My Experience with Fallout 2

[JPH330]

Okay, I liked Fallout 3 a lot, so I figured it would make sense to try out the original Fallout games. I knew they were very different, I knew they were traditional, turn-based, slow-paced RPGs with an emphasis on roleplaying, but I figured that wouldn't be a problem because I like playing D&D, which is about as traditional as you can get. Not to mention that I've played my fair share of complex RPGs. I got almost to the end of FF6 and FF8. I've beaten KOTOR. I played quite a bit of Oblivion. So I think it should be clear that I like RPGs. And yet when I played Fallout 2, I didn't have one bit of fun.

I got the Fallout collection (Fallout 1 and 2, and Fallout Tactics), but Fallout 1 didn't seem to run properly on my computer for whatever reason, and I know that there's an arbitrary time limit throughout the game anyway and I don't want to have to deal with that, so I figured I'll just stick with Fallout 2.

The big problem I have with Fallout 2 is that the interface is very complicated, and they don't really explain much. Sure, they explain what each of the stats does (basically) but it's hard to tell what you're really going to need and what's just going to be a waste of points. With my first character I put most of my S.P.E.C.I.A.L. points into Charisma and Intelligence, because I wanted him to be able to talk through most problems, but then I found that right at the start of the game you're forced to go through a dungeon with lots of big mutant insect things, and at the end you have to win a punchout against some douchebag. This didn't go very well at all, so I rerolled my character with a focus on strength, agility and intelligence, and specialized in melee weapons.

When I'm playing this game in general, I really get the impression that my character is not anywhere near optimized, and I don't mind that very much, but I also get the impression that I'm not taking full advantage of the stuff I have. All the fights I've had so far have just amounted to me repeatedly smacking the monster with my spear while he smacks me with his claws or his fangs or whatever, and considering I've heard tons of people go on about how this game is so big on strategy, I'm pretty sure this is not how things are supposed to go. Not to mention that I've run into a lot of problems where the only way I could solve them was to go through each of the interface screens and just press buttons until something happened. When I was low on health and it wouldn't let me use first aid anymore, I just had to open up each screen and press anything that looked like a button until I found that the "rest" button was located at the top of the Pip-Boy screen. Not sure how I was supposed to guess that, but whatever.

I really get the feeling that I'm supposed to have read the manual to know what the fuck is going on. I've gotten this impression with other games before. It's just too bad that I bought the game online and don't have a manual. This would be easily solvable by having some sort of tutorial level, where the game would gradually introduce each game feature that you'll need to know while simultaneously giving you plot exposition and introducing you to the world of Fallout. Wait a minute, I remember a game that had that. Fallout 3!

You see, I'm not against depth and complexity. Like I said before, I've played plenty of complex RPGs, including the godfather of RPGs itself, D&D. My problem with Fallout 2 wasn't that I thought it was boring; I just don't really have any way of following the game's interface and all that. And frankly, I don't blame that on my unwillingness to learn, I blame that on the game's unwillingness to tell me anything. User-friendliness is commonly considered a good thing, after all.

Anyway, I'm not trying to say that Fallout 2 is a bad game; I'm sure it's a great game, considering how much of a fanbase it has. But I also think it's perfectly reasonable for someone to have liked Fallout 3 more than Fallout 2, because its interface is a hell of a lot more intuitive. I'm fully aware that Fallout 3 had plenty of flaws, and I have no doubt in my mind that the original Fallout games had much better writing, but what I resent is that whenever I mention that I liked Fallout 3 more, people on forums like the Escapist accuse me of being some A.D.D. suffering Halo freak who can't play a game for more than a minute without seeing an explosion. This is completely wrong. I don't even like FPS games that much; at least, not nearly as much as most of my friends do. That has to be the absolute worst case of elitism I've ever seen, and yet so many people do it.

So anyway, if you want to flame me now and call me a retard, go for it. If you have any advice on how I could make the Fallout 2 interface easier to follow, that would be cool too. Or if you want to agree with me, I'm fine with that. But let me clarify one more time that I don't think Fallout 2 is a bad game. I just think it's unfair to say that no sane person could possibly like Fallout 3 more.

EDIT: Apparently my problem isn't really with the interface, since I seem to have a better understanding of the game than I thought I did. I don't know what to say then. I just didn't think it was fun, I guess.

 

[JPH330]

fallout 1 only has a time limit for the first quest. after that its gone but DOES punish you if you dick around too much and not do the 2nd and last quest. if you complete the last quest you can continue playing for 13 in-game years (you will complete all side quests LONG before the 13 year mark). this isn't a time limit, its a problem with the ENGINE the game was based on.

the interface is easy, find a way to play fallout 1 and that will be a good tutorial. Fallout: tactics has a tutorial and pretty much uses the same interface. use the tutorial there.

I actually did use the tutorial in Fallout Tactics, but that only explained the very basic elements that I pretty much was able to figure out on my own, like how to attack a monster. If that's really all I need to know, then hell, maybe the game isn't as complex as everyone has been telling me. But I figured since people refer to it as THE BEST RPG EVER!!!, there would be more to it than that.

 

[Tribalbeat]

The big problem I have with Fallout 2 is that the interface is very complicated, and they don't really explain much. Sure, they explain what each of the stats does (basically) but it's hard to tell what you're really going to need and what's just going to be a waste of points.

Read the manual. It explains everything.

With my first character I put most of my S.P.E.C.I.A.L. points into Charisma and Intelligence, because I wanted him to be able to talk through most problems, but then I found that right at the start of the game you're forced to go through a dungeon with lots of big mutant insect things, and at the end you have to win a punchout against some douchebag.

You can talk to him and convince him that there is no reason to fight. After that you can pretty much talk though every encounter you will have.

When I'm playing this game in general, I really get the impression that my character is not anywhere near optimized, and I don't mind that very much, but I also get the impression that I'm not taking full advantage of the stuff I have.

You say this like it is a fault of the game, just check the Fallout wiki or consult the manual to see what stuff does.

All the fights I've had so far have just amounted to me repeatedly smacking the monster with my spear while he smacks me with his claws or his fangs or whatever, and considering I've heard tons of people go on about how this game is so big on strategy, I'm pretty sure this is not how things are supposed to go.

You are right, it's not supposed to go that way.

Not to mention that I've run into a lot of problems where the only way I could solve them was to go through each of the interface screens and just press buttons until something happened. When I was low on health and it wouldn't let me use first aid anymore, I just had to open up each screen and press anything that looked like a button until I found that the "rest" button was located at the top of the Pip-Boy screen. Not sure how I was supposed to guess that, but whatever.

That happened to me also. It sucked because everyone kept saying that I looked tired and wouldn't talk to me.

I really get the feeling that I'm supposed to have read the manual to know what the fuck is going on. I've gotten this impression with other games before. It's just too bad that I bought the game online and don't have a manual. This would be easily solvable by having some sort of tutorial level, where the game would gradually introduce each game feature that you'll need to know while simultaneously giving you plot exposition and introducing you to the world of Fallout. Wait a minute, I remember a game that had that. Fallout 3!

Where did you buy it from? I am pretty sure both STEAM and GOG comes with the manual.

http://www.nma-fallout.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=56087
Download that right away, it is a major fix for a lot of the bugs and just makes the game much more fun to play.

 

[Chomajig]

I had the exact same idea as you and bought fallout collection. For me, Fallout 2 didn't work, and Tactics was kinda shitty. Fallout was good for the first few towns, but after a while I just lost any sense of direction and had no idea where I was going. The problem with going backwards through time is that the games gradually lose more and more features that you've grown to like. This problem is multiplied exponentially with RPG's. It's like many games which were ground-breaking at the time, but now feel outdated and clunky. I also agree with you that all the fighting was more or less to just hit or shoot something to death for every single enemy. The only RPG that is still awesome after 14 years (not including updated versions of old games) is Pokemon Red, Blue and Yellow.

 

[MiracleOfSound]

I played all 3 games and fallout 3 is by far my favorite of the 3.

Also, this will help you learn the basics of Fallout 2, and help if you get utterly stuck at one point like I did:

http://user.tninet.se/~jyg699a/fallout2.html

 

[JPH330]

I had the exact same idea as you and bought fallout collection. For me, Fallout 2 didn't work, and Tactics was kinda shitty. Fallout was good for the first few towns, but after a while I just lost any sense of direction and had no idea where I was going. The problem with going backwards through time is that the games gradually lose more and more features that you've grown to like. This problem is multiplied exponentially with RPG's. It's like many games which were ground-breaking at the time, but now feel outdated and clunky. I also agree with you that all the fighting was more or less to just hit or shoot something to death for every single enemy. The only RPG that is still awesome after 14 years (not including updated versions of old games) is Pokemon Red, Blue and Yellow.

Yeah, you pretty much hit the nail in the head. I'm sure Fallout 2 looked great for its time, but now it just seems really unappealing. And considering I grew up playing shit like Warcraft 2, I don't think it'd be fair to argue that I get bored too easily. To me, Fallout 3 is just a lot more immersive and fun than its predecessors. And frankly, I don't really want to spend so much time and effort trying to like a game that doesn't entertain me as much as other games of mine do, just so that I can be considered one of the "real" Fallout fans.

 

[jpoon]

I have Fallout 2 on my computer and to me it's pure nostalgia in the hayday of my gaming bonanza. It's clunky, and slow but it sure was a lot of fun so it still is enjoyable to me today. If I were younger I'm sure I would have a different opinion based on the games we have now. Now with more non-user-friendliness!

 

[oplinger]

I had a lot of fun with Fallout 2. ...But I got into it without a hitch. :X so I can't really comment I guess.

It, like most RPGs, starts slow, really slow...but gets exponentially better as you progress. Just like FO1.

Most satisfying is when the number of enemies goes up. So you just sit there...sniping all their eyes out.. critting for massive damage. It made me happy. That's really late in the game though.

 

[Keava]

See, just recently there was article here on The Escapist about people these days not being able to handle old cRPGs. Congratulation, you fit that group. You were most likely raised alongside games that had extensive tutorial sections that for good hour or more explain every little mechanic of the gameplay that for me are just reincarnation of Clippy, the annoying MS Office assistant. Can't be helped really.

cRPGs like BG, IWD, P:T, or Fallout were made for the story and atmosphere loving crowd, not the twitchy shooty/hack and slash types. Maybe it's just not your boat.

 

[JPH330]

See, just recently there was article here on The Escapist about people these days not being able to handle old cRPGs. Congratulation, you fit that group. You were most likely raised alongside games that had extensive tutorial sections that for good hour or more explain every little mechanic of the gameplay that for me are just reincarnation of Clippy, the annoying MS Office assistant. Can't be helped really.

cRPGs like BG, IWD, P:T, or Fallout were made for the story and atmosphere loving crowd, not the twitchy shooty/hack and slash types. Maybe it's just not your boat.

Out of curiosity, just how old do you think I am?

 

[Mr.Petey]

With my first character I put most of my S.P.E.C.I.A.L. points into Charisma and Intelligence, because I wanted him to be able to talk through most problems, but then I found that right at the start of the game you're forced to go through a dungeon with lots of big mutant insect things, and at the end you have to win a punchout against some douchebag.

That bit just takes a bit of time and it's worth upping the strength and unarmed skill to thump the ants and radscorpions to death. Plus I think with the right combination you can talk your way out of that last scrap. Lets see....apparently with enough in speech or steal you can either talk your way of that fight or nick his key.

I did the game with a high small guns skill, steal skill (you could always reload the game if they turned hostile and some for speech as it pays off later in the game, just like Fallout 3...almost anyway

 

[Srdjan]

Man you did not play complex RPG, FF is jRPG and they are not like cRPG-s, and KotOR an Oblivion use very simplified rules, so they are not complex too.

You didn't have fun because you sucked. Read manual twice, set to easy and then try.

 

[Keava]

]Out of curiosity, just how old do you think I am?

According to your birth date in profile you are 18 so you are pretty much half my age.

 

[JPH330]

Man you did not play complex RPG, FF is jRPG and they are not like cRPG-s, and KotOR an Oblivion use very simplified rules, so they are not complex too.

You didn't have fun because you sucked. Read manual twice, set to easy and then try.

Well, I figured the elitist pricks were gonna show up sooner or later...

If you consider D&D to not be a complex RPG, then you must not know much about D&D.

 

[JPH330]

]Out of curiosity, just how old do you think I am?

According to your birth date in profile you are 18 so you are pretty much half my age.

Okay, good, you're smart enough to check.

Awhile ago I posted a thread talking about how I don't get why elitists argue that using emulators disqualifies you from being a "real gamer", and some of the people who replied talked to me as if I were 8 years old, saying stuff like "well I think it's cool that the new generation is willing to try out games of the past, and blah blah blah you young whippersnappers..." And that bothered me because I myself grew up with an SNES.

Anyway, yeah, these games might just not be my thing. Well, except that I played quite a bit of Baldur's Gate 2 and enjoyed it, so that might discount that argument a bit, but my main problem is that the people who do like traditional cRPGs act like they're better than people like me, just because we like different kinds of games. That's just flat-out ignorance.

 

[Mr.Petey]

Man you did not play complex RPG, FF is jRPG and they are not like cRPG-s, and KotOR an Oblivion use very simplified rules, so they are not complex too.

You didn't have fun because you sucked. Read manual twice, set to easy and then try.

That's hardly a helpful response. Just because it's a western RPG makes it no more difficult than a Jrpg. They're different yes but it doesn't mean he has to slam down the difficulty to easy JUST because he got off to a rocky start (he did state he was well versed with other RPGS too)

 

[JPH330]

Man you did not play complex RPG, FF is jRPG and they are not like cRPG-s, and KotOR an Oblivion use very simplified rules, so they are not complex too.

You didn't have fun because you sucked. Read manual twice, set to easy and then try.

Well, I figured the elitist pricks were gonna show up sooner or later...

If you consider D&D to not be a complex RPG, then you must not know much about D&D.

I know D&D, I also know many GMs who will lower the campanigh difficulty so you can play them, but fuck, computer won't do that would he?

I didn't say "you sucked", which you obviuslly do, to prove myself that I'm superhuman created by God to play Fallout 2, I said it so you could fucking know that you need to learn more about a game and became better at it, so you can enjoy it like rest of us.

I WILL KICK YOUR ASS AT HALO SON.

Yeah, sorry, didn't realize you were being sarcastic. Or maybe you're just trying to troll, and if that's the case then you fail.

 

[Srdjan]

Man you did not play complex RPG, FF is jRPG and they are not like cRPG-s, and KotOR an Oblivion use very simplified rules, so they are not complex too.

You didn't have fun because you sucked. Read manual twice, set to easy and then try.

Well, I figured the elitist pricks were gonna show up sooner or later...

If you consider D&D to not be a complex RPG, then you must not know much about D&D.

I know D&D, I also know many GMs who will lower the campanigh difficulty so you can play them, but fuck, computer won't do that would he?

I didn't say "you sucked", which you obviuslly do, to prove myself that I'm superhuman created by God to play Fallout 2, I said it so you could fucking know that you need to learn more about a game and became better at it, so you can enjoy it like rest of us.

I WILL KICK YOUR ASS AT HALO SON.

Yeah, sorry, didn't realize you were being sarcastic. Or maybe you're just trying to troll, and if that's the case then you fail.

Yes I was trolling. After few months, 700 posts on this forum I just came to topic about one of my favorite games and started trolling. (This was also sarcastic). And also I don't fail, I anything. (This wasn't sarcastic)

 

[JPH330]

Yes I was trolling. After few months, 700 posts on this forum I just came to topic about one of my favorite games and started trolling. (This was also sarcastic). And also I don't fail, I anything. (This wasn't sarcastic)

You anything?

Me hungry! Me want food!