Nintendo Says No To Same Sex Relationships For Tomodachi Miis

[faefrost]

I don't think this is out of malice or anything, Nintendo just has a long tradition of not wanting to be yelled at by religious nut jobs. They didn't like any religious iconography on games released on their systems, they had midway remove the blood from Mortal Kombat 1, and they wouldn't allow Binding of Issac to be released on the ds or 3ds.

When it comes to issues of LGBTQ, if you're not with us then you're part of the problem.

The biggest issue being faced is apathy or indifference to the issue and having it be ignored.

Well, that's one more company to add to the block list for homophobia.

Such a shame, I really liked Nintendo too.

I wouldn't be so quick to judge them, they've got to keep in mind what the current viewpoint in their home country is as opposed to what they may feel.

Home country view is irrelevant when they're so deeply involved with Western affairs.

Well to be fair, people asked for a game that was already made, be brought over for the west, so they did. Despite the bad reporting, this was never an option in the game, and the US version is the same code as the original version. the game wasn't made with western affairs in mind.

Then it should have been in the original game.

We didn't excuse Chik-fil-a for coming from a Christian background and we shouldn't excuse Nintendo here.

Look, the "You're either with us or you're against us" mentality will not be healthy for the LGBQT community. People who are "against" us fall into two different groups: hate and ignorance. People who hate the LGBQT community are people in which the more vile tools of protest, while not encouraged always, are certainly understandable. People who are ignorant of said biases, however, must be made known about the bias. Attacking people who are ignorant are a fast way to make people hate the attacker. Knowledge and understanding is what is ultimately required for the LGBQT community to be universally accepted in the world community. By attack blindly with anyone who disagrees with you without checking to see why they disagree with you will do more bad than good in the long run.

Wow! I'm just flabbergasted. So the only options are they either "hate" you or they are "ignorant"? There is no option for "some people don't agree with us" that isn't based on hate or ignorance? You know the more I see of this debate the more it become very very clear that far too many of the supposed aggrieved parties are the ones that truly are the ignorant hate filled bigots.

 

[Dragonbums]

Well, that's one more company to add to the block list for homophobia.

Such a shame, I really liked Nintendo too.

And lets ignore the fact that since this game came out in Animal Crossing: New Leaf (a game that came out after this game) has two very visible queer/transgenders characters, and in Pokemon X and Y you can run into an NPC in the Battle Maison where the trainer tells you how wonderful it is to become a Beauty ( a female only trainer) after she used to be a Black Belt ( a male only trainer) and proclaims how wonderful modern medicine is.

Yep. Definitely homophobic stuff right there.

 

[xaszatm]

I don't think this is out of malice or anything, Nintendo just has a long tradition of not wanting to be yelled at by religious nut jobs. They didn't like any religious iconography on games released on their systems, they had midway remove the blood from Mortal Kombat 1, and they wouldn't allow Binding of Issac to be released on the ds or 3ds.

When it comes to issues of LGBTQ, if you're not with us then you're part of the problem.

The biggest issue being faced is apathy or indifference to the issue and having it be ignored.

Well, that's one more company to add to the block list for homophobia.

Such a shame, I really liked Nintendo too.

I wouldn't be so quick to judge them, they've got to keep in mind what the current viewpoint in their home country is as opposed to what they may feel.

Home country view is irrelevant when they're so deeply involved with Western affairs.

Well to be fair, people asked for a game that was already made, be brought over for the west, so they did. Despite the bad reporting, this was never an option in the game, and the US version is the same code as the original version. the game wasn't made with western affairs in mind.

Then it should have been in the original game.

We didn't excuse Chik-fil-a for coming from a Christian background and we shouldn't excuse Nintendo here.

Look, the "You're either with us or you're against us" mentality will not be healthy for the LGBQT community. People who are "against" us fall into two different groups: hate and ignorance. People who hate the LGBQT community are people in which the more vile tools of protest, while not encouraged always, are certainly understandable. People who are ignorant of said biases, however, must be made known about the bias. Attacking people who are ignorant are a fast way to make people hate the attacker. Knowledge and understanding is what is ultimately required for the LGBQT community to be universally accepted in the world community. By attack blindly with anyone who disagrees with you without checking to see why they disagree with you will do more bad than good in the long run.

Wow! I'm just flabbergasted. So the only options are they either "hate" you or they are "ignorant"? There is no option for "some people don't agree with us" that isn't based on hate or ignorance? You know the more I see of this debate the more it become very very clear that far too many of the supposed aggrieved parties are the ones that truly are the ignorant hate filled bigots.

OK, maybe I over-exaggerated the point I'm making still stands and ironically the one you're yelling at me for. I was trying to explain to the other person that having a "It's us against them" mentality was wrong because the world is very grey, I must have forgot to put other examples into my explanation and I apologize. This subject has been making me angry for the exact same reason as you and I tend to not think when I'm angry. I do apologize for any misunderstandings.

 

[evilnancyreagan]

HA! Well Nintendo's damned if they do and damned if they don't on this one. I wonder what flavour they'll choose. Nintendo has been having a rather rough go of things lately, it's all rather Fockeresque.

 

[MasterOfHisOwnDomain]

I don't understand what the problem would have been in programming the game in the first place to ignore gender or sex distinctions when it came to Mii relations? This is essentially what happens with The Sims, where there is no big deal made of having same-sex relations and it is treated as yet another possible interaction between the avatars. Wouldn't it have been more of a deal to have programmed in the fact that [male/female] Mii can have relations with [opposite gender]?

 

[Vegosiux]

When it comes to issues of LGBTQ, if you're not with us then you're part of the problem.

No. The "with us or against us" mentality is the problem. Not part of the problem, but the whole bloody problem.

I refuse to associate with people who think in black and white. And I don't care if they're black, white, straight, gay, or enchanted motorcycles. Such people have brought nothing but trouble into my life with their obsessive and manipulative behavior, trying to rob me of my own will, of my own choices and instead guilting me into "falling in line". Because they think they know what's good for me. Or because they don't bloody care about me as a person, only as another number to add to their ranks. Or because they just need to look down on others to feel good about themselves, the poor sods.

If you treat me as an object or a tool, then kindly go somewhere else. I'm not playing that game.

You do not own me. You do not get to tell me which side I have to pick to be "right". Hell, you don't even get to tell me to pick a side at all. Good luck with your quest for justice. Just make sure you don't cut off the nose to spite the face. That never accomplished anything.

 

[KingsGambit_v1legacy]

Well, that's one more company to add to the block list for homophobia.

Such a shame, I really liked Nintendo too.

Well...I don't think you over-reacted quite hard enough here. Maybe a mass protest, death threats or burning buildings down is in order?

 

[Andy Shandy]

To be fair to Nintendo, I like to believe that initially not including same-sex relationships came from a place of ignorance - or apathy (considering the initial release was Japan only) - instead of hatred.

However, now that it has been brought to their attention through the Miiquality campaign, and they are bringing it out globally, for them to shrug this issue off as "Oh, this isn't reality, and gays aren't a thing in our quirky and whimsical world" is extremely disheartening to see.

"Your friends. Your drama. Your life. Except if you're not straight." is the message it sends out, whether Nintendo wants it to or not.

 

[Something Amyss]

I'm more interested if Movie extreme liberal Nintendo fan Bob will bring this up?

If you think he's an extreme liberal, I'd hate to see what you think of some actual liberals.

Also the main point of the bug back in 2013 was that Males could get pregnant. Funny how that wasn't mentioned at all.

You mean, exactly what was said in the linked article?

and male characters could actually become pregnant

Yeah, no mention.

It's a simple decision, Nintendo. Despite your adamant stance on the subject, some traditions need to die due to its narrow-minded background.

It's a simple decision, one that will have business impacts in Japan (the country that still actually still buys Nintendo stuff en masse).

Allowing gay marriage may be like banning homophobia from Duck Dynasty.

Nintendo makes a sims knock off. Doesn't include the freedom to go with your virtual life.

Would it really be Nintendo if they didn't nanny you?

"We're not trying to provide social commentary", except, you know, that you are.

Such as that homosexual relationships have no place in a 'whimsical quirky world'. Only straight people allowed there.

But remember, it's only social commentary when minorities are involved. When we're excluded, it's totally not.

I wouldn't be so quick to judge them, they've got to keep in mind what the current viewpoint in their home country is as opposed to what they may feel.

Despite what I said above, it still doesn't particularly make it acceptable.

It's probably premature to call them homophobic, but if someone wants to boycott to send the message this isn't okay, they might as well. Of course, boycotting everything from Japan could be logistically tricky....

It's not about homophobia as much as trying to avoid controversy, controversy that might drastically hurt sales in some regions.

Something they can't do no matter what they do.

We didn't excuse Chik-fil-a for coming from a Christian background and we shouldn't excuse Nintendo here.

Isn't that kind of a harsh comparison? Chick Fil-A was an issue not because of their religious affiliation, but because of the owner donating money to dehumanising anti-gay legislation. Nintendo has opted not to make pregnant men a thing anymore in a game. I would hope we wouldn't treat the two with parity.

There's a reason for why people such as Martin Luther King and Mahatma Ghandi are known worldwide. They realised that the best way to win people over was by showing themselves to be better than those they opposed, not sinking to their level or worse.

If somebody wishes to act morally superior it's best they act moral in the first place.

Funny you say that, but you mention Martin Luther King and Ghandi, both who didn't have morality on their side. One was a philanderer who was fond of a Bible which his church had used to accept subjugation of other peoples, and the other preached pacifism even as he was involved in WW2 and had his own cultural baggage.

We whitewash them in retrospect, but those "heroes" were accused of the same things you're accusing RD et al of. And they were more militant than any keyboard warrior. Seriously.

 

[Something Amyss]

"Gay marriage isn't legal in Japan"

That's funny, considering they seem to like their lesbian anime girls a ton. Way to go, Japan.

Don't trust TV to accurately depict culture. If anime was remotely accurate, Japan would be 80% Christian and 30% tentacle monster.

 

[demoman_chaos]

Honestly, they should have set it so two Miis could marry without a gender qualifier. It would have been simpler than having qualifiers like they do.

 

[MrMan999]

I kind of feel bad for the Miiquality guys. They provided a reasonable, mature, well thought out argument and to Nintendo's credit they responded in kind. And then the hardcore social justice crowd got wind and started flinging hate towards Nintendo in response to an imagined slight. Leaving Miiquality in the dust and basically drowning out any sane voice in the room.
And its not like Nintendo has shied away from openly gay characters in the past. Animal Crossing, the very existence of Birdo, and Heather from Fire Emblem: Radiant Dawn was very heavily implied to be a lesbian.

 

[MrMan999]

Well, that's one more company to add to the block list for homophobia.

Such a shame, I really liked Nintendo too.

Well...I don't think you over-reacted quite hard enough here. Maybe a mass protest, death threats or burning buildings down is in order?

No, all I did was just stop buying Nintendo stuff and throw out all the Nintendo products I have (hardware and games and that's it.)

I'm not going to do something drastic like that.

Wouldn't a more sensible move be simply following MiiQuality's suggestion and using the Club Nintendo Survey to campaign for a same sex DLC or more likely a Same Sex couple feature in the sequel?

 

[TaboriHK]

It's their choice to not add it, just as it's your choice to buy a gun and shoot yourself in the foot with it. I can't stop you from doing it, but I can exclaim how pointless and stupid it is.

 

[MeChaNiZ3D]

Well ok, they're trying not to rock the boat. It doesn't make them homophobic, it makes them lacking in conviction, which I doubt they have any of. They're just trying to avoid the ire of their home audience.

 

[MrHide-Patten]

It's funny watching the Ninendo defence force go to work in these scenarios. Frankly I've always seen Nintendo as incredibly backward, socially, technologically, everywhere. If there was ever a progressive thought in mind it was quickly squashed by the bottom dollar.

Despite the kiddy friendly facade, nintedo is damn insidious. Like a man in a pedo-bear suit.

 

[CpT_x_Killsteal]

Also the main point of the bug back in 2013 was that Males could get pregnant. Funny how that wasn't mentioned at all.

You mean, exactly what was said in the linked article?

and male characters could actually become pregnant

Yeah, no mention.

Ok so I guess it was mentioned in a link to an older story. Still think it should've been mentioned up front what the real bug was, the fact that you could cross-dress characters to look same-sex and have them marry was a fairly minor part of the bug.

 

[Dragonbums]

Does anyone know what Japan's stance on homosexuality is? I remember something about them being less prudish about it prior to western influence, but I don't know if that's some sort of myth.

While I can't speak for the general population I think someone in this thread or the other thread on the gaming forum have stated that in terms of opinion 56% of the Japanese population are for gay marriage, and gay marriage in legal terms is completely illegal.

So knowing this I can see why that would pose as a huge problem for Nintendo in their own country. After all you can marry Mii's in this game and allowing gay Mii's to marry would prove absolutely catastrophic in terms of public face over there. So even if they WANTED to, it would be very ill advised to follow up with it. Providing of course they either bar gay couples form marrying within the game itself, or they patch it out to allow marriage for the Western audience. The latter probably won't happen because the audience for this game here has yet to be proven.

 

[Dragonbums]

Oh look, more of Nintendo altering their content because they don't want to piss off some ignorant, if not bigoted, parent who might see that the game they're playing has people who aren't heterosexual and cisgender. I understand why they do it, and its bottomline over ethics, but its totally within my rights, and reasonable, to condemn them for stuff like this. And yes, I know, they have potentially one gay romance between Ike and Soren and an openly gay woman, Heather (who, by the way, was more or less stalking the person she was infatuated with, as the object of her affection did not reciprocate), in Fire Emblem: Radiant Dawn. I'll chalk that up on the "Pro-LGBT" side where it can be lonely by itself, and put Nintendo's long history of censoring LGBT-content on the "Con" side, along with a repeated history of knowing that things like this very Tamodachi thing were very much wanted, but not fulfilled because they'd rather play it safe than release a game to children that has a positive image for LGBT kids to look up to.

Major note to the author of this article: Please update what the bug was really patched out for. PLEASE.


Okay, Nintendo didn't patch out this bug because it involved two male Miis' romancing each other. They patched it out because the bug in question corrupted save data and crashed the game. The latter involving gay romance so on and so forth was a minor side effect of this bug. But that was far from the reason why they got rid of it.

Secondly they didn't alter anything about this game for the Western audience. This was a patch released on April 2013. Long before this game was even announced to come here. This patch was done and over with. The original poster who started this all was actually quite reasonable and asked Nintendo if they can implement this feature in their next installment. To which Nintendo replied calmly to. That is of course until the radical activists came in, shat all over the original poster and used their comment as a spring board to attack dog Nintendo. Now everything is a fucking mess.

Uh, you might want to check out the history of the Civil Rights movement, the Women's Rights movement, and the Gay Rights movement in American history. Shit didn't change because people say on their thumbs while mildly suggesting to people that maybe they shouldn't be such meanies towards them.

There is a good term that goes along the lines of "Pick and choose your battles" that springs to mind in these situations. Lashing out at everyone that takes an apathetic or neutral stance on an issue is far from the way to go in terms of convincing anyone to listen to you. Especially since after Nintendo made this game they added two prominent queer/transgenderd characters in Animal Crossing and one NPC in Pokemon X and Y talked about how happy she was about modern medicine because she can now be a Beauty (female exclusive trainer) as opposed to a Black Belt (male exclusive trainer)

 

[DOOM GUY]

Nintendo should of really just kept their mouth shut about this, 'cause now we're gonna get a shitstorm over some fucking video game... again...