Mind control is here.

[Jabberwock xeno]

In my scientfifc amercian issue that arrived today, it had an artcile about how scitenists could directly input electrical signals into a beetles neuromuscluar system, so to bypass the brain and the beetle's own free will.

Based on what I understood, they could selectibly control certain aspects of the beetle's muscular systenm, such as wings or legs, but let the animal keep automatious tasks.

While the scitenists have good intentions: using them to scout dister areas, I can't help but wonder:

Why ins't this animal abuse? I understand that beetles are insects, but they are nontheless sientient and ARE animals.

Thoughts?

EDIT:
And no, SIENTIENCE means it can feel, IE: consciousness. SAPIENCE is human level intellgence. Look it up.

Via Wikipedia: "Sentience is the ability to feel or perceive. The term is used in science and philosophy, and in the study of artificial intelligence. Sentience is used in the study of consciousness to describe the ability to have sensations or experiences, known to Western philosophers as "qualia". In eastern philosophy, sentience is a metaphysical quality of all things that requires respect and care.

In many science fiction works sentience is often used as a synonym for sapience meaning "human-level or higher intelligence"

 

[ProfessorLayton]

Ok, so how exactly are they doing it? Can they do it remotely or do you have to be plugged up? Because if it's remote than I'm going to start freaking out now.

 

[Owyn_Merrilin]

Scientists do some pretty nasty things to animals, but a lot of it is necessary -- you wouldn't want them testing new drugs, for example, on humans before they had a good idea of what was going to happen, would you? I don't have a problem with animal testing, as long as it's used in a situation where the testing would otherwise have to be done on humans. Pouring shampoo in a rabbit's eyes to see if it burns may be bad, but I don't have a problem with doing legitimate scientific research on animals, and frankly, neither should you.

As for this specific instance, the possible applications of the research are scary, but some of them are pretty cool -- if we can make a beetle flap its wings, how far off are we from cybernetic implants allowing a human brain to control a robotic arm or, better yet, a hand? The main reason we haven't been able to do it in the past is that we don't know what the signal is that causes the movement in the first place. It sounds like this research is getting one step closer to finding that out.

 

[Serenegoose]

Beetles are not sentient. They don't have big enough brains for sentience. Very few animals pass the test for sentience - chimps, elephants, dolphins. Beetles are just a set of instincts in a biological cage. You've probably accidentally stepped on hundreds of them - unless you seriously think you should be arrested for killing animals... It's certainly interesting, but it's also not mind control, I mean it's usurping physical autonomy, but that was always theoretically possible in humans. Some animals do it already, and the rabies virus also does so to a limited extent (rabies compels biting, and there's a form of wasp that usurps cockroaches)

Still, fascinating stuff.

 

[Serenegoose]

Ok, so how exactly are they doing it? Can they do it remotely or do you have to be plugged up? Because if it's remote than I'm going to start freaking out now.

It's physical - they have to send their own electrical impulses through the body and into the muscles - you're basically fooling the muscles into thinking it's the brain. The taser does the same thing without any element of control, just electricity making muscles spasm - this is a refinement on that basic attribute of motor control, nothing more.

 

[Leemaster777]

In my scientfifc amercian issue that arrived today, it had an artcile about how scitenists could directly input electrical signals into a beetles neuromuscluar system, so to bypass the brain and the beetle's own free will.

Based on what I understood, they could selectibly control certain aspects of the beetle's muscular systenm, such as wings or legs, but let the animal keep automatious tasks.

While the scitenists have good intentions: using them to scout dister areas, I can't help but wonder:

Why ins't this animal abuse? I understand that beetles are insects, but they are nontheless sientient and ARE animals.

Thoughts?

I don't think you quite understand what "Sentient" means. Sentience is having human-level or higher intellegence.

OT: This is interesting, but at the moment, I seriously doubt that we have to worry about mind-controlled people. A human brain is VASTLY more complex than an insects. It'll be quite some time before technology advances to the point where mind-control could even be attempted on humans.

EDIT: Damn, ninja'd on the sentience.

 

[Romidude]

Well, that is interesting. And no they're NOT sentient, don't use words that you don't know the meaning of.

 

[Redlin5_v1legacy]

Ok, so how exactly are they doing it? Can they do it remotely or do you have to be plugged up? Because if it's remote than I'm going to start freaking out now.

Me too. Soon big brother will strap cameras to the beetles and have them following people who are "dangerous to the state".

This is scary... I wonder if they'll start experimenting with people in hospitals after they've been put under...

Gah!

 

[Jabberwock xeno]

Ok, so how exactly are they doing it? Can they do it remotely or do you have to be plugged up? Because if it's remote than I'm going to start freaking out now.

It looks like a computer chip glued unto their head with wires attaching it to their brain.

EDIT:

And no, SIENTIENCE means it can feel, IE: consciousness. SAPIENCE is human level intellgence. Look it up.

Via Wikipedia: "Sentience is the ability to feel or perceive. The term is used in science and philosophy, and in the study of artificial intelligence. Sentience is used in the study of consciousness to describe the ability to have sensations or experiences, known to Western philosophers as "qualia". In eastern philosophy, sentience is a metaphysical quality of all things that requires respect and care.

In many science fiction works sentience is often used as a synonym for sapience meaning "human-level or higher intelligence"

 

[RatRace123]

Beetles don't really count high on the list of things that people love, I think they're only above cockroaches and urinary tract infections.

Still, this has potential, evil potential. What happens when they decide to move up to a bigger animal, like a human.

 

[Sinclair Solutions]

You had me all excited with your title, but your first post is such downer.

Still, I have always considered abuse to be when something is seriously injured or killed. Are the beetles dying or being seriously injured in anyway? If they are just controlling their muscles with electric pulses, but not harming them in anyway, its not exactly "abuse" in my opinion, though I am not exactly an expert on the study you are discussing.

 

[Kirkby]

Well mainly because most bugs dont have a fully developed nervous system. They respond to stimulus but that is not the same as feeling pain. Secondly, this is a huge advance in science. It could be used to control muscle spasms in humans sooner or later, if a few bugs and even mice have to suffer for the benefit of man kind so be it

 

[WeOwnTheSky]

Did they control the entire mind? There's a difference between controlling a few muscle movements, and completely taking over the brain.
Regardless, I'm not sure yet if this is creepy or really cool. Just don't attach the wire thing to my brain.

 

[lee1287]

Scientists do some pretty nasty things to animals, but a lot of it is necessary -- you wouldn't want them testing new drugs, for example, on humans before they had a good idea of what was going to happen, would you? I don't have a problem with animal testing, as long as it's used in a situation where the testing would otherwise have to be done on humans. Pouring shampoo in a rabbit's eyes to see if it burns may be bad, but I don't have a problem with doing legitimate scientific research on animals, and frankly, neither should you.

As for this specific instance, the possible applications of the research are scary, but some of them are pretty cool -- if we can make a beetle flap its wings, how far off are we from cybernetic implants allowing a human brain to control a robotic arm or, better yet, a hand? The main reason we haven't been able to do it in the past is that we don't know what the signal is that causes the movement in the first place. It sounds like this research is getting one step closer to finding that out.

Why do it to animals when there are hundreads of millions people starving to death and would partake in said trial for money? HMMMMM?

 

[Jadak]

Why ins't this animal abuse? I understand that beetles are insects, but they are nontheless sientient and ARE animals.

Umm...Since when?

Assuming you mean sentient, that's a title currently only officially held by humans.

 

[Owyn_Merrilin]

Scientists do some pretty nasty things to animals, but a lot of it is necessary -- you wouldn't want them testing new drugs, for example, on humans before they had a good idea of what was going to happen, would you? I don't have a problem with animal testing, as long as it's used in a situation where the testing would otherwise have to be done on humans. Pouring shampoo in a rabbit's eyes to see if it burns may be bad, but I don't have a problem with doing legitimate scientific research on animals, and frankly, neither should you.

As for this specific instance, the possible applications of the research are scary, but some of them are pretty cool -- if we can make a beetle flap its wings, how far off are we from cybernetic implants allowing a human brain to control a robotic arm or, better yet, a hand? The main reason we haven't been able to do it in the past is that we don't know what the signal is that causes the movement in the first place. It sounds like this research is getting one step closer to finding that out.

Why do it to animals when there are hundreads of millions people starving to death and would partake in said trial for money? HMMMMM?

Because no matter how much you pay them, it would be unethical and, in most cases, murder.

 

[feather240]

Beetles are not sentient. They don't have big enough brains for sentience. Very few animals pass the test for sentience - chimps, elephants, dolphins. Beetles are just a set of instincts in a biological cage. You've probably accidentally stepped on hundreds of them - unless you seriously think you should be arrested for killing animals... It's certainly interesting, but it's also not mind control, I mean it's usurping physical autonomy, but that was always theoretically possible in humans. Some animals do it already, and the rabies virus also does so to a limited extent (rabies compels biting, and there's a form of wasp that usurps cockroaches)

Still, fascinating stuff.

What about Pigs?

 

[SD-Fiend]

ok but why? who would we use it on?

 

[Chamale]

This is hardly news. It can already be performed on humans, with a magnetic rig that doesn't even need to touch the person. You can instill an urge to move certain body parts with low power, or turn up the power and make someone move that part.

 

[Scipio1770]

Either way, a beetle has almost no memory, nor adaptive behavior. sentience is almost irrelevant to them. It's moronic to think scientists are being immoral by testing on beetles while every other human being in the world slaps and stomps away at insects all over the place.