Over-thinking Halo

[Uber Waddles]

I think your looking way to much into it.

Why is Halo half-baked? Because it doesnt give you a BioWare-ammount of options, it doesnt have character development, RPG Elements, hacking, blah...

Halo was meant to be just a bare-bones shooter. Not a game with RPG elements, decisions, timed missions. Its just, for the sake of arguing, mindless killing. And its functional too; you shoost the gun at your target, it hits your target, after enough they die. They arent chasing realism; your a genetic super-soldier wearing a ton (in weight) of armor, capable of firing a 50 Caliber rifle with one arm without them, ya know, falling off... Halo is NOT supposed to be realistic; and I feel a lot of your arguement is picking at it from a standpoint like its supposed to be (if you intended it, I dont know)

IF YOU MUST put a realistic spin on it...

As far as guns go, there pretty much just going to stay the way they are till we can make Plasma. Guns shoot fast and hard. In this SciFi setting, we have shielding technology. While bullets can hurt us, having that much armor on, and being that fit, would cut recoil and damage done.

On the flip side; Alien weapons are Plasma based; which would tear through our shields, but we still have armor on, meaning they dont effect our physical self as much. If you played Halo, pick up an Assault Rifle, and a Plasma Rifle. Fire it at someone, see how it reacts. The human rifle will bounce off your shield, but kill you once the shield runs down (as a bullet would go through metal). Plasma would melt away metal, but aside from a burn, you wouldnt take much damage to you life (keep in mind, super soldiers, genetic work, etc). The weapons arent meant to be Call of Duty, 1 hit KO types.

Part of Halos conflict is the lack of human tech. Ours sucks; theirs doesnt. As for the environment, The Halos were designed to be Earth Like, they were made by a sect of humans. I like your UAV theory, but looking at it again, the humans are in a desperate war. And before that, they werent used to fighting Aliens. Super Soldiers who dont need to hide behind walls and chest high walls dont need super-armored vehicles, a light-weight jeep with a 50 Cal would be MORE then fine.

Your complaint about the chief is a bit illogical. If you can withstand shots to the face, body, etc. why do you need to take cover? I understand, more tactical, blah blah blah. But if you can take the punishment, and then negate the damage with regenerating health, you dont need to be careful.

Halo was not meant to be a War-Sim, or realistic. It was supposed to be fun.

I love Halo, love Halo 2, and really like Halo 3. It worked. Not everything is meant to have a double meaning, a moving plot, realism, all that crap. Sometimes, people just want mindless fun. And Im having fun, lots of people are too from the looks of it.

 

[swolf]

Halo around the Snip, pocket full of Snipsies
The ODST:
They're useless in Halo 3: ODST. They have knives but don't use them as a melee attack, their guns are even more underpowered and they're just cliches. The worst part? They were supposed to go raid a huge covenant ship with just a silenced SMG and a Pistol when you need around 2 clips to kill one brute. It's like trying to raid a NAVY Carrier with a Magnum and a smile.

Didn't some Somalian pirates do something like that a little while ago? I don't think it worked out too well for them in but still...they did have the ship for quite a while. On that subject, who was in charge of security of that ship? I mean, even if they weren't carrying precious cargo, shouldn't they have enough security to prevent any idiot with a few friends, guns, and motorboat to just jump on and lay claim to the ship? Sounds kinda odd to me.

 

[Firetaffer]

snip snap snippity snip

The level was just plain average for me, I can't really find the words to express it but it all just seemed.... bland. Maybe it's because I played it a long time ago and was, -cough- a bit too 'casual' then. I do recall the flood not being a major surprise for one, was probably due to the fact that I usually generalize aliens with being xenomorphs and not some 'smart' ones with plasma pistols. I mean seriously if they are so smart and technologically advanced can't they at least make an agreement? Violence is never the answer. Well games are based off violence so, I guess that's the only way you can go. I've only played the first halo and a bit of the second, so don't expect me to know everything.

I have not seen a first person shooter that has a story that remotely compares to Halo's.

Now no first person shooter with a story remotely close to Halo you say? I rarely play third person shooters and RPG's, so I can name a whole bunch of good first person shooters. Thief: The Dark Project for one (And may I say that's the best game I've ever played), Half-Life has an awesome story too, except Half-Life ain't everyone cups of tea. Bioshock really wins it for me, the plot twists got me good. F.E.A.R, the series is just full of fantastic plot twists, it all flows very nicely. Portal Not as in-depth as the other games, but the story does fit in quite well and keeps you hooked onto the game. Penumbra Overture, well, more of a First Person Horror but still it's well done, takes multiple play-throughs but you can really see how all the little details combined, an example would be in the first level (in the mine shaft) where you found what is an 'animal part.' After a second play through I read all the logs, looked at all the drawings on the walls and was like *slaps self* OH SNAP it's the guys tongue! These little 'horrific' details made the game enjoyable for me. Crysis. I actually found this game to have a good story contrary to popular belief, all the drama between characters and when -minor spoilers ahead- prophet got taken away and you see him back at the end, talk about one heck of a cliffhanger! Crysis Warhead. You get to play as one of your friends? NEAT! Unreal A story about a group of native people getting their territory overrun by the Skaarj. Sounds simple on paper but like Half-Life the atmosphere just works. I would write a bit more but feel like playing some of these games all of a sudden . Soz for going slightly off topic

 

[DarthFennec]

QFT. I always felt that that was a gaping plot hole in the Halo series. I mean, humanity's back is against the wall, why are we not adapting and shifting from our 21st century weaponry to match that of the times? Why are we not attacking Covenant ships with thermonuclear weaponry? They live on floating cities for crying out loud - easy targets.

Because if it was just dropping nukes on the Covenant it wouldn't make for much of a shooter, would it?

I enjoyed Halo. And Halo 2, but after that they got annoying. Anyway. The story missions couldn't keep my attention more than two or three times through, but that's expected. The thing I like about it is (from what I hear) the thing that lots of people don't care for: the fact that I can duck behind a tree and regenerate all my shields by waiting for a few seconds, and especially the fact that I can jump, really, really high. There's all this hype where I am (I expect it's where you are too, but I may be wrong, I don't really pay attention to any of these things) about COD:MW2, everyone I know and their cat loves that game to death and back, and they can't understand why I hate it, well it's because whenever I hit the jump button in MW2 I go about six inches and that's it, and it gets infuriating. But anyway. I guess I'm just not a hardcore shooter, I like games like Katamari and Silent Hill and Legend of Zelda. Actually I'm not even sure why I posted here. I like Halo. Sorry for wasting your time ^_^

 

[iFail69]

About the fact that Halo has a good story IF you read the books... well, a game should have a good story that doesn't require reading a few novels beforehand. I play a game to have fun, and interactively go through an interesting story that requires no outside work whatsoever, so the need to read the books to make the story interesting will just turn me onto another game where I don't have to do this (like Half Life)

But who cares about my opinion on Halo, after all, I am a Half Life player

 

[Vrex360]

The game itself was uninspired, the only reason anyone is even talking about Halo today is because they gave the frigging thing away free with every console.
For many it was the first fps experience they had.

Not really, I think if I recall my first FPS experiance was actually Goldeneye for the Nintendo 64. That said, Halo was certainly a bigger deal for me than Goldeneye was because I was more interested in aliens and spaceships then I was with spys and such.

Was it bad, no, it did an ok job.

I agree, it was a good competant and enjoyable FPS.

Your "but the Books... THE BOOOOOOKS" argument is one of the lamest Ive seen.
The game came first, the books followed the manufactured success.
Hell if I had to buy and read a book to fully enjoy any game I played I'd need to convert my gaming room into a library.

It's never a:
"BUT THE BOOKS!!"
Argument as such. The fact is most fans of established game franchises also like to read books from the same franchise. They've been made for titles like Final Fantasy and Mass Effect so technically people pointing out that Halo has great stories in the books are probably just pointing at the franchise AS A WHOLE, books and games and all.
Plus in my own opinion even if the games are the weakest entry in the canon it still at least rises to the point of decent epic sci fi with big battles and raging conflicts and an overall feeling of epicness and given that it's an FPS with an emphasis on action it's above the usual status quo for the average console shooter.
Sure its not in league with something like a Bioware RPG but given the restrictions of its genre that's not too surprising.

Also as a note, the book Fall of Reach was actually written around the same time as the game's development and in some places even came out before the game itself did.

The simple truth is, Microsoft forced the mediocre Halo franchise down the throats of everybody.

The simple truth is that the game came out and people liked it. These people enjoyed the gameplay, liked the music, enjoyed playing it with friends and as a result it became popular. Yes Microsoft are using Halo as their flagship now but the same can be said for Nintendo with Mario or Sony with God of War. Every game company needs a mascot and Microsoft picked Masterchief (even though admittedly, recently it feels more like the COGs from Gears of War are claiming that throne)

The people who saw it for the shallow piece of crap it was, spat it out.

The sheep swallowed, and when MS told them it tasted delicious they opened their mouths again for another steaming spoon.

Using the 'mindless sheep' argument?
Wow, just wow.

Seriously, you do not have the right to call people out and claim that their liking of a franchise that you don't like has to be evidence of a lack of ability to think for themselves. If a person likes something it is because they like it, maybe they liked the gameplay, maybe they liked the story but it is their right to like or dislike what they wish and people were in no way told that it was good, they conciously decided it was good just as others conciously decided it wasn't good. On the same topic, I don't have any right to call you out on disliking Halo because likewise that is your right but I can still call you out on being rude and obnoxious about it.

EDIT:
Just to be clear I mean no direct offence and respect your opinion on the matter of Halo, I just don't like your attitude.

 

[Eclectic Dreck]

I think one of my favorite arguments being made here is "Halo was rubbish but Microsoft tricked EVERYONE!" To those who would consider making that argument consider for a moment just how utterly silly your statement is by considering a few key details:

Fact 1) The Xbox made it's debut in intensely hostile waters. Nintendo had lost much of it's ground in the N64 era to the PSOne, thanks mostly to the larger storage media available on the PSOne that allowed for full voice acting and gobs of CG that lead to the perception that the platform was more powerful than it actually was. The PS2 had been in the wild for quite some time and was selling like hotcakes. Most of the gaming community was sceptical (to put it politely) that Microsoft would actually be able to pull it off.

Fact 2) Halo was not bundled with initial launch Xbox consoles

Fact 3) In spite of this, Halo CE sold (including later bundles presumably) sold 5 million units. More than well recieved contemporary titles like Metroid Prine (2 Million units) and no PS2 FPS even cracked the top 10 in terms of sales.

Fact 4) Halo's popularity has only continued to rise. From the intial 5 million units, Halo 2 sold 8 million units making it the best selling game for the Xbox. It's multiplayer was still being enjoyed by people up until (and indeed after) the original Live service was shut down. Halo 3 managed to best the previous total with 8.1 million units sold to date and, at the time, the single biggest launch of an entertainment product ever.

Fact 5) There have been approximately 40 million Xbox 360's sold worldwide. Disregarding the fact that some percentage of these were likely replacements for a failed console, that means that there is one copy of halo for every 5 360's. By contrast the PS3 has moved 35.7 million units worldwide and it's best selling title, Modern Warfare 2, currently sits at less than 5 million units moved to date. Or 1 copy for every 6 consoles. The original Xbox only managed to move 24 million units across it's lifecycle, meaning that there was one copy of Halo for every 5 xbox consoles and one copy of halo 2 for every 3 consoles.

From these points of data I can readily guage that the game was intensely popular achieving staggering market penetration across the console. Not only did Halo and it's successor sell more copies than any competing FPS game (on a console) during the last generation, they did so with only 24 million consoles (versus PS2's 143.8 million units and the Game Cube's 21.7 million units).

The argument I'm hearing is that this astounding success was not because a significant portion of the audience enjoyed the games but rather that they were all brainwashed by clever advertising. That's right - 1 in 3 people who owned an Xbox were tricked into buying Halo 2 and because they were such momumental morons each and every one of them went out and purchased the sequel (By which I mean, by the numbers - obviously some of those are new sales and some Halo 2 owners never made the jump). This is presented as being more reasonable than the game selling because of it's merits as a AAA FPS. I think this sort of logic is below even face-palm status to be honest.

 

[Daipire]

And you realise 'marines' has very little to do with ships.

Hence why marines are in Iraq.

Which is a desert.

 

[Nova5]

To preface this, I enjoy HALO, have pre-ordered Reach, but by no means think the game is perfect and is by any standards a bland, if at least functional FPS, that gives an experience more like shooters of old than modern titles. Okay? Moving on.

Master Chief:
The fact that he's the pinnacle of armed combat yet relies on underpowered guns, can't fly, doesn't have night vision, can't sprint or take cover really makes think that the bar for "the pinnacle" will be lowered significantly in the future. That and the fact that he doesn't even have a combat knife makes me think he's an under-trained soldier who taped some tin foil to his kevlar.

*Bold added by Nova5 to highlight.

Sorry, but this bit in-particular stuck out at me as something that needed to be hammered down. The guy's operating a suit of armor that would destroy most people. He can shoot a Grunt in the head from across a fucking canyon with a pistol (not using its scope), and is able to operate 90% of their weapons/vehicles. Somehow, that doesn't strike me as under-trained.

While I'm nit-picking...

He's a guy in one suit of armor. So let me tick off the list of reasons there isn't more extraneous crap stuck to him:
1.) 'Underpowered guns': Okay, so he should carry the Spartan Laser at all times? And what, just lug a gigantic power-cell with him? He's a small arms combat specialist, not a demo man.
2.) Flying: Yeah, it's really convenient to have a gigantic jetpack strapped to your arse while running through an alien spaceship. This smacks of going camping and literally bringing the kitchen sink! Heavy, cumbersome, useless unless you have a readily available water supply... You get the idea.
3.) Night vision: There's only so much crap you can cram into a helmet, even in the 'future'. There's a saying in the military: "Remember, your weapon was made by the lowest bidder." I don't see that changing, ever. Why spend all that dough on a NV system if you can slap a flashlight on it?
4.) Can't sprint: He's wearing armor that weighs about as much as a light SUV. God forbid he can't win the LA marathon in it.
5.) No knife: He's facing an enemy that is either A.) wearing fairly serious metallic armor with powered overshields or B.) an enemy made of rotting flesh that doesn't really seem to mind a full magazine of shredder rounds pounding through it. What the hell good is a knife going to do him?

I could pick apart the rest, but this seemed the most fun.

 

[gmaverick019_v1legacy]

well to point out, the flood are actually the main conflict that both sides are fighting, so they are really the big thing in the picture

and the games themselves, not too deep, but if you actually read the books, specifically the fall of reach and ghosts of onyx, then you will see how deep the books go and what it means to fight the covenant or be a spartan, where master chief isn't a cut out character really, and i haven't seen all of halo legends but from what i saw it was pretty interesting, so have a go at that, and believe me master chief is in no way "rambo" in the books, they use strategic small team based units to do missions.


i know you were over analyzing it..but try checking out all the material it has to offer, the games are just a taste of what halo really is (in my opinion)

The game itself was uninspired, the only reason anyone is even talking about Halo today is because they gave the frigging thing away free with every console.
For many it was the first fps experience they had.

Was it bad, no, it did an ok job.

Your "but the Books... THE BOOOOOOKS" argument is one of the lamest Ive seen.
The game came first, the books followed the manufactured success.
Hell if I had to buy and read a book to fully enjoy any game I played I'd need to convert my gaming room into a library.

The simple truth is, Microsoft forced the mediocre Halo franchise down the throats of everybody.

The people who saw it for the shallow piece of crap it was, spat it out.

The sheep swallowed, and when MS told them it tasted delicious they opened their mouths again for another steaming spoon.

in no way am i trying to defend or argue for the games, all i was getting at was that the books are worth a read, compared to the averageness of the halo games

halo did some damn good things right, but overall i would not rate it as high of scores as it got. and i didn't know they released it free with the console? i dont know what deal you found but me an all my friends bought it seperately

 

[DrEmo]

Humans:
Marines? In space? Is it because they're in ships? Makes sense, I suppose. What makes no sense are the weapons. Why are the humans armed with assault rifles and pistols? They're fighting aliens! They should have weapons specifically tailored for the situation. They should have guns made to pierce a Brute's armor, guns made to shoot down a fast moving Elite and guns to deal with large numbers of head crabs. Not weapons made for killing soft, squishy humans.

Last time I checked in Halo when you shoot at an Alien, it does die. Why would they be making Brute Armor piercing weapons when a Sniper does it anyways? Why do Aliens need special types of weapons to fight them? Lead works on all the species to exist. When you shoot an Whale, it dies. When you shoot a human, he dies. When you shoot an alien, why wouldn't it die?

Lead kills elephants, yet hunters use elephant rifles/bullets to kill them. Same thing but with a specialized use.

What I'm saying is that after years of fighting aliens, you'd think humans would have built a gun that could kill an alien faster than punching them.

QFT. I always felt that that was a gaping plot hole in the Halo series. I mean, humanity's back is against the wall, why are we not adapting and shifting from our 21st century weaponry to match that of the times? Why are we not attacking Covenant ships with thermonuclear weaponry? They live on floating cities for crying out loud - easy targets.

THAT's what I mean with the whole technology debate.
Remember the Hammer of Dawn?