Piracy... Not Inherently Evil, Mayhaps

[SnowdensOfYesteryear]

There seems to be a lot of varying opinion on The Escapist about piracy, and one of the most common arguments I see is "Wrong, always." As someone who disagrees with this argument, and has no particular feelings that anything or anyone is automatically one thing or another, I think I'll just state my case as such:

If a pirate pirates a game just for the sake of pirating, they're wrong. Developers have the right to make money.

If a devvy dev's a game that's broken for the sake of preventing piracy (Ubisoft...), they're wrong. Gamers have the right to a good game.

So... I just would like to hear the cases that are always-pro or always-anti piracy, just so I can see the logic behind them.

 

[delet]

The companies 'break' their game in an attempt to stop piracy. If piracy didn't exist, the games wouldn't be inherently broken by this software that's supposed to stop piracy. See where I'm going?

Piracy is always wrong, but that won't stop people from doing it. People tend to like getting things for free rather than not.

 

[Gigaguy64]

Company makes a game.

You pirate it and play it without paying for it.

That's wrong In my opinion.

So piracy will always be wrong to me.

 

[xHipaboo420x]

Everyone on the internet has already made their mind up. There's no use convincing a pirate or a non-pirate otherwise. Most of the people on The Escapist are afraid of t3h b4n upstanding citizens, and will not admit to pirate games.

I'd probably pirate games if it wasn't for Steam - it's the only place that I actually feel like a valued customer, as opposed to an 'guilty-until-proven-innocent' walking wallet.

 

[mindlesspuppet]

Meh... back in the day you used to be able to download a demo for almost any game. These days few games have demos, at best maybe you can get a free weekend on Steam.

Point being, I think a lot of people pirate games just to test them, only to find the game has a severe lack of content or something to that effect.

Not to mention, I'd argue that companies tend to charge too much. I think most of us can testify to buying games we had little to no interest in simply because they were 10 or 20 bucks.

 

[Doctor VonSexMachine]

If a devvy dev's a game that's broken for the sake of preventing piracy (Ubisoft...), they're wrong. Gamers have the right to a good game.

I might have you misunderstood, but do you mean it's ok to outright pirate a game that had broken, or that it is ok to get a cracked version once you paid for the game if it's necessary to run it?

Otherwise, it seems like a pretty flimsy excuse because many bugs could be interpreted as a broken game.

 

[Irridium]

The only area's of piracy that can shift either way is if the game isn't available anymore, or if your original copy broke for whatever reason and you need a replacement.

Every other reason doesn't have much moral high ground.
Can't afford it? - Go without. You don't need it to live.
Want to demo it? - Something tells me when people like the "demo", they have a hard time making it to the store. I know this doesn't mean everyone, but a lot of people do this.
"Sticking it to the man" - Thats just giving publishers more reasons to use DRM
Bypassing the DRM? - Buy the game. Then do whatever. That way publishers get your money, and you get your game.

Gamers should get good games, but they should also have to pay for them.

 

[CuddlyCombine]

You're never going to find a reasonable man who deals in absolutes. Just kidding, I'll spare you the oxymorons. Seriously, though; there's rarely an opportunity where you've got a sole opportunity that is completely right or wrong. Piracy has just as much grey area as any other subject.

I'm mostly aligned to your viewpoint; publishers who restrict the gaming experience (I'm looking at you, Ubisoft) shouldn't be allowed to reign free. For example, the recent anti-DRM cracks that have broken Ubisoft's DRM are an example of piracy for a good cause.

I'm hesitant to fully encourage that behaviour, however. After all, developers usually have nothing to do with DRM; they're mostly people like us who set out to design a fun game. Pirating it just takes money out of their pockets. That's the flip side, I guess.

I'm going to cut myself short, though, because this subject has been debated far, far too much.

 

[Miumaru]

Its not always wrong, just usually. But sometimes you have to break the law for good causes. Most people pirating though I doubt are doing it for any noble rebellion reasons and just wanna make money, or save money.

 

[SnowdensOfYesteryear]

If a devvy dev's a game that's broken for the sake of preventing piracy (Ubisoft...), they're wrong. Gamers have the right to a good game.

I might have you misunderstood, but do you mean it's ok to outright pirate a game that had broken, or that it is ok to get a cracked version once you paid for the game if it's necessary to run it?

Otherwise, it seems like a pretty flimsy excuse because many bugs could be interpreted as a broken game.

I meant more of the cracking it area, but devs seem to think EVERY cracked download is a pirated version, so...

And I'll admit it, I have pirated games. Some for no reason other than I didn't want to buy them, or couldn't at the time. I can't say I won't do it again. So, come on, upstanding citizens, I know you're not all perfectly-clean-slated.

 

[Destal]

So, your argument is that you don't like the DRM on a game so you get it for free? I'm sorry I'm completely missing the logic to that. If one aspect of the game will prevent you from buying it, then don't play it. How does the DRM on it devalue the time and effort it took to make the rest of the game?

 

[Corven]

So... I can steal anything as long as I'm angry about it?

 

[SnowdensOfYesteryear]

So, your argument is that you don't like the DRM on a game so you get it for free? I'm sorry I'm completely missing the logic to that. If one aspect of the game will prevent you from buying it, then don't play it. How does the DRM on it devalue the time and effort it took to make the rest of the game?

Yeah, I could've phrased that better. I meant in terms of cracking.

 

[go nana go]

How many seconds
until this turns to flaming
on an epic scale?

 

[ReincarnatedFTP]

Eh. I think the essential thing that makes piracy more debatable and easier to argue about than theft is the material reality and how people see things.

Situation 1:Robber breaks into house, and steals a vase. The owner loses access to the vase, but the robber has it.

Situation 2: Artist X releases information Y. Person Z downloads information Y. Anyone else can still access information Y and see that it had its origins in Artist X. Artist X still has the information as well. However, Artist X has potentially lost revenue because the information was pirated without charge instead of exchanged for currency. OTOH, Artist X may gain a greater following because of the widespread ability to advertise through others, and have more actual buyers/audience members at his next gig. Maybe Person Z was just testing the quality. Or maybe he'll never ever pay.


Alot of people argue based on their personal situation or what they think is right and wrong by the standards of theft. I think the key to understanding where you should stand on the issue is more closely related to how free you think the transfer of information should be, and what your views on intellectual property/copyrights/patents etc. are as opposed to how you view conventional theft or whether you see "poor artists/developers losing money from pirating" or "bastard record companies taking advantage of the artists/bastard artists getting more than they're worth/bastard developers and their DRM".

 

[Fire Daemon]

Gamers have the right to a good game.

No you don't. Why would you have that right, why would anybody have a right for their purchases to be 'good', good being an undefined value that differs for each individual? You can't seriously think that for a product to not deserve to be stolen, it has to fit some personal criteria of yours. Game developers are not infringing on your rights by making a bad game, they are free to create whatever game they want and you are free to buy whatever games you want. You have no rights in terms of the quality of entertainment that you are free to view at your leisure.

If you seriously use the 'I deserve good games so if it isn't good I just steal it' argument I question how you sleep at night. Whatever it takes to justify piracy I guess everyone. has there own reason why they pirate and oddly enough it's never because they just don't want to pay for this stuff, it's always some odd reason that kind of makes them look like a hero.

 

[SnowdensOfYesteryear]

Can't afford it? - Go without. You don't need it to live.

Out of curiosity, Irridium, how often have you had a good amount of money to spend on luxury?

 

[TheComedown]

So, your argument is that you don't like the DRM on a game so you get it for free? I'm sorry I'm completely missing the logic to that. If one aspect of the game will prevent you from buying it, then don't play it. How does the DRM on it devalue the time and effort it took to make the rest of the game?

Yeah, I could've phrased that better. I meant in terms of cracking.

... what do you mean by cracking? cause cracking is just a way around said drm, or do you mean downloading just the crack?

 

[SnowdensOfYesteryear]

Gamers have the right to a good game.

No you don't. Why would you have that right, why would anybody have a right for their purchases to be 'good', good being an undefined value that differs for each individual? You can't seriously think that for a product to not deserve to be stolen, it has to fit some personal criteria of yours. Game developers are not infringing on your rights by making a bad game, they are free to create whatever game they want and you are free to buy whatever games you want. You have no rights in terms of the quality of entertainment that you are free to view at your leisure.

If you seriously use the 'I deserve good games so if it isn't good I just steal it' argument I question how you sleep at night. Whatever it takes to justify piracy I guess everyone. has there own reason why they pirate and oddly enough it's never because they just don't want to pay for this stuff, it's always some odd reason that kind of makes them look like a hero.

I think you're misunderstanding what I'm saying.

By good I meant "non-broken."

By "non-broken" I mean "not intentionally programmed to self-destruct if there's a scratch on the disk" or "a cat sneezes in Taiwan" or something.

 

[mindlesspuppet]

Can't afford it? - Go without. You don't need it to live.

If you can't afford it, and you're not going to buy it... yes, you could go without it... or you could just pirate it. Doesn't make a difference, because if you can't afford it, it's not a lost sale, thus hurts no one.