My thoughts on "Avatar"

[ShotgunShaman]

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Wow. This review is totally backwards. People are seeing a movie that's amazingly enjoyable to see, but that isn't amazing when you think about it later. So you move right past the enjoying it, to give us a bad report on what we knew.

See it. Ignore the message, just enjoy it for what it is, because what it is is DAMN fun to watch.

 

[vampirekid.13]

Okay, this may come off as rather ill-informed, since I admit right up front that I've not seen the movie Avatar, but that's because I feel that from everything I've seen from trailers, heard in a review from The Escapist and heard from others who have seen it, I really don't need to go see the movie to get the major gist of it. And what I've heard has convinced me that while I may enjoy the movie visually, I would be inwardly groaning at the plot, hence I'm not going to waste my money on it.

Since I haven't seen the film I can't really spoil anything, but I will warn you I'm about to lay out the basics of the plot as I've heard it; of course it's nothing you probably haven't already guessed if you've seen more than two commercials for the thing. So here's the basic premise: humanity has developed interplanetary travel and has discovered a planet with a mineral that's highly valuable. But there's a native population on the planet who, naturally, are like space elves in that they live in harmony with nature.

So it should be no shock to anybody with at least a high school education that this movie is about the evil human beings (in particular the military) who want to rape the environment for its resources and the brave tribal aliens who try to stop them. God, I am so sick of Hollywood's liberal agenda. To these people the military has no positive qualities ever and there's no such thing as responsible, eco-friendly industry. It makes me want to puke.

Now I've heard praise heaped on Avatar for its visuals and I will admit, what I've seen has been visually impressive. Even knowing a lot of it is CG doesn't take away from the amazing detail they've put into it. But as a writer, visuals aren't enough for me. If the characters' behavior is unbelievable, their dialogue hackneyed and forced, or the overall plot unappealing, I'm not going to be impressed.

Two things seem incredibly ironic to me here. This movie, from all accounts, has a plot with the usual liberal environmental agenda, and liberals are known for saying they don't like extremes or absolutes. And yet when you bring up things like the military or industry, they seem convinced that it's all bad; how extreme and absolute is THAT?

The other thing that strikes me as ironic is who made this movie. Avatar was produced by 20th Century FOX. That's right; the same Fox corporation owned by Rupert Murdoch, the man so many have painted as a right-wing, conservative anti-Christ, MADE A MOVIE WITH A PRO-ENVIRONMENTAL MESSAGE BEHIND IT. But do you think he or Fox will get any credit for this? I wouldn't bet on it.

Now before anyone gets any thoughts about me, seeing as how I'm conservative myself, I just want to make it clear that I think protecting the environment is a good thing. As a reporter, I'm on the environmental beat, and I think that a lot of the efforts people make that I report on are great. I cover student groups planting beach grasses to help stabilize shorelines, environmental groups helping build oyster reefs to bring back the oyster populations and help clean the water, and other sorts of efforts of that nature. Personally I think its a good idea to protect the environment and to avoid harming it.

However, I do see the need to take advantage of natural resources. But I think it should be done responsibly. Harvest trees for lumber, but remember to plant new ones after that's done. Use eco-friendly pesticides to protect crops. Conduct mining operations that do as little damage to the surface ground as possible.

Now, with that out of the way, one last thought. Some people may think its easy to rail on typical political agenda plots without suggesting a solution. But I actually have an idea for what they COULD have done in Avatar to make it a little more politically balanced. It's simple; the protagonist would have been placed in his alien hybrid body and told to gather data on the Na'vi so they could try to find a way to find a diplomatic solution to the problem. The plan could have succeeded, and humans and the na'vi could have begun making plans to cooperate and coexist. But extremists on both sides, military fanatics on one and na'vi xenophobes on the other, wouldn't approve of the peaceful cooperation and would start doing everything possible to destroy the peace and engage in an all-out war between their races. Hence it would be up to the heroes of both races to find a way to stop the warmongers on both sides before peaceful coexistence between the two was shattered.

Now that would have been a movie I would've paid to see.

you need to chill. its a movie. not really a portrayal of real life at the moment. just a movie. go watch it and enjoy it for what it is instead of trying to make loose connections to real life situations.

 

[BGH122]

True, it's not necessarily pro-military, but it certainly comes across as pro-torture, or at least in a way...* I understand that torture in the show is more of a device to move the plot along at the pace dictated by the layout of the show, but my point here is that I can leave my personal sensibilities at the sideline while I enjoy a good show, as, you understand, it's not real and all...
I can cheer for the hero of the story without dissecting and complaining on the internet that he is a tool of the Bush administration, because he isn't. he's a charactor, and after watching all the episodes, my opinions about tortune are still the same.

Look, I'm all for saving the environment, but some points of the movie Avatar pushed this a little hard (that I was sitting there saying, "ok, I get it, let s move on now"), but I understand we had to cover the plight of the Navi (sp?) people to move forward. The movie is 3 hours long though, so almost everything is drawn out.
At the end of the day though, see the damn movie. It's not going to convert you, but if you can put up with the environmental message parts of the movie, you will surely be entertained.

*In the way that it justifies it, and yet pushes plot points (rarely) that demonise it.

I've only rarely watched 24, so I'm a little out of my depths on this particular debate. But, an issue such a torture really doesn't seem the same as an issue such as environmentalism or imperialism. Torture is a means of achieving a desired end such as enforcing an ideology, it can't be an ideology unto itself. We can disagree with the efficacy or moral justification for using torture at all, but any personal opinions about torture are likely a result of other larger ideological beliefs upon which it rests. For instance, as a liberal, one might feel that the government should never be in a position to exert that kind of force over another, or one might feel that we have a right to be protected from torture, however, our opinion of torture is not formed directly, but instead indirectly by higher ideological beliefs. It itself isn't an ideology, but an implementation of an ideology with which the viewer may find contention.

However, ideas such as imperialism or environmentalism are purely ideological. They are not used to achieve the ends of an ideology, but are instead ideologies unto themselves. If a film/show is in support of using torture (as with 24), then it is using it to achieve an end which you may or may not agree with, but it is nonetheless a means of plot progression rather than ideological propaganda. The character will use torture, not on ideological grounds, but because it is necessary in the context of the wider ideological backdrop of the film/show (anti-terrorism, strong patriotism in the case of 24). Environmentalism or anti-Imperialism as themes can't be used in such a way: one can't utilize the concept of pseudo-pantheism tree hugging to achieve a particular ideological end.

But, to escape from this quagmire of philosophical tossery, my main contention is that it appears to me that shows such as 24 are not created to serve as a mouth piece for a particular ideological issue. Sure, from time to time certain ideologies may flick up to add variety or some form of real-life relatability, but its overriding purpose isn't to glorify a particular ideological stance (although the underlying patriotism-slant does seem constant in the few episodes I've watched, I guess if you were very anti-patriotism then the show would be annoying). Conversely, it seems that at least a major glamorised theme within Avatar is environmentalism. Why would I go to see a work of fiction which relies upon a factual ideology with which I disagree? It won't alter my view of said ideology because it's a view based upon reason, not emotion.

It seems illogical, furthermore, to say that I should see the movie and just essentially ignore a major part of plot. How could I possibly maintain my suspense of disbelief (so intrinsically tied to the power of a movie to suck me into the plot) if I was actively preventing myself from engaging with the film? I'm well aware that it won't convert me or change my ideas, but it's a straw man fallacy to raise this point; I've never claimed that I would be converted by the film, merely that its message will prevent me from enjoying it. Though, as I have already stated, I believe the OP would have been better served by creating a thread that looks at the political bias of the media without going into specifics on a film he's not seen.

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Wow. This review is totally backwards. People are seeing a movie that's amazingly enjoyable to see, but that isn't amazing when you think about it later. So you move right past the enjoying it, to give us a bad report on what we knew.

See it. Ignore the message, just enjoy it for what it is, because what it is is DAMN fun to watch.

There's also a wider problem with this "live in the moment, don't think about the message" attitude. Sadly, due to consumer capitalism, if you choose to endorse a movie with a bad message then you give the go-ahead for more movies of its kind to be made.

 

[sauerkraus]

OP, I support you, don't let these guys get you down with their "great effects" and "amazing 3d experience"