ModDB Shuts Down School Shooter Mod

[moppop]

this is bull. freedom does not come in bits and parts. either you support everyone right to free speech or you don't, freedom of speech is not the right to agree with people, its the right to disagree, free from reprisal. i now hate mod db. that sucks for the dev's

So you hate ModDB for exercising their rights as owners? It's not suppression if it's on private webspace.

Here's an idea for you, why don't YOU host the mod since you so deeply care about their freedom.

If you actually hate ModDB, then I hope you won't be a hypocrite and go to the website and download any of the 12,000+ popular mods for hundreds of games. No one should ever go to a website they where they so despise what the owners stand for that they "hate" them.

 

[vivster]

And ModDB crumbles under pressure.

yeah that
well some sites just don't have the balls for neutrality

Neutrality != not enforcing their ToS.

--> ToS = not neutral

(before you now say child porn.... this mod in question is not illegal in any way)

 

[BoogieManFL]

The guy making that is an idiot. It's obviously in bad taste and is completely pointless. It doesn't provide anything interesting or wanted.

If ModDB decides not to host something, that's their right. It's their website and their bandwidth. I wouldn't host garbage like that. I'm all for free speech - but just because you can say or do something doesn't mean you should. It's just pure idiocy.

Just like those horrible people that protest at soldier's funerals. Free speech or not, someone lost a loved one and it trying to say goodbye and share stories with family. Go do your protesting elsewhere you heartless pricks.

 

[moppop]

[

And ModDB crumbles under pressure.

yeah that
well some sites just don't have the balls for neutrality

Neutrality != not enforcing their ToS.

--> ToS = not neutral

(before you now say child porn.... this mod in question is not illegal in any way)

Actually, I never was going to mention child porn...guess what happens when you assume?

So, why aren't you complaining about the Escapist for also not being "neutral"? Why aren't you complaining about every other site that not only has a ToS, but also enforces that ToS? Why are you singling out ModDB for being a hypocrite when they actually aren't?

No one is questioning the legality of the mod here. No one. Get that strawman shit outta here.

 

[GothmogII]

[

And ModDB crumbles under pressure.

yeah that
well some sites just don't have the balls for neutrality

Neutrality != not enforcing their ToS.

--> ToS = not neutral

(before you now say child porn.... this mod in question is not illegal in any way)

Actually, I never was going to mention child porn...guess what happens when you assume?

So, why aren't you complaining about the Escapist for also not being "neutral"? Why aren't you complaining about every other site that not only has a ToS, but also enforces that ToS? Why are you singling out ModDB for being a hypocrite when they actually aren't?

No one is questioning the legality of the mod here. No one. Get that strawman shit outta here.

Well, a few people in this thread have. But, it's significantly more tactful to not be so abrasive about it, especially when it comes to the opinion of a staff member, which can lead easily to a ban. Having measured respect for other people's opinions isn't really that hard,
but a lot of people seem to struggle with the idea resorting to outright hostility from the moment they type up their argument.

That said, I don't agree entirely with Mr.Tito's appraisal, whether this is held by the rest of Escapist staff remains to be seen.

You are correct however, ModDB IS WELL WITHIN THEIR RIGHTS TO REMOVE CONTENT AS THEY SEE FIT. They are a private organisation after all, right?

But, that does not make the decision agreeable regardless of the pressures they're facing, in my opinion, of course. I've already mentioned the dissonance behind what people perceive to be acceptable or not, and indeed said how I too find the content of the mod distasteful at the very least. But it irks me something fierce to see people applauding the action, as if this game was going to spontaneously cause mass murders if it were released. The same people who will defend other games with similar (or worse) levels of violence and depravity, who then meander about defending this thinking with: Ohh, it's all fiction, those are monsters, soldiers, aliens, they aren't based on a real event so it's perfectly okay! Of course!

Funny, often seems like the strongest argument in favor of not making these kinds of games is: Too soon.

 

[mighty_wambat]

this is bull. freedom does not come in bits and parts. either you support everyone right to free speech or you don't, freedom of speech is not the right to agree with people, its the right to disagree, free from reprisal. i now hate mod db. that sucks for the dev's

So you hate ModDB for exercising their rights as owners? It's not suppression if it's on private webspace.

Here's an idea for you, why don't YOU host the mod since you so deeply care about their freedom.

If you actually hate ModDB, then I hope you won't be a hypocrite and go to the website and download any of the 12,000+ popular mods for hundreds of games. No one should ever go to a website they where they so despise what the owners stand for that they "hate" them.

fine, i won't, i will never again use mod db. period.

your right that its a private space, there freedom of speech is not protected there by law, and that sucks. its not a constitutional violation but it is suppression. (if fewer ppl see it because its not on mod db, the idea has be partially suppressed)

my comment is more to the idea that mod db claims to support freedom of speech, they clearly don't.

specifically, if they were to make an argument to the tune of "we support freedom of speech because we left insurgency up, but this school shooting is just to offensive"
then it would be blatant bullshit. freedom is not freedom to agree, its freedom to be offensive.
if you take one idea down because you don't like it, that is censorship. its true that mod db has the right to do that, but its morally offensive to me and anyone who likes freedom (and is informed) that they would do this on moral grounds, i can see no reason why this would have been bad business.
if it were? if service providers threatened to stop loading there page or adds said they would stop advertising then sure, but i see no evidence of that.

they found an idea offensive, so they censored it. that may be legal. but it is also wrong.

 

[vivster]

[

And ModDB crumbles under pressure.

yeah that
well some sites just don't have the balls for neutrality

Neutrality != not enforcing their ToS.

--> ToS = not neutral

(before you now say child porn.... this mod in question is not illegal in any way)

Actually, I never was going to mention child porn...guess what happens when you assume?

So, why aren't you complaining about the Escapist for also not being "neutral"? Why aren't you complaining about every other site that not only has a ToS, but also enforces that ToS? Why are you singling out ModDB for being a hypocrite when they actually aren't?

No one is questioning the legality of the mod here. No one. Get that strawman shit outta here.

you can't possibly be serious in comparing a heavily moderated site like the escapist with no user generated content whatsoever with a site that lives of user generated content

what makes this thing so delicate is the timing
sure they couldn't see see it the first day it was put up there but it's been some time until this whole thing got public and if they were SO concerned about their ToS they would've actzed quickly and not waited until that buzz about it became too great for them to handle

to be honest i haven't read their ToS but i somehow doubt that it explicitly forbids such content
it is quite common that "bad content" is described quite vaguely in ToS so this mod was probably in a gray zone with subjectivity in the matter

so in my opinion this was less of a ToS enforcement and more of a decision based on the pressure they got by outside forces such as the media

i'm all for freedom of the private sector and i hold absolutely nothing against their decision... every clever businessman would've pulled out on that
but still it leaves a bad aftertaste...

 

[punipunipyo]

I'm glad it was taken down, but not like this. It's gonna inflate Jack Thompsons ego more.

yeh... I agreed... Jack(ass) should be ignored, We as players should all stood up to bad taste game Dev like School Shooter, and DUMP them as we call it "Degraded Art", and Mod-DB(and other Mod hosts) should reply the matter to us the consumers, and not Jack(ass), and his bitching... his words shouldn't matter. it's US who decides what games are good, and what games are BAD(and we'd all agreed that Jack(Ass)Tom is the Ugly~ Right?).

Unfortunately it wasn't us gamers that were able to get ModDB to dump this mod but Jack Thompson and his media fans. What does that say about where our moral compass points?

True, we are NOT the ones that band together to threat, letter, protest, get on Fox networks, make other ways to EXPLODE such manner, in this case, Jack(the raper; raping our art medium) did. But that didn't make us the disgusting one, see...

We all knew that School Shooter is a bad taste, and we all talked about it when it was announced, and I knew that it got many angry mails from fans/foe alike of this medium, only Jack(ed up) made it in to an "issue"; he went the extra mile to make sure this game in particular, gets the attention, this game in particular, will be the talk of the town (and Duke Nukem forever soon), BECAUSE HE THRIVES ON THIS! It's what puts food on his sorry ass table every night, his job, what he DEPENDS ON, and may I say, doing this as if he cared about our children, by attacking the (ENTIRE) industry, and (ALL OF THE MODERN DAY MEDIA) artists, when the whole thing is actually the fault of the distributor (Stupid game shop clerks with knowledge/sensitivity/alertness only worthy 10 bucks an hour) , and the (STUPID PARENTS) consumers. Yeah, like FOX News, these people have no real idea what's going on, and they are just being Xeno-phobic about video games.

We COULD be the ones that makes the news, we COULD be the one that threat the Mod Dev, but we are only doing what we suppose to do as "consumers", boycott, or angry letter, and NOT SUPPORTING, and THAT WOULD have been enough to tell the industry that WE KNOW THE DIFFERENCE, and WE HAVE STANDARDS... and that kind of crap won't be made again, it will just... fade away, instead, Jack(ass) wants to made sure his band of stupid,Xeno-phobic, ignorant moms, and dads supports by Fox and all other game haters with their parade of mindless, deaf screaming of game hating chants, beat down of the ENTIRE MEDIUM as ONE title was made Degraded...

As long we know whats going on, it'd be okay, because their words don't mean "jack"(shit). We know what's good, and bad, we know a work of art, break through when we see one, and we need not angry, ignorant band wagon to tell us what NOT to buy, even though we are not ones to take EXTREME measures, we are ones that are informed, well educated, and wise enough to try to solve our problems by using professional civilized fashion, such as supporting the good, and Disapprove/boycott the bad. of cores again, we ignore the ugly (Jack asses).

 

[ALPHATT]

are you guys retarded or something, he's obviously trolling, he created a satire persona and the game is an extension of that.

 

[Hussmann54]

And ModDB crumbles under pressure.

Just because someone supports free speech doesn't mean they have to let Hitler rent a room in their house to say he wants to commit Genocide again. Your aloud to have a negative opinion of it and if you own/run/take care of/etc. whatever you have the right to close/shutdown/discontinue the access.

Unless there's a contract/statement made prior saying you wave the rights forever or a set period amount of time to close any programs you just don't agree with or otherwise then it's not hypocritical.

Yeah Raynor. Why cant free speech also mean "Hey I freely believe I dont want this garbage hosted up on my website. So I choose not to allow it."

You might wanna take another look at the definition of "free speech". It doesnt mean "Hey If I make something edgy and controversial, people MUST LOVE IT B0w b4 MY InFIni!E CONTr()VE5Y!"

Ughhhh... sorry had to get that out.... people forget that freedom also means the freedom to deny in many circumstances.

 

[Hussmann54]

I am glad this was taken down.

This is just as lame and pointless as Rapelay IMO.

Nah, rapelay is to videogames as porn is to movies. I don't agree with it, but if that's what you need to relive yourself, then go ahead.

This, on the otherhand, has no postive value I can think of.

The problem is, unfortunately the psychology of it doesnt always work that smoothly, eventually even the video game isnt gonna satisfy.

I have personally delt with addictions to porn in my life, and I can tell you that neither feeding, nor starving the addiction is going to fix it. Even if you feed it with alternatives.

 

[Wintermoot]

I,m glad it has been taken down,but on the other hand it,s a violation of freedom of speech (but that doesn't make it less distasteful)