Pixar's Brave - Good movie or bad?

thejboy88

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Aug 29, 2010
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Brave, one of Pixar's most recent films, is one that I really enjoy. While there may be many aspects to it that have been done many times, like having princesses etc, it was, overall an enjoyable film for me, even though I don't think it compares to Pixar's earlier masterpieces, like Wall-E or Finding Nemo.

However, as I looked at comments and reviews online about the film, I found that, more often than not, people tend to dislike this film. They call it cliche, or uninteresting, with some even going so far as to call it Pixar's worst film.

So, I ask all of you, where do you stand? Do you like this film or dislike it? And what are your reasons?
 

Colour Scientist

Troll the Respawn, Jeremy!
Jul 15, 2009
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I enjoyed it, it's not Pixar's best film but it's still a good movie.
It was also really refreshing to see an independent female protagonist, where not everything she does is motivated by the pursuit of a love interest.
 

Casual Shinji

Should've gone before we left.
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Jul 18, 2009
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Terrible movie.

The moment that musical scene came along with Merida riding her horse, shooting arrows, and climbing a waterfall in defiance, I was seriously wondering if I was watching a parody.

Also, Merida is a giant *****, poisoning her own damn mother. Now I know this was sorta the point with her making a mistake and dealing with the consequences, but after that I couldn't bring myself to care about her plight one iota. And this whole "my mother's a bear" is supposed to be a serious issue with like her maybe never turning back to normal and going full bear, losing her memories of being human, but then those three little brothers turn into bears and it's played for yucks. Way to deflate your own drama there, movie.

And the climactic end battle was unintentionally hilarious with mother bear comically bumping the evil bear against the loosening rock. It felt like watching a Charlie Chaplin routine.

And the visuals of the movie, apart from being bland, were very at odds with oneanother. Everything was rendered too realistically for the cartoony aesthetic. Mainly the hair. A lot of the characters looked almost like troll dolls.

Overall it was just a dreadfully, painfully mediocre mess of a movie.
 

omega 616

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May 1, 2009
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I'm not one of these people to delve into the nitty gritty of why a film is good or bad, the way I judge a movie isn't a critical one, it is one based on feeling and/or enjoyment.

And I enjoyed brave, nice kiddies animated movie (although the big bad wolf was more nightmarish than expected), had a nice "girls don't always need saving" theme, had its funny moments with the 3 little brothers, had serious moments and mysterious ones.

I'd watch it again. I think you have to remember, pixar are kiddies films, I don't think you should be applying the same level of criticism at a pixar film than you would at "the kings speech"... You should just go with the flow and enjoy it
 

FalloutJack

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Nov 20, 2008
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Highly enjoyable. Funny. Also strange. Sort of an animated folktale. Works for me.
 

Ed130 The Vanguard

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Sep 10, 2008
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I have yet to see it but Moviebob's column on it was rather interesting.

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/articles/view/columns/moviebob/9760-Near-Miss

The problem with being Pixar, in a nutshell, is that people will always expect you to be Pixar - meaning, that you are expected to hit every movie project out of the park every time. With the exception of the Cars movies, which everyone seems to have decided (despite protestations of the filmmakers to the contrary) are more of a merchandising focused fundraising thing. Pixar isn't simply expected to always make good movies, they're expected to make great ones, movies that loom large over and even define their very genres. So, when they make one that's merely pretty good, one that would be higher-end fare from anyone else, it becomes a big deal.

That's the first thing that makes Brave a little bit difficult to talk about. It's not a bad movie, or even a disappointment by any reasonable standard, but it feels like it ought to be given its pedigree.
Apparently the Creator/Director left during production as well.
 

hazabaza1

Want Skyrim. Want. Do want.
Nov 26, 2008
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I enjoyed it.
Wasn't nearly as good as some of their other movies and I doubt I'd watch it again but I liked it.
 

BunnyKillBot

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Oct 23, 2010
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Bad because nothing happens. The story is flat and doesn't go anywhere, the writting poor and character development awful. Its just dull and lacks complexity.
 

shootthebandit

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May 20, 2009
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I didnt enjoy it. The voice acting was superb, being scottish myself more often than not these films have terrible fake "mel gibson" accents. Billy connolly is a stand out performance as a voice actor

The visuals are amazing but i think they spent more time trying to show you around this beautiful world they created rather than telling a story
 

Casual Shinji

Should've gone before we left.
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Jul 18, 2009
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Ed130 said:
Apparently the Creator/Director left during production as well.
I think the same thing happened to Ratatouille, but thankfully they brought in Brad Bird to kick some ass.
 

Vanorae

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Oct 5, 2011
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Very enjoyable. Not quite the groundbreaker that Up or other Pixar movies are known for being, but it's still a great movie. I loved Merida's personality.
 

King Billi

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Jul 11, 2012
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I didn't think much of it the first time I saw it but it certainly isn't terrible. After seeing it a second time with my little nephew and niece I now consider it actually a fine little family movie.

It is quite clear there was a lack of focus with the story but it holds together well enough, it dosen't compare very well with most of Pixars other films but it's not hurting anyone.
 

EeveeElectro

Cats.
Aug 3, 2008
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It was a good movie, not great or one of the greatest but enjoyable.
Merida was probably one of my favourite female leads for the most part, I kept expecting to see a love interest pop up and her turn to mush like most females do in movies so to keep her as she started was a nice touch.
 

Miss G.

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Jun 18, 2013
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I enjoyed it, however I would've enjoyed it even more had they been able to keep a lot of the stuff, as was shown in the iTunes extras, that didn't make it into the film. I understand that the movie might've been too long or something, but seriously, those extras were interesting and entertaining, like Mor'du's backstory as told by the witch.
 

Vancleef

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Jul 6, 2010
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It could have been better, but it's still by all means, a good movie.

Great visuals and animations too.
 

Sandjube

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Feb 11, 2011
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It was.....alright. It felt like it lacking to me, though, like it was rushed or something, I dunno. Still liked it.
 

Heronblade

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Apr 12, 2011
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It has its flaws, but I enjoyed it. Which is more than I can say for a lot of Pixar's work.
 

Tono Makt

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thejboy88 said:
Brave, one of Pixar's most recent films, is one that I really enjoy. While there may be many aspects to it that have been done many times, like having princesses etc, it was, overall an enjoyable film for me, even though I don't think it compares to Pixar's earlier masterpieces, like Wall-E or Finding Nemo.

However, as I looked at comments and reviews online about the film, I found that, more often than not, people tend to dislike this film. They call it cliche, or uninteresting, with some even going so far as to call it Pixar's worst film.

So, I ask all of you, where do you stand? Do you like this film or dislike it? And what are your reasons?
It's a good film. But it doesn't focus on male characters, which means that for a large segment of the vocal online and reviewing population, it's got one strike going against it already. No, I don't mean "sexism", I mean understanding and empathy - it's harder to empathize and understand the plight of someone different than you. The closer the characters are to the viewers, the easier it is to understand the motivations and the less the movie (or any other work of art, really) needs to explain them. The biggest mistake Brave made was underestimating how much time and effort it needed to spend in order to connect the characters to the entire audience.

Brave looks worse than it is because Pixar keenly understands this problem, and in movies like Wall-E and Up, it did a phenomenal job connecting the audience to the characters. Really, who can understand what it is to be a ROBOT, left alone for centuries doing nothing but cleaning up garbage? So Wall-E needed to spend the 30-45 min getting us to understand Wall-E, so that when things picked up and the story really began, we had a powerful connection to Wall-E. How many reviewers are seniors, widowers and childless? Up only needed to spend 8 minutes (perhaps one of the greatest segments in movie history; easily in the discussion for the greatest segments in movie history at the very least) to get the audience to understand, empathize and root for Carl, the man older than many of the audiences grandfathers.

But Brave didn't do this as well, and so there's a disconnect. The disconnect heightens all of the other errors that arose in the movie, some of the inconsistencies and changes in tone, making the movie seem worse than it was. It's not hard for us to understand what it is to be so confined to a narrow role (wife/mother) and to have an entire society against your attempts to break free - this is often couched in terms of "Parental Vision" (As an example look at How To Train Your Dragon, and how Hiccup is supposed to become a warrior like his father, a slayer of dragons. We all know Hiccup is too weak, scrawny and smart for it, but his story is about rejecting that role and making something for himself that is new.) or "Overcoming Poverty/Class/Gender/etc." (Disney's Mulan is an example of overcoming Gender to be seen as something different) Brave looked like it was going to follow the "Overcoming Gender", but ends with the Princess accepting her fate and not really becoming anything different. She's still going to be a princess, she's still going to marry one of the three princes, it's just delayed until the future.

Because of the disconnect between the vocal audience and the character, this unconventional ending becomes more jarring than it should be. And as with most things, the way it ends flavours the way we remember it. If the ending is good and satisfying, things in the movie that we were concerned about before are glossed over and remembered more fondly than perhaps they deserve to be. If the ending is not satisfying for us, the mistakes that went on before are magnified out of proportion.

A good article I remember reading (and bookmarking!) is found here: http://thenewinquiry.com/essays/just-another-princess-movie/ . It's extremely long but well worth the read.
 

Diddy_Mao

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Jan 14, 2009
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Given the Binary option of good or bad I'll probably stick with "good." On a more arbitrary scale, relating it to other Pixar films.

It's better than Cars and Monsters University and not quite as good as Ratatouille or Bugs Life.

Wall of text incoming, I'll hide it behind a spoiler wall for the TLDR crowd.

One thing Pixar has always been good at is using their fantastic settings as metaphor, and the main plot of Brave is a really good example of that. I grew up with an older sister and a mother who were rather frequently at odds with one another. And I can't count the times I saw one or both of them say or do extraordinarily hurtful things in the heat of an argument. Those kinds of situations are tough to come back from and I know for fact that both parties struggled with how to make things right afterwards.

The main storyline between Merida and the Queen was a really good take on that concept, taking that all too real and common concept and adding a fantastical element to it to drive the plot forward.

The parts of the movie that focused on that plot I really enjoyed. The problem is that there's too much else going on to fully flesh out that story.


Pixar movies seem to work best when they're only trying to keep 2 plates spinning at one time.
For example:

Wall-E: A story about a robot in love with another robot and a connected subplot about the fate of Earth's remaining humans.

or

The Incredibles: Mr. Incredible is going through his super mid-life crises resulting in jeopardizing his families safety to relive his glory days.

Brave suffers a bit from the same problems that Ratatouille has in that the plot gets a little too muddled for it's own good and has to play catch-up to make everything wrap up nicely.

"Merida doesn't want to have her life path chosen for her and inadvertently curses her family in an attempt to gain her freedom." That should have been the beginning and end of it. Instead we also get a weird, loosely connected sub plot involving an evil bear and the fate of the old kingdom, and another loosely connected framing device about uniting the clans. Thematically these all flow in the same direction toward "the importance of family unity" but they're sort of their own individual stories and aren't that heavily reliant on each other. In the end, rather than having one strong plot with maybe a connected subplot that I can care about I'm just left with 3 mediocre plots that aren't given the screen time to really mature enough for me to fully invest in any of them.