Negative Marks or How the School System Kicked me in the Nuts

[asmidir]

Ok guys. I have a bit of a rant and a question for all of you. Today I received the results for my 1st year Genetics and Cell Bio exam. The exam consisted of 100 multiple choice questions. I was only taking the class as an elective so I didn't put as much effort into it as my major. Anyway, most people would love to take a multiple choice test. The only catch was this:

Every wrong answer = Negative 1/4 of a percent.

To pass an exam you need to score at least 50%. Any lower and you fail. When I received my results I sadly obtained a 40. Now lets do some math.

If I lose 1/4 of a % for each wrong answer then to answer half of the questions correct gives me a result of 37.5%. This means that to achieve the passing mark of 50% you in fact need to correctly answer 62.5% of the exam.

I legitimately correctly answered over half of the questions correctly. Yet I failed because of the penalty. After some research I found that no other classes that have multiple choice exams deduct points.

So my question to you escapists is whether or not you think it is fair? That's pretty much my rant. Mostly wanted to blow off some steam.

 

[Marter]

If you don't give an answer, do you still get the deduction? I remember a similar type of penalty being applied to some math tests in high school, but you had to attempt the question in order to lose a mark. You didn't lose marks if you didn't answer it.

If that's the case with yours, then I see no problem with it. Having a passing grade at 67%, however, is pretty high.

 

[asmidir]

If you don't give an answer, do you still get the deduction? I remember a similar type of penalty being applied to some math tests in high school, but you had to attempt the question in order to lose a mark. You didn't lose marks if you didn't answer it.

If that's the case with yours, then I see no problem with it. Having a passing grade at 67%, however, is pretty high.

You lost a mark if you left it blank as well. They encouraged guessing while at the same time discouraging it,

 

[Marter]

You lost a mark if you left it blank as well. They encouraged guessing while at the same time discouraging it,

Oh. Well, that sucks, then. Not exactly "unfair," but not a whole lot of fun, either. Hope it gets curved. ;p

 

[madwarper]

You lost a mark if you left it blank as well. They encouraged guessing while at the same time discouraging it,

No, they're discouraging being Wrong and encouraging you to get the answer Right.

You know, the entire point of taking a test.

 

[Fluffythepoo]

I've never heard of an all multiple choice final, but assuming its abcd, which means a 1/4 chance of getting it wrong or right even if youre clueless; then the -.25% penalty would just be an atempt at adjusting the scoring criteria to address that issue.
To elaborate with some quite possibly wrong math: if you answered 50% correrectly you're still left with 50 questions, statistically just guessing randomly you can still excepect to get 12.5 of those questions right and therefore the 62.5% buuuut that'd mean you got 37.5 wrong and 37.5(.25)=9.375, which comes short of negating the 12.5 you got by random chance, the penalty would need to be 1/3 of a percent in order to appropriately balance random chance (1/3*37.5=12.5) meaning the negative scores on the all multiple choice test weren't actually severe enough. Unless it wasnt an abcd format test in which case scratch everything.

Edit: was and wasn't.. Important distinctions...

 

[Kopikatsu]

Whoa, whoa whoa. Hold up. What place lets you pass a test with a 50%? Because my college requires 80+% on everything. Even the course as a whole. Getting 79% or lower means you have to re-take the entire class.

 

[AstylahAthrys]

Whoa, whoa whoa. Hold up. What place lets you pass a test with a 50%? Because my college requires 80+% on everything. Even the course as a whole. Getting 79% or lower means you have to re-take the entire class.

Mine isn't that strict, but it's the same thing, but with 70%, a 69% means you have to retake the class, and multiple instances of this can get you screwed over with loans, financial aid and scholarships. Even in high school anything below a 59% meant you failed. I want to go to school where you go, OP. Yeah, that is harsh grading, but they're letting you pass with a 50%! I think I'd cry if I got a 50% on a test! That's a horrible grade, at least to me!

 

[Angie7F]

What a horrible testing system!!
I have been through approx 25 years worth of education (some skipped grades, some overlapping schools) but I have never had a test like that.
For us, if you at least gave it a shot, you will get partial points. (wrong answers in multiple questions just gave you no marks at all)

You know, sometimes people making hte tests are dumber than you think.
If I were you I would politely ask the teachers if they are aware of the fact that the system is quite screwed up.

 

[Loonyyy]

It all depends on the curve they're grading to. If they require 70% on the test, then that's their perogative. Remember, the difficulty of the test is scalable, and if they want to place a high standard on it, that's totally legit.

For driving tests where I'm from, certain parts reqire 100%. Because not knowing is considered too much of a risk. Similarly, if you write an exam that's easy, you'll have a high pass mark. The disadvantage to that is that you end up with high definition of failure, instead of a high definition in success, which makes it hard to work out who's the best, and assign scholarships etc. My university has a different set of marking, 70%-80% (It varies, scaling), Distinction, the rest, HD. So our exams are usually nightmarishly difficult, making sure that to get that 45% is not a matter of luck.

But, this isn't even about that:

I've never heard of an all multiple choice final, but assuming its abcd, which means a 1/4 chance of getting it wrong or right even if youre clueless; then the -.25% penalty would just be an atempt at adjusting the scoring criteria to address that issue.
To elaborate with some quite possibly wrong math: if you answered 50% correrectly you're still left with 50 questions, statistically just guessing randomly you can still excepect to get 12.5 of those questions right and therefore the 62.5% buuuut that'd mean you got 37.5 wrong and 37.5(.25)=9.375, which comes short of negating the 12.5 you got by random chance, the penalty would need to be 1/3 of a percent in order to appropriately balance random chance (1/3*37.5=12.5) meaning the negative scores on the all multiple choice test weren't actually severe enough. Unless it wasnt an abcd format test in which case scratch everything.

Edit: was and wasn't.. Important distinctions...

For a multiple choice exam, they can attempt to consider the effect chance has on the output. Really, they should be taking 1/3 of a mark per question (If it's a 4 choice system), but of course, the ideal 1/4 correct is not necessarily going to be the result for everyone, so they've actually done you a favour by penalising you less harshly than they needed to. Unless of course, it's a 5 choice system, in which case, they're penalising you assuming the mean result, the most likely outcome. There's going to be some who are hurt more or less than others by this, purely by chance, so they have to take care in writing it. It kind of demonstrates the problems with Multiple Choice tests to be honest, the ability to use random chance to influence the result can prevent the test from accurately assessing knwoledge.

 

[asmidir]

I've never heard of an all multiple choice final, but assuming its abcd, which means a 1/4 chance of getting it wrong or right even if youre clueless; then the -.25% penalty would just be an atempt at adjusting the scoring criteria to address that issue.
To elaborate with some quite possibly wrong math: if you answered 50% correrectly you're still left with 50 questions, statistically just guessing randomly you can still excepect to get 12.5 of those questions right and therefore the 62.5% buuuut that'd mean you got 37.5 wrong and 37.5(.25)=9.375, which comes short of negating the 12.5 you got by random chance, the penalty would need to be 1/3 of a percent in order to appropriately balance random chance (1/3*37.5=12.5) meaning the negative scores on the all multiple choice test weren't actually severe enough. Unless it wasnt an abcd format test in which case scratch everything.

Edit: was and wasn't.. Important distinctions...

It was 5 choices. A B C D E.

 

[asmidir]

Whoa, whoa whoa. Hold up. What place lets you pass a test with a 50%? Because my college requires 80+% on everything. Even the course as a whole. Getting 79% or lower means you have to re-take the entire class.

Mine isn't that strict, but it's the same thing, but with 70%, a 69% means you have to retake the class, and multiple instances of this can get you screwed over with loans, financial aid and scholarships. Even in high school anything below a 59% meant you failed. I want to go to school where you go, OP. Yeah, that is harsh grading, but they're letting you pass with a 50%! I think I'd cry if I got a 50% on a test! That's a horrible grade, at least to me!

This is an Australian university. They are pretty relaxed. At least for first years. Though, 80% is rather tough as a minimum. That qualifies as an A grade. What kind of school is that?

 

[MagunBFP]

You answered 52 out of the 100 questions correct, suffering a 12 point penalty which gave you your mark of 40... 52 out of 100 in a multiple choice exam... did you prepare for the exam or just figure it's 50/50 and you felt lucky?

You know what might have actually helped you pass this exam... actually putting effort into it. I get that to you its just an elective but that doesn't mean that getting a satifactory mark is going to be any easier then any other subject... But comments about your study habits aside...

You knew the format of the test before you sat it, you knew it would be negatively marked (and if you didn't then you probably weren't paying attention in class... see the comment about putting in effort) and yet you only decide its unfair after you failed. Given that you only had to get 50% or better if there were no negative marks then you'd have a 50/50 chance of passing if you studied or not, so to actual get you to demonstrate that you know the subject material (theoretically the objective of the course) they give you a penalty for not knowing what you've been taught. I'm inclined to say its a fair test that should show you know your stuff... Obviously with only 40 you don't know it, and shouldn't be passed.

 

[Strazdas]

Whoa, whoa whoa. Hold up. What place lets you pass a test with a 50%? Because my college requires 80+% on everything. Even the course as a whole. Getting 79% or lower means you have to re-take the entire class.

Thats a bit heavy. its 50% at uni here, but that 50% is like the OP described, you have to know 80% to get the 50% mark.

Then again, i never had a problem, i got 10 (10/10. max score) at an consolidated accounting exam yesterday

 

[Calcium]

Whoa, some people need 80% to pass? o_o

The university I'm at requires 40% or 50% as a pass... Though maybe that's because, according to a lecturer, 70% or more on a piece of coursework is reserved for distinction / extra effort / originality. It's not a bad university either, it seems to be regularly ranked as 5th or 6th in the UK, as high as 20th in the world - and I've seen it even higher for ranks based on postgraduate research.

The deducted marks for an incorrect answer I can understand, though deducting marks for leaving an answer blank makes no sense to me. They're basically saying "If you don't know this it's better to try to fool us with a guess."

 

[MagunBFP]

Whoa, whoa whoa. Hold up. What place lets you pass a test with a 50%? Because my college requires 80+% on everything. Even the course as a whole. Getting 79% or lower means you have to re-take the entire class.

Mine isn't that strict, but it's the same thing, but with 70%, a 69% means you have to retake the class, and multiple instances of this can get you screwed over with loans, financial aid and scholarships. Even in high school anything below a 59% meant you failed. I want to go to school where you go, OP. Yeah, that is harsh grading, but they're letting you pass with a 50%! I think I'd cry if I got a 50% on a test! That's a horrible grade, at least to me!

This is an Australian university. They are pretty relaxed. At least for first years. Though, 80% is rather tough as a minimum. That qualifies as an A grade. What kind of school is that?

Wow, Bio Sciences at Uni give you a full pass with 50%. I studied the wrong courses at Wollongong. Maybe a Restricted Pass, or Pass Conceded but an actual pass? Well on the plus side, you got the course "for Free" on HECS so you really only lost the time you didn't put in.

 

[Tropicaz]

My course in the UK isnt negatively marked however the multiple choice sections do go from between A-N to A-W, so whilst it is multiple choice, it isnt exactly possible to pass by guessing (all the answers are pretty likely if you dont know your stuff)

 

[Thaluikhain]

If you don't give an answer, do you still get the deduction? I remember a similar type of penalty being applied to some math tests in high school, but you had to attempt the question in order to lose a mark. You didn't lose marks if you didn't answer it.

If that's the case with yours, then I see no problem with it. Having a passing grade at 67%, however, is pretty high.

You lost a mark if you left it blank as well. They encouraged guessing while at the same time discouraging it,

Dafuq?

Yeah, that's stupid.

Oh, and what percentage you have to make is more or less irrelevant, it sounds good to say you need a 60 rather than a 50, but unless you know how difficult the test is, it doesn't mean anything.

 

[Arfonious]

Ok guys. I have a bit of a rant and a question for all of you. Today I received the results for my 1st year Genetics and Cell Bio exam. The exam consisted of 100 multiple choice questions. I was only taking the class as an elective so I didn't put as much effort into it as my major. Anyway, most people would love to take a multiple choice test. The only catch was this:

Every wrong answer = Negative 1/4 of a percent.

To pass an exam you need to score at least 50%. Any lower and you fail. When I received my results I sadly obtained a 40. Now lets do some math.

If I lose 1/4 of a % for each wrong answer then to answer half of the questions correct gives me a result of 37.5%. This means that to achieve the passing mark of 50% you in fact need to correctly answer 62.5% of the exam.

I legitimately correctly answered over half of the questions correctly. Yet I failed because of the penalty. After some research I found that no other classes that have multiple choice exams deduct points.

So my question to you escapists is whether or not you think it is fair? That's pretty much my rant. Mostly wanted to blow off some steam.

It's fair and good for keeping people from guessing their way to a pass

 

[Sonicron]

Only valid answer: No, it's not fair. It's not even close to logical, for that matter.
They did that shit to us at university one semester. After the student body damn near burned down the campus and raped the administration with 10-foot poles, the idiotic system was revoked, but those who'd done poorly on the exams because of it still had to live with their crappy grades.