Need some piracy advice....
- Thread starter bfgmetalhead
- Start date
I said it on page 3 and I'll say it again. As much as it's a fun topic to debate, the ethics of piracy are not really the issue here. Yes, the friend is breaking the law. Yes, there are reasons for copyright laws, and there is no ethical justification for piracy in this case.
The question is one of proportionate retribution and loyalty to the friend. What is it you really want to accomplish with this? Do you want your friend to stop pirating, or are you trying to live up to Lawful Stupid [http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/LawfulStupid] ideals?
If you really want to be the great champion of all legality... well go for it I guess. Report him, but I swear to god you had better not ever jaywalk or speed again.
If you just want him to stop pirating, or at least make him think twice, there are a number of ways to get that message through. I suggested earlier making a fake "you're busted" letter to give him a bit of a scare, and someone else suggested buying him games he's pirated. Depending on how ethically questionable you're willing to get, you could remove the files from his computer and set up a fake application that just opens an image file reading "Thank you for playing this demo. Please purchase a full copy."
The thing is that once you bring the law into a situation like this, the level of punishment is completely out of your hands. They might ignore him, and he would learn nothing. Likewise, they might smash him into the ground so hard he spends the rest of his life in debt. He wouldn't pirate again only for lack of computer and/or food. You don't know, and that's a hell of a risk to take.
People here seem to be presenting this as black and white: Either piracy is ok or you should fuck your friend over a table. That's not how it has to be. You have a lot of options between "do nothing" and "backstab so brutally the Spy would call you dishonorable."
To use an old analogy, a 12-guage shotgun may indeed prevent someone from getting a cold, but there are a lot better solutions available.
The question is one of proportionate retribution and loyalty to the friend. What is it you really want to accomplish with this? Do you want your friend to stop pirating, or are you trying to live up to Lawful Stupid [http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/LawfulStupid] ideals?
If you really want to be the great champion of all legality... well go for it I guess. Report him, but I swear to god you had better not ever jaywalk or speed again.
If you just want him to stop pirating, or at least make him think twice, there are a number of ways to get that message through. I suggested earlier making a fake "you're busted" letter to give him a bit of a scare, and someone else suggested buying him games he's pirated. Depending on how ethically questionable you're willing to get, you could remove the files from his computer and set up a fake application that just opens an image file reading "Thank you for playing this demo. Please purchase a full copy."
The thing is that once you bring the law into a situation like this, the level of punishment is completely out of your hands. They might ignore him, and he would learn nothing. Likewise, they might smash him into the ground so hard he spends the rest of his life in debt. He wouldn't pirate again only for lack of computer and/or food. You don't know, and that's a hell of a risk to take.
People here seem to be presenting this as black and white: Either piracy is ok or you should fuck your friend over a table. That's not how it has to be. You have a lot of options between "do nothing" and "backstab so brutally the Spy would call you dishonorable."
To use an old analogy, a 12-guage shotgun may indeed prevent someone from getting a cold, but there are a lot better solutions available.
And how does taking the computer program property of another without right or permission fails to comply the definition? Merriam-Webster defines take as "to get into one's hands or into one's possession, power, or control", and by pirating you are certanly getting a game into your possession without right, or are you not?SmashLovesTitanQuest said:
Also I dont know what's the issue people take by assuming the possesive of something, it might be the Oxford dictionary definition, but I would assume it's also yours and that doesn't devalue it, does it?
Have you seen the UV mapping in that game? These people crapped out really unpolished game and your saying they poured a lot of work into it. He'll marry us!
On a site that will ban you for being pro-piracy, where even people who aren't pro-piracy have to tread EXTREMELY carefully to avoid moderation?bfgmetalhead said:
I can see why you'd be concerned.
Oh No! Maybe you can reporting to the internet police!bfgmetalhead said:
This whole subject is pathetic, your "friend" can pirate all he likes and there is little you can do to stop him, tens of thousands (maybe even hundreds) of people have pirated Skyrim and reporting him to Bethesda or the parent company is pointless because they wont care about one person playing it for free. If anything they would rather target the person who posted the link but considering most piracy is Peer2Peer not much will come of that.
Oh well, good luck with forcing of your moral values on someone you consider your friend, maybe if it is possible you could donate £30 to Bethesda if you feel sorry that they are missing out on that money your friend is denying them.
I think what surprises me most about this entire thread is how much people will bash the OP just because he considers going to the authorities for a friend breaking a law. Last I checked, being a friend does not mean "you must cover up this dirty behavior," nor anything else. Loyalty to a friend must be your own personal choice, and if you decide not to there's nothing wrong with it. Why must you risk your reputation for allowing your friends to be criminals? That's just sickening.
Maybe I'm just a different class, all of my friends prefer to actually help society, and we know each others dark secrets, and none involve law breaking (just lots of stupid or messed up situations but surprisingly nothing illegal about them). While I know if one of them did something illegal, I wouldn't report it (depending, I actually am required to report things like this in my position), but I would force them to man up about it. Either they fix it some way, turn themselves in, or I will no longer affilate myself with them and will spread the word that others should not either. We've already done this to a few former friends, and we all know the risks associated. Any time one of our core group messes up, they've always repaid their debt somehow, and we all know about it because we have integrity--which appears to be the last pure form of humanity left in this world.
Shame, loyalty being put up before integrity. Friends before personal morals. No wonder people give into peer pressure so easily these days or allow entire crimes to be committed under their nose. People just don't know the right choice anymore.
Good luck, OP. Whatever you decide to do to handle this, just make sure you're comfortable doing it with your integrity. You don't necessarily have to report him, but at the same time you don't have to ignore it like majority in this thread seem to want. (I assume most here are afraid if this catches on they themselves will be caught the same way your friend is)
Integrity first.
(PS: I don't respond to threads after controversial posts because I know it's meaningless. Remarks to this post won't even be read. Just wanted to give you all a heads' up.)
Maybe I'm just a different class, all of my friends prefer to actually help society, and we know each others dark secrets, and none involve law breaking (just lots of stupid or messed up situations but surprisingly nothing illegal about them). While I know if one of them did something illegal, I wouldn't report it (depending, I actually am required to report things like this in my position), but I would force them to man up about it. Either they fix it some way, turn themselves in, or I will no longer affilate myself with them and will spread the word that others should not either. We've already done this to a few former friends, and we all know the risks associated. Any time one of our core group messes up, they've always repaid their debt somehow, and we all know about it because we have integrity--which appears to be the last pure form of humanity left in this world.
Shame, loyalty being put up before integrity. Friends before personal morals. No wonder people give into peer pressure so easily these days or allow entire crimes to be committed under their nose. People just don't know the right choice anymore.
Good luck, OP. Whatever you decide to do to handle this, just make sure you're comfortable doing it with your integrity. You don't necessarily have to report him, but at the same time you don't have to ignore it like majority in this thread seem to want. (I assume most here are afraid if this catches on they themselves will be caught the same way your friend is)
Integrity first.
(PS: I don't respond to threads after controversial posts because I know it's meaningless. Remarks to this post won't even be read. Just wanted to give you all a heads' up.)
LOL. I loved that.Unsilenced said:
Fake DMCA notification from his ISP would probably get the point across. At the very least, it'd be funny as hell to see their reaction if you're into that sort of thing.
I wouldn't do it myself, mind. I would still rather try acting through positive examples, but still.
And if everybody pirated all the time then there would be no more games industry. Perhaps you should look up Immanuel Kant, become his best friend and learn a little bit of morality.SmashLovesTitanQuest said:Tanakh said:
I recommend setting this as your desktop background until the message finally drills its way through your skull.
This guy's your friend? Games companies have a habit of "making an example" of those who they have definitely caught and can definitely punish, and from a big litigation-happy company like Bethesda...he could easily be bankrupted, in jail, and THEN some, so think twice.
Secondly this ain't the best example really, pirating a big popular AAA game like Skyrim has very little effect on the actual makers; the people who really suffer are the publishers, so decide how much you care based on the suits behind the game, not the people making it.
When you should get angry is in the pirating of Indie games, thats when people really stand to lose out.
Secondly this ain't the best example really, pirating a big popular AAA game like Skyrim has very little effect on the actual makers; the people who really suffer are the publishers, so decide how much you care based on the suits behind the game, not the people making it.
When you should get angry is in the pirating of Indie games, thats when people really stand to lose out.
They forfeit the "stealing" option if they want to go the license route. This is part of the problem: Game companies need to decide if they are a product or a service and stick with it, not play both sides of the coin.NameIsRobertPaulson said:
Currently, they occupy both or neither as is convenient at the time.
Yeah, I know you said you wouldn't read any replies, but I'm gonna reply anyway, because I agree with you. I mean, if the punishment for piracy was life imprisonment or execution or something, then defend your friend at all costs. Morality above legality. But piracy is immoral and illegal, and since the OP's friend is so convinced he doesn't owe the company anything for using their product, maybe it's time he took a good kick to the bank account. This...anti-snitch culture is quite frankly insulting. And it's dangerous. If I found out a friend was pirating and I disagreed, I'd not do anything about it. If they were laughing in my face and telling me how they can break the law whenever they want simply because they want to...wellDevil said:
I'd shoot them the fuck down. Teach them a little humility, and a little respect for the people that provide such products.
Take video games out of your friendship then, simple as that. If you don't like that he pirates, then games are one discussion that you will not have with him, and you will not enjoy with him. When he asks why, and you tell him, and he decides that piracy is more valuable than friendship. Well then that will show how much of a friend he really is.bfgmetalhead said:
If you're one of those friends that spends the majority of their time gaming or talking about it (have a few of those myself) then, he'll know something's wrong then.
Either that or feign interest the next time he pirates a new game, be there for when he starts it up for the first time, and just as he double clicks it, you slip your hand over to the tower and touch a magnet to it, make it look like the game did it, and mention something about pirating can bring really messed up viruses. 8D
(I'm kidding, don't do that... That could actually get you in trouble I think)
Kant's universal maxims, while quite useless for neutral actions, are quite good for more morally clear-cut affairs like piracy. Piracy is bad. There is no justification for it. Well, with the exception of the region-locks and shit - no reason to miss out on a game just because you were born in the wrong place.SmashLovesTitanQuest said:
But as for not having enough money? Well tough shit. Do you know what it's called when you make a copy of money? That's counterfeiting. Sure, you're not stealing money off anybody, but you ARE spending money that isn't even real.