[Politics] Trump and Concentration Camps

[Saelune]

Actually the lesson is that it doesn't matter why Lincoln ended slavery, nor does it matter why the world stopped Hitler...

Yeah, it absolutely does, in every conceivable way. Because radical Republican condescension, rampancy, and corruption were how we ended up with the Gilded Age and a century of Jim Crow. Because the embrace of domestic Nazi sympathizers, profiteers, and apologists in the highest echelons of the federal government during the Truman administration is how we ended up with the Cold War and seventy years of foreign policy -- in this case Latin America, but it applies just as easily to the Middle East, south Asia, and practically all of Africa -- that led us to this precise moment in time and this precise issue.

And then we had the Civil Rights Movement where extremists like Martin Luther King and Malcom X decided to do shit about it. It meant standing up to the police who abused their power for racism, it meant standing up to the government who abused their power for racism. It meant pissing off 'moderates' and 'centrists' who were fine with the status quo.

My point is, the only way to fix anything is to piss off centrists and piss off the status quo and to not pretend the government or the police will fix themselves on their own, it means fighting for what is right even when bigots tell you it is wrong.

 

[Thaluikhain]

It is absolutely true that the Democrats aren't going to fix the US. OTOH, they are going to keep things more or less stable, while alleviating some issues. The only other option is the Republicans, who are going out of their way to make things worse.

Now, if the Democrats rival party was going to radically reform things for the better, fine, abandon the Democrats if they don't scurry to catch up. The voters of the US don't have that option, but voting for the lesser evil gets you less evil.

 

[Saelune]

It is absolutely true that the Democrats aren't going to fix the US. OTOH, they are going to keep things more or less stable, while alleviating some issues. The only other option is the Republicans, who are going out of their way to make things worse.

Now, if the Democrats rival party was going to radically reform things for the better, fine, abandon the Democrats if they don't scurry to catch up. The voters of the US don't have that option, but voting for the lesser evil gets you less evil.

What should have happened is Hillary became President, continues to mostly keep Obama's policies floating, until a more progressive Democrat gets in office and takes Obama's policies and picks away at the Republican concessions, rinse and repeat until Socialism.

But instead Trump is President, I miss Bush, and if I have to, I will vote for Biden. I mean hey, I want Warren, and eventually AOC, but at this point, I just want Republicans to be anti-Nazi and anti-Russia, something that should not be a stretch to hope for, something that was true in the 80's. That's right, I want 1980's America, its better than 1940's Germany.

 

[Seanchaidh]

Jeff Foxworthy voice:

If the idea of people opposing fascism bothers you, you might be a fascist.

Unless the people are punching Asian-American Journalists for covering them.

What, this guy? He deserves worse.

[tweet t="https://twitter.com/BethLynch2020/status/1157784705992929280"]

What should have happened is Hillary became President, continues to mostly keep Obama's policies floating, until a more progressive Democrat gets in office and takes Obama's policies and picks away at the Republican concessions, rinse and repeat until Socialism.

The problem with this theory is that you can draw a pretty straight line between the policies of the Clintons and Obama (and Republicans) and discontent, discontent which tends to manifest itself as a collapse in political engagement by the marginalized and most vulnerable-- the very people who would vote for the socialism you want. More Clinton would not lead to someone further left, but instead would lead to someone further right. The problem with corporate democrats is that they discredit the left by inhabiting its skin while enacting the policies of the right. The Republicans, by contrast, drag the country right by going further and further right whether or not they win elections.

10 Dissatisfied with right-wing Republican rule->Elect Democrats
20 Dissatisfied with right-wing Democratic rule->Elect Republicans
30 GOTO 10

The way for the left to win is not to line up behind corporate candidates graced with a (D); if there was any reason to believe someone like Hillary Clinton would lead to socialism any quicker or more certainly than Donald Trump, the corporations wouldn't have funded her. And the same goes for Joe Biden and Kamala Harris.

 

[Saelune]

Jeff Foxworthy voice:

If the idea of people opposing fascism bothers you, you might be a fascist.

Unless the people are punching Asian-American Journalists for covering them.

What, this guy? He deserves worse.

[tweet t="https://twitter.com/BethLynch2020/status/1157784705992929280"]

What should have happened is Hillary became President, continues to mostly keep Obama's policies floating, until a more progressive Democrat gets in office and takes Obama's policies and picks away at the Republican concessions, rinse and repeat until Socialism.

The problem with this theory is that you can draw a pretty straight line between the policies of the Clintons and Obama (and Republicans) and discontent, discontent which tends to manifest itself as a collapse in political engagement by the marginalized and most vulnerable-- the very people who would vote for the socialism you want. More Clinton would not lead to someone further left, but instead would lead to someone further right. The problem with corporate democrats is that they discredit the left by inhabiting its skin while enacting the policies of the right. The Republicans, by contrast, drag the country right by going further and further right whether or not they win elections.

10 Dissatisfied with right-wing Republican rule->Elect Democrats
20 Dissatisfied with right-wing Democratic rule->Elect Republicans
30 GOTO 10

The way for the left to win is not to line up behind corporate candidates graced with a (D); if there was any reason to believe someone like Hillary Clinton would lead to socialism any quicker or more certainly than Donald Trump, the corporations wouldn't have funded her. And the same goes for Joe Biden and Kamala Harris.

I like Bernie more than Biden (I like Warren more than both). I will vote for whoever is not Trump. Please do the same. Us fighting doesn't really help anything though.

 

[Seanchaidh]

Jeff Foxworthy voice:

If the idea of people opposing fascism bothers you, you might be a fascist.

Unless the people are punching Asian-American Journalists for covering them.

What, this guy? He deserves worse.

[tweet t="https://twitter.com/BethLynch2020/status/1157784705992929280"]

What should have happened is Hillary became President, continues to mostly keep Obama's policies floating, until a more progressive Democrat gets in office and takes Obama's policies and picks away at the Republican concessions, rinse and repeat until Socialism.

The problem with this theory is that you can draw a pretty straight line between the policies of the Clintons and Obama (and Republicans) and discontent, discontent which tends to manifest itself as a collapse in political engagement by the marginalized and most vulnerable-- the very people who would vote for the socialism you want. More Clinton would not lead to someone further left, but instead would lead to someone further right. The problem with corporate democrats is that they discredit the left by inhabiting its skin while enacting the policies of the right. The Republicans, by contrast, drag the country right by going further and further right whether or not they win elections.

10 Dissatisfied with right-wing Republican rule->Elect Democrats
20 Dissatisfied with right-wing Democratic rule->Elect Republicans
30 GOTO 10

The way for the left to win is not to line up behind corporate candidates graced with a (D); if there was any reason to believe someone like Hillary Clinton would lead to socialism any quicker or more certainly than Donald Trump, the corporations wouldn't have funded her. And the same goes for Joe Biden and Kamala Harris.

I like Bernie more than Biden (I like Warren more than both). I will vote for whoever is not Trump. Please do the same. Us fighting doesn't really help anything though.

Hah, well... I went from TX to WA, recently, so my vote counts for even less in a general election now.

 

[Saelune]

I like Bernie more than Biden (I like Warren more than both). I will vote for whoever is not Trump. Please do the same. Us fighting doesn't really help anything though.

Hah, well... I went from TX to WA, recently, so my vote counts for even less in a general election now.

Honestly, I just want to believe voting still matters at all in this country. I am genuinely scared to find out it wont. We will see in a year.

 

[Schadrach]

Honestly, I just want to believe voting still matters at all in this country. I am genuinely scared to find out it wont. We will see in a year.

Ideally, we'll get a Democrat candidate that can win somewhere outside the largest coastal cities, and that will make all the difference. Still think Sanders could have beaten Trump - he was drawing big crowds and massive applause in places that were otherwise MAGA country.

I have not a bit of worry that elections still matter. I just suspect that we have different meanings for that phrase where I mean "the system will act as designed, regardless of who wins" and you mean "a Democrat will win the presidency." I have no worry that the former is true, I worry that the latter might not be (and it will again be because the Dems can't manage to sell themselves outside the coasts - which isn't enough).

Hopefully the Dems won't fuck it up from the outset and try to put a thumb on the scale, though the media already seems to be pushing Biden hard.

 

[Tireseas_v1legacy]

Hah, well... I went from TX to WA, recently, so my vote counts for even less in a general election now.

Welcome (back?[footnote]I seem to remember some time ago that you used to live in the Seattle area.[/footnote]) to Washington. If you're upset your vote is likely neg liable in the presidential election, please remember that you have local and state races that heavily impact what policies are passable in the state legislature and county counsels. Democrats only just got control of the legislature 1.5 cycles ago in a special election.

 

[Saelune]

Honestly, I just want to believe voting still matters at all in this country. I am genuinely scared to find out it wont. We will see in a year.

Ideally, we'll get a Democrat candidate that can win somewhere outside the largest coastal cities, and that will make all the difference. Still think Sanders could have beaten Trump - he was drawing big crowds and massive applause in places that were otherwise MAGA country.

I have not a bit of worry that elections still matter. I just suspect that we have different meanings for that phrase where I mean "the system will act as designed, regardless of who wins" and you mean "a Democrat will win the presidency." I have no worry that the former is true, I worry that the latter might not be (and it will again be because the Dems can't manage to sell themselves outside the coasts - which isn't enough).

Hopefully the Dems won't fuck it up from the outset and try to put a thumb on the scale, though the media already seems to be pushing Biden hard.

Hillary got more votes. More people wanted Hillary than Trump. HILLARY BEAT TRUMP! Outdated political systems beat Hillary.

Your blaming of Democrats and Hillary show a lack of understanding of this.

 

[Baffle]

Bam! And the dirt is gone!

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-49306032

Sorry, I didn't know which one of the million Trump threads to dump this in.