Mass Effect 3 Gets An Ending

[trooper6]

Am I the only person who finished it without "everyone dying"?

I mean, yeah a lot of people died; nameless people of all species if that's what you mean. But it seems like for everyone, all of their teammates died as well, when all of mine lived.

I'm with you. In my game not everyone died. As a matter of fact, my Shepard saved the entire universe in a really profound way by creating a new form of base life. It was great.

But many of the people who didn't like it are just assuming that everyone is dead in order to complain more. They say: Well the Mass Relays were destroyed and we know from arrival that when a Mass Relay is destroyed that is destroys everything in that system...SO EVERYONE IS DEAD!

But, a) in arrival we rammed that relay, we have no evidence that the Catalyst's self-destruct results in the death of the people in that system.
b) Even if people in that system died--which we don't know (and if you picked the control reapers option they relays weren't destroyed)--there are many systems with no mass relays...I know this because I spent time FTL'ing between them to scan for stuff.

People are just being hyper-negative.

The most irritating thing about the nay-sayers is that they act like their opinion is objective truth and anyone who disagrees with them must be a troll or stupid or not really a fan (or too much a fan) or not paying attention or haven't watched Angry Joe or not read the Google doc.

I've read the google doc, I've watched Angry Joe. I find both to be flawed, poorly supported, and unconvincing.
I'm not a troll for liking the ending.
I'm not stupid or not paying attention or lacking analytical skills
I'm not "not really a fan" (or too much a fan).

I liked the ending. I made perfect sense to me. It was thematically proper to me. I appreciated the way my choices throughout the entire series played out over the course of ME3. I like how the things I did shaped with of the final 6 endings I was given to choose from. I like the open-endedness--the space for interpretation.

I liked the ending.

And that doesn't mean my view is now suddenly less valid than those who didn't like it.

 

[permacrete]

Anyone who talks about the ending's artistic integrity, or the idea of concluding the game and series in the way that the developers intended, is completely missing the point.

The end of Mass Effect 3 was rushed, sloppy, half-assed shit. Really, all you have to do is to play the rest of the game (without rushing through the main quest line leaving everything else behind) to see what I'm talking about--the game is fucking great, but the ending looks like the janitor came in and played with some of the art assets one evening, and the development team decided to just go with in and add a voice actor to meet their deadline.

If the end of the game reflected artistic integrity, if it seemed as if the BioWare team had actually put any thought into it at all, then I would respect it even if I disliked it. When the "Final Hours" app that takes you behind the scenes flat-out tells you that the ending didn't get written until the very last minute (November, just in time to get the VO done before the game went for console certification) the whole "artistic integrity" argument is revealed for what it is: bollocks. It's a farce. If they had any artistic integrity they would have taken the time to write something good, polish it through the same process that created the rest of the game, and release a finished fucking product.

 

[permacrete]

I'm with you. In my game not everyone died. As a matter of fact, my Shepard saved the entire universe in a really profound way by creating a new form of base life. It was great.

Its not a new form of life, you just made machine hybrids out of every living thing. What the reapers do to make husks, banshees, marauders, etc. on a systemic level, you have done on a cellular level. Setting aside for a moment that it makes no sense to add machinery to DNA, it is a pretty serious violation. I mean, how would you feel if I re-wrote your DNA for you?

This is really a fundamental problem with the ending of Mass Effect 3, regardless of which color of explosion you choose. The more you think about it, the worse it gets, the less it makes sense, and more it becomes obvious that it is thoughtless and careless--the opposite of "artistic integrity."

 

[Erttheking]

Yahtzee, all the charm and wit of a brick to the nut sack.

 

[Diana Kingston-Gabai]

I'm with you. In my game not everyone died. As a matter of fact, my Shepard saved the entire universe in a really profound way by creating a new form of base life. It was great.

Just to demonstrate a counter-critique of that particular ending:

1. You've basically validated Saren's actions in the first game, since - indoctrinated or not - everything he did was meant to promote an organic/synthetic fusion that would prove his "worth" to the Reapers.

2. By choosing Synthesis, you've forced a state of homogeny on every living thing in the galaxy. All those races set aside their differences to help you, and you've sacrificed everything they are without a clear understanding of the consequences because the Catalyst never tells you what Synthesis means - do they all have computers for brains now? Nanobots instead of blood? Will they age if they're part machine? Can they procreate? Big questions, no answers.

 

[skywolfblue]

Well said Yahtzee, I agree.

 

[trooper6]

I'm with you. In my game not everyone died. As a matter of fact, my Shepard saved the entire universe in a really profound way by creating a new form of base life. It was great.

Its not a new form of life, you just made machine hybrids out of every living thing. What the reapers do to make husks, banshees, marauders, etc. on a systemic level, you have done on a cellular level. Setting aside for a moment that it makes no sense to add machinery to DNA, it is a pretty serious violation. I mean, how would you feel if I re-wrote your DNA for you?

This is really a fundamental problem with the ending of Mass Effect 3, regardless of which color of explosion you choose. The more you think about it, the worse it gets, the less it makes sense, and more it becomes obvious that it is thoughtless and careless--the opposite of "artistic integrity."

Actually no...it isn't like what the Reapers do to make Husks. Reapers *kill* people to make husks and banshees and marauders. And those husks and banshees and marauders are more or less mindless zombies--they in no way have the personality of their former selves and no longer have individual personalities. Joker and EDI looked like the same people with the same personalities but with some different underlying structures. And the trees looked the same, with a little bit of tech thrown in. We basically became the cylon-human hybrids. And since my Shepard rewrote the Geth heretics, it is perfectly in line for me to do this cellular rewriting as well. Especially since by erasing the synthetic/organic binary I have stopped that particular cycle of violence forever. My Shepard has been a synthetic/organic hybrid since the Lazarus Project...it hasn't made me a the equivalent of a just. It is disingenuous to argue that they are the same. Just a poor excuse to QQ.

 

[GoodApprentice]

Yahtzee, all the charm and wit of a brick to the nut sack.

I vote you as a replacement for Yahtzee. Can you speak quickly?

 

[GoodApprentice]

Yahtzee, all the charm and wit of a brick to the nut sack.

I vote you as a replacement for Yahtzee. Can you speak quickly?

 

[GoodApprentice]

Yahtzee, all the charm and wit of a brick to the nut sack.

I vote you as a replacement for Yahtzee. Can you speak quickly?

 

[permacrete]

People like you are insane. You will no longer support a company that gave you 300 entertaining hours because they botched 10 minutes? Will you never buy a car based upon the fact that sometimes a flat tyre happens and its a bit shit? Seriously.

Yeah, I can see where you're coming from. Let me try to explain.

Playing the Mass Effect isn't like most other games, because the quality of the characters and writing combine with the player's ability to make choices that dramatically effect the story progression and creates a level of immersion and immediacy I haven't gotten with any other media. Seriously, if you get into Mass Effect you can *really* get into it.

This give the Mass Effect games the ability to have a serious impact on your mood, to leave thoughts and questions with the player for weeks or months after you've finished the game, to even change the way you think about certain things. Because of the overall quality of the writing, that's actually been a good thing throughout the series. People think of the time they've spent playing Commander Shepard as time well spent, just like you would reading literary classics or taking elective philosophy classes.

The ending of the third game sucks so bad that it makes me feel like an idiot for spending that much time playing video games.

It's not just that the ending retcons the entire trilogy in the last 5 minutes to make everything stupid, it is that on an emotion level it retcons your perception of the time you spent playing the series, making the player actually feel foolish. Most of us have had a relationship blow up on us, and had a break-up that made us look back at the entire relationship and think "I would have been better off spending that time slamming my head into a wall." That's what's happened with this ending.

 

[Iron Criterion]

I just figured out the perfect analogy for ME3's ending. It's like if at the end of Romeo and Juliet before Juliet takes her own life, she uses a pandora's box to pull the trigger instead at the behest of a stranger who she recommends it to her and who she has no reason to trust.

A good analogy that was sloppily executed. Do it over.

 

[Erttheking]

Yahtzee, all the charm and wit of a brick to the nut sack.

I vote you as a replacement for Yahtzee. Can you speak quickly?

Uh, any particular reason you felt the need to say that three times?

 

[trooper6]

I'm with you. In my game not everyone died. As a matter of fact, my Shepard saved the entire universe in a really profound way by creating a new form of base life. It was great.

Just to demonstrate a counter-critique of that particular ending:

1. You've basically validated Saren's actions in the first game, since - indoctrinated or not - everything he did was meant to promote an organic/synthetic fusion that would prove his "worth" to the Reapers.

2. By choosing Synthesis, you've forced a state of homogeny on every living thing in the galaxy. All those races set aside their differences to help you, and you've sacrificed everything they are without a clear understanding of the consequences because the Catalyst never tells you what Synthesis means - do they all have computers for brains now? Nanobots instead of blood? Will they age if they're part machine? Can they procreate? Big questions, no answers.

1. Saren wanted to promote organic/synthetic fusion to prove worth to Reapers. But his plan wouldn't have done anything to change the Reapers or stop the cycle. What I did was fundamentally change the way everything is done. I've even changed the reapers. The cycle is over. Saren wanted to make everyone subservient to the reapers in order to hopefully survive (which wouldn't have worked because the reapers weren't going to go for that). I have erased the hierarchy completely.

2. Just because we are all organic/synthetic hybrids now--like Shepard is, doesn't mean everyone is the same. The Turians and the Asari are both organic and they are quite different. There is diversity among organics, there is diversity among synthetics, there will continue to be diversity between the synthetic/organic hybrids...especially looking at EDI and Joker at the end. What does synthesis mean? Well the catalyst points out you, Shepard, are a synthesis...and is has worked out well enough for me. Are all the implications clear? No, but you can never know all the implications of anything. You didn't know all the implications of destroying or not destroying Mehlin's data. You don't know all the implications of curing or not curing the genophage. You don't know all the implications of saving or not saving the Rachni Queen. As Shepard you have continuously made the best decisions you could based on the information you had for yourself, your team, various species. And from the final coda, it looks like it turned out all right. My Shepard made that choice and it turned out to be a happy ending.

 

[mfeff]

If I had to call it...

The biggest issue of all, was that Shepard is narratively "forced" into the roll of The Shepard, through the use of the Chekov's Gun, Kid, literary device.

ME3 reduces the choice wheel, too often times, two choices. The world is getting smaller.

For all practical purposes Shepard, becomes, Gaius Baltar from Battle Star Galactica.

Lucid Dreams... check

See's things that are not there... check

Noise in the ship... check - Cylon Sleeper agent reference

Hand is "forced" through external forces... check

Regrets decisions, and facing impossibilities... check

Hall of the Dead... check

The kid, is the device used to separate the player "agency" to fate "destiny" or hard determinism.

Why?

God'did't, but no... to get the player to let go of a franchise, that was/is going away. Should the player of been able to have made that choice on their own? I think so. But it was forced anyway. Oh well.

The unexplained super A.I. God that inhabits the citadel/crucible is "waiting" for a messianic figure to emerge and end the cycle.

Why a cycle?

Circular Logic... you tell me.

The problem is the narrative, the outcry, the exposition... it is just bad hack writing from a half dozen other Sci-Fi genre flicks, it's so poor from start to finish, that a poorly conceived ending was all that was left.

It's not particularly deep.

It's not particularly meaningful.

It retcons it's own universe, and retcon's it's own narrative several times during it's own exposition.

If you are just coming into the game "fresh" it's great.

It's the Aliens 3 of the Alien franchise.

Sadly... it is "just a game". That borrows most of it's universe and identity from other stuff.

What was done, was done well. Some good character arcs from the previous games where resolved in excellent and rewarding ways. Those stories, come from the other 2 games. Met expectations. What let's down, is the ME 3 content, on it's own, without "those" elements.

Jessica C from IGN?
Vega?

Time for this, but no time for a coherent ending? It didn't matter... cause the game is over... maybe somewhere in all this, that was the message.

Disappointing? Yep.

Perhaps inevitable as games become more "like" movies. Maybe the rub was that underneath all the... mess, was a really solid, memorable narrative that really would of set the bar.

It didn't, probably can't in this medium... and ultimately... one must concede... video games, are toys... entertainment... they have budgets and marketing goals, which far in a way exceed any other possible motivation to develop a product.

If people feel that they didn't get there 80 bucks worth... why not let em rage for the difference in what it was worth to them?

Bright side, Shepard becomes Robot-Jesus, Lobster-Buddha, or the Ubermensch...

Why explain any more... likely, won't BE anymore... why bother?

To heal my own pain... I "shopped for victory" and bought a Marauder Shields T. Shirt... going to wear it at PAX.

Even making a Legion Resin, for my office desk. What a cool character. That was a different writer, weaving straw into gold though... not ME3.

Ah well... we get a new meme? That's cool... right?

 

[ThunderCavalier]

*sigh*

I like believing myself someone who's getting the points of both sides:

On one hand, I understand that Mass Effect 3's ending was one of the most abhorrent and wretched endings that I've ever seen to a series. For a moment, I thought there couldn't be an ending worse than Halo 2's, or Neon Genesis Evangelion's, but nothing has ever missed the point and simply been unable to 'end' a series quite like ME3's ending.

On the other hand...

ONLY THE ENDING WAS SHIT.

The game before it? Amazing. The multiplayer? Fun and addictive. The lore? Extremely well-developed and, discounting the ending, still leaves room for new stories to be told in it.

I'm seeing the exact same thing with the Prequel Trilogy here. People keep bitching about the BAD parts of the series, forgetting about the GOOD parts that kept them playing until the end, which I honestly think is more important and should be remembered more fondly.

Should we protest and argue that ME3's ending was shit and should have been better? Yes. Do I think that Retake Mass Effect is justified, as well as most of the fan reaction to tell BioWare to 'suck it' and that they're just 'money-grubbing whores'? NO. Yes, I admit, this feels like a mandated cash-grab by EA so they can make more DLC so people can get a better ending, but come on guys, GET OVER YOURSELVES. You guys think Mass Effect is the one good thing that's happened and letting this go unnoticed will lead to the destruction of quality in it and franchises following, but you're missing the point both MovieBob and Yahtzee have.

Experience.

THEY'VE SEEN THE EXACT SAME THING HAPPEN BEFORE.

AND THEY GOT OVER IT, BECAUSE JUST BECAUSE IT HAPPENED ONCE DOES NOT MEAN EVERYTHING AFTERWARD IS GOING TO BE CRAP.

My god, people. Mass Effect's ending is NOT the end of the universe (well, maybe the ME universe ). Simply insert your two cents that Mass Effect 3's ending was horrendous and BioWare should have really done better. Scream to the heavens, if you must. But the minute you start making petitions threatening to buy out the ME IP so you can make your own ending, you've entered 'pants-on-head retarded' territory.

 

[permacrete]

Actually no...it isn't like what the Reapers do to make Husks. Reapers *kill* people to make husks and banshees and marauders. And those husks and banshees and marauders are more or less mindless zombies--they in no way have the personality of their former selves and no longer have individual personalities. Joker and EDI looked like the same people with the same personalities but with some different underlying structures. And the trees looked the same, with a little bit of tech thrown in. We basically became the cylon-human hybrids. And since my Shepard rewrote the Geth heretics, it is perfectly in line for me to do this cellular rewriting as well. Especially since by erasing the synthetic/organic binary I have stopped that particular cycle of violence forever. My Shepard has been a synthetic/organic hybrid since the Lazarus Project...it hasn't made me a the equivalent of a just. It is disingenuous to argue that they are the same. Just a poor excuse to QQ.

When you "re-wrote" the Geth, you were fixing a glitch that cause a mathematical error which led them to a mistaken perception of the reapers. It's like fixing someone's cataracts so that they can see what their ugly girlfriend really looks like. They were still free to form an alliance with the Reapers, which they did--you did not force your will upon them.

Shepard isn't a synthetic hybrid, he had some gizmos that replace or augment organic parts that had stopped working. The purpose of the Lazarus project was never to make Shepard into something new, it was to restore Shepard to the same level of function as before the Normandy was attacked.

A husk is fundamentally different from a human. It is a hybrid of man and machine. Shepard's robo-genetic experiment with green space magic might be creating hybrids that are much more independent and high-functioning, but they are still fundamentally different than they were before.

Any way you slice it, it isn't cool for Shepard and the Star Child Reaper God to go re-writing the genetic code of every living thing, and it is made even worse by the fact that the Star Child's justification for it is demonstrably wrong. Long before you reach the end as a Paragon, Shepard has resolved the AI issue. This unit has a soul. Joker has a girlfriend. You're done with that, you have closure, but the Star Child tells you that this issue has to be dealt with through space magic and the destruction of the relays. It's dumb.

 

[Iron Criterion]

I hope a lot of us consumers learn not to trust bioware again, this whole experience has been souring.

And if the big lesson from the ending is "you dont always get what you want", then I hope people take notice of this lesson and apply it to all related things.

Bioware isnt selling enough games, "well tough you dont always get what you want

Internet Reviewers arent getting enough hits on their pages or videos "well tough you dont get what you want"

I hope people that read this get the not so subtle hints.

Sounds like sour grapes to me.

Sour grapes because Bioware didn't give you the ending you wanted.

Sour grapes because people like Movie Bob and Yahtzee don't share your opinions.

Sour grapes because you don't always get what you want.

 

[4173]

I still feel like it was the ending for some other game. Shouldn't the big, ultimate, game ending choice have some ties to the rest of the series?


I wasn't sure I would like how ME3 ended, but never in my wildest dreams did I expect the ending to be underwhelming or without urgency.


Is that too much to ask for, an ending that I could care about?