. The practice of voting is democratic, and my point is mainly that they shouldn't be able to defend their actions as easily as they did last year. Many people defended the action saying that, "It was fair." My point is that it was not and should not be treated as such.

Dunno about you, but I'm not going to stand for it if they win again.
 

Craftybonds

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Feb 6, 2010
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To add to your analogy about people from a different nation coming into vote;

the people from this "different nation" are being bribed to come and vote as well, for one specific candidate. I'm pretty sure bribery is against the law in all democratic voting systems anyway(with limited corruption)
 

Altorin

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May 16, 2008
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TheDrunkNinja said:
Demented Teddy said:
The internet is in huge contrast to a nation.

It's like comparing the ocean to a car.
They are two completely different things that behave and are treated completely different
I'm more or less comparing the March Mayhem voting to an electoral voting of a democratic government. The practice of voting is democratic, and my point is mainly that they shouldn't be able to defend their actions as easily as they did last year. Many people defended the action saying that, "It was fair." My point is that it was not and should not be treated as such.

Dunno about you, but I'm not going to stand for it if they win again.
and you don't think that advertising goes into electoral voting?

How many millions of dollars did Obama spend on his campaign? The number's out there, but it's huge.

what would have happened if Obama had just sat at home and said "You know, I could really run this country, but I'm busy with other things".. or if he couldn't be bothered to get his name out there?

He wouldn't be president, that's for sure.
 

Kollega

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Jun 5, 2009
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In short, ballot stuffing.

I think the administration should just be honest and call it a popularity contest, not "best developer contest". At least it'll be exactly what it says on the tin.

Altorin said:
but the point of March Madness is to get people to come to the escapist. That's the whole point. That's why they have it. To increase the size of the community, and get word out there that we exist. There's a reason why last years March Madness results weren't overturned, and why the escapist allows companies self-promotion when it comes to winning.
I don't get that aspect, because community dosen't "grow". Very, very few people will go back here after voting, which kinda undermines the point. The only thing they could possibly have is an increase in advertising revenue... then again, is it really worth it? Probably yes. But guessing here is useless.
 

TheDrunkNinja

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Altorin said:
and you don't think that advertising goes into electoral voting?

How many millions of dollars did Obama spend on his campaign? The number's out there, but it's huge.

what would have happened if Obama had just sat at home and said "You know, I could really run this country, but I'm busy with other things".. or if he couldn't be bothered to get his name out there?

He wouldn't be president, that's for sure.
Advertise your favorite developer in the forums? Fine.

Telling other people on your twitter account to be a member for a day and vote for your favorite pick without any incentive to actively participate in the site? Does that sound fine?
 

Insanum

The Basement Caretaker.
May 26, 2009
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Let me put this too you another way:

The Escapist is a FOR FREE[/I].

They make their money via advertising revenue, and the more accounts & Site traffic means more money for the escapist, Which will be re-invested into the site to improve it.

So, Sure, We have a month of two where elitism is an issue, But elitism doesnt pay the bills.

And if im honest, I cant see the fuss, I avoid the MM stuff, and if it wasnt for people putting "MM" in their avatar's, I wouldnt even know its going on.
 

Altorin

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May 16, 2008
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Kollega said:
In short, ballot stuffing.

I think the administration should just be honest and call it a popularity contest, not "best developer contest". At least it'll be exactly what it says on the tin.

Altorin said:
but the point of March Madness is to get people to come to the escapist. That's the whole point. That's why they have it. To increase the size of the community, and get word out there that we exist. There's a reason why last years March Madness results weren't overturned, and why the escapist allows companies self-promotion when it comes to winning.
I don't get that aspect, because community dosen't "grow". Very, very few people will go back here after voting, which kinda undermines the point. The only thing they could possibly have is an increase in advertising revenue... then again, is it really worth it? Probably yes. But guessing here is useless.
they only need a very few of them to come back... a few thousand people who discover yahtzee because they came to vote for CCP and come back again and again is all they need.

And it's not even just that. It gets the word "Escapist" out there, which is important. My mom, for instance, didn't know what it was, and came to me because Zynga asked her to vote for them in the March Madness... times that by millions, and it's millions of people who know what the Escapist is now, that didn't know two days ago.
 

JourneyThroughHell

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Sep 21, 2009
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reg42 said:
You're missing the point that MM is mainly just a business move. The Escapist cares about it's people, but they have to focus on making money primarily.
Technically you are right. Even Funk, at one point, said something about new sign-ups and "if 1% of them stay".
So, basically, if this were a fair and non-popularity contest, the registration for new users would've been closed. As it stands, it's just a bussiness idea. Nothing wrong with that either.
 

Altorin

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May 16, 2008
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TheDrunkNinja said:
Altorin said:
and you don't think that advertising goes into electoral voting?

How many millions of dollars did Obama spend on his campaign? The number's out there, but it's huge.

what would have happened if Obama had just sat at home and said "You know, I could really run this country, but I'm busy with other things".. or if he couldn't be bothered to get his name out there?

He wouldn't be president, that's for sure.
Advertise your favorite developer in the forums? Fine.

Telling other people on your twitter account to be a member for a day and vote for your favorite pick without any incentive to actively participate in the site? Does that sound fine?
It actually does to me. like I said in my earlier posts.. anytime someone anywhere posts 'Go to the Escapist' in public channels is a GOOD THING for the escapist.. even if they only come for a moment.
 

TheDrunkNinja

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Demented Teddy said:
Look even so.
So what?
A developer wins 3 times in a row (I think) who the hell cares.
This is merely a popularity contest, nothing more, nothing less.
Different developer this time around. Most people who come to vote probably don't even care about main stream gaming in general.

I just don't believe it's fair. This isn't life or death I'm talking about. Sue me for actively participating in the event. I'm not taking this as seriously as you assume.
 

Avaholic03

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May 11, 2009
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TheDrunkNinja said:
Demented Teddy said:
The internet is in huge contrast to a nation.

It's like comparing the ocean to a car.
They are two completely different things that behave and are treated completely different
I'm more or less comparing the March Mayhem voting to an electoral voting of a democratic government. The practice of voting is democratic, and my point is mainly that they shouldn't be able to defend their actions as easily as they did last year. Many people defended the action saying that, "It was fair." My point is that it was not and should not be treated as such.

Dunno about you, but I'm not going to stand for it if they win again.
Don't all people deserve a voice in a democratic election? Just because one "candidate" does a better job getting their supporters to vote does not make it anti-democratic. However, your complaining about it is pretty anti-democratic. If you want a democratic victory for whichever developer you're supporting, then you need to recruit fellow supporters to vote. Just because things turn out different from how you planned doesn't mean someone cheated.
 

TheDrunkNinja

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Altorin said:
It actually does to me. like I said in my earlier posts.. anytime someone anywhere posts 'Go to the Escapist' in public channels is a GOOD THING for the escapist.. even if they only come for a moment.
Problem being that 70% will not return due to the nature of the developer in question. If anything, all those unused accounts are taking up more bandwidth than they're worth.
 

Altorin

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May 16, 2008
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TheDrunkNinja said:
Demented Teddy said:
Look even so.
So what?
A developer wins 3 times in a row (I think) who the hell cares.
This is merely a popularity contest, nothing more, nothing less.
Different developer this time around. Most people who come to vote probably don't even care about main stream gaming in general.

I just don't believe it's fair. This isn't life or death I'm talking about. Sue me for actively participating in the event. I'm not taking this as seriously as you assume.
I for one, despite thinking your premise is more holey then a swiss cheese factory, fully endorse you in being part of the event.

The Protesters are just part of the party, and I'm cool with that
 

SimuLord

Whom Gods Annoy
Aug 20, 2008
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I, for one, don't give a flying crap about March Mayhem at this point---I'm too busy watching Ali Farokhmanesh reinvent himself as the Iranian Robert Horry in the only tournament that matters this time of year (and anyone whose dad is an absolute dead ringer for Borat is automatically cool).

So the Escapist gets traffic. Or it doesn't. Or everyone expends lots of energy yelling at each other over fucking Farmville. I just wish it wouldn't creep into Gaming Discussion. I like it better when it stays quarantined where it can be safely ignored.
 

TheDrunkNinja

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Avaholic03 said:
Life is not fair.
I take it you are at least 16 or over, you should know by now that the world is not sunshine and lolipops and "the good guys always win!".
I can be 20 and optimistic. This is an issue of entertainment, not real war. If an orphan is killed because of food deprivation, that's life. This is a discussion about games, something that I only practice in my spare time. Still, it's time worth spent, and I know bullshit when I see it. I feel it necessary to call it out.