Notch Decides Not To Back Psychonauts 2
- Thread starter Andy Chalk
- Start date
I don't hate Notch for backing out. It's the smart and reasonable choice.
I hate Notch for being the kind of arrogant and pretentious douchebag to make random claims without consulting any of his business partners, doing any research, or thinking them through. The phone, email, face to face meetings: all better ways to make initial contact about a multi-million dollar deal than twitter.
He wanted to reap the popularity and goodwill of the internet by making a big show, and he's earned whatever he gets.
I hate Notch for being the kind of arrogant and pretentious douchebag to make random claims without consulting any of his business partners, doing any research, or thinking them through. The phone, email, face to face meetings: all better ways to make initial contact about a multi-million dollar deal than twitter.
He wanted to reap the popularity and goodwill of the internet by making a big show, and he's earned whatever he gets.
Holy well-spoken post, Batman! +5 internets to you, Scars.Scars Unseen said:$18 million isn't a lot? Maybe by AAA publisher standards where they spend ludicrously excessive amounts of cash on administrative costs and marketing. Chris Roberts brought up a chart of manpower costs when he was explaining why he was asking for as much money as he was for Star Citizen. Let's look at that, shall we?
So the total cost(including equipment and software) for a member of a game development team(aside from those QA peasants) is around $127,571 per year. So let's assume a long development time: 5 years. $18M would pay for a 28 man team for 5 years. Frankly, I think that 28 people may be a bit of overkill for a platformer, as is a 5 year development cycle. $18M is quite a lot of money when you don't have to feed CEOs and plaster your game's image on every major television network every 10 minutes.
If these numbers are correct, I find it completely plausible that Notch was surprised by the 18M bill for this project.
I'm more shocked by the $18M price tag than anything else
We see 3D indie games all the time on a budget of free
We see 3D indie games all the time on a budget of free
28 people is too much for a full 3D Game? Not really. Nooo way is that too little. You're also forgetting costs associated with distribution, marketing and sales, legal, the whole nine yards. What DoubleFine is doing is making sure that they have the talent to get this game done correctly so that it doesn't squander its kickstarter money as well as the name of the brand. That's not cheap.bearlotz said:Holy well-spoken post, Batman! +5 internets to you, Scars.Scars Unseen said:$18 million isn't a lot? Maybe by AAA publisher standards where they spend ludicrously excessive amounts of cash on administrative costs and marketing. Chris Roberts brought up a chart of manpower costs when he was explaining why he was asking for as much money as he was for Star Citizen. Let's look at that, shall we?
So the total cost(including equipment and software) for a member of a game development team(aside from those QA peasants) is around $127,571 per year. So let's assume a long development time: 5 years. $18M would pay for a 28 man team for 5 years. Frankly, I think that 28 people may be a bit of overkill for a platformer, as is a 5 year development cycle. $18M is quite a lot of money when you don't have to feed CEOs and plaster your game's image on every major television network every 10 minutes.
If these numbers are correct, I find it completely plausible that Notch was surprised by the 18M bill for this project.
And Notch? Notch is what we would call "lucky". He got to invest 100k of his own money into a game and watch it produce millions. Not many have that opportunity. The problem? It gets to his head. He takes the concept and full look of Infiniminer, slaps on some RPG Elements that most of the people who play the game don't care about (a lot of servers even run with it off), and now he feels can comment on anything in the gaming industry and make commitments that are far over his head.
Helloooooo ego.
He could give me some of it > > I'll put it to good use.DVS BSTrD said:
Edit: Such is life. No big deal, I'll probably keep buying Double Fines games just because they're fun.
It would not have bothered me at all if he hadn't just gone on about how much money he has and how he doesn't know what to do with it all.
Oh well.
Oh well.
Um... how about Notch thinks before he acts. He committed to backing a game without knowing how much it would cost. He did so without consulting anyone within his company for any real numbers, or any real numbers from DoubleFine. If you read this article, then, you'll find that he made an assumption based on his rather trivial investment in Minecraft (100k dollars), and then applied that to another game project. He then -reached out- to Tim Schaffer and said that he would help make Psychonauts 2 happen. Tim wasn't begging him for money. Notch reached OUT to him! If I remember right, Tim got an email from Notch that said "Let's make Psychonauts 2 Happen", or something along those lines.A Smooth Criminal said:
Then he has the gall to say, "Oh, well 18 million is a lot of money! Silly me! How could they spend such an amount? I made millions off of Minecraft after investing 100k!"
The guy lives in a bubble of his own ego. He needs a reality check, because when he speaks, he often comes across as disconnected.
I won't say I hate Notch, not for this really, but I will say this:erttheking said:
I fucking called it!!
A year ago, when Notch made a big show of telling Tim Schaffer, "Psychonauts 2, let's make it happen.", I was as excited as just about everyone else. I'm a big fan of the first game, so the prospect of another delighted me.
However, I know Notch. Or rather, I know how he acts. As such, given his tendency to talk big but inevitably flake on his responsibilities, I knew...just KNEW...he'd back out of the deal. I seriously hoped this time would be different, but seeing as it's not, I'm not surprised.
But hey, he got what he wanted. Practically a year of love, praise, and admiration from the 'net community for "standing up" to the big-bad-triple-A studios and promising to fund a sequel to a series that was considered a financial failure.
Oh wow, I forgot about the part where Notch signed a contract and Tim Schaffer jumped on board rather than running off to crowdfund some point and click adventure game.Nocturnus said:
Notch made no commitment. He expressed serious interest in privately funding Psychonauts 2. Then, after receiving an estimate of the cost, he decided he didn't want to invest $18M on the game. You say he should think before he acts, and that's what he did. Quit trying to demonize him for it.
Yes, he's said some things that are commendable. However, he also has a tendency to jump the shark and say things that are ... not very bright.
Remember the whole Windows 8 Comment that he made? Over them asking him to renew his certificate with Microsoft for the OS? What he didn't tell you was that he already did this for Windows 7, Vista, and XP. He also certed it for XBox Live, who's marketplace takes a 30% cut similar to Steam. Forgetting even the cert issue, why was he railing against W8? Because of the Windows Store, which.. takes a 30% cut. Similar to Steam. And similar to the service he's already using... XBoxLive Arcade.
The guy just doesn't think these things through when he gets heated and passionate. He'll make stupid statements and commitments without researching things, or assessing what he's already done that might contradict it.
And does he have an ego? Yes. Because with all that, he likes to speak as though he represents the entire Indy Gaming Community.
Does he say some good things? Yes. Does he fall flat on his face a lot? Heck yes. Does he have an ego? Better believe it. I mean, just a few days ago he was talking about how he had more money than he knew what to do with. Ugh...
Oh yeah, if not just developing on PC, I think each dev kit costs like $10k and at the end of the project you have to give it back (they don't reimburse you). And paying for support from them in case of hardware failures. And paying for the certify process for release for the consoles.
Also not just regular salaries but also paying for the voice actors too!
And maybe paying off any debt incurred from the past.
DF's webpage lists them at ~65 people. I don't know how they divvy up the project teams and all that, but it would suck if only the P2 people got the funding for the guestimated 28 people @ 5 years and left the other half to fend for themselves.
Nevermind that the various dev disciplines overlap their production periods all the time, as people transfer in and out, so you might as well fund the whole studio.
So $18 million / (65 people @ $127k cost) = ~2.17 years.
Suddenly that $18 million doesn't seem so large anymore, does it?
Also not just regular salaries but also paying for the voice actors too!
And maybe paying off any debt incurred from the past.
DF's webpage lists them at ~65 people. I don't know how they divvy up the project teams and all that, but it would suck if only the P2 people got the funding for the guestimated 28 people @ 5 years and left the other half to fend for themselves.
Nevermind that the various dev disciplines overlap their production periods all the time, as people transfer in and out, so you might as well fund the whole studio.
So $18 million / (65 people @ $127k cost) = ~2.17 years.
Suddenly that $18 million doesn't seem so large anymore, does it?
Even if it's quite high for a single person, they could still find a way: apparently Notch didn't have reservations when he thought it was 13 millions, perhaps the rest could be raised via crowdfunding given Schaefer already has experience with that process and there are tons of fans eagerly hoping for that game.
Well... looks like I just learned a little something about finances. Hardly was even expecting such.