Ok enough arguing over DA2's gameplay, how is the story?

[TheDuckbunny]

I'm loving it! Finally a fantasy RPG without a 'save the world' plot. And they've really nailed Kirkwall with a unique style and look, not your typical fantasy city. All the lore stuff that was so interesting in Origins (The feud between the templars and the mages, blood magic, the Qunari) has now been given the forefront attention it deserves. They've really created an interesting fantasy world with Dragon Age and now they're making it their own.

As for the plot, it's a character study. That's what it is. Don't expect a great epic going into this because you will likely be dissapointed. It's all about your character and how he/she rises through the ranks of the city over the span of a few years. It's a daring approach to this kind of RPG which is evident in the amount of backlash it gets but to me it felt really refreshing and I wish more games would do this. To the archdemon? You're a noone. No legendary hero, no heir to the throne. You're just a person living in a fantasy world. And Dragon Age 2 is that tale.

 

[mireko]

I see, I've been summoned again.

The story is better than the first game's story, and so are the characters.

The plot is "smaller", and it serves the game excellently, allowing it to look at the minute elements of Thedas' society that were hinted at but glossed over in Origins. The struggle between the Circle and the Chantry, the struggle between the government and the Qunari, all much more interesting topics than the "SAVE MIDDLE-EARTH" drone of the first game. Even better thanks to the high degree of moral ambiguity that permeates the story.

A lot of the choices in the game are never clearly stated to be good or evil, and you have to take the consequences of those actions. There's nothing like a karma meter, and none of the sides can decisively be said to be in the right at any time. There are no 'good' sides, there are only good people, and even they may ask you to do evil things. This is something I like.

In many ways, I feel like they've broken out of their old style of writing and borrowed a few notes from their BFFs at Obsidian. This is also something I like.

We get to experience much more of the character's subplots than in Origins as well. Example: Leliana and Merill. Most of you will see the similarity immediately (they both have accents with which we're unfamiliar and are cute), but where Leliana's past is mostly revealed in conversations (DLC doesn't count), you actually get to be a part of Merill's story. As a result, Merill's plot is so much more moving when things go off course.

I understand the criticism of not being able to speak to your characters whenever you want, but conversations show up much more often than they did in Origins, and it isn't anywhere near as boneheaded as Awakening, so I'm fine with it.

[sub]I'll concede, at last, that Origins was better due to less dungeon recycling. However, I still like DA2 more, for the reasons mentioned above.[/sub]

 

[the_green_dragon]

Luckily some of the characters are really good. Namely Merrill, Varric and Avaline.

Really? I though Merrill was a big cry bay in denial and Avaline didn't really feel fully fleshed out. I had Avaline in my party most of the time, she would have so been fired from her job...... Varric is cool.

Eh. If you say so.

...

Okay, sorry if that sounds rather passive-aggresive. I just don't have the energy to argue about these things on the internet.

Arguing on the internet is stupid anyway, we all have our own opinions of characters we like and dislike.

 

[Ladette]

The story was alright, different, which scores a lot of points with me. It was nice not being "an hero" for up until the 3rd act. I liked that it didn't focus on a huge, over-arching quest too.

I think Bioware was trying to do what Mass Effect 2 did, with the focus shifting onto the characters, with varying success.

I loved Merril and Varric, and really liked Aveline. Isabella got on my nerves for the same reasons Zevran did (to me their shared defining character trait is "slutty"). Fenris seemed to only exist to act like an asshole and brood. Anders is a preachy dick. Bethanay and Carver are decent, I found Carver to be more intresting though.

All in all, I guess I liked Dragon Age 2 more than Origins, but they both do things differently.

 

[DustyDrB]

It's a refreshing departure from BioWare's normal fare. The story is near non-existent in the first act. You're simply trying to establish yourself. Then it picks up heavily in the second act and is strong until the very end of the final act. I'm not pleased with the ending. It had some very good fights, but I felt like I was trolled.

Spoiler: What I mean

I sided with the mages. It was my opinion, as well as the opinion of many stable-minded individuals in the game (even some Templars) that the policies of Meredith drove the mages to extreme and forbidden magic. We were shown the worst of mages, but we were also shown how and why they came to be that way. And we were also shown good, honest mages as well as former rogue mages who exhibited a repentant attitude.

At the end of the final act, however, it seems that every mage except Merril and Bethany lose their minds completely. Anders actions were just...God, I would have killed him right then and there if I didn't need a healer. Orsino turns to blood magic because of what? Because he's expected to do so, so why the hell not? It didn't fit his attitude from my previous encounters with him. Then Abominations run rampant through the street. I don't remember seeing a single mage (aside from Bethany, Merril, and Anders) who didn't apparently make a deal with a demon. I was just pissed off at the story at the end of the game, after having loved it until that point.

 

[mireko]

It's a refreshing departure from BioWare's normal fare. The story is near non-existent in the first act. You're simply trying to establish yourself. Then it picks up heavily in the second act and is strong until the very end of the final act. I'm not pleased with the ending. It had some very good fights, but I felt like I was trolled.

Spoiler: What I mean

I sided with the mages. It was my opinion, as well as the opinion of many stable-minded individuals in the game (even some Templars) that the policies of Meredith drove the mages to extreme and forbidden magic. We were shown the worst of mages, but we were also shown how and why they came to be that way. And we were also shown good, honest mages as well as former rogue mages who exhibited a repentant attitude.

At the end of the final act, however, it seems that every mage except Merril and Bethany lose their minds completely. Anders actions were just...God, I would have killed him right then and there if I didn't need a healer. Orsino turns to blood magic because of what? Because he's expected to do so, so why the hell not? It didn't fit his attitude from my previous encounters with him. Then Abominations run rampant through the street. I don't remember seeing a single mage (aside from Bethany, Merril, and Anders) who didn't apparently make a deal with a demon. I was just pissed off at the story at the end of the game, after having loved it until that point.

Spoiler: I agree, furthermore..

That pissed me off too, especially Orsino's "WE'RE CORNERED, I'M GONNA GO CUT MYSELF AND ATTACK MY ALLIES" stunt. It just.. didn't work. I have to wonder if it was planned to be used for players who sided with the Templars (his reaction would make more sense if you had fought your way in), and then just didn't bother to make a scene for mage-symphatizer players.

Still, I think (and hope) that the mages you fight in the finale are just a tiny fraction of all the mages in Kirkwall. You run into waaaay too many abominations, but the Templars wouldn't lose the war in Kirkwall unless there were more good mages.

That's my take on it. They didn't actually show my take on it, but I have to assume that's how the story ends, because the alternative (everyone's dead due to blood magic?) is just too stupid. Another thing that was stupid was Anders. He blows up the Chantry. Fine, we know he's an extremist, and he did give me some very loud hints that he was about to do something seriously awful, but why the Chantry? Why not the Templar base? It's just a block away. Gah.

Although I will commend the writers for one thing: This was actually the first time I spared a character's life with the reasoning that they could do more good alive than dead. I mean, characters in games do that a lot, and I've let people live before, but in games like this this is the first time I've had my character say that and actually mean it, which is interesting.

 

[LordOfTheDance]

I loved that the game didn't follow Bioware's normal structure. So that was a such a huge plus for me I think it allows me to give the story a little bit of extra leeway.

I think for the most part the companions were much better then DA:O's party. Notably Varric (who I now edges out Garrus as my favorite Bioware companion), also Anders was setup beautifully, and Merrill may well be Bioware's cutest companion ever, while still possessing more character then being just the cute naive one.

But most importantly. DA2 actually takes advantage of its setting. IE Thedas. Thedas is a dark fantasy world where good and evil are greatly obscured, decisions are difficult, and usually things end tragically for heroes. DA:O had a few moments that fit with that sort of narrative theme but really it came down to, Good Grey Wardens defeat Evil Dark Spawn. Hawke's story is far more tragic then the Warden's even if the Warden makes the ultimate sacrifice.

 

[Coldie]

It's a refreshing departure from BioWare's normal fare. The story is near non-existent in the first act. You're simply trying to establish yourself. Then it picks up heavily in the second act and is strong until the very end of the final act. I'm not pleased with the ending. It had some very good fights, but I felt like I was trolled.

Spoiler: What I mean

I sided with the mages. It was my opinion, as well as the opinion of many stable-minded individuals in the game (even some Templars) that the policies of Meredith drove the mages to extreme and forbidden magic. We were shown the worst of mages, but we were also shown how and why they came to be that way. And we were also shown good, honest mages as well as former rogue mages who exhibited a repentant attitude.

At the end of the final act, however, it seems that every mage except Merril and Bethany lose their minds completely. Anders actions were just...God, I would have killed him right then and there if I didn't need a healer. Orsino turns to blood magic because of what? Because he's expected to do so, so why the hell not? It didn't fit his attitude from my previous encounters with him. Then Abominations run rampant through the street. I don't remember seeing a single mage (aside from Bethany, Merril, and Anders) who didn't apparently make a deal with a demon. I was just pissed off at the story at the end of the game, after having loved it until that point.

Spoiler: Well, actually...

Merril's entire personal storyline is about her dealings with demons (specifically, a Pride demon) and her "it's okay, I can quit anytime" use of Blood Magic. Anders is an Abomination, willingly possessed by a demon of Vengeance. Bethany is the only innocent mage with more than a single scene of screen time and even at that she's a fairly minor character. Even CHARNAME Hawke can dabble in blood magic. With no consequences, of course.

The fantasy Nazis are right in this game. Their use of The Right of Annulment and "The Tranquil Solution" is pretty much justified by the mages. And that's a terrible message for a game a story anything to have.

 

[Bostur]

As for the plot, it's a character study. That's what it is. Don't expect a great epic going into this because you will likely be dissapointed. It's all about your character and how he/she rises through the ranks of the city over the span of a few years. It's a daring approach to this kind of RPG which is evident in the amount of backlash it gets but to me it felt really refreshing and I wish more games would do this. To the archdemon? You're a noone. No legendary hero, no heir to the throne. You're just a person living in a fantasy world. And Dragon Age 2 is that tale.

Isn't DAO a character study as well? Or all good stories for that matter?

The overall frame of the DAO story about killing the archdemon is pretty minor. Most of the story is about political intrigue, personal intrigue, small love stories, big love stories. Rise to power, fall from power. The main difference I think is that in DAO there is more of a framework for those character studies.

My main gripe with DA2 is that I can't keep track of the pieces of the story, because I get presented with too many pieces at once. A bit like a novel where the first chapter introduces me to 10 different characters.

 

[Ladette]

It's a refreshing departure from BioWare's normal fare. The story is near non-existent in the first act. You're simply trying to establish yourself. Then it picks up heavily in the second act and is strong until the very end of the final act. I'm not pleased with the ending. It had some very good fights, but I felt like I was trolled.

Spoiler: What I mean

I sided with the mages. It was my opinion, as well as the opinion of many stable-minded individuals in the game (even some Templars) that the policies of Meredith drove the mages to extreme and forbidden magic. We were shown the worst of mages, but we were also shown how and why they came to be that way. And we were also shown good, honest mages as well as former rogue mages who exhibited a repentant attitude.

At the end of the final act, however, it seems that every mage except Merril and Bethany lose their minds completely. Anders actions were just...God, I would have killed him right then and there if I didn't need a healer. Orsino turns to blood magic because of what? Because he's expected to do so, so why the hell not? It didn't fit his attitude from my previous encounters with him. Then Abominations run rampant through the street. I don't remember seeing a single mage (aside from Bethany, Merril, and Anders) who didn't apparently make a deal with a demon. I was just pissed off at the story at the end of the game, after having loved it until that point.

Spoiler

This I do need to agree with. It's hard to argue with the Templars when every Mage you meet goes and proves them right. I think Bioware got to concerned with their "grey morality" and went overboard with showing that the Templars extreme plans were not without cause. Orsino in particular was just bad writing, there was nothing to indicate that he would resort to blood magic, especially not when things weren't nearly as bad as he was making them out to be.

 

[Elamdri]

As many complaints as I've heard over the gameplay and the whole dumbing down of the RPG aspect, knowing Bioware, I'm still wondering how the story turned out.

Plus, compared to the first game, how does the story stand out?

The story is alright, although the 1st act lacks a clear antagonist, and there is an antagonist shift between the 2nd and 3rd act. Have one clear antagonist throughout all 3 Acts would have been very beneficial.

 

[MetallicaRulez0]

Characters were good as always with Bioware, but this was easily their weakest main plot to date. Lack of antagonists and poor pacing are the biggest issues. It's refreshing that they didn't go with a "save the world" story for the umpteenth time, but I didn't enjoy the story particularly much.

 

[theevilsanta]

As many have stated above, a story other than "save the world" is quite refreshing. Unfortunately, they didn't exactly knock the ball out of the park. It was good. I wanted to know what happened at the end for sure. And the implications of what happened in Kirkwall was a pretty great setup for the third game. I just don't think the whole frame narrative was done as well as it could have been done. I expected Varric's interrogation scenes to differ drastically with the choices made. I mean, a lot of the side quests that carried across timelines I found quite compelling. If Varric had at least alluded to these events during his interrogations the whole thing would have felt a lot more tight.

It all just adds up the the "rushed" feeling of the game. That said, I've put more hours in Dragon Age 2 than I've put into an RPG/story game than I have in a longggg time. I've beat DA2 twice and didn't ever get past the final battle in DA:O (I play on nightmare and didn't bring enough potions, doh). The fact is the game is just very playable. A lot of the side quests are GREAT if you take the time to read play through them completely, instead of just finishing up every quest in an area and moving on.

 

[TheDuckbunny]

As for the plot, it's a character study. That's what it is. Don't expect a great epic going into this because you will likely be dissapointed. It's all about your character and how he/she rises through the ranks of the city over the span of a few years. It's a daring approach to this kind of RPG which is evident in the amount of backlash it gets but to me it felt really refreshing and I wish more games would do this. To the archdemon? You're a noone. No legendary hero, no heir to the throne. You're just a person living in a fantasy world. And Dragon Age 2 is that tale.

Isn't DAO a character study as well? Or all good stories for that matter?

The overall frame of the DAO story about killing the archdemon is pretty minor. Most of the story is about political intrigue, personal intrigue, small love stories, big love stories. Rise to power, fall from power. The main difference I think is that in DAO there is more of a framework for those character studies.

My main gripe with DA2 is that I can't keep track of the pieces of the story, because I get presented with too many pieces at once. A bit like a novel where the first chapter introduces me to 10 different characters.

I think it's in the difference in approach between games, mostly. In Origins I remember Alistair, Leliana and Morrigan as being part of the world, they were there when it happened. I do however not think of my own character in that sense. He was more of a projection of myself, but not really there.

In Dragon Age 2 you have a place in the world. You feel like part of it. I guess that's the difference I felt. There is a link between your character and the world, even though you decide how to play out that character.

 

[Hader]

It is a bit predictable, but not all that bad. It's still plenty fun. Being able to control your character's overall attitude through what kind of things you say throughout the game, while a simple mechanic, was quite entertaining. That is best seen on multiple, different playthroughs though.

 

[Yassen]

I find it interesting that people are saying that the story in DA2 was boring and predictable while DArigins also had a boring and predictable plot. Elves, dwarfs, plotical human problems and an army of orcs... err darkspawn and you're the only one who can stop them.

Come on guys, let's be realistic. Every Bioware game has a predictable, generic sounding plot but this is balanced out by excellent execution. But since we're talking about the story here's the general scructure.

Origins starts off with your origin story of choice, you are then pushed into joining a exclusive group of warriors against the main threat of the story. They win, you're left with nothing and have to amass an army to fight them off. To do so you pick between 4 quest hubs of any order. But you can bet your mana potion that there will be some problem preventing them from helping you which you must revolve. Normally there is a small twist towards the end of each sub-plot, but eventually you'll have your army.

You then commence the final battle followed by a text epilogue that lists the consequences of your actions. The plot scructure is almost built from a textbook.

DA2 on the other hand is a more personal story. It's a rags to riches story that expands on a struggle that was highlighted in origins. But due to the interference of Hawke this struggle escalated and by the end of the story the entire world is on the brink of war. No matter what you do this will always be the case. At first I was annoyed by this but after some thought, perhaps that was the point. To know what it feels like to have the entire world fall apart around you, no matter how hard you try to prevent it.

But anyway, in terms of quality of the plot, I'd say it's about the same as origins. The reason people are moaning is because the plot was scructured differently to origins. But this didn't bother me, like I said I found the plot to be on par with origins. Just because it's different doesn't make it bad. It just means it wasn't what the fans were expecting and so they feel betrayed because of it.

What does annoy me about the plot however is the fact there's no closure or resolution. The story ends on an enormous cliffhanger that didn't go into any details about the consequences of my individual actions and was pretty much just done to make me want the inevitable sequel that will resolve it all. THAT is annoying. THAT made me feel like Bioware was just stringing me along.

 

[mavkiel]

In response to the title of the thread, my first impulse was to say, "Short". It feels like they hacked out half the story.

You are given no background as to what your leaving behind. (Dirty hovel? Mansion?) The time skips are done poorly, a couple examples. I never noticed the city changing throughout the game. Also, it seemed to have less npcs then the dwarf town in da1. Another thing poorly done was the introduction of characters. No less then three people you have never seen before introduced themselves by, 'remember me? we worked on x job together'.

Quest wise its mostly fed-ex. Where you stumble across a random item you were not looking for, and somehow know someone is looking for it, and where they are.

 

[Frotality]

its like ME2 in alot of ways; disjointed, only tangentially related mainplot, with much better party member subplots, if unimportant ones.

except DA2s party is maybe half as interesting, and the main plot reveals in the last act that nothing at all mattered up until that point apart from some chekov's guns. it tries SO hard to be 'dark and gritty' that it goes straight into "everyone is an asshole" territory and leaves you feeling like nothing you did mattered and that every choice youve made throughout the game fucks everything up equally as bad. im starting to see why they implemented the obviously evil darkspawn into the morally gray DAO, because without them DA2 leaves you feeling that everyone is an irredeemable monster and with little reason to care about anyone involved in the plot outside of MAYBE some party members, but even most of them are complete jerkoffs or just plain too stupid to stay attached to after the cliffhanger ending.

 

[StormShaun]

their biggest mistake is *cough* NO DUAL WEILDING WARRIOR* ok now thats over, I loved the story but the ending was confusing cant wait till DA3...

 

[darth.pixie]

It's not...bad per say. It just didn't feel like much of a story line. Considering that this is Thedas, the main character deals with the problems that arise the same way you or I would buy groceries. And with the same enthusiasm. There isn't a defined plotline as much as some events that happen in the span of some years and have little connection to each other.

It's not even a full rags to riches story since even from the first year my character was rather wealthy with all the Fed Ex quests (I assume Thedas hasn't invented couriers yet, for if one person did they would be able to swim in gold) and after the first year it all went to hell. Most events actually seem a little forced, without giving the player the option to do anything about anything.

The third year was just painful for me. The character I role played was a blood mage and was not at all interested in the events of the city. She had her cash, her pint of cheap drinks and Varric and was satisfied like that. So I considered she had no reason to get involved in anything but you were just pushed from behind, with no emotional connections or even need. Varric said it best "I care about either side which is why I won't get involved".

Sadly, you can't take that approach. (Fuck you, Anders)

All in all, it was pretty disappointing even for someone like me, who started with low expectations from the get go. It was a nice game to play if bored (finished it in about 2 days or less) but not one I'd go to for depth and characters.

Edit: I think, in retrospect...that all people in Thedas are stupid. From Cailan to Loghain to Duncan to Anders to Orsino, they're all just idiots who can't think of more than one thing at a time. It's awfully frustrating to play as the only person in the world that makes a little sense.