Opinions on Whale Wars?

[rcs619]

In my completely uninformed opinion based solely on youtube clips of the series, I have to side with the whalers. I may not agree with excessive whaling, but at least they don't fucking ram their ships into other vessels to make a point.

It just boggles my mind that these assholes are able to get away with this shit and haven't been charged. But that's just my opinion. What do you think about these 'save the whales' activists and their war against the Japanese whaling industry?

Edit: found a better video to show what I mean about the Sea Shepherd intentionally ramming japanese whaling vessels.

Well, to be fair, the guy in charge *did* get kicked out of Greenpeace for being too aggressive and crazy. That should tell you something right there. I believe the only reason he started is own thing is because none of the other environmental groups want to touch him with a 10ft pole.

As to the issue itself... it's kind of a complex issue. On the one hand, the Japanese *are* completely within international law, and only kill a specific number of whales. They aren't actually doing anything illegal. On the other hand, it *does* seem like they are exploiting the 'scientific research' loophole simply to engage in whaling at this point and while they aren't in violation of any laws, they do seem to be interpreting the intention of said laws fairly loosely.

Should international whaling laws possibly have another look taken at them and maybe be altered to be a little more reasonable and less exploitable? I think there's a legitimate discussion to be had there.

You know what isn't going to bring about a legitimate discussion though? The asshats aboard the Sea Shepherd and its sister ships. Ramming boats, maintaining dangerously unsafe distances to intentionally block another ship's movement, and even sneaking onto Japanese ships to... i don't even know what the hell they're trying to do other than get caught and make a scene. Not to mention their embellishments about getting "shot" at, and getting "beaten" by the Japanese. It just makes them, and anyone who might agree with at least the basic premise of their complaints look like idiots.

All they do is go around and play pirates and pretend like they are doing something other than setting their own cause back years.

 

[Soviet Heavy]

Paul Watson is well-intentioned, but terribly misguided, and honestly, he's a bit of an attention whore. There's fostering sustainability and responsible industry, and then there's eco-terrorism, which can and does endanger human lives.

But, of course, when you've got hot Discovery Channel money pouring in, who honestly cares?

I'm seriously waiting for the day when someone in Tokyo flips a table and decides to take the fight not to Watson, not to Greenpeace or any decent, sedate environmental defence group, but to Discovery itself. They're enabling illegal and reckless behaviour for the sake of audience appeal and because it's righteous and stuff. Dur, people like righteous stuff on TV, it's good entertainment, so money!

That's really no excuse. Someone in Discovery Channel's upper management needs to be the bigger man and recognize that while whaling is bad, reckless endangerment is also something that needs to be condemned. There has to be a sedate way to get the Japanese whalers to lower their quotas without bombarding their decks with water cannons or ramming their ships.

Technically, the show was proposed by Animal Planet. Discovery bought airing rights, but they weren't the ones responsible for sending the camera crews.

animal planet is owned by Discovery Communication
They also own TLC & Military channel(along with all the Discovery channles)

I stand corrected. What he originally said, then.

 

[dogenzakaminion]

I'm Norwegian, so I have to be pro-whaling. I am tho, basically because most people who are anti-whaling have no idea what it is about. As long as there are rules (which there are) to prevent excessive whaling and to protect species extinction. Japan does have a little less stringent system, but still.

 

[Soviet Heavy]

I'm Norwegian, so I have to be pro-whaling. I am tho, basically because most people who are anti-whaling have no idea what it is about. As long as there are rules (which there are) to prevent excessive whaling and to protect species extinction. Japan does have a little less stringent system, but still.

Didn't the Norwegian Navy take a more militant stance against the Sea Shepherds? I recall seeing a video where a Norwegian patrol ship crossed the T against their ship and forced them off at cannon point.

EDIT. Found it.

 

[direkiller]

The Japanese whalers are as bad, they deliberately sank the Sea Shepard ship the Ady Gil.

Ships that big have big blind spots(when they are that close the helmsmen cannot see the entirety of that craft)
The fault of that accident is entirely on the smaller craft. Larger ships with a less of an ability to change direction or slow down always have the right away.


from the International Regulations for Preventing Collisions at Sea


18. Responsibilities between vessels
Except in narrow channels, traffic separation schemes, and when overtaking (i.e., rules 9, 10, and 13)
A power-driven vessel must give way to:
a vessel not under command;
a vessel restricted in her ability to maneuver (this may include vessels towing one another[9]);
a vessel engaged in fishing;
a sailing vessel.

 

[Soviet Heavy]

The Japanese whalers are as bad, they deliberately sank the Sea Shepard ship the Ady Gil.

Ships that big have big blind spots(when they are that close the helmsmen cannot see the entirety of that craft)
The fault of that accident is entirely on the smaller craft. Larger ships with a less of an ability to change direction or slow down always have the right away.


from the International Regulations for Preventing Collisions at Sea


18. Responsibilities between vessels
Except in narrow channels, traffic separation schemes, and when overtaking (i.e., rules 9, 10, and 13)
A power-driven vessel must give way to:
a vessel not under command;
a vessel restricted in her ability to maneuver (this may include vessels towing one another[9]);
a vessel engaged in fishing;
a sailing vessel.

Also, without going into international rules regarding seafaring ships, the batboat was doing nothing to move out of the way. They were sitting there, intentionally getting way too close to the ship.

 

[jklinders]

I'm Norwegian, so I have to be pro-whaling. I am tho, basically because most people who are anti-whaling have no idea what it is about. As long as there are rules (which there are) to prevent excessive whaling and to protect species extinction. Japan does have a little less stringent system, but still.

Didn't the Norwegian Navy take a more militant stance against the Sea Shepherds? I recall seeing a video where a Norwegian patrol ship crossed the T against their ship and forced them off at cannon point.

I am pretty sure the Norwegians have a bit more leeway on what to do with their military than Japan does. I might be wrong but I believe to this day Japan's military is on a strictly for defense only policy courtesy of losing a little war against the US and that most assuredly does not include threatening other ships thousands of miles from Japan's territory.

 

[attackshark]

i hate hippies.

from what my dad tells me, the "activists" get their asses kicked all the time.

 

[fenrizz]

Sea Shepard are terrorists, plain and simple.

They should be arrested and tried for terrorism.
Maybe even arrange for them to have a little "visit" to Guantanamo Bay.

Whaling is not a bad thing.

 

[JoesshittyOs]

I get that the Escapist apparently hates hippies, but Jesus people. There's no one else trying to stop the illegal whaling. Saying that they "take it to far" with the boat ramming is a little moronic, seeing as how the Japanese are doing the exact same thing to them. You can't get pissed at them for doing something when absolutely no one else is trying to stop them. Sometimes you got to let someone take a stand. And sometimes that someone is a hippy.

Do we actually know that the Japanese Whalers are lying? Is there any proof? Or do we just have the word of the militant anti-whalers?

How do we know that Sea Shepard and his crew aren't lying about Japan's illegal whaling operations?

Is the whole "they kill whales" thing not enough proof? They've got it on video multiple times. They sure as shit don't have a license for what they're doing.

 

[Henkie36]

I agree with the statement that they shouldn't be ramming ships into other ships, because those people also have to make a living and if those Whale Wars guys keep throwing nets into their porpellors, they won't get paid and therefore won't eat.

However, I also agree with the fact that Japan is whaling too much and that something has to be done. And since nobody else seems to be doing anything, we're just going to have to make do with Sea Sheperd.

So in short, their cause is good, but their methods are wrong.

 

[GrandmaFunk]

I'm still surprised by the level of restraint that the whalers have used in dealing with the "activists". The Sea Shepherds play very dangerous games and risk the lives of every single person on all the boats involved; collisions in the middle of the ocean can go REALLY bad, REALLY fast.

 

[J Tyran]

The Japanese whalers are as bad, they deliberately sank the Sea Shepard ship the Ady Gil.

Ships that big have big blind spots(when they are that close the helmsmen cannot see the entirety of that craft)
The fault of that accident is entirely on the smaller craft. Larger ships with a less of an ability to change direction or slow down always have the right away.


from the International Regulations for Preventing Collisions at Sea


18. Responsibilities between vessels
Except in narrow channels, traffic separation schemes, and when overtaking (i.e., rules 9, 10, and 13)
A power-driven vessel must give way to:
a vessel not under command;
a vessel restricted in her ability to maneuver (this may include vessels towing one another[9]);
a vessel engaged in fishing;
a sailing vessel.

Even if the ship had a blind spot the RADAR would sound a collision warning alarm, besides those ships have excellent visibility (as well as several crew members around the ship on watch) and outstanding maneuverability. They took a conscious choice to either hit it or get recklessly get close enough that they might hit it.

The Ady Gil was also without power and had been adrift for some time, again the captain of the Shonan Maru II either wanted to hit it or recklessly got close enough that a collision might have been the result.

Several experts have already given the verdict that while both Captains showed shoddy seamanship the collision was ultimately the fault of the Captain of the Shonan Maru II. Nothing was ever done because of the international waters thing.

 

[BloatedGuppy]

i hate hippies.

from what my dad tells me, the "activists" get their asses kicked all the time.

I think everyone should take what their parents tell them at face value.

Otherwise one day we're going to completely run out of racists.

 

[Rose and Thorn]

I have majour cetaphobia (fear of whales), so it took me awhile to click this topic. My curiosity was to much peaked, so I clicked it while keeping my mouse over the back button in case I needed a sudden retreat!

Thankfully it was just a bunch of boats ramming into each other. Now although I am not chummy with whales, I think what whalers do is sick. Go ahead and ram them I say, even if those overly large buggers haunt my dreams, they have a right to swim without fear. Perhapes whales have a fear of humans?

Maybe we aren't so different after all.

 

[twistedmic]

I get that the Escapist apparently hates hippies, but Jesus people. There's no one else trying to stop the illegal whaling. Saying that they "take it to far" with the boat ramming is a little moronic, seeing as how the Japanese are doing the exact same thing to them. You can't get pissed at them for doing something when absolutely no one else is trying to stop them. Sometimes you got to let someone take a stand. And sometimes that someone is a hippy.

If whaling is completely and totally illegal world-wide, then more people than the Whale Wars people would be stepping in to stop the Japanese whalers through legal means (Sanctions, fines and possibly even blockades and detainment) and they would (almost certainly) attempt to make contact with the Japanese ships.

Do we actually know that the Japanese Whalers are lying? Is there any proof? Or do we just have the word of the militant anti-whalers?

How do we know that Sea Shepard and his crew aren't lying about Japan's illegal whaling operations?

Is the whole "they kill whales" thing not enough proof? They've got it on video multiple times. They sure as shit don't have a license for what they're doing.[/quote]

Part of the whaling process involves killing the whales, the same way that fishing ultimately involves killing the fish that they caught and hunting involves killing animals (Duck, deer etc.). As long as whaling is legal, even if regulated, killing and harvesting whales is not an illegal activity.

 

[direkiller]

The Ady Gil was also without power and had been adrift for some time, again the captain of the Shonan Maru II either wanted to hit it or recklessly got close enough that a collision might have been the result.

Several experts have already given the verdict that while both Captains showed shoddy seamanship the collision was ultimately the fault of the Captain of the Shonan Maru II. Nothing was ever done because of the international waters thing.

1.no Radar whould not have made a collision alarm as the radar is on the top of the ship it suffers from the same blind spot.

2.The ship dose not have that great of viability. The height of that ship probably has about 200 foot blind spots around the entire front part of the ship.

3. It's job was to not make any change in direction as to not confuse the much smaller craft.

4. Spotters are nice and all but there is still a delay along with noise from heavy machinery it is rather hard to quntfy how you should move at best they can give round distance to an object like a dock.

5. The smaller craft had a wake it was under power

6. I would like to see those reports because all the offical ones are a wash or inconclusive.

7. Bethune(the pilot) posted an open letter to his Facebook page on October 6, 2010 in which he said that after colliding with the Shōnan Maru 2, Watson directed him to deliberately sink the Ady Gil for PR purposes.