Need Some advice (SC2)

[Karnot]

Dear community,

I have been recently searching for a RTS game, And I am contemplating to purchase Starcraft 2.
I have played Starcraft 1 + brood wars with friends but that was quite a while ago. Recently I downloaded the demo version of Starcraft 2 to try it out. There is alot of things to like about the game, but there are some things that make me unsure about purchasing the game.

First of from the looks of it, it looks like Starcraft 2 is a highly competitive game. And I am not really a competitive type of player. I like playing against people but I mainly play for fun. I do not really care about rankings, ladders or getting into the diamon league or whatever. So my question is even if I am not a highly competitive player, will I enjoy playing the game?

The second thing is that Starcraft 2 moves at a high pace (battles can be over in a matter of seconds it seems), you have build orders, the meta, etc.
It is kind of hard to get into at first it seems, and looks like it is also a deterrent for new players.
Or is it just a thing you have to get used to by playing against the AI and/or friends.

The last thing is concerning multiplayer games. As I said before I don't really care about climbing the rankings, And I don't mind losing as long it are good and fun mathces. Not the kinds of matches that are over in 5-10 minutes or the kind of mathces where you know that you have absolutely no chance of winning or are juist being stombed by some cheese tactic. I myself dont really like spamming 1 unit over and over again.

So with that in mind is Starcraft 2 a game that I could enjoy and have fun playing it? if someone could give me some pointers and advice on it that would be great. Thank you in advance.

PS.
Here is a list of Strategy games that I have played

- Dawn of war 1 & 2
- Heroes of might and magic series
- Command & conquer series (all of them expect for C&C 4 and Red alert 3, I really disliked Red alert 3)
- Total war series (Rome, medieval 1 & 2)
- Age of mythology
-Blitzkrieg 2
- Sudden Strike
- Company of Heroes 1 + expacs
- Age of wonder 3

There are more but these are the Strategy games that I played most.

 

[Silence]

So you want to play mostly multiplayer?

The community is quite competitive, but I don't think that should hold you back. The Matchmaking-System in place is good enough that"getting stomped" happens rarely (maybe the first few games when the system decides in which league to place you).
I don't know if you have experience with other MMR-based games, but I think they have improved quite rapidly in recent years.

I would recommend learning some build orders though, it's just the nature of these really fast paced RTS. If I interpret your list of games you have played correctly I think it will be a lot faster than what you are used to. So that is something to decide.

"Cheeses" happen (these are the strategies used to end the game in 5-10 or less minutes), but I hope they are not prevalent. A few years ago they weren't. I would think maybe one in ten games was a cheese. Scouting is important, if you know it is coming you can stop these pushes mostly easy.
Most matches will be 20-30 minutes, I think.

If you have friends to play with I would recommend the game instantly.


So: I recommend learning about build orders and scouting and which unit counters which before going into multiplayer. I think you can have long, fun matches. But there will be occasional cheese. It's really diverse in what can happen.

I hope that helped a little bit. I have not played SC2 in a long time (want to get back into it with the new expansion maybe), so I cant't talk about how the current meta is. But I had lots of fun and I know people who still do casual matches now and then, not playing competitively.

 

[Karnot]

Yes this helpes alot thank you. Would be handy though if someone who is playing SC2 could give some info on the current state of the game. But still this info is verry useful.

 

[BloatedGuppy]

Yes this helpes alot thank you. Would be handy though if someone who is playing SC2 could give some info on the current state of the game. But still this info is verry useful.

Last time I played was shortly after HOTS launched (Heart of the Swarm, not Heroes of the Storm...stupid Blizzard and their stupid acronyms). The game's community has shrunk quite a lot, and what remains is 1) very experienced and 2) very cutthroat. I can only imagine it's much worse now, this far out from the last expansion.

RTS games are pretty much on their last leg, and very much in need of a revival. MOBA's stole almost their entire audience. I've heard good things about Grey Goo, although more along the lines of "services an under-serviced genre" rather than being a great game in its own right.

 

[Signa]

Maybe I'm just biased, but SC2 looks really bad to me. Personally, I need to have a proper zoom feature in my RTS games so I can get a good overview of the battlefield. Supreme Commander and Sins of a Solar Empire are great RTS games because of that. Supcom is a lot closer in playstyle to SC2, so I'd look into that. When I played it when it came out, the community was competitive, but not assholish about it either.

 

[andy_amfad]

SC2 isn't bad, but it isn't the kind of game where you have any time to sit back, zoom in and enjoy the action.
It takes all your attention to just do the things that you have to do to not die.

The graphics are clear, informative, and unambiguous, that's exactly what the game needs.

I used to love it, but you have to keep up with the meta and stuff and i couldn't really be bothered cos i like playing other games too.

 

[shintakie10]

Yes this helpes alot thank you. Would be handy though if someone who is playing SC2 could give some info on the current state of the game. But still this info is verry useful.

Last time I played was shortly after HOTS launched (Heart of the Swarm, not Heroes of the Storm...stupid Blizzard and their stupid acronyms). The game's community has shrunk quite a lot, and what remains is 1) very experienced and 2) very cutthroat. I can only imagine it's much worse now, this far out from the last expansion.

RTS games are pretty much on their last leg, and very much in need of a revival. MOBA's stole almost their entire audience. I've heard good things about Grey Goo, although more along the lines of "services an under-serviced genre" rather than being a great game in its own right.

Really? Felt pretty good to me still. Granted I'm in Bronze hell because I'm friggin terrible at the game since I spend all my time playin custom games, but still.

Maybe its different at the higher rankings.

"Cheeses" happen (these are the strategies used to end the game in 5-10 or less minutes), but I hope they are not prevalent. A few years ago they weren't. I would think maybe one in ten games was a cheese. Scouting is important, if you know it is coming you can stop these pushes mostly easy.
Most matches will be 20-30 minutes, I think.

Cheese happens more or less depending on league. In bronze its every once in a while, luckily everyone is really really bad at it so its not hard to fight against. I still see people tryin to 6 pool ling rush games which is always a god awful idea. Back when I was good enough to actually get in higher leagues I noticed that high silver and low-high gold is where the cheese gets ridiculous.

On topic!

I'd give it a shot. The ELO system is really really good about keepin you at around a 50% win rate. Outside of when I got a hot streak in my placement matches and got stuck way higher than I should of (seriously, mid silver at best here and I ended up in gold. That was a really awful couple weeks) matches rarely, if ever, didn't feel competitive. Plus you can rank yourself against AI or play in 2v2, 3v3 matches (and 2v2 and 3v3 AI which is fantastic for noncompetitive types since it scales the AI difficulty with your relative skill level) which I feel not enough games take advantage of.

Even better, the custom games are fantastic as well. Its not as robust as WC3 maps (still don't see all that much custom assets, which is a shame), but there are a ton of different fun games to play. For a while I spent almost all of my time simply playing that weird Bar Brawl card game.

 

[visiblenoise]

My experience with multiplayer was not that great. I felt like I only had good, entertaining games when I was really in the zone - otherwise, the game would be up really quickly. And I don't think I ever would have been able to even understand how people played the game if I didn't have a friend who drilled the basics into me. Sure, I could have looked it up online, but I'm not inclined to learn that much about a game that I'm not even that into yet. It's a game that requires you to know a lot of details before you can have fun games online.

The first single player campaign was pretty fun though, so even though I probably only played the multiplayer for a few months before losing interest, I didn't feel like I wasted my money.

 

[andy_amfad]

Don't forget all of the awesome mods too. There's single player campaigns, the ones from the original Starcraft and Brood War have been redone in the SC2 engine. The game is much better for the single player experience IMO unless you have the time and skill to get really good at it.

If you want to get good, i would recommend watching this: http://day9.tv/d/Day9/day9-daily-132-back-to-basics-the-mental-checklist/ and see if that's the kind of thing you would enjoy doing.

 

[WhiteFangofWhoa]

No Multiplayer unless you have a great deal of time to devote to practise and a strong internet connection. Without these you won't even make it out of Bronze League, and the community is almost half as toxic as a MOBA.

I quit playing it about six months ago out of how samey most games turned out, how frustrating it was, and how quickly most matches were decided after 30+ minutes of careful planning and concentration without any distractions. As I had with the first game I mained Protoss for the most durable units, but even their shielded armies melt in microseconds, giving you no time to do anything tactics-wise but A-move with your whole group and pray yours comes out ahead.

Single player campaign is pretty good though.

 

[mrbonzai211]

Go to their official forums... half the posts are about the game being dead. I played a couple thousand matches but havent touched it in over 2 years. The game died because every time they found balance they would destroy it in the next patch. The last straw for me was when they added widow mines and 2 or 3 could take out a max army of mutas.

 

[cleric of the order]

Dear community,
- Command & conquer series (all of them expect for C&C 4 and Red alert 3, I really disliked Red alert 3)

Yeah, I dislike it too.
Casual multiplayer doesn't make much sense to me so I'm just going to throw games the wall to see what sticks.
Okay, Myth the fallen lords. cult following, think melee
The first two age of wonders and shadow magic. just doo itt
Rise of nations, rise of legends. not sure if still there
Homeworlds, do it already just play it
Xcom already All of them do it. now.
Valkyrie chronicles
Supreme comander. pretty okay
titan attacks. yeah nvm
Stronghold crusader.
Overlord. <shut up it is.
Endless, anything.
Bannersaga.
fire emblem all of them
Orge tatics
FFTA
Blackguards
Conquest of Elysium
Civ
[edit] or just start playing TGs.[edit]

 

[GentlemanJ]

The trick with Starcraft is it isn't just an "army commander simulator" it's a "army commander simulator where all of the army must be given exact instructions on how to do anything."
So it's a combination of scouting your opponent, good base design, good building strategy, efficient and well timed spending strategy, and very fast mouse control.
If you want a game where you're strongly in the role of what a semi-realistic army commander would be doing, avoid it. If you don't mind the fact that you're effectively controlling everything that happens to a very low level give it a shot.

I've played it pretty regularly since it came out, as have the majority of people still playing. So you're probably going to get stomped to start with by people with years of experience. Still, plenty of fun with friends, or if you can find a good custom game. Also there's still enough of a player base that you wont have to wait more than 1 minute for a classic 1 on 1 game.

 

[mrbonzai211]

If you are serious about it, the official forum has sub sections where you can find a mentor who will teach you to play. You will need a headset and skype, but they will coach you and watch your game replays and help you become fluent in the metagame. With the competition at the current elite level that it is, even bronze league is daunting. Bronze now is what gold used to be a few years ago. If you don't find a coach/mentor teach you in-game, then there's no chance you will tolerate the constant losing and will give after a couple weeks.

GLHF

 

[ObsidianJones_v1legacy]

You've mentioned Dawn of War 2. I'm wondering if you've tried the Elite mod [http://www.dawnofwar.info/#] or the Codex Edition [https://steamcommunity.com/groups/DoW2-CE] mods?

Elite does a few good touch ups to Retail edition, but Codex really reworks a lot. For example, in Codex the Heroes are the Force Commander, A Reclusiarch, and the Master Librarian. All scouts receive a sniper with the upgrade, not just one. More vechicle types. You get to choose your type of Land Raider... It's a bit rough around the edges but it's a giant leap from Retail in terms of what is added.

 

[Denamic]

I wasn't a competitive player either, or even an RTS gamer for that matter, but then I got the SC2 beta and gave it a whirl. Pressed Zerg and entered a game; lost horribly. Before I knew it, I had played over a thousand games and was in Diamond league. The game is crack, and a gateway drug to dota 2, which is super crack.

I can't recommend you watch Day9's videos on the youtubes enough. He's got so goddamn much SC2 content aimed at teaching you the game, it's ridiculous. And he's really good at it too.

Oh, and even if you don't like vanilla SC2 online, there's a lot of custom games with a lot of variety.

Edit: When you get to silver or gold league, be wary of cheese tactics. Silver is when people start understanding the game and the race dynamics and start deploying actual strategies. Simple strategies, mind. Rush tactics. Keep calm and don't shit your pants and you can snatch victory from the jaws of bullshit fairly easily.

 

[Rack]

Don't forget all of the awesome mods too. There's single player campaigns, the ones from the original Starcraft and Brood War have been redone in the SC2 engine. The game is much better for the single player experience IMO unless you have the time and skill to get really good at it.

If you want to get good, i would recommend watching this: http://day9.tv/d/Day9/day9-daily-132-back-to-basics-the-mental-checklist/ and see if that's the kind of thing you would enjoy doing.

Wow, I had no idea SC2 mods got anything like that good. Do you know any good places to find the best single player mods? I'll be giving Mass Recall a go whatever.

As for multiplayer I found it hard to keep up even at the dregs of bronze. You might do better as I'm a pretty mediocre player, but I found the single player and even skirmish SC2 a lot of fun.

 

[loa]

Starcraft 2 is way more than just competetive multiplayer.
You still have a well made singlepayer campaign, you can still stomp AIs in a cooperative game and there are tons of custom maps to play with.

 

[DSK-]

Starcraft 2 is a fun game, whether you want to be super competitive or just have fun and play with/against friends in custom lobbies or versus the AI. The great thing about it is that you can go as deep or as shallow into the game as you want. Want to improve? Team Liquid's Liquipedia is a most excellent learning resource, and I highly urge anyone and everyone who isn't aware of it to take a look if they are in a quandry. There is also a wealth of informative YouTube videos from the likes of Lowko, Day9 (his old stuff, he seems to have moved on from SC2 at present) and from Twitch streamers and tournament casts.

Here's a video of a Korean SC2 pro playing in a tournament a few years ago, from his point of view. Don't be daunted, because you won't be expected to be at that level unless you're a masters player. You might see a lot of differences from Brood War, and a fair bit of streamlining, but I think coming from BW is definitely an advantage when getting into SC2.

Spoiler

The final expansion pack, Legacy of the Void will be coming out in the near future and will make a number of changes to the current state of the game, so coming into the game now shouldn't affect you too badly, as everyone will have to adapt and change their play styles when it comes out. I hope this helps

 

[Rattja]

The very nature of the game is fast, so if you are anything like me that likes to take their time and build a base it's not really the game for that.

First thing if you wanna do normal 1v1 is to learn to deal with rushes, people do this from time to time, things like cannon rush and ling rush is something even a noob should be able to pull off so be ready for that.

There are plenty of bad players out there though so don't worry too much about being stomped, you will be matched with people of equal skill eventually.

Thing I want to point out is that if 1 person has the game, his friends can play multiplayer and arcade for free. The only thing you dont get is the story. This can be a huge factor if you wanna play with friends.

Also the arcade has tons of fun modes so there is also that