Muslim Should Not Equal Villain

[GothmogII]

You know, I'm currently reading The Arabian Nights as translated by Husain Haddawy, while the morals on display are certainly a little...outdated, (see: King Shayrayar and King Shahzaman killing their wives for cheating on them, and then being forced to have sex with the wife of a demon...yeah, which of course is only the prologue, and starts off Shayrayar's subsequent new wife killings and meeting Shahrazad. Fun stuff though.) it'd certainly be something fascinating to tap into and make a videogame out of, maybe a RPG?

Okay..maybe not the best source to get a 'good' Arab character out of (though there are plenty), but, at the risk of sounding like I'm against the idea (I'm not), it seems the general advice given to artists of any kind is to write/draw/create what you know. However, this advice is clearly both held to and ignored at the same time, with creators at once creating only solid, well thought out characters that they can relate to, that share their skin colour or culture, while at the same time, trying to paint what cultures or persons they may not have very good knowledge about as being only bad guys.

You know though, if you were looking for a representation of good Arab characters, personally I thought Blizzard did an excellent job in Lut Golien in Diablo 2. The entire chapter of course loosely based on everything Middle Eastern, yet without relegating the NPC's in the area to outright stereotypes.

 

[Jkudo]

And today's game review is Mafia 2. Gee, maybe if an ethnic group or culture makes itself infamous at one point in history, games might revisit that time. Seen any "Mongols workign as farmers and accountants" games? No, that would be stupid.

mafia 2 is loosely based on the mafia that existed, you expecting to play as a terrorist in a few years? Because in mafia 2 you aren't shooting at the mobsters you are one. They mafia is depicted as real people. There isn't a problem with revisiting the time but if all you did in mafia 2 was be a cop and shoot at people yelling in italian there might be an issue.
I really doubt all the people posting read anymore than the title.

Mafia 2 Was already protested for portraying an ethnic stereotype. The game features fictionalized people loosely based on real events, just like the Medal Of Honor Taliban. if you cannot see the correlation, you're not smart enough to be part of this discussion. The Nazi's killed more people than the Taliban and people have played the Germans in Medal of Honor multiplayer without a huge uproar. Get a clue.

Barely a protest and once again in medal of honor the single player isnt about the taliban from the eyes of the taliban if you dont see the difference then you're not smart enough.

LOL none of which changes what I said. You area moron. Reply all you want. I am just ignoring your retarded ass now, Sarah Palin.

uhhh what? Now you just seem ridiculous. You dont see the difference between playing as the taliban or a nazi in multiplayer and playing them as real characters with names in single player?

 

[A Pious Cultist]

http://www.theonion.com/articles/man-already-knows-everything-he-needs-to-know-abou,17990/

Hits the nail on the head I think

Yes, yes it does. Trust the Onion to satirically one-up all major news organisations.

 

[Jkudo]

I agree that it would be a good idea to produce more games where it isn't just, "Certain Race = Villans"
That is Lazy Storytelling.

I like this post, its always good guy vs bad guys. Well really Americans vs bad guys, which can look bad when you are supposed to be depicting a war that actually happened.

 

[Velocirapture07]

maybe if moderate muslims took a more front and center position against extremists, and took back your religion from facists that seek to define it and jihad as some war against non believers, instead of the internal struggle with faith.

back when christianity was putting philosophers and scientists and jews to death as evil and non believers. islam welcomed science and other faiths.

sure does not help the islamic cause when chrisitans on one hand are often ridiculed and made the but of jokes and downright belittlement they take more or less with a grain of salt. but south park dares use the name and "image" of muhammid and they get death threats pouring in so they have to bleep even the name.

islam can be a beautiful religion and people that follow it can be caring generous and accepting even of non believers, but far too often do the vocal minority of the extremists rise to the top and belittle the rest of you.

You sir hit the nail on the head. I would respect the religion a whole lot more if the moderates were more vocal and spoke out against the disgusting acts of these extremists. It's almost saddening to think that South park made a show about muhammed that blasted the other religions (Hindu Gods smoking dope, etc.) but when it comes to Muhammed there are death threats??? Something is wrong here.

 

[The_ModeRazor]

O rly?
That's interesting and all, but once again, there is more to it than seems.
Western society is racist towards Islam.
Islam does stuff casually that are not very acceptable by western society. Like banning rock bands (islam kid on radio talks about the shit they had to go through), etc. Islam society certainly isn't without fault here.
Now, if we just nuked everybody and the kangaroos took over, everything would be fine. Methinks.

 

[Stagetree]

I thought Saladin Ahmed wrote an excellent article.

But look at the genres of these videogames he mentioned:

Metal Slug 2 and Desert Strike: shoot em up;
Full Spectrum Warrior: real-time tactics;
Splinter Cell: stealth em up;
America's Army: FPS.

These genres tend to embrace killing as a way to earn experience.

Both Prince of Persia and Assassin's Creed are action/adventure. Civ III is a turn-based tactics game

Yes, there's killing in these games--hell, Altair is an assassin--but there's a great emphasis on thinking your way through a problem, rather than mindless killing.

I may be stretching here, but it seems that videogames that require a certain type of creative thought know that Muslims are people too, whereas videogames that emphasis hair-trigger reactions (and in the case of a stealth em ups and RTTs, a different kind of creative thought) dehumanize their enemies. And if the enemy happens to be Muslim, it doesn't matter. He's just another target.

Talk about terminating with extreme prejudice.

 

[bojac6]

Sorry, but this kind of one-sided examination of an issue never helps anything. A long list of games that depict Muslims unfairly (and you're probably right to say most of them do) can't hope to get people really thinking.

I'm loathe to say you've got to look at the whole issue, since the whole issue here goes way beyond just videogames, but this needs balance - a word from the developers of those games, a non-Muslim perspective - to be in any way meaningful.

I disagree with you entirely. I thorny this article was fairly balanced, established its argument well and made a good point. How does a non-Muslim perspective make this argument more legitimate? "I'm not a Muslim, I have only outside exposure to this issue.". What difference does what the developers say make? Does it matter if they justify it by saying "We just wanted a generic bad guy and people have been using Arabs for years"? Is that somehow a better justification than "We just don't like brown people"? It's still institutional racism, whether conscience or not. It's still obvious racism, whether intentional or not.
Some issues have no middle ground. It's a major problem with the US today that so many people think that the truth is always in the middle. A rather stark example: I write an article to say rape is bad. Do I need to put in the point of view of a serial rapist justifying rape for it to be meaningful?

As for everyone else making the "Russian and German" argument, so what? They are usually portrayed as villains, it's getting silly and it's not right. Instead of saying "the Russians and Germans got in line first, so shut up" can't we just acknowledge this is a large issue and help all of them?

 

[HentMas]

is it wrong that i felt a giggle comming up when you said "less time blowing up guys that look like my dad"???

anywhay, i kind of see your point, but being from México i cant really relate to all this problems, i mean sure, being called a beaner or seen how in the border things are getting out of hand is extremely irritating, but there are no games or media really exploiting that kind of thing, so its... ok?? in a sense

 

[TraderJimmy]

This article will convince no-one. I'd like people to change a lot of attitudes, in fact everyone would like their views to be held by the majority (that is unless they're trying to be individuals) what makes you assume your attitude is right?

So he should just be silent about it and accept that arabs/muslims are good target practice in video games? That arabs/muslims and generally "brown-people" culture should be vilify for the enjoyment of some developed countries entertainment? Video Games are not exactly an obscure medium of entertainment anymore.

A few years down the line, and we will probably see a lot of games covering the conflicts in both Afghanistan and Iraq (guess who the bad guys are going to be). That's something that will happen no matter how many people are offended by it. If 1 million of Muslims died in the two conflicts combined, video gamers should be able to break that high score easily with video games.

Also, he has a cool name.

You're presenting a binary argument where there isn't one. This is doing no-one any favours.

The best way, in my mind, for Muslims to overcome the stigmas society has attached is by better attaching themselves to society. I'm not saying it's their fault, it's specific people within Islam, but it's their job to win people over. No-one gets given anything.

So he can write some smug article about how racist and bigoted westerners are, or he can realise that everyone's as racist as each other and that these arguments simply gain momentum here because a majority of us are better educated and thus 'they' need to change their method.

How many red-necks/racists/Muslim bashers do you think will be convinced by this? How many level headed, educated people do you think see things this black and white?

You can cherry pick an argument if you want, but all I see here is a writer putting his own publicity ahead of what will do the people he's 'supporting' the better deal, in my opinion.
Just because he's Muslim doesn't give him a more valid opinion than other other writer, nor will it shield him from criticism.

Your search for a righteous argument seems to have led you to condemning things that haven't even happened yet.

We've got enough on our plates to solve now before we worry about censoring future media.

Plus... I prefer my Salad Out. (I couldn't resist )

I didn't see any smugness there. Just a sense he felt left out of some games, because he wasn't represented. More well-done ethnic diversity in games = good is the argument, and it is a binary argument. I didn't see anything about censorship.

This isn't some declaration of a future constitution of America, it's an article on a games website saying "Wouldn't it be cool to have a relatable Islamic character in a game? Here are some games that've missed this opportunity. Here are some games that have SEIZED this opportunity, including Triple-A titles. I think the latter are improved games by including such a character."

That's what I got from it.

 

[Undead Dragon King]

I think that one of the problems of there being no "modern Muslim" heroes, as you seem to lament, is that to Western developers there really seem to be no Muslim archetypes today who fit that description. The closest I can think of would be moderate Muslims who take a stand against the supposed "hijacking" of their religion from the likes of the Saudi royal family, al-Qaeda, al-Sahab, Hamas, Hezbollah and the Taliban.

But the choruses of "civilians just trying to live their lives" dercying extremism from within the Muslim world are noticeably absent. Sure, every now and then we get a press release from the government of Pakistan vowing to fight the extremists, and Egypt is (at least nominally) helping blockade Hamas in Gaza, but that's about it. To many Westerners, this means that the average moderate Muslim in the Middle East either (a)does not care or supports the bloodthirsty ideologies of these groups, or (b) is too cowardly to speak up against them.

Neither of these options sound very heroic. Modern Muslims can have a place in our gaming world. But they must prove that they are capable of such heroics.

Following people would like to have a word with you on stopping to complain and get over it: Russians, Germans.

Quite right.

 

[junkmanuk]

http://www.theonion.com/articles/man-already-knows-everything-he-needs-to-know-abou,17990/

Hits the nail on the head I think

Another vote for this as the best response.

A fair few people are demonstrating their bigotry in this thread...

 

[IceStar100]

maybe if moderate muslims took a more front and center position against extremists, and took back your religion from facists that seek to define it and jihad as some war against non believers, instead of the internal struggle with faith.

back when christianity was putting philosophers and scientists and jews to death as evil and non believers. islam welcomed science and other faiths.

sure does not help the islamic cause when chrisitans on one hand are often ridiculed and made the but of jokes and downright belittlement they take more or less with a grain of salt. but south park dares use the name and "image" of muhammid and they get death threats pouring in so they have to bleep even the name.

islam can be a beautiful religion and people that follow it can be caring generous and accepting even of non believers, but far too often do the vocal minority of the extremists rise to the top and belittle the rest of you.

You sir hit the nail on the head. I would respect the religion a whole lot more if the moderates were more vocal and spoke out against the disgusting acts of these extremists. It's almost saddening to think that South park made a show about muhammed that blasted the other religions (Hindu Gods smoking dope, etc.) but when it comes to Muhammed there are death threats??? Something is wrong here.

This as long as the most violant are the most outspoken this is how it will be.

 

[CitySquirrel]

I'm not the only Muslim geek out there hoping to spend more of my gaming hours jumping off buildings in medieval Jerusalem and fewer of them blowing away guys who look like my Dad.

This was a great way to end this. It really puts a human face on the issue.

 

[cainx10a]

This article will convince no-one. I'd like people to change a lot of attitudes, in fact everyone would like their views to be held by the majority (that is unless they're trying to be individuals) what makes you assume your attitude is right?

So he should just be silent about it and accept that arabs/muslims are good target practice in video games? That arabs/muslims and generally "brown-people" culture should be vilify for the enjoyment of some developed countries entertainment? Video Games are not exactly an obscure medium of entertainment anymore.

A few years down the line, and we will probably see a lot of games covering the conflicts in both Afghanistan and Iraq (guess who the bad guys are going to be). That's something that will happen no matter how many people are offended by it. If 1 million of Muslims died in the two conflicts combined, video gamers should be able to break that high score easily with video games.

Also, he has a cool name.

You're presenting a binary argument where there isn't one. This is doing no-one any favours.

The best way, in my mind, for Muslims to overcome the stigmas society has attached is by better attaching themselves to society. I'm not saying it's their fault, it's specific people within Islam, but it's their job to win people over. No-one gets given anything. which boils down to integration of Muslims in western societies. Are they not integrated at all? I mean, are they just here like some other forum-dweller said only here to benefit from welfare and other flaws in the system? Ok, I will be honest, here in Canada, I don't exactly have any contact with my muslim friends on the same level I had back in my home country, but these people seems well integrated. They are getting educated, and working. They are functioning members of society. (note I'm only referring to Muslims here in Canada and the US, from what I get, Europeans tend to have it worst in a way)

So he can write some smug article about how racist and bigoted westerners are, or he can realise that everyone's as racist as each other and that these arguments simply gain momentum here because a majority of us are better educated and thus 'they' need to change their method. True, everyone is a little bit racist. We tend to emphasize on the "they/them" first, then look on our side of the fence. But remember Avatar? Popular movie, still have typical 'white' guy to save the aliens because apparently they can't save themselves. It's understandable considering WHO are the PRIMARY target audience? What needs to be change is that this 'primary' target audience need to include everyone. Something a simple character editor can do. Remember those arguments about the 'lack' of female protagonists? That could solve that problem all-together. The characters don't need to be painted completely as the minority/race they are representing. Does it matter if Gordon Freeman was an arab, an indian, or a latino? It doesn't.

How many red-necks/racists/Muslim bashers do you think will be convinced by this? How many level headed, educated people do you think see things this black and white? excellent point, but there are still people in-between those two groups

You can cherry pick an argument if you want, but all I see here is a writer putting his own publicity ahead of what will do the people he's 'supporting' the better deal, in my opinion.
Just because he's Muslim doesn't give him a more valid opinion than other other writer, nor will it shield him from criticism. there was a saying after 9/11 that Muslims opinions don't matter. Your criticism however is good criticism, but it doesn't change the fact that most of the things he said in this article, or anyone written by a gamer who also happens to be a minority will echo that (being a minority myself: although I must admit, games seem to ignore Indians (me ancestors, not originally from India) as the bad guys, I am deeply hurt. I always wanted to murder my gramps before he met my grandma.). Of course, I don't disagree that it is pretty pointless to know the back-story of the pixels you are shooting most of the time when they see no qualm in shooting you.

Your search for a righteous argument seems to have led you to condemning things that haven't even happened yet. Not looking for an argument over this point, but MoH (which after watching some videos felt just like a certain Modern Warfare game everyone plays) is getting released, and 6 Days was almost here (and I am particular glad it's not).

We've got enough on our plates to solve now before we worry about censoring future media. Is it about censorship? What exactly is being censored? Inclusion of Muslims-like characters as the bad guys? Games can be more than generic shooters or gratuitous US military fantasies. Also, what exactly do gamers have on their plates that need to be addressed first? BioWare has made the step forward with its acceptance of homosexuals in its games. What else? Dealing with how violent games are censored? That's probably the biggest and only issue the industry has (unless you want to count games addiction as another issue), but thanks to the 'freedomz' they hate us for, that will in the future, protect video games from unnecessary censorship as well considering the money the VG industry produces, I find it hard at this stage that the video industry is in a big danger of anything.

Plus... I prefer my Salad Out. (I couldn't resist ) No, you!

 

[Jkudo]

I think that one of the problems of there being no "modern Muslim" heroes, as you seem to lament, is that to Western developers there really seem to be no Muslim archetypes today who fit that description. The closest I can think of would be moderate Muslims who take a stand against the supposed "hijacking" of their religion from the likes of the Saudi royal family, al-Qaeda, al-Sahab, Hamas, Hezbollah and the Taliban.

But the choruses of "civilians just trying to live their lives" dercying extremism from within the Muslim world are noticeably absent. Sure, every now and then we get a press release from the government of Pakistan vowing to fight the extremists, and Egypt is (at least nominally) helping blockade Hamas in Gaza, but that's about it. To many Westerners, this means that the average moderate Muslim in the Middle East either (a)does not care or supports the bloodthirsty ideologies of these groups, or (b)is too cowardly to speak up against them.

Neither of these options sound very heroic. Modern Muslims can have a place in our gaming world. But they must prove that they are capable of such heroics.

Following people would like to have a word with you on stopping to complain and get over it: Russians, Germans.

Quite right
.

Yea we probably wouldnt hear what the civilians of arab nations are saying right now. There are muslim soldiers in many armies, and they have fought in many wars for there country.

 

[EvolutionKills]

Still, while a lot of races/ethnicities are under-represented as hero's, they still feel they don't come close to be vilified. So most of the hero's are caucasian, guess what? So are a LOT of the bad guys.

The big 'controversy' over Residnet Evil 5. Really, who here was at all surprised that the big-bad was still Umbrella and it's poster-child, Albert Wesker? Modern Warfare 2? Your own commander, General Shepard, betrays you (and the one Marines you play is 'Ramirez', a very Latino name).

I just never really cared one way or another. I am caucasian, and grew up in a predominantly white neighborhood. My high school, with a graduating class of 92, had just two black kids (and one of them was our class President). You know what that means? 99% of the assholes that I've ever had the misfortune of meeting face-to-face have been white. So yeah, maybe I'm just super jaded, but I've been hating my fellow man (regardless of race) for quite some time now.

 

[Gethsemani_v1legacy]

I find it odd that America's Army is mentioned. In the old America's Army, you played as the American Army with the Opposing Force being from an unnamed nation that just so happened to have Russian gear and weapons. In the Special Forces mode, there were indeed Muslims present, but they were on both sides (Both the American and OpFor) and were simply refered to as Indigenous Forces that assisted either sides Special Forces. In the latest installment of America's Army, the fight is taking place in a ficitional Eastern Bloc country against an OpFor that is seemingly inspired by Serbia. Perhaps I am wrong, but I distinctly recall that both Serbia and Russia are Orthodox Christian and not Muslim.

While I agree to some extent with the portrayal issue, someone has already mentioned that the same thing regularly happens with Russians (for Cold War/Modern) or Germans (for WW2). And let's be honest here, I don't play Modern Warfare for its' nuanced portrayal of geo-political conditions and the horrible nature of war. No, I play Modern Warfare because it is fun occasionally, to pretend you are soldier and a war hero.

 

[Saladin Ahmed]

Hey folks. This is my first Escapist article after being a longtime reader. So thanks for all the feedback, both critical and supportive. A few points:

1) A number of people have pointed out that Germans, Japanese, Russians, etc. have also been stereotyped in games. Um. Yes. But I'm not sure how this makes things any better. "Other people have gotten crappy treatment" isn't really an argument for crappy treatment being ok.

2) Re: Mafia II and the Italian gangster stereotype: While this, too, is offensive to some folks, I think there's a pretty huge difference (as some here have pointed out) in being the HERO, even when the hero's a criminal. Nowadays when moviemakers want a mobster they rarely go to the Italian American stereotype (there's a reason Mafia II's historical). Usually now we get the Albanian/Serbian/Russian etc. mob. But while Niko from GTA IV is a criminal and thus fits this new stereotype, he's also the POV character, the one we're rooting for and controlling. We get the moving story of how he got to be the way he is. We laugh at what he laughs at, get pissed off by the things that piss him off, etc. That's a huge difference. Similarly, Altair from Assasin's Creed is a cold-blooded killer trained by a fanatical sect -- on the surface, a Muslim stereotype if ever there was one. But he's humanized and fleshed out b/c he's the protagonist. That's different than an endless horde of might-as-well-be-orc towelheads who exist just to be mown down and deserve it because...well, they're *bad guys.*

3) A number of comments seem to basically start 'Well, until muslims stand up and refute the extremists...' So let me ask you: if you're white, do you feel the need to constantly apologize for the actions of the KKK? If you're Christian, do you feel the need to constantly apologize for the nutjobs that bomb abortion clinics? If you're American, do you feel the need to constantly apologize for the actions of a few soldiers at Abu Ghraib? Probably not. (See http://slacktivist.typepad.com/slacktivist/2010/08/please-forgive-me-for-the-actions-of-extremists-i-have-never-met-who-commit-acts-of-violence-that-i-.html)

4) The idea that this is 'just entertainment' is both wrong and right. Of course I realize that most gamers are not so zombiefied that they totally confuse the images of gaming with the real world. I mean, even *I* played the *hell* out of Metal Slug 2 back in the day, blowing the little SNK Ay-rabs to kingdom come and didn't feel compelled to then go blow away my relatives. But anyone who claims that videogames don't have any effect on our culture, or that media doesn't help in subtle ways to shape our perceptions about who's a good guy and who's a bad guy is just not paying attention to reality.

 

[Saladin Ahmed]

Yeah, I think this is absolutely true. And I think RPGs have even more potential for nuance. What I'd really love to see, in fact, is a Dragon Age-style 'open morality' type game with an Arabian Nights theme...

[ETA: this is in response to StageTree @ #43]