PlayStation 4 Selling at $60 Loss for Sony

Roxas1359

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Fiz_The_Toaster said:
Neronium said:
Considering the huge losses that Sony took with the PS3 at launch, this is really an improvement. Too bad I'm not getting it at launch, but I'll get a PS4 eventually.
I was surprised that it's actually that low of a loss, so I agree about it being an improvement. Now one can hope that it will be easier to develop for this time. I can't get it at launch either for stupid financial reasons, but I really want to get it at some point since from what I can tell they really did listen to people.
For me it's not having enough money as well, and I blame my newly bought Wii U for that. :p
Although it works out for me since the PS4 doesn't support HDMI capture at launch and I'll probably get one when that becomes supported so I can use my HD PVR 2. Well that or when Kingdom Hearts 3 comes out since that's a system seller for me. :D
 

Fiz_The_Toaster

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Neronium said:
Fiz_The_Toaster said:
Neronium said:
Considering the huge losses that Sony took with the PS3 at launch, this is really an improvement. Too bad I'm not getting it at launch, but I'll get a PS4 eventually.
I was surprised that it's actually that low of a loss, so I agree about it being an improvement. Now one can hope that it will be easier to develop for this time. I can't get it at launch either for stupid financial reasons, but I really want to get it at some point since from what I can tell they really did listen to people.
For me it's not having enough money as well, and I blame my newly bought Wii U for that. :p
Although it works out for me since the PS4 doesn't support HDMI capture at launch and I'll probably get one when that becomes supported so I can use my HD PVR 2. Well that or when Kingdom Hearts 3 comes out since that's a system seller for me. :D
Ah. fair enough.

Although, I have a feeling you will be waiting awhile before than will happen, but who knows, maybe six months to a year I would guess.
 

Arizona Kyle

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achicoria3 said:
no wander shareholders want playstation dead. This is insane.
How the hell are they going to break even with selling only 1 game per console, they dont get the whole 60 bucks out of the sale
Because you buy PS+ and most people will be getting extra controllers and such from Sony. Also I and i would suspect that others are buying a good bit of games during launch not just one. The point is the get the consoles in the hands of people and put a tap on their back to get the money that you want. Microsoft did it with the Xbox 360 and now Sony is doing it with the PS4
 

Arizona Kyle

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Ed130 said:
MinionJoe said:
Now hold on just a ding-dong minute...

In May, CFO Masaru Kato stated in an earnings call that the PS4 would NOT be sold at a loss.

http://www.ibtimes.co.in/articles/466755/20130511/sony-ps4-release-date-gaming-console-sold.htm

Did manufacturing and supply expenses suddenly increase over the past 4 months?

Or were they lying to potential investors during their earnings call?
There was that fire at a factory that produced GDDR5 RAM which drove up prices, as wll as other factors (weak yen, etc).

A $60 loss on a console isn't bad considering that it is already undercutting its compeditor as well as releasing eariler and into more markets.
A "fire" in the factory

Capatcha: that's positivenergy
 

RicoADF

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MinionJoe said:
Now hold on just a ding-dong minute...

In May, CFO Masaru Kato stated in an earnings call that the PS4 would NOT be sold at a loss.

http://www.ibtimes.co.in/articles/466755/20130511/sony-ps4-release-date-gaming-console-sold.htm

Did manufacturing and supply expenses suddenly increase over the past 4 months?

Or were they lying to potential investors during their earnings call?
Everyone that buys a console will get a game or 2 minimum. At $60 loss even 2 new games break even (people wont spend $500 on a console and get 1 game) and 3 or 4 turns a profit. So technically their not lying. That's not including PS+ which would make the required number of game sales be less.

EDIT: Turns out it is also due to manufacturing issues after a fire in the GDDR5 factory, well that explains it far better. Still at $60 that's next to nothing and as stated above will be recovered on day 1 or shortly after.
 

Lord_Jaroh

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Heh, without backwards compatibility, they are selling me their PS4 at a $340 loss, plus a loss of any future potential sales of games. I will say, that's a lot of money they won't be seeing from me. I know that's not a lot in "the grand scheme of things" but hey, I'm not about to support their terrible business practices, and I will stay happy playing the multitude of PS3 and PS2 games that I have on the back-burner until the inevitable PS5 comes out that is incompatible with any of the PS4 library...
 

Arawn

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I'm shocked. No more shocked to hear that Xbox One would break even (or minimal loss) Although before didn't they say that the Kinect 2.0 was a $200 value or something? Not sure what to believe on the matter. That aside I think PS4 might do well enough with it's week head start on Xbox One.

http://www.ign.com/wikis/playstation-4/PlayStation_4_Launch_Titles

Looking at that list you and see several games that will undoubtedly sell well. Then others that will garner enough interest as well. Honestly the games coming next year (the launch window) are just as interesting. So if only $60 per person is what's separating them from profits, I don't think they have much to worry about. The fact you're paying $100 less to purchase it, you're more than likely going to reinvest that saved money. Although there are some nifty F2P games on PS4 as well.
 

ImmortalDrifter

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I called it. Completely outside the console war brand of faggotry that stinks up any page involving the next gen consoles, I saw Sony's price at E3 and said "they're selling at a loss aren't they? Yes, I'm sure they are." Will it matter in the long run? Can't say for sure. It's obvious they have a head start on their competitor, but at the same time if launch content flops, or issues arise with the hardware, selling at an initial loss could be trouble. Especially after the whole payment debacle. This will be fun to watch :D
 

Snotnarok

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This isn't new, this is how the PS3 was being sold for a while, even the 360 was losing money, the only system at launch for a long while that was actually making money was the Wii because they cut every corner they could, no CD/DVD/BR playback, 512mb of system memory, no ethernet jack, no battery pack.
These guys are cramming everything they can into the systems, bigger HDDs, BR players, media center functionality, more powerful hardware and fancy new controllers.
 

Clive Howlitzer

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From what I understand it is pretty normal to take a loss on consoles at launch. Isn't that how it usually goes? You rely on the sale of games to make up the difference.
 

Therumancer

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I don't believe them, they are probably defining loss in a creative way. Sony in particular is a giant spiderweb of a company, the scary thing about it is that very few people know how big it is, only that it's much larger than it allows itself to be presented as in rankings and such. Sony is pretty much the basis for those evil Japanacorps from cyberpunk fiction that were going to take over the world due to secretly being more powerful than most nations. Sony in particular is involve in everything from consumer electronics (they started out producing rice cookers), to movies and music, to heavy machinery, robotics, and manufacturing. In all honesty they probably have interests involved in every aspect of manufacture starting with the mining for base materials, to the processing, to the manufacture of parts, and then assembly. One of the big things about Sony was how despite appearances they were arguably able to not only create high end products, but also do every aspect of it in house to help protect their technologies.

At any rate back with the PS-3 Sony was involved in a battle for the next generation video disc, pitting Blu Ray against HDDVD. PS-3 shortages were largely caused by the lack of the lasers they used to read Blu Ray discs due to Sony repurposing so many of them towards dedicated Blu Ray players in an attempt to get the players on the market and out saturate HDDVD. The ironic thing being that Sony was selling dedicated disc players for more than the PS-3 system (something which ironically continues until today). Sony allegedly wasn't taking an actual loss on the PS-3 itself,
but basically the loss was that at that time they felt they could make hundreds of more dollars a pop by putting the lasers into another product. The reality of the time being that video games were seen as a toy, where adult consumers with money were more likely to want to buy a dedicated video machine. Despite the technology for multi-purpose devices being there it had yet to catch on (going back as far as the PS-2). The fact that you could get a PS-3 for a fraction of the price of a dedicated Blu Ray player AND play games on it too was something a few people laughed about at the time (and still do to be honest).

All told I'd imagine Sony is making the current claim to sound good, and honestly if there is some truth to it, it probably has to do with internal optimization of their products and parts more than an actual loss.

Remember, people bootleg hardware for a fraction of the price. I'm kind of interested in seeing if these digital innovations and security features in this generation will prevent a Chinese knockoff within 3 months (including the Sony logos) for one third the price. Remember we live in a world where not only do you have people making functional, counterfeit I-products, but you actually have people selling them from fake stores that match legitimate Apple retailers perfectly, who actually claim to work for Apple (I've read articles about this).
 

Demandred20

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Of course unit cost isnt telling much of the actual profit they are going to do with the machine. All those buildings must have their lights turned on and the horde of officeworkers needs to be payed a salary somehow. Also taxes.
 

Ed130 The Vanguard

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Sep 10, 2008
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Lord_Jaroh said:
Heh, without backwards compatibility, they are selling me their PS4 at a $340 loss, plus a loss of any future potential sales of games. I will say, that's a lot of money they won't be seeing from me. I know that's not a lot in "the grand scheme of things" but hey, I'm not about to support their terrible business practices, and I will stay happy playing the multitude of PS3 and PS2 games that I have on the back-burner until the inevitable PS5 comes out that is incompatible with any of the PS4 library...
Hopefully with X86 and standardized parts the PS4 library should hopefully be compatible with any hypothetical PS5... Unless computing technology undergoes a massive shift in the future.

But don't expect PS3 games to be backwards compatible any-time in the future short of streaming, which quite frankly is pathetic.