Notch Tweets Rage Over Minecraft Party Sexual Assault

[Dusty Donuts]

COngratulations Escapist. You're now officially more sexist and douchebaggy that god-damned Something Awful. Damn, I*m not going to use sexist, because then some idiot is going to cry about White-Knighting. You're basement-dwelling neckbeards, remnants of an era that for all intents and purposes should be fucking dead.

How the hell do you manage? Seriously? How the FUCK do you manage? 11 pages of mostly victim-blaming and "Lol that's hilarious.

There's only been 385 posts by this point, probably a lot of people doing repeat posts, and you decide that the WHOLE ESCAPIST is like this?
Oh yeah, and on the basis of being "douchebaggy" you called everyone here basement-dwelling neckbeards...have you BEEN to any internet community that didn't have it's share of routine morons? The only ones that don't are the ones with only 100 or so people in them.

How the FUCK do you manage?

Well enough, apparently. If you don't like it, hit the bricks, no-one is forcing you to stay.

 

[I'mANinja]

You're supposed to dress up as a creeper for Minecraft parties, not be one!

Look out man, you made a joke on a thread about Sexual Assault, you might wanna take cover!

 

[I'mANinja]

No doubt this will somehow reflect badly on the gaming community
The whole thing is kind of sad

Our "good friends" at Shakesville posted about this whole mess, just so you could be right: http://www.shakesville.com/2012/09/oh-look-its-time-to-talk-about-gamer.html

Oh! So now being not even a gamer, but a NERD in general makes us more likely to be rapists, that's honestly fucking worse than anything I've seen FOX news say. I can now no longer be mad at anyone in this thread after reading that bullshit and it's comments.

 

[Immsys]

Dude...whoa. Chill out with the logic. We have to have the witch hunt, ruin as many people as possible based on unsubstantiated claims alone, then we look back with somber recollection and use logic.

You're going out order.

We don't know the names or identities of anyone involved with this incident (except the alleged victim). Whose life could we possibly be ruining here?

You know, you really ought to give this logic thing a shot some time. it's works pretty well!

I'm certain he was being sarcastic. However you raise an interesting point, if anyone here had the names or addresses of people involved, would they feel the need to give any input? if not, then are all these people complaining about how bad this is just whining ineffectually, or would they just understand their place in the situation is not to interfere? fascinating questions. From some of the more... Militant posts I've read, it certainly seems that some people would like to get involved in some way, yet I'm sure that they wouldn't if given the opportunity.

 

[Immsys]

HE GRABBED HER HAND AND PUT IT ON HIS JUNK. She didn't stick her hand down his pants and feel bad about it later. This guy took advantage of her politeness, and possibly her inebriation, then performed a sexual act on her without her consent.

This is the mainline problem with people's assessment of situations similar to this. Without wishing to single you out you are, in effect, not allowing for any possible scope of exaggeration, mis-remberence, forgetfulness, traumatic memory altering (real, imagined or exaggerated) and of course the obvious one, the inebriation. Instead of factoring in these things into how you look at what may or may not have happened, everyone seems to be jumping the gun and saying that not ONE of these factors significantly or insignificantly altered her recollection of the events and that her account, given a significant amount of time after the even, is a true; uninfluenced and unbiased telling of what did or did not occur.

just to clarify I'm not accusing her of lying, that would be stupid. I'm only suggesting that people should really hold off on making statements such as "THIS is what happened" until a more clear picture emerges, if that ever is the case. To take the version of events given here as gospel is an easy way to be accusing a lot of people, male and female, of rape or assault when in reality there was a misunderstanding or, at very worse, a complete rearrangement of events in a witnesses' head.

 

[cobra_ky]

I'm certain he was being sarcastic. However you raise an interesting point, if anyone here had the names or addresses of people involved, would they feel the need to give any input? if not, then are all these people complaining about how bad this is just whining ineffectually, or would they just understand their place in the situation is not to interfere? fascinating questions. From some of the more... Militant posts I've read, it certainly seems that some people would like to get involved in some way, yet I'm sure that they wouldn't if given the opportunity.

I'm not sure i understand the question. Even if we knew of the parties involved i'm not sure if anything constructive could be done with that information after the fact. I can't speak for others, but the reason i think this is important to talk about is that situations like this happen all the time in the real world, and they shouldn't be tolerated in our culture or anywhere else in society. there's not much to be done about this situation now, but maybe the discussion we have here can prevent other incidents in the future.

HE GRABBED HER HAND AND PUT IT ON HIS JUNK. She didn't stick her hand down his pants and feel bad about it later. This guy took advantage of her politeness, and possibly her inebriation, then performed a sexual act on her without her consent.

This is the mainline problem with people's assessment of situations similar to this. Without wishing to single you out you are, in effect, not allowing for any possible scope of exaggeration, mis-remberence, forgetfulness, traumatic memory altering (real, imagined or exaggerated) and of course the obvious one, the inebriation. Instead of factoring in these things into how you look at what may or may not have happened, everyone seems to be jumping the gun and saying that not ONE of these factors significantly or insignificantly altered her recollection of the events and that her account, given a significant amount of time after the even, is a true; uninfluenced and unbiased telling of what did or did not occur.

just to clarify I'm not accusing her of lying, that would be stupid. I'm only suggesting that people should really hold off on making statements such as "THIS is what happened" until a more clear picture emerges, if that ever is the case. To take the version of events given here as gospel is an easy way to be accusing a lot of people, male and female, of rape or assault when in reality there was a misunderstanding or, at very worse, a complete rearrangement of events in a witnesses' head.

That post was in direct response to Blablahb's analysis of events as presented in the original blog post. I'll allow the possibility that ky's account isn't entirely accurate, but in the absence of any evidence to the contrary, i don't see any point in speculating on it. I'm less concerned about the details of this particular incident and more concerned about the general reaction from the community here. In particular i'm concerned about people like Blablahb who seem to believe that the actions of the man in this story were entirely justifiable.

 

[cobra_ky]

You clearly don't understand how consent works, and that's why my last post had an entire paragraph at the end describing how it works. Read it again, and note the complete lack of forms involved.

I think you're the one who needs to read up on how stuff works if anyone. I've been quite clear what I base myself on, while you've not even bothered to examine the situation at all. There's no need for talking down to me, especially not if you're wrong.

I did quite a bit of reading, and i invite you to do the same: <a href=www.scarleteen.com/article/boyfriend/drivers_ed_for_the_sexual_superhighway_navigating_consent>Feel free to skim, there's a lot of information here.

It seems clear to me you base your idea of consent on assumptions and vague "signals". You seem to think that an unwillingness to end a risque conversation constitutes aggreement to any number of possible sex acts. That's a failed model based on inadequate communication, and it very easily lends itself to all kinds of bad sexual experiences.

if you talk food with someone, is that an invitation for them to start ramming shrimp down your throat? I mean it's perfectly reasonable to assume that if you're talking about food, you must be hungry.

If you talk food with someone and they invite you over to a good restaurant, can you scream, call security and press charges?

That's not an apt metaphor, because (allegedly) he never offered an invitation. He simply presumed and acted without her consent.

If someone grabs your hand and drags you into a nice restaurant against your will, then yes, you can scream and call security and press charges.

Well for starters, you could at least ask "hey wanna see my cock?" before you start shoving people's hands down your pants.

For all you can know, he did, and she said yes.

For all we know she may have turned into a dragon and bitten him in half. As i said before i have no interest in rampant speculation.

Let me just ask you this: Assuming the story as told is complete and entirely factual, would it be bad if such an incident occured? Who would be at fault? What, if anything, could and should be done to prevent such incidents in the future?

Who gives a shit was his intentions were?

Why thank you. That little sentence says a lot about your reasoning. I also think we can never agree on this now.
You see, you're basically saying "He's a man, thus always guilty"

That's not at all what i'm saying, and i thought the little sentences following would have made that clear: Good intentions do not absolve you of a crime. I'm sure he thought he was being quite charming, but his actions, as described, constitute a sexual assault. Gender does not figure into it.

You see, socially clumsy people exist. Sexually clumsy people even exist. Equating them with sexual predators is more than a little silly.

Clumsy? Did he or did he not intentionally move her hand to his penis? "Sexually reckless" is a more fitting term, i think.

 

[Immsys]

I'm not sure i understand the question. Even if we knew of the parties involved i'm not sure if anything constructive could be done with that information after the fact. I can't speak for others, but the reason i think this is important to talk about is that situations like this happen all the time in the real world, and they shouldn't be tolerated in our culture or anywhere else in society. there's not much to be done about this situation now, but maybe the discussion we have here can prevent other incidents in the future.

I believe I was trying to question the people who type on here about the injustice, and how something must be done, without considering any practical applications. I guess as you say the real question (not the ones that I proposed, those are silly) is how exactly could this be prevented? Sadly "not very easily" is likely to be the answer. I'm not sure about you, but sexual assault and to a greater extent rape are crimes that are a clear reminder that underneath all the civilizing we are just animals clawing at a cage, alcohol just throws in the key.

That post was in direct response to Blablahb's analysis of events as presented in the original blog post. I'll allow the possibility that ky's account isn't entirely accurate, but in the absence of any evidence to the contrary, i don't see any point in speculating on it. I'm less concerned about the details of this particular incident and more concerned about the general reaction from the community here. In particular i'm concerned about people like Blablahb who seem to believe that the actions of the man in this story were entirely justifiable.

You're quite right, in a blindingly embarrassing depiction of irony I did in fact jump the gun on claiming that you jumped the gun. My apologies. I suppose my real point (utterly missed due to my misuse of quotes) is aimed at the group of people who are pounding their war axes and calling for blood. Again, sorry for a long quote pointing out what you already knew.

In regard to the question you pose, while I would hardly consider myself in any way part of or representative of the larger community, yet I wouldn't be surprised if I wasn't alone in feeling slightly apathetic towards events like these. Of course its very sad; of course if my feeling sad would in any way help any victims I would be happy to oblige, yet I can't shake the feeling that I really have no power to stop anything like this from happening. We've done a pretty good job of suppressing natural human instinct, I don't think wiping it out completely is really an option. As such, people will be killed, robbed, discriminated against and, to no end of sadness, raped and sexually assaulted, for all of the foreseeable future.

 

[Immsys]

And Something else. I know the image of someone taking a hand and putting it on there dick and saying "is that big enough" is funny hell its hilarious but thats not the disturbed part. the part that really matters.

The part that matters is when you come across that "darkness" in a person. Its not natural and doesnt belong in the manifest realm of the living. When you come into contact with someone like that its something else kind of like peering into a void.Its not put in someone in one day its built brick by brick for years in festering neighborhoods and shitty homes. Its creepy as hell and until you experience it and truly come into contact with it like this girl and i have you cant really understand. Its about as creepy as slender man or pyramid head.

theres something wrong that drives a person to do that.

I feel my explanation was lacking but I hope it atleast conveys the concept.

I'm afraid I have to disagree slightly with you're point. That darkness isn't "unnatural", instead it is actually far more natural than this charade of human decency that we tend to refer to as our "normal state". It is important to remember that we are animals, more so under alcohol, nice houses and schooling may hide and lessen the primal urges, but it is a mistake to assume that everyone is decent until corrupted by some malign force. They are the malign force corrupted by decency.

Having said that, I do agree that sexual aggression is a deeply saddening part of our nature. Natural isn't always better, after all nature is a cruel, cruel place.

 

[cobra_ky]

I'm not sure i understand the question. Even if we knew of the parties involved i'm not sure if anything constructive could be done with that information after the fact. I can't speak for others, but the reason i think this is important to talk about is that situations like this happen all the time in the real world, and they shouldn't be tolerated in our culture or anywhere else in society. there's not much to be done about this situation now, but maybe the discussion we have here can prevent other incidents in the future.

I believe I was trying to question the people who type on here about the injustice, and how something must be done, without considering any practical applications. I guess as you say the real question (not the ones that I proposed, those are silly) is how exactly could this be prevented? Sadly "not very easily" is likely to be the answer. I'm not sure about you, but sexual assault and to a greater extent rape are crimes that are a clear reminder that underneath all the civilizing we are just animals clawing at a cage, alcohol just throws in the key.

That post was in direct response to Blablahb's analysis of events as presented in the original blog post. I'll allow the possibility that ky's account isn't entirely accurate, but in the absence of any evidence to the contrary, i don't see any point in speculating on it. I'm less concerned about the details of this particular incident and more concerned about the general reaction from the community here. In particular i'm concerned about people like Blablahb who seem to believe that the actions of the man in this story were entirely justifiable.

You're quite right, in a blindingly embarrassing depiction of irony I did in fact jump the gun on claiming that you jumped the gun. My apologies. I suppose my real point (utterly missed due to my misuse of quotes) is aimed at the group of people who are pounding their war axes and calling for blood. Again, sorry for a long quote pointing out what you already knew.

In regard to the question you pose, while I would hardly consider myself in any way part of or representative of the larger community, yet I wouldn't be surprised if I wasn't alone in feeling slightly apathetic towards events like these. Of course its very sad; of course if my feeling sad would in any way help any victims I would be happy to oblige, yet I can't shake the feeling that I really have no power to stop anything like this from happening. We've done a pretty good job of suppressing natural human instinct, I don't think wiping it out completely is really an option. As such, people will be killed, robbed, discriminated against and, to no end of sadness, raped and sexually assaulted, for all of the foreseeable future.

Sorry, but i just don't buy the "drunken monkey" model of human behavior. Most of us have absolutely no difficulty acting like civilized human beings every day of our lives, and on the rare occasion where somebody gives in to their base desires and kills, or steals, we rightfully condemn that person and their actions.

How can we stop this from happening? We can take things like this seriously, for starters. We can stop cracking jokes about it and laughing it off. We can stop second-guessing the victim and defending the perpetrator. We can stop throwing up our hands and blaming it all on alcohol or human nature. We can have a frank and honest discussion about consent and safe, appropriate ways of initiating sexual contact. The more we talk about these things, the more people understand what actually went wrong here and how not to repeat the same mistakes, the less likely they are to be involved in them in the future.

 

[Immsys]

Sorry, but i just don't buy the "drunken monkey" model of human behavior. Most of us have absolutely no difficulty acting like civilized human beings every day of our lives, and on the rare occasion where somebody gives in to their base desires and kills, or steals, we rightfully condemn that person and their actions.

I'm sorry but I can't help but disagree with that view. 100 years ago intellectualism was pushing towards a pretentious denial of our animalistic nature, furthered by the main philosophers of the time, and a view that humans were "better" than animals, thus not only capable of, but obliged to, a strong code of ethics. I won't go into how arrogant it is to claim to be an arbiter of morality, but what i can say with certainty is that this shows that before and during that time, humans were impulsive creatures, tending towards murder, rape, stealing and many other things that we now with hindsight consider wrong. So something changed. We weren't always nice and good and corrupted by alcohol, we were always corrupted and made "good" by social forces, we just sometimes revert back to the pre-social state due to circumstance. There is no further reason necessary than to look at the acts committed by those in extreme poverty, they lack certain things (wealth, clean food or water, education) and so commit what we would call atrocities. They are human, they are not the exception, for the majority of human history THAT has been the norm, we are the exception.

How can we stop this from happening? We can take things like this seriously, for starters. We can stop cracking jokes about it and laughing it off. We can stop second-guessing the victim and defending the perpetrator. We can stop throwing up our hands and blaming it all on alcohol or human nature. We can have a frank and honest discussion about consent and safe, appropriate ways of initiating sexual contact. The more we talk about these things, the more people understand what actually went wrong here and how not to repeat the same mistakes, the less likely they are to be involved in them in the future.

We joke about murder, joke about it a lot in fact. Coming to terms with death has recently (last 50-100 years or so) come into mainstream consciousness, why should sexual assault be different? We can stop having logical discussions about the reality of sexual assault, such as the fact that very few claims are verifiable and the fact that false claims are made? that seems rather naive and childish, don't you think? Blaming it on a combination of human nature and alcohol are pretty big pillars, add in stupidity and you have the majority of cases figured out. It certainly seemed to me that this guy wasn't malicious, people who don't care about hurting people tend not to try to chat and up their potential rape victims.

The reason most people tend to not see the point about talking sexual assault is that drunken people mistaking consent do so mostly because they are drunk, they wouldn't usually mistake consent. Talking about consent isn't going to make them not make mistakes when they are drunk, in the same way that talking about balance isn't going to make drunk people not fall over. Taking out that proportion of the rapist crowd, and you are talking to the people who INTEND to assault people, and then you might as well be talking to Croyden about robbing people.

 

[ShiningAmber]

I think I honestly just come to this site now to look at the horrible, sexist remarks most of the men make on here.

I don't expect anything less from this community. Whether it's about feminism, women's rights, abortion, sexual assault, whatever, you guys never disappoint with your disgusting remarks.

Grats on being your stereotype.

As a woman and a victim of sexual assault that left visible scars on my face, I don't give two shits how big or little you judge the assault. The fact is that some man (in this case) felt he had the right to physically push her to do something she didn't want to do. That's the fucked up part.

THE FACT THAT THIS MAN FELT IT WAS HIS RIGHT TO OVERRIDE HER CHOICE AND FORCE HER TO DO SOMETHING SHE DIDN'T WANT TO DO.

Just visiting this forum is a headache and a reminder of awful things for me. Seriously. Read any topic that's brought up about women. I dare you. Look what happens. Look at what most of you say and do. It's fucking awful.

You guys are pigs and you're disgusting. I hope karma fucks you in the ass one day and I mean that in the most vile and disgusting way possible.

 

[SmugFrog]

I think I honestly just come to this site now to look at the horrible, sexist remarks most of the men make on here.

I don't expect anything less from this community.

Are you talking about the Escapist community? The gaming community? I'm not sure.

I think you came here just to necro an old thread and start an argument. You had to go digging for this thread - it wasn't on the front page of the news posts; it is almost a year old! Escapist, when will you start locking posting on older news stories so this doesn't happen?

My suggestion is that when you see something like this topic, rather than diving in and reading about it and opening your old wounds, you close your eyes, take a breath, and let it go. You've got to let yourself heal from your past, and you can't change the entire world. Unfortunately there's always some jerks out there that do bad things. This is the reason I don't visit CNN / FOXNEWS, I just can't stand seeing (and then being pulled into reading) those stories of abuse and people's ignorance. Humans do some of the most horrible things to each other.

 

[Olas]

Snip

Holy crap, look at the date of the last post above yours. This thread is a fossil. I'm only here because I was surprised to see it at the top of my Participated Threads list and had to see what was going on. I'm going to assume this was an honest mistake, but read the code of conduct if you haven't already.

And if you're going to broadly generalize an online community for being a bunch of sleazy chauvinistic bigots, the Escapist is a very odd choice. Hell, until a week ago our editor and chief was a woman. I won't say this site has never had rotten apples among it's many members, but as you may have noticed from this thread those guys tend to get get banned quickly and the vast majority of us are pretty awesome.

just sayin.