Poll: 4X: Coming or Going?

[Eyclonus]

I've been looking through the net lately, hitting game review sites, old schooler's archives, gaming news groups and I've yet to see any recently released or upcoming 4X games. I'm well aware that its quite a small field compared to the first-person-shoot-kill-Tbag genre of gaming but as a fan of Sid Meier and 4X in general I worry that in the next 5 years the only 4Xers we'll be seeing will only be "Sid Meier's -----". I wonder if we could, (barring the exception that is Mr. Meier) consider it a borderline extinct genre?

 

[vede]

Wow. Double-thread.

Except one was a shell, and the other was a shell with innards.

Strange.

Um, yes, it would seem to be. To me, at least. It could just be my that my changing preference in games has changed my attention to gaming news, though.

 

[Eyclonus]

Shit did I double thread?

 

[Altorin]

well, They just released a new Civilization that does still have the 4x's, even though it is a lot more graphical in its movement of units etc. And I haven't played Spore, as it's not quite out yet I don't think, but I'm fairly certain it could squeeze into the genre as well during some of its phases.

I would say the classic "look at a map, take control of the map" gameplay is pretty much gone, but the 4X part of the equation is still alive and kicking

 

[Altorin]

There are also several indie games that could fit this genre as well, like the Pandemic series of flash games. If they could build up on those make it easier to finish and harder to almost finish (if you play pandemic 2, you might know what I mean), they could be a big contender in this genre and a game series to look out for.. I'd personally LOVE to see Pandemic 3 be a real in depth strategy game

 

[Eyclonus]

I've not heard of this Pandemic series.
More of this demand I of you to tell!

I do know a few in the Indie community have some projects up but so far they all look like Civ2 with a more horrible control and interface scheme.

 

[Altorin]

well, I'll be honest

Pandemic isn't quite what you'd think of as a strategy game yet I don't think

basically, you are a pathogen (a virus, bacterium, or parasite), and you control your symptoms, how you spread, your resistances etc, and your ultimate goal (and only way of winning the game) is to KILL EVERY SINGLE HUMAN BEING ON EARTH.

it's a difficult task, mainly because once a country closes its borders, if you haven't infected anyone in that country, you've effectively lost the game (shit, I just "lost the game"). Madagascar is very tiny, and has only a single boat port, and if that boat port closes, it's impossible to win the game.

It COULD be really really really awesome though, if they filled it out a little.

check out pandemic 2

 

[Eyclonus]

Its pretty good, but not what I was thinking on the more conventional lines

 

[Anniko]

Galactic Civilization 2.[/thread]

 

[Fenixius]

Unfortunately, it does seem that 4X gets no love from publishers or developers outside of Firaxis/Sid Meier and Stardock. And hell, I don't even know if Stardock are making anything new, but they did do Galactic Civilisations II recently(ish).

Does anyone have any thoughs on Sins of a Solar Empires in respect to its claim of being a 4XRTS? I personally don't think it worked very well, since it was a very slow game for an RTS, and it was too limited compared to other 4X games out there.

The other game coming out soon that you might be able to call 4X (maybe) is Empire: Total War. I have no idea if it'll be any good, but I suspect that few people will be able to run it due to the level of detail they've put into the game.

Galactic Civilization 2.[/thread]

One game does not constitute a genre. While it's a very good game, it's not a whole genre.

 

[Eyclonus]

Sins of a Solar Empire was ok but like you said its slow enough to put off most RTS fans.

 

[Fenixius]

Sins of a Solar Empire was ok but like you said its slow enough to put off most RTS fans.

It's not just slow, but it's boring. I mean, I'll gladly spend hours and hours and hours at a time playing Masters of Orion 3 or Galactic Civilisations, but damn, Sins just doesn't do anything... ever. Nothing happens, and even when the fighting breaks out, I'd honestly rather go watch a Masters of Orion III fight. I have no idea why it's got to be so slow, or so tedious, but at least in GalCiv the diplomacy was more than "hurt your allies and I'll pay you" or "we'll give money to the Pirates to attack you".

I don't think that many people are actually into 4X anyway. Which mades me sad because I am, but too many people would see it as "boring" or "overly complicated".

 

[TheBadass]

Sid Meier's never going to let it die, and I bloody well hope he doesn't. I get bored as hell playing these games, but more variety in the industry's always a good thing.

 

[Eyclonus]

Hopefully good old Sid Meier will remake Alpha Centauri, thats my favourite of his games.

 

[Unknower]

Does anyone have any thoughs on Sins of a Solar Empires in respect to its claim of being a 4XRTS? I personally don't think it worked very well, since it was a very slow game for an RTS, and it was too limited compared to other 4X games out there.

I can't help but compare SoaSE to Hegemonia: Legions of Iron. SoaSE repeats the same flaws as that game and it doesn't even have as FRIGGIN' AWESOME explosions as Hegemonia had. Hegemonia is 6 years old already! Why do we still have ships stopping when they enter a battle? Do some evasive maneuvers, dammit!

 

[AyaReiko]

Yes, due to the fact that the Civ series is being reduced to retard-friendly crap. Civ 2 was excellent, Civ 3 was meh, Civ 4 is overrated spunk. (Where is Brian Reynolds anyway?)

And, as said earlier, GalCiv2 cannot constitute a genre.

 

[Asehujiko]

Explain the fundamental differences between 4x games and regular rts/tbs please.

 

[42manZ]

Maybe with the popularity of the Sid Meier games, more game developers will want to make 4k games in orser to sell more games. This is scientifically known as the "Halo Effect".

 

[Eldritch Warlord]

Explain the fundamental differences between 4x games and regular rts/tbs please.

4X =
eXplore
eXpand
eXploit
eXterminate

basically it's a strategy game in which you build an empire and there's some isolated or clearly defined "territories/planets" to control

 

[Eyclonus]

Explain the fundamental differences between 4x games and regular rts/tbs please.

4X =
eXplore
eXpand
eXploit
eXterminate

basically it's a strategy game in which you build an empire and there's some isolated or clearly defined "territories/planets" to control

That said theres usually a more social, political and economic focus rather than zerg rushing, it also plays out over a much longer time scale of turns then regular TBS. Taking 20 turns to build a single insignificant structure is pretty much the norm except for Civ4 where they streamlined some of these aspects and made the turns take up more history in the early game, eg the first 3 turns are usually covering 100/90/80 year blocks, depending on game speed.