Nintendo just Other M'd Star Fox

[Aiddon_v1legacy]

Although I have to ask where did you get the info that it was intended to be episodic? Because this is the first time I'm hearing of this model.

http://www.gamnesia.com/news/everything-we-know-about-star-fox-u#.U65IjY1H6Sp

It may have been episodic at one point, but it's iffy as to whether the episodic comment referred to story or release structure.

He was talking purely about story structure; what Miyamoto meant was that the levels were meant to be shorter for quicker playthroughs (which is why levels have different "phases" in the game) but they decided to make them longer in order to emulate SF64.

 

[Elvis Starburst]

Hate to be shallow on this Xas but the graphics were pretty underwhelming. Especially for a new Starfox game.

I don't blame this much. My roommate felt the exact same, saying it looked way too much like 64 (Despite this game taking that art direction on purpose). But, the game already has a decent amount of slowdown in highly explosion packed areas, and it's 720P native. If we upped the graphics further, I highly doubt the game would be able to handle 30FPS most of the time. Look no further than Titania for an example of this

 

[Dragonbums]

Hate to be shallow on this Xas but the graphics were pretty underwhelming. Especially for a new Starfox game.

I don't blame this much. My roommate felt the exact same, saying it looked way too much like 64 (Despite this game taking that art direction on purpose). But, the game already has a decent amount of slowdown in highly explosion packed areas, and it's 720P native. If we upped the graphics further, I highly doubt the game would be able to handle 30FPS most of the time. Look no further than Titania for an example of this

Since I have no history with Starfox 64 this wouldn't of been a problem for me. It's just that....there wasn't more 'oompf' to any of the scenes. I wanted to see more lasers flying everywhere, more allies and enemies alike going after each other in the background, more nasty and quick witted AI enemies (with consideration to difficulty settings of course.), more side pilots banter. This is a war after all.
In other words I kind of want those space dog fighting explosions and sparkles with all the cheesiness I would expect from Starfox and crew.
The Starfox universe is ripe for that. Hell they can even use characters from the other games to add more life into the game. Revamp them if needed to have them fit within the universe they were going for.
Maybe this game would of came out better if Nintendo wasn't stretched thin basically one-manning their Wii U console. Or perhaps Miyamoto himself just isn't really that interested in Starfox anymore, and neither were any of his in house producers- who seem to care a whole lot about LoZ and Mario.
I can understand his desire to pull Starfox in back to the Nintendo made fold, but it seems that outside studios have a lot more interest in the game than Nintendo does.
I think they should commission the game out to studios again. But just keep tabs on what they are doing so we don't get another piece of nonsense like Starfox Adventure. (And I'm saying this knowing that it was Miyamotos fault as well.)

 

[JUMBO PALACE]

I lent my gamepad charger to a friend a year ago and just never bothered to go pick it up again. I gave up on my WiiU completely. When Nintendo brings out a non-gimmick console and releases decent games for it I'll be happy to support them. I put myself out there with the Wii U and got burned.

OT: This game looked like trash to me from the first time I saw it. I wish it were otherwise. Star Fox deserves better.

 

[xaszatm]

Hate to be shallow on this Xas but the graphics were pretty underwhelming. Especially for a new Starfox game.

I don't blame this much. My roommate felt the exact same, saying it looked way too much like 64 (Despite this game taking that art direction on purpose). But, the game already has a decent amount of slowdown in highly explosion packed areas, and it's 720P native. If we upped the graphics further, I highly doubt the game would be able to handle 30FPS most of the time. Look no further than Titania for an example of this

Since I have no history with Starfox 64 this wouldn't of been a problem for me. It's just that....there wasn't more 'oompf' to any of the scenes. I wanted to see more lasers flying everywhere, more allies and enemies alike going after each other in the background, more nasty and quick witted AI enemies (with consideration to difficulty settings of course.), more side pilots banter. This is a war after all.
In other words I kind of want those space dog fighting explosions and sparkles with all the cheesiness I would expect from Starfox and crew.
The Starfox universe is ripe for that. Hell they can even use characters from the other games to add more life into the game. Revamp them if needed to have them fit within the universe they were going for.
Maybe this game would of came out better if Nintendo wasn't stretched thin basically one-manning their Wii U console. Or perhaps Miyamoto himself just isn't really that interested in Starfox anymore, and neither were any of his in house producers- who seem to care a whole lot about LoZ and Mario.
I can understand his desire to pull Starfox in back to the Nintendo made fold, but it seems that outside studios have a lot more interest in the game than Nintendo does.
I think they should commission the game out to studios again. But just keep tabs on what they are doing so we don't get another piece of nonsense like Starfox Adventure. (And I'm saying this knowing that it was Miyamotos fault as well.)

I'm not sure. Miyamoto was the one who directed that short and you do see this banter in quite a few of the missions. Sector Alpha and Sector Beta in particular are those big set pieces people wanted.

Actually for that matter, why does everyone somehow think that Zero had less enemies than 64? Is this some placebo effect? Baring Zoness, most stages has enemy kill counts in the hundreds Secor Alpha and Sector Beta are fleet vs fleet battles and are very dialogue heavy. Hell, the story itself is more complicated than the past two versions.

Also, another about the graphics is that most of the ships are 1 to 1 recreations of their SNES and N64 counterpoints. The problem comes from the fact that since they are recreation of SNES and N64 models, there's only so much you can do to pretty them up before the blocky shapes just prevent any true "prettiness" to progress.

Also, I'm really really confused about your comment in-house people being uninterested because...Platinum is involved in the game. And it shows...a lot. Hell, even the extremely complicated yet necessary controls are a Platinum standard.

I lent my gamepad charger to a friend a year ago and just never bothered to go pick it up again. I gave up on my WiiU completely. When Nintendo brings out a non-gimmick console and releases decent games for it I'll be happy to support them. I put myself out there with the Wii U and got burned.

OT: This game looked like trash to me from the first time I saw it. I wish it were otherwise. Star Fox deserves better.

Oh sure. I'm sure you never bought...ANY of Nintendo's consoles since you despise traditional consoles so much. You also probably avoided that ultimate gimmicky Playstation dual shock controller as well. Console gaming has ALWAYS been about gimmicks. ALWAYS. Just because you don't like a company's gimmicks for one generation doesn't suddenly mean that all consoles before hand were gimmick free.

 

[hermes]

I thought Star Fox Adventures was Other Md Star Fox. That was a game that had little to do with the franchise and felt like it was about other characters that they remodeled and rebranded Star Fox when they got the licence.

Star Fox Zero is just a sequel to Star Fox 64... that was developed 20 years ago and released just now, for some reason.

 

[BrawlMan]

No, Other M had bad acting and a horrible story. Star Fox Zero fucked up by not having options for just using a regular controller.

 

[Elvis Starburst]

I thought Star Fox Adventures was Other Md Star Fox. That was a game that had little to do with the franchise and felt like it was about other characters that they remodeled and rebranded Star Fox when they got the licence.

Can't tell if you're aware or not, cause this is impressively well worded for an un-aware situation, but Adventures actually WAS a rebranded game. Dinosaur Planet was originally to be released on the N64 with Krystal and another brown fox to be the main characters. But the game turned somewhere along the line, was put on the GameCube, and Fox was made the protagonist with Krystal being a damsel in distress sort of thing

 

[Velvet Green]

It baffles me that so many are having such a hard time with the controls. All it takes is a little coordination, which today's people seem to lack way too much. Of course, I can't speak for the physically impared (in which case the game didn't have you in mind, whcich is unfortunate) but I must say that if you've ever done things such as sports, dancing, driving or any activity that involves paying attention to your surroundings, you should be able to adapt. It's okay not to like the game, but it doesn't suck. The levels are masterfully designed around the Gyro controls; this mechanic wasn't hapazardly thrown into the game, the game was built around it. Miyamoto clearly knew what he was doing.

 

[marioandsonic]

It baffles me that so many are having such a hard time with the controls. All it takes is a little coordination, which today's people seem to lack way too much. Of course, I can't speak for the physically impared (in which case the game didn't have you in mind, whcich is unfortunate) but I must say that if you've ever done things such as sports, dancing, driving or any activity that involves paying attention to your surroundings, you should be able to adapt. It's okay not to like the game, but it doesn't suck. The levels are masterfully designed around the Gyro controls; this mechanic wasn't hapazardly thrown into the game, the game was built around it. Miyamoto clearly knew what he was doing.

This. 100% this.

Also, if you want to go with the Other M comparison, then that would be Star Fox Command that nearly killed the franchise.

 

[Dragonbums]

I'm not sure. Miyamoto was the one who directed that short and you do see this banter in quite a few of the missions. Sector Alpha and Sector Beta in particular are those big set pieces people wanted.

I wouldn't mind seeing more Starfox anime. It was so charming!

Actually for that matter, why does everyone somehow think that Zero had less enemies than 64? Is this some placebo effect? Baring Zoness, most stages has enemy kill counts in the hundreds Secor Alpha and Sector Beta are fleet vs fleet battles and are very dialogue heavy. Hell, the story itself is more complicated than the past two versions.

Well I'm not particularly basing my opinion off of Starfox 64. I'm just basing it on my expectations of an interstellar space fighting game in todays' gaming age.
Granted I don't think you were specifically referencing me with that comment. This is just the opinion of a user with no childhood history or love with the original Starfox and someone who is just looking in based on appearance and showcase.

Also, another about the graphics is that most of the ships are 1 to 1 recreations of their SNES and N64 counterpoints. The problem comes from the fact that since they are recreation of SNES and N64 models, there's only so much you can do to pretty them up before the blocky shapes just prevent any true "prettiness" to progress.

Yeah...in feel in that regard they should of done a full on conceptual upgrade. I'm sure the ships could of stayed the same, but add more to it ya know? It just didn't impress me all that much.

I'm really really confused about your comment in-house people being uninterested because...Platinum is involved in the game.

It's not like Platinum had full reign of the entire game. They were only in charge of the graphics and special effects. And even how well they do on that is determined by art direction, time, and how much Nintendo was willing to spend on that. P* isn't a 'make everything good' studio.

And it shows...a lot. Hell, even the extremely complicated yet necessary controls are a Platinum standard.

That really depends on who your asking. I'm not going to make any comments on the controls simply because I haven't played it. But to me it overall just came off as underwhelming. It's a feeling even my friends who were otherwise interested had.

 

[Scow2]

Starfox Zero just sucked. And it sucked because Miyamoto is trying to bring it back to it's highly simplistic roots which just isn't going to work for it anymore.

Not going to argue the validity of the complaint, but that doesn't seem to be a common theme among reviewers and players. Most of them would prefer a simpler control scheme, from what I've heard, since the current one splits your attention.

I guess I should of clarified that I wasn't talking about the control scheme. But more or less how Miyamoto wanted Starfox to be a simple shooting game with enough plot to justify the games existence.

I can't really make a statement on the controls since I have never experienced them first hand.
But plot wise this series is just begging to evolve into something more than Starfox 64 basic plot.

Unfortunately, that's how we might end up with a Star Fox that TRULY is the "Other M" of the series...

 

[Dragonbums]

Starfox Zero just sucked. And it sucked because Miyamoto is trying to bring it back to it's highly simplistic roots which just isn't going to work for it anymore.

Not going to argue the validity of the complaint, but that doesn't seem to be a common theme among reviewers and players. Most of them would prefer a simpler control scheme, from what I've heard, since the current one splits your attention.

I guess I should of clarified that I wasn't talking about the control scheme. But more or less how Miyamoto wanted Starfox to be a simple shooting game with enough plot to justify the games existence.

I can't really make a statement on the controls since I have never experienced them first hand.
But plot wise this series is just begging to evolve into something more than Starfox 64 basic plot.

Unfortunately, that's how we might end up with a Star Fox that TRULY is the "Other M" of the series...

That depends on who is managing it. It should be noted that Other M was directed by someone who- for all intents and purposes should of KNOWN better. He was the director of some of the most well known and loved Metroid games out there.
Which is the irony of the situation- the garbage that was Other M wast at fault from someone in house at Nintendo, while the Prime Trilogies were done by an outside studio.
That is not to say that Nintendo themselves couldn't make a good more evolved Starfox game. But it should highlight that outside studios (the correct ones of course.) are just as good at pushing an IP forward if not even better than the studio that owns it.

 

[Quellist]

I had to send this game back it was such shit, the refund went straight toward a preorder of Star Ocean 5. I just hope Tri-Ace learned something from the shitheap that SO4 was or i guess that money's gonna bounce again!

 

[Hawki]

Starfox Zero just sucked. And it sucked because Miyamoto is trying to bring it back to it's highly simplistic roots which just isn't going to work for it anymore.

Not going to argue the validity of the complaint, but that doesn't seem to be a common theme among reviewers and players. Most of them would prefer a simpler control scheme, from what I've heard, since the current one splits your attention.

I guess I should of clarified that I wasn't talking about the control scheme. But more or less how Miyamoto wanted Starfox to be a simple shooting game with enough plot to justify the games existence.

I can't really make a statement on the controls since I have never experienced them first hand.
But plot wise this series is just begging to evolve into something more than Starfox 64 basic plot.

Unfortunately, that's how we might end up with a Star Fox that TRULY is the "Other M" of the series...

Even if that's the case, the alternative is, potentially worse. Star Fox Zero has told the story of the Lylat Wars for the third time. The storyline from Star Fox 64 to Command wasn't that deep, but it was at least continuous, and while I haven't played Zero, from what I've seen, the story doesn't seem to do anything particuarly interesting enough to justify a reboot. If the premise of Zero was to show off new mechanics and a new control scheme, that doesn't preclude setting a game after Command (why not have Marcus and the new Star Fox take on Dash?), or an interquel set before Command? Nintendo's shown itself to have no problems setting Metroid and Legend of Zelda games wherever they want in the overall timeline, and while Star Fox is far less story driven than those series, there's still plenty of opportunity for stories to be told, if however basic they might be.

 

[Scow2]

Starfox Zero just sucked. And it sucked because Miyamoto is trying to bring it back to it's highly simplistic roots which just isn't going to work for it anymore.

Not going to argue the validity of the complaint, but that doesn't seem to be a common theme among reviewers and players. Most of them would prefer a simpler control scheme, from what I've heard, since the current one splits your attention.

I guess I should of clarified that I wasn't talking about the control scheme. But more or less how Miyamoto wanted Starfox to be a simple shooting game with enough plot to justify the games existence.

I can't really make a statement on the controls since I have never experienced them first hand.
But plot wise this series is just begging to evolve into something more than Starfox 64 basic plot.

Unfortunately, that's how we might end up with a Star Fox that TRULY is the "Other M" of the series...

Even if that's the case, the alternative is, potentially worse. Star Fox Zero has told the story of the Lylat Wars for the third time. The storyline from Star Fox 64 to Command wasn't that deep, but it was at least continuous, and while I haven't played Zero, from what I've seen, the story doesn't seem to do anything particuarly interesting enough to justify a reboot. If the premise of Zero was to show off new mechanics and a new control scheme, that doesn't preclude setting a game after Command (why not have Marcus and the new Star Fox take on Dash?), or an interquel set before Command? Nintendo's shown itself to have no problems setting Metroid and Legend of Zelda games wherever they want in the overall timeline, and while Star Fox is far less story driven than those series, there's still plenty of opportunity for stories to be told, if however basic they might be.

Same reason Legend of Zelda and Super Mario tell the same story again and again. I've never played "Command". I have played "64", though. I wish I'd played Assault, and could understand a sequel to that one, given that it was a main console release. And people keep mentioning another one?

I like the Andross/Lylat war. Of course, I know it can only be re-told so many times, but I don't mind them re-telling it if they flesh it out more and more each time, with better/more in-depth characterization and dialogue.


... I'm looking up the soundtrack now. Unfortunately, the opening theme doesn't seem to replay any of the old themes, which is a shame. My favorite part of the Zelda series is the familiarity and reworking of the music.

EDIT: NEvermind! Found it! THey did reuse the old theme! I need to get a Wii U and this game now.

 

[JUMBO PALACE]

I lent my gamepad charger to a friend a year ago and just never bothered to go pick it up again. I gave up on my WiiU completely. When Nintendo brings out a non-gimmick console and releases decent games for it I'll be happy to support them. I put myself out there with the Wii U and got burned.

OT: This game looked like trash to me from the first time I saw it. I wish it were otherwise. Star Fox deserves better.

Oh sure. I'm sure you never bought...ANY of Nintendo's consoles since you despise traditional consoles so much. You also probably avoided that ultimate gimmicky Playstation dual shock controller as well. Console gaming has ALWAYS been about gimmicks. ALWAYS. Just because you don't like a company's gimmicks for one generation doesn't suddenly mean that all consoles before hand were gimmick free.

I'm really confused about your response. I never condemned all of console gaming, just Nintendo's continuing focus on gimmicky motion controls; and comparing them to a controller that rumbles is hardly apples to apples. Nintendo is bleeding money because they have no third-party support and keep forcing control options nobody asked for. I loved my Gamecube, N64, and SNES. I've owned a Playstation, Xbox, and Xbox 360 as well. I'm sorry if you got triggered but I never said consoles were bad, just Nintendo's past two.

 

[Hawki]

Same reason Legend of Zelda and Super Mario tell the same story again and again. I've never played "Command". I have played "64", though. I wish I'd played Assault, and could understand a sequel to that one, given that it was a main console release. And people keep mentioning another one?

I like the Andross/Lylat war. Of course, I know it can only be re-told so many times, but I don't mind them re-telling it if they flesh it out more and more each time, with better/more in-depth characterization and dialogue.


... I'm looking up the soundtrack now. Unfortunately, the opening theme doesn't seem to replay any of the old themes, which is a shame. My favorite part of the Zelda series is the familiarity and reworking of the music.

EDIT: NEvermind! Found it! THey did reuse the old theme! I need to get a Wii U and this game now.

Zelda hardly tells the same story over and over. Oh sure, there are common plot threads and tropes, but that's true of every franchise ever. Zelda's also had remakes, but those remakes never superseded the lore. Every Zelda game occupies a distinct place on the overall timeline.

Star Fox is in a weird position where we have three timelines, and no, unlike Zelda, it's not due to the timeline splitting, it's due to being rebooted twice. Which is different from Mario because with some exceptions, every Mario title has existed in isolation from one another. Events in one title are rarely referenced in subsequent ones. Star Fox, at least in the space of Star Fox 64 to Command, clearly followed sequentially, and its titles DID reference one another. If I was feeling generous, I'd say that the series was rebooted because Command had a number of endings the player could choose from, so Nintendo didn't want to continue onwards and quash some endings. I can't say I'm feeling generous though, because Command was dog-shite (and most people will agree that it was at least not up to snuff with past titles), and Star Fox Zero is a game that sold itself on its mechanics, not on the prospect of retelling a story that would have been fresh in the minds of those who played the 64 version, or the 3DS remake.

 

[Hades]

I got around to playing the game and...what was the problem again? You can actually get quite far with just aiming and flying how you're used to, at least when not in all range mode.